DMooch

Sitting on the bike is ILL ADVISED, unless someone else is operating the jack! Plus, this or another person would need to be around if you wanted to sit on it when putting it back on the ground, but NEVER sit on the bike while on the jack! IT IS NOT STABLE ENOUGH! Anyway... With the bike on the side stand, slide the jack under the bike form the right side. Place two hockey pucks on the jack so they line up with the frame on the left side. The forward puck will need to have a chunk taken out of it to get around the side stand switch. Use a hacksaw or Reciprocating saw for this. You can't take out too much, so be generous with the notching; as long as there's more than 2/3 of it left the remaining puck will still be strong enough to support the bike. While lying on the ground, slowly work the pedal by hand until the pucks/jack arms make contact with the frame. You should even be able to get the bike to lift slightly this way, taking a little slack out of the suspension. Place your second set of pucks on the right side of the jack. At this point you may stand and SLOWLY pump the pedal by foot until the bike goes upright. Make sure the right side pucks align on the frame and not the pipes! Note that the side stand stays in the DOWN position. This also makes it easier for when you are lowering the bike as you can lean it right over on it as it makes floor contact. If all is well, pump away until the bike is at a sufficient height to do what ever work you need, preferably activating one of the locking steps. Then, STRAP THE BIKE DOWN! Because of jack positioning and the center of weight on a Venture, they tend to look like the bike is going uphill on the jack, even if you unloaded your saddlebags and trunk. STRAP THE BIKE DOWN across the seat (or the frame under the seat if it is removed) and in front of the gas tank over the frame (NOT through the steering head as you can cause damage there, plus it's a tight fit). If you want, grab some Wite-Out and mark where the pucks are one the jack arms. Then, once the bike is off the jack, notch out the grooves in the rubber on the jack arms (I have a Craftsman jack) so the pucks will (1) always be in the right place for lifting and (2) won't so easily get knocked off the arms if you bump the jack as you are positioning it under the bike (very frustrating!).

Brake Pad: Holes will line up fine. Doesn't look like they will, but the piece is in the exact same position and place. It appears way off because the rear fender and sub-frame assembly was loosened to allow for proper welding, so it is still misaligned at this time. Freebird: It may very well remain a mystery... But as I said before, some owners have already checked with negative findings, and I'm sure there's plenty of folks on here that will make this a regular (if at least seasonal) check over that gets done on their bikes before any lengthy ride.

To all: Repair Pictures Attached I took a couple of shots of the repaired area. Much more welded material in the joint now, as you can see in the unpainted shots. After a few swipes with some generic black touch up paint, you can barely tell any work was done. Soon enough (Tuesday afternoon, I'm hoping) I'll start re-assembly. Shouldn't wind up with any spare parts afterward, wondering "Now where did I pull this off? Where was it supposed to go back?"

To all: WELDING IS COMPLETED.:cool10: Other items mentioned: I replaced the shock with the updated model in 2005, and I run it with about 25 psi on a regular basis. (I prefer a stiffer ride.) I never trailered the bike, so it's never been tied down across the back end in any way by me. Prior owner, kinda doubt it, since he traded it for a Wing in '04, and I know of no Wing rider that trailers anything except behind their bikes. (General observation.) Battery arcing? No evidence of it at all (melting, scorching, etc.), so that's not possible. As for mounting points, there's a few more than I realized. The two in this broken piece, the one srstewart mentioned (which I knew), plus the little bracket that acts like a wire loom and is the bolt location for the rear saddle also goes into support #12. While this last one doesn't do much, it is still there. And then there's the fender side supports which aren't shown in the frame diagram. However, this morning I loosened up every part in the area, removed the battery tray and all other non-metal items. A friend-of-a-friend has a MIG welder, and he came over this morning, assessed it as do-able, and did it. A few test welds for strength yielded good results, so full-circle welds on both tubes were done. Nice thick bead all around, much more than Yamaha originally supplied. I will paint over it once cooled, and then reassamble the entire works as time allows during the week. Oh, and a good whack with a hammer after the welds were done verified a good bond. No movement at all. BEST PART: $0.00 = FREE repair And while "The DMooch Weld" is nice, I can't take the credit for that work. The damage or break maybe, but not necessarily the actual fix.

Thanks of course for everyone's input, whether someone else thinks it's valid or not. My main reason for posting was (1) to see if anyone else had ever heard or seen this kind of break in this region and (2) help others keep an eye out for a POSSIBLE failure on their own bikes. As far as I know, the bike was 100% original with no impact accident damage at any time, other than having evidence of a fall over to the left side by the previous owner (scratches on fairing, left mirror, clutch lever) but no major frame problems. Any inspection I did before purchase was detailed, knowing especially to look in this area for battery acid corrosion, and I had the opportunity to do so because they installed the new battery while I was checking it over. As for any noticeable trunk bounce I mentioned, it was only if I was on an especially bumpy road, but I also mentioned I ride into NYC sometimes (not known for the smoothest roads). Again, no trailer, and it's never been trailered by me (I ride it bike events, not trailer events!). I've seen pictures of plenty of couples easily tipping the scales more than my wife and myself riding two-up, with I'm sure plenty of matching luggage and travel gear. How many here can HONESTLY say they don't go over the 400 lb. limit Yamaha says the bike can carry? Remember: that's people AND luggage AND gear. If there's a 20 lb. limit per trunk and saddlebag, that means you and your mate better not tip more than 300 together, and add in your clothes and helmets, to push that limit! The bike hasn't been ridden since the beginning of December, so it has sat for a few months. Gravity will work over time, and once both sides broke completely, that's when the sagging began. There's two other support points on each side for the rear sub-frame, and I've checked those too (all tight). The gap you see may have been expanded due to me moving the rear end around checking for that possible looseness elsewhere, and taking the pics afterward. When initially discovered, the gap was about 1/8" on either side, and I was barely able to get the cable tie in the area back through and in place as shown in one of the pics I attached. I agree it is a poor design in this area. That broken-off piece should be a tube that slides into an opening on the main frame, not a butt weld, to make a stronger joint, so I am on the same page here with autopilot. A welded area has no flexibility in it and will always remain rigid (except in this instance), as such any shock to the area whether from road surface, bouncing passengers and luggage, to other impacts will stress that location. The bolted on parts have a minimal amount of movement allowed in them because the 3 pieces (part a, part b, fastener) involved are all still physically separated even though attached at a common point. Which is why I think the saddlebag stays and the other mounting points for the fender and sub-frame are still doing their job since any transmitted force was absorbed by them where as the weld didn't fare so well. If I HAD NOT LOOKED CLOSER at this, looking at the bike assembled, NONE OF YOU would have ever thought there was a break in this part of the chassis. It still fits together THAT GOOD overall. Besides, at least two of you have actually inspected your bikes just to be sure... On the more hopeful side: I have made contact with a few persons in the area of welding skills (I can do just about anything mechanical, but have no weld-ability), and they will be looking at the bike Sunday or Tuesday, depending on availability. Opinions will be offered and received on the task at hand. By phone, all feel it's fixable, but of course a personal inspection will make the true determination. If it's a go, I'll be stripping the rest of the parts off the back and sides of the bike (fender, sub-frame, side covers, wires, hoses, battery & case, etc. etc. etc.) and the fuel tank (no fires!) so that a full-circle weld can be done. I'll also run the bike dry after I pull the tank to empty the fuel line and pump as much as possible. Seriously, too: I was intent on selling the bike this year and moving to something lighter, as previous knee and hernia surgery keep me off this fine bike more than on it. Any takers?

To all: PICTURES ATTACHED Mileage correction: I have 33,594 on the odometer. Break correction: the breaking point is BELOW the weld area (closer to the main frame as opposed to being towards the bracket {see pics}). V7Goose: I've always noticed some flexing while riding, feeling the trunk give a little hop and a squeak over bumps in the road, but nothing where it felt like it was going to shake off. It's never 'off-road', even on hard pack dirt. Strictly paved roads. It's made it from NY to Myrtle and back, NY to DC and back, with no problems on either trip. Else, it's ridden around Long Island and once a week into NYC on nice days. (I avoid known crappy roads in the city, but you can't know them all.) I don't think handling would be affected either, given that the main frame is still fine. It's just this piece that's broken. There are the parts of the rear frame (under the chrome bits on the sides of the rear fender) that attach at points on either side of the rear wheel right above the swing arm pivot which mainly support the fender and trunk, but this piece is what gets bolted through the part that is broken on my bike. Also, there's the saddlebag support/muffler stay underneath. Still, not enough strength there to keep that kink from appearing on the fender. BUT: handling certainly WOULD be affected if the assembly collapsed onto the rear wheel while spinning at highway speed! Otherwise, all bolts are secure throughout the rear of the bike. I have already removed the rear seat, trunk and saddlebags in an effort to lessen the stress back there. The rest will come off once I (hopefully) find someone to take it to, or that can come to me. NOTE ON PICTURES: The gap shown is with the rear seat off, the saddlebags empty (except for tool kit on right side) and trunk with less than 2 pounds of weight in it (ball cap, shades, gloves, rags, paperwork). No other sprung (carried) weight added to the back of the bike.

I find that winter riding has nothing to do with the weeping, but more of a general low temperature when the bike is parked. Any time it dropped below 20ºF, I would see a little green on the floor, from either the front or rear just on the left side. the cylinder heads contract every which way in the cold, and that includes causing the cylinder drain plug holes to 'grow'. A few years back I even got new cylinder drain plugs, gooped 'em up with some monkey snot sealant (not a brand name, just know it by that affectation), and yet they still weep from time to time when it drops way down in temperature. Since the plug is shaped with an edge on it, keeping pressure on this edge ought to keep them sealed against the cylinder heads. A look at the inside of the finned covers has a small raised circle right where the cover would align with the plug. Please note: while the manual says to thread a spark plug top into the drain plug to remove it, these things will pop out all on their own! Coolant is quite slippery, and if they're leaking now, they will fly right out just from the weight of the coolant. Imagine a leaking dam... I speak from experience here. Have a spare hand on hand to help out. Invest 4 pennies (or 4 dimes if you don't need so much thickness) and tape or glue them onto the high spots on the covers. Re-install and you should hopefully be leak-free.

flb_78: No pic of area yet, cell phone takes a crummy pic. Will get it out into the light with a good photo perhaps tomorrow or Sunday (stay tuned!) Gary N. & flugur: No accidents, and while I'm not sure of the EXACT location of the breaks, whether in the welds themselves or in the tubing (the future photo will tell), but from what I can recall, I think the breaks are on the smaller piece above the weld points (toward the fender, not the main frame). This small piece in question is attached on one part of an upside-down T that is on the left and right sides of the frame, with the 'cross' part of the T going forward to the 'backbone' (fuel tank support) and backwards toward curves for the swingarm pivot points. To everyone else: I am the 2nd owner, having bought it used from a dealer in 2004. (Original owner had it for 4 years and got a Wing.) I agree with flb_78's comment to flugur: outside aberrant riding (wheelies, motocross, circus tricks, trampoline use, whatever), there should be NO reason for the frame to give way, especially in this area. I would think if it were to do so, a more 'impacted' area would be the steering head or something like it. I'm going to eventually strip down the rear of the bike as much as possible before taking it to a Yamaha dealer for consult on a possible NHTSA complaint. I have to strip it because in it's current state, as mentioned the rear fender is already starting to kink on the right side, and lightening the load is in my best interest for riding it there (under 2 miles). It may be I have to get it welded with no compensation from Yamaha, due to the bike's age. I'm here looking for possible stricken brethren in similar circumstances, and to provide a place for others to now look for a possible weak point in an otherwise very strong and well-made motorcycle. (How many of you have already pulled your saddle and had a look??)

JUMPING?!?!? Crikey! I'm lucky I get this beast off the side stand! Forget about catching air between the treads and the roads!!

Brake Pad: Answers to your questions... battery leaked? - NO Leaks whatsoever. Clean, dry, no crud. rust spots? - None in that area (minor stuff elsewhere but nothing frame-integrity threatening in any way). hit by lighting? - No. trailer hitch support hooked up to any part of it? or lower section of fender? - No hitch on bike. bubbling paint around that area of frame? - No bubbling, or anything to indicate a corrosion issue. Pegscraper: Never on the throttle THAT hard where I'm twisting the tubes. Plus, my clutch slips a little so even if I wanted to, I'd be hard pressed to accomplish such a feat! ALSO: These breaks have no bending from what I can tell, so when the break happened, it appeared to be a shock to both weld areas, not crack-bend-break. But this may just be the way a break like this occurs in a weld area (I can wrench, but not torch).

First: I'm not that fat. 225 lbs. No passengers on bike in some time. 35k miles on the bike's odometer. Garage kept, but not temperature controlled, on Long Island, NY. Now... While re-installing a freshly charged battery into my 99 RSV, I noted that both sides of the frame are cracked completely through in the piece that the rear tab of the driver's seat would go into. This piece also has two bolts that go into the rear fender, essentially providing almost all the support for anything over the rear tire (rear seat, trunk, saddlebags, etc.). (See attached scan from parts diagram; I can hopefully take and attach an actual image of this part on the bike another time.) I also noticed the beginning of a 'kink' in the right side of the rear fender, apparently due to the stress of the saddlebag support pieces having to carry all the weight from above. Has ANYONE here had this happen to them? Or heard of other's in a similar situation? I'm kinda bummed about the riding season starting real soon and the possibility of no bike for an extended period of time until this is fixed. Plus, I just sent off the insurance premium and registration fees. Welding recommendations (type, process, who can do it)? Difficulties involved (other than getting the fender and related parts off)?