Tennessee

Obviously, you have a superior command of not only the English language, but the intricacies of these motorcycles. I only wanted to post my impressions and feelings about this motorcycle. Obviously I violated some principles that must not be crossed. Do I know the difference between carbs and fuel injection? I believe so, since I have worked on both extensively for years. Do I understand the fact that this bike is fourteen years old, and probably will not perform as well as a 2016 Indian Roadmaster, or even a 2009 Venture? Yes. But with all that being said, somehow I have intruded upon your superior knowledge of these bikes and their capabilities, and for that I am totally apologetic. How bout' I jus' don't post nuttin' else, and let the forum knowledge to guys like you??

Took this bike out for a real test run this morning. (I can do that on a weekday since I am retired!!) If you are familiar with the Great Smokies just South of Chattanooga... I left Cleveland, TN on Highway 64, about 15 miles to Rt. 411. Headed East on 411, keeping the bike around 60-70 MPH. So far, so good. Above Benton, Tennessee, just past the Polk County High School, is a turnoff for Rt. 30 which leads SouthWest to Parksville lake and reconnects with Rt. 64. This is a 15 mile stretch that has been called the "Dragon's Tail with driveways." This really tested the bike, up, down, major tight turns, no real straightaways, for about 15 miles. I didn't hit fourth but once or twice, and not for long. Never in fifth. Personally, I was glad to finally get off of it, since it also included a random portable stop light, (which I hit red), that was placed there to allow for people to use the one lane remaining since the NorthEast bound lane had collapsed into the mountainside from a recent rainstorm. (I had to wait for a beat up mini-pickup...) After completing that 15 mile run, I reconnected with the Ocoee highway about five miles East of TVA dam #1 . Took that road back to Cleveland, TN. Total run, just short of 80 miles. Temps, in the mid to high 80's. Bike performed OK, not great in my book. No real problems, but the handling is not what I hoped for. I wish that the lowering kit that is on my '09 was on this bike. I may add one. Wife says go for it. I keep the money, so wait I shall, but it hit the list today... The Clearshield with the vent was a lifesaver in cooling. Also 1.5" lower. Love to add that to the '09!! Overall, the bike did what it was supposed to do, but I found myself really using my eye/hand technique to get me through the curves of the Rt. 30 portion. Bike just doesn't want to lay over like my other scoots, both of which are lowered. But for a fourteen year old bike, and fourteen year old technology, not bad, not bad at all. I plan on taking the '09 that is lowered through the same route maybe tomorrow. Hope the messed up carbs play nice. Have not had a chance to get it in to get them balanced and cleaned yet, but it is improving with me riding it often. What I liked about the '05: Bike shifted like a dream. Neutral is much easier to find than my Indian. Mileage seemed good, but only using the gauge to guess I did maybe 35-39MPH. Clearshield windshield is a lifesaver, with the vent in the lower middle. Highly recommended. Never overheated, nor did it ever miss a beat. What I didn't like: I still am not used to the four-cylinder pulse that the motor puts out. You can feel every cylinder explosion, a strange feeling. Just...odd. Carbs are no replacement for fuel injection, period. It is only a 1300CC. You have to remember that. Despite the 90+ HP, the torque is lacking at high speeds, and it kind of runs out of power around 65-70 MPH. Handling was so-so, bit too high of COG, and made me use my eye-hand technique hard to get it over for the tight curves of the 15 mile Rt. 30 run. Overall, I am pleased that the bike did what it should, didn't make any real mistakes, and kept me going. Could it be quieter, despite my Motokote addition? Yes. Are there funny whining noises at different times that make you wonder? Yes. Did it take me out and home safely? You bet... So I think I am happy with my fourteen year old Yamaha Venture with the eye popping paint job. I may add the lowering kit.

This new electric bike from HD has a few problems many levels in the world of electrics... 1. Too big. 2. Too expensive MSRP $29,799 (I believe you can have a Toyota Prius for less). Zero motorcycle, their main competition, Standard $18,995, Premium $20,995. Still a chunk of coin. 3. Too few miles between charges on the HD. 4. Its main competitor, the Zero SR/F, goes farther, is about 60 lbs lighter, and is about $10,000 less money. It also uses a lighter motor, non-water cooled. The HD requires a water cooling jacket around the motor, which then brings in a water system, and a pump, etc., etc. And the Zero has been out there for a couple years already, debugging first year jitters. 5. The HD charges faster, but since you have to stop more often, who cares? The only thing that HD offers, and it's kind of a big thing, is the dealer network. Zero, well, almost zero. HD, thousands of dealers. But is it worth $10K more? Not on my best day. The major problem with electrics is they are already pushing the battery technology about as far as they can. And I agree with above, battery disposal in the future will be a huge environmental problem. When someone shows me how we're going to move the current 95% of all freight in this country that moves by diesel powered semi tractor trailer, and replace that with electric movement, then I'll listen. Till then, electric is not much more than a fad at this point. None of these people pushing electric technology will ever mention the freight problem, because they have absolutely no solution nor technology to tackle it. So your new electric motorcycle will be delivered by a diesel powered semi, most likely. It might spend some time on a diesel powered train.

I would think it physically impossible for clutch fluid to "burn". Should not even be a reason why it should have gotten hot. On the other hand, a bad set of rubber O-rings and bushings in the fluid circuit could give off a lot of discoloration if they are degenerating, and if you did ride the clutch a lot doing the tail, I can see how you could have actually burned the clutch plates. But the clutch hydraulic fluid? Am I missing something?

Du-Rron I do not swap the pads. I am more like RDawson, tend to change things early, rather than taking them to the edge. And I use a lower cost Caltric sintered pad. Certainly not as good as say, EBC's, but I am only looking for about 5000 worth of wear, and this brand grips well, is very quiet with the copper plated backplate, and although I know it will wear quicker, I change them out sooner anyway, so no harm done. On the other side, I can get a complete set of Caltric's for my Venture for $28.60 on eBay, or the fronts for $18.60, or the backs off Amazon for around $15.00. At those prices, I can change brakes every year, even if I only put on 4-5K on the bike. At my advanced age, I don't plan on any cross country trips, just day trips, so I'm good. Your use may vary. If you even commute to work, like I used to, you can rack up some miles every year rather quickly. That takes my current brake pad philosophy and trashes it. But for my light use of my bikes, new brakes every year is OK with me. I like the way the Caltric's grip, the total lack of noise, and they should not glaze. And on these bikes, changing out a set of brakes is about 90 minutes tops. I don't want to swap pads then worry if that one was a bit thin...

I agree with you, big-norm. About 18 months ago, my wife and I walked into our local HD dealership and I was wearing my US Navy Retired ball cap, and we were dressed OK. We walked that showroom for almost 20 minutes, looking at bikes, and the three sales guys in the building were either on their computers or fiddling with their phones the whole time. After the girl in the front said "Hi", that turned out the be the total conversation we had with anyone in that dealership. When someone obviously in their 60's with a wife walks into a dealership like that, usually you don't get 20 feet into the room before some eager beaver is glued to you. Not this place. Thunder Creek Harley Davidson, Chattanooga, TN. Now out of business and renamed White Lightning HD. Wonder why?

Rafterd, that was actually the first thing I did. The previous owner, (generous fellow that he was), left me with a bike that was almost out of gas and I had to stop at the very first station, (about a mile away), to fill it up. I put in premium, and added a generous dollop of Seafoam, and have been riding with that tank full ever since on that. Obviously, it has sat a few times so the Seafoam can do its work. So far, not much better, but it runs better at higher RPM's than it did the day I bought it, and starts a little easier. It actually does feel like the carbs are out of balance in some way. I would not be surprised if they find a cracked vacuum hose or leak on a carb manifold gasket. Worst case scenario would be a varnished up carb and they have to rebuild it, which is entirely possible, since the previous owner let it sit for three months while he tried to decide if he could still ride, and the owner before that only put on about 1K a year so it probably sat months at a time with no gas saver. Sometimes these low mileage bikes are more headache than diamond find. I'm giving it over to my longtime Yamaha dealer, who has some very good mechanics that have been there for years and years. They'll find it. It'll cost me a few hundred, but they'll find it. My garage space is now all woodworking, and I sold off all my old tools for working on carb banks after I got rid of my 86' Suzuki Cavalcade, swearing I would never buy a carbonated bike again. Never-Say-Never...

I don't think the motors in the CD player would suffer any overheating, and there is just not enough amperage going through it to overheat any board inside. I can remember having one of these in one of my cars, and in the summer the car would do the usual, get up to about 120' in the summer. Never had any problems.

I've changed the rear brakes first thing on both my 05 Midnight Venture, (the inboard pad was more worn), and on my 09 Venture, with the lowering kit. It also had a more worn inboard pad, even with the lowering kit from Barrons which relocates the caliper near the bottom of the rotor on a different arm altogether. I think it has more to do with the different pressures generated by the four different pistons, and their place in the hydraulic chain of events, rather than being off center. I did not add any washers. I want the full allotment of threads from the caliper bolts, and am willing to change the rear pads every few thousand miles, since I use the rear so much in slow speed maneuvers, along with the clutch and feathering the throttle. If you've ever taken, watched or even read about the Ride Like a Pro classes and videos, you see why you need to change rear brakes often.

So I did pick up another one as some have seen, a 2009 with only 10K on her and every option offered. It has been lowered, and is a beautiful bike, but it idles rough, and coughs some until the revs get up some. it also might have a bit of a starter switch problem, or maybe a weaker battery or maybe even a dirty starter solenoid, have not looked into it yet. I think to be honest, just a dirty start switch. If I press soundly on the switch, it starts. I have to hit it with some plastic safe contact cleaner and see if that corrects it. It also whines just like the Midnight did before the Motokote. I will say that now that I have about a hundred miles on the 05' Midnight since I added the Motokote, it shifts easier, finds neutral better, and just runs quieter. You don't really realize how noisy the whining is until you turn on the radio. Now I can hear it clearly, while on my 09, which I did an oil change and put in Castrol 20-50 with a new Yamaha filter, it still whines. And no clutch slip that I can detect on the '05. Some say the whine problem got better as the years went along. Well, I now have an 05' that is quieter than an 09'. The whine is NOT completely gone, but much better. Once I get the '09 tuned up professionally, I think then I might consider adding the Motokote as I did on the '05. I've had Motokote in my Indian for almost three years now, with no ill effects. So there's my update!

Well, it might be ugly, but the foam surround seems to work great. The unit is sitting on about two inches of foam, and as in the second set of pics, surrounded by foam. I took it out yesterday morning, purposely on a road that has a fair amount of little bumps, some sharp bumps, and even took it on the rumble strips on the side once or twice. Had one slight jump in the music, not even a skip when I hit what actually was a small bump. Ran it through the gears, let it lug, did about everything I could think of (within reason) to make it skip. Didn't go looking for potholes, but we don't have many of those down here anyway. Really could not make it skip. So ugly it is, but I am happy. I just used up about 70% of one bag, but I don't do overnight trips anymore anyway, so I'm good.

Randy, that business model is why a couple new Honda's showed up in their inventory list. They are not really a Honda dealer, just carry so many that they had a couple new ones. And I think the fellow up in Pennsylvania, he doesn't even have a service center, yet... He had an Indian that went sour on him, and he posted a couple of Youtube videos on why he would never buy another Indian, when actually, the problem was his, not the buyers. He took a lot of flak for that. Can't remember what the problem was, have to look it up. But it was something he should have caught before he put it out on his floor. But make no mistake, I think he is making good money. I have a guy near me who does consignments, and repairs. About three employees, and they are doing a ton of sales and repairs. You want tires put on? At least three-four days. He sells consignment bikes, and the only reason he slows down in the summer is he can't get the bikes since everyone is riding them in the summer, not selling them. He just recently put in a line of little dirt bikes for little kids. Probably Chinese, have not stopped in, but saw them lined up outside his showroom. Next to the consignment bikes. I think actually a dealer who knows what they are doing can make easily more on a used bike than a new one. Take a trade wholesale, sell retail, just like cars. Tack on an aftermarket warranty, make more money. And for sure, we are drowning in used bikes in the United States and Canada.

I have no statistics to prove this, but it seems like some of the most successful motorcycle dealerships are doing it with used bikes, all brands, models, price ranges. This would only be applicable in the USA, as I have no doubt that the India and China markets are expanding. Europe, not sure. It would seem that we have finally hit the convergence of two roads: On the one hand, the new generation coming up is not that into motorcycles, and as we all know, a lot of brands are contracting, not expanding, at least in the short term. (next five years or so) Secondly, it would seem that at least in the United States, we have reached a saturation of motorcycles. I certainly don't know how many bikes are sitting in garages, barns, sheds, etc., but I think the numbers might be much higher than we might imagine. Used bikes litter the landscape on multiple sales forums, like Craigslist, Cycle Trader, eBay and obviously we all know a number of dealers who might not be there if not for their used bike sales. If you live anywhere near Atlanta, you certainly know of WOW motorcycles. My first visit there was eye opening, to be conservative. About 225-250 bikes on display in their three room showroom, and the nice man who took me around said they have "numerous" buildings where they keep bikes that are not ready for sale yet, still to go through their mechanic staff of seven certified mechanics, and two helpers. They also have an upstairs floor that is chained off. I was told that was where the owner keeps the ones he might want to keep. But with the right amount of coin in hand, they will take you up. You almost miss the place when going through Marietta, GA, just North of Atlanta, as it sits sideways to the main road. Once inside, you cannot believe it. And I was told that their service center is about three weeks behind on major jobs, two-four days on simple things like oil, tire, etc. And although they do sell a little known brand of electrics called Zero, and seem to handle new Benelli, Hyosung and an outfit called SSR, by far and away their biggest products are used bikes, accessories, and I would think their service center is doing pretty well. But when it comes to bikes alone, used is king at WOW, and I am seeing more and more dealers who without used, would simply disappear. Overall, when I look at a lot of dealers, used is the bread and butter that pays the bills. Scary at best. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like the largest new model is the used garage queen, not a 2019 or 2020.

We all have close calls, and some even have "accidents", as I hesitate to call them, since most of what I see is not the fault of the rider, but some idiot in a cage. Sitting still yet. Good heavens! I really feel for you - beautiful new bike, ready for a great trip, and some jack-a-mo ruins it for you. Thank The Lord you are alright, but I commend you on your ability to withhold your anger. Hopefully the dealer you work with will make it like it never happened, and life can go on, after a correct period of being just pissed off, that is! Personally, I'd be looking for a lawyer who might be able to soften the blow a bit...

I didn't really like the first time around, so cleaned up the foam a bit. So now the front and rear of the bag have some room for something, should I need it. I have an iPod, Fifth Gen that I pulled out of pawn shop, put a library of about 700 classic rock songs on it and plugged it into my Aux on my 02' Midnight. Also have the iPod charger cable going to a 12V USB plug I put into the 12V outlet on the bottom of the dash. OK, but not keen on the wires, and of course having that iPod hanging off the dash with velcro. I like the CD's better, since it is all hidden. There is a procedure available to put a USB port on any slightly out of date electronic radio, and a lot of people do it for car radios. I see no reason why this one couldn't have it done. Then you just plug in a thumb drive with your tunes, and have it set up to activate with the Aux function on the controller. I see the boards on eBay now and then. I've never been keen on using my phone and the Bluetooth function.

Well, here is the result. The foam came from Hobby Lobby, on sale at 30% off it came to about $14. Surround the CD player with the foam, keeping it from taking all the hits from the roads when riding. We'll see, I have it mounted and working, but have not taken it for a ride yet. The CD player sits almost two inches above the bottom of the bag, supported by the foam. Basically I sacrificed the left saddle bag, but now have a CD player that should be protected from the bumps from the road. Hooked up, it works fine sitting still. Have to put it on the road to see if I am successful. At least I am not trying to break off a tray wall inside the bag with a single bolt mount, as in the original setup. On the other hand, I have sacrificed a saddlebag for a CD player. We'll see how it all goes.

Excuse my rambling, but I think more information is better, and people can learn from my mistakes! I know they are dated, but I still have a fairly large collection of CD's which I play mostly in my woodshop. But to be honest, I never thought I'd see a CD player on a motorcycle. (As a sidenote - I worked for Time Warner Music Duplication in NE Pennsylvania for eleven years, (CD's, cassettes, and vinyl), we all used to say "When they figure out how to put music on a chip, we're all out of a job.") How true that turned out to be...Came on board in 86', laid off in 97'. At least I got a decent pension out of it, which helps these days nicely! In any case, my 09' came with a CD player, which was put back in the original box. It had been installed before, in the left saddle bag. I'm OK with the spot, I don't use those bags that often anyway, but the mount on this thing is an abomination. The unit itself is surrounded by a thick rubber sleeve, about 1/2" thick, and harder than a car tire. I don't see how that will dampen anything. Then there is a folding simple cage that is supposed to go around the rubber sleeve, and has one factory mounting hole in it that upon inspection, I found the hole it bolts to in the sidewall of the plastic tray that is molded into the bag inbetween the lid locks. As best as I can tell, the bolt holds it to the thin plastic wall of the tray, and the weight is allowed to swivel down until the bottom left is on the bottom of the saddle bag? I tried putting it on end, but the hole doesn't line up. Ironically, the original car floor brackets are still in the box. I might put those in use before this is done. And all the instructions are there, in Spanish...The English ones are gone, probably put in the trash by the mechanic who installed it at the Yamaha dealer ten years ago! Take a look at the pics of it installed... Either way, there is a very clean hole in the back wall of the bag where the cable comes through, and it has a professional looking rubber grommet holding the cable as it comes through the hole. It looks factory. The hole in the wall of the little plastic tray also looks molded in, or one of the cleanest holes ever drilled into plastic. I have a couple problems with this setup. First, the metal bracket does not wrap itself properly around the rubber sleeve. I know the metal didn't get any smaller over the years, so I have to assume that somehow the rubber expanded a bit and now the bracket will not wrap properly and latch. You can see it in the pics. Second, the bolt that goes into the tray wall, that is just too thin of a plastic wall and I think in the very near future the CD player will break away and I'll have a broken tray inside the bag. The third and last thing is the ability to eject the cartridge even if the ignition is off. It is a feature of the unit. I had one of these exact same units in a car years ago, and the same glitch still exists - if the cartridge is empty, it keeps hunting, looking for a CD, even though there isn't one to be found. I always had to keep at least one in the player in my car unit, and this seems to be the same. Once it finds one, it stops at it, is happy, and stops using up your battery. No CD, keeps hunting in some sort of odd calibration setup or something. This may be why the previous owner, (two owners back actually, the one I bought it from never put it back in), took it out, or maybe for luggage space, or maybe he just didn't use CD's anymore. Ironically, the player plays exactly as advertised, and to be honest, it puts out a fairly high quality sound. I'd love to leave it in but not with that mounting system. I know a lot of you that have these have put them in the trunk, but since I tend to put helmets in the trunk, I think I'd like to leave it in the bag. And I already have the one hole in my saddle bag, I am not inclined to put another in the back of the trunk. I think I am going to look for a block of furniture cushion foam, (not cheap, by the way), that is a little thicker than the width of the inside of the bag. I'll take off the silly rubber sleeve off the CD player, and cut a block out of the foam, insert the CD player into the hole in the foam, and sit it on the floor of the bag with about two inches of foam below, and of course the foam all around the player, slightly tight to the inside walls of the bag. Should kind of float within the confines of the cushion foam, and help it from the bumps on the road. Keep it lower than the bag lid and all should be well. I certainly don't think it hurts the value of the bike, as long as it works. We'll see how it goes.

Seems like it would, doesn't it? But the wheelbase length stays the same. I should have mentioned that in my other post. The rear lowering is almost always a vertical drop of the rear tire. As long as the contact patch of the rear tire stays the same length away from contact patch of the front tire, the rake stays the same. What does change is the COG, center of gravity. With that dropping closer to the ground, and in some cases even moving somewhat backwards due to the vertical drop of the rear wheel, the bike now can corner easier and handle quicker. It becomes easier to swing that weight left or right when it is lower, and especially bring it back to center coming out of the turns. Here's a good example: If you have ever ridden on a twistie road, (who hasn't), did you ever raise your body in the turns, or did you have a tendency to lower your body in an effort to lower your weight? Nobody ever gets themselves higher, or up on the pegs into a turn - that is a good way to end up on your side. Even when you watch dirt track racing, you see the riders try to get their butts back into the seat when they go into turns after doing jumps or moguls where they might be up on the pegs. Gotta get that COG as low as possible getting into the turns so you can do them easier. You never see anyone raise their body going into a turn, they instead tend to hunker down into a turn, lowering the COG. Same effect when you lower the rear end of the bike permanently. Get the COG as low as possible, easier to turn.

Tire on the front is a 150. It has Dunlop Elite 3's on it now. My Midnight has Metzlers on it.

Grubsie: No, I have no desire to raise it back up. I'm a fan of lowered bikes, actually. This lowered Venture, when I brought it home, I noticed it immediately, the handling was just better than my Midnight. I thought at that time that maybe Yamaha had done some geometry homework, but now I know thanks to a company called Barrons, I have a lowered Venture. It will improve the handling in my mind, for a couple reasons. First off, shorter riders, (not really me, I'm about 5'11"), they can get a much better grip on the ground with their feet. Second, it lowers the center of gravity and pushes it backwards a bit. This helps with rolling the bike into turns. And for sure, I noticed it immediately that this bike can roll into a steep turn a bit easier than my Midnight, although not as easy as my Indian Roadmaster. The Indian handles better in turns due to the rake angle, which on the Indian Roadmaster is only 25 degrees, with a trail of 5.9" As another example, Harley Electra Glides have a rake of 26', with a nice large trail of 6.7" For those who don't know, Rake is the angle of the front forks as dictated by the head bearing/steering assembly welded to the main frame. Trail is the first point where the front tire contacts the ground, and ends at a vertical line drawn from the bottom point of the front fork straight to the ground. Anything from 4" to 6" is considered OK, but a slightly larger one is even a bit better, within reason. On the Yamaha Royal Venture and Midnight Venture, the rake angle is a strong 29.2 degrees, which is starting to get out there a bit. Trail is still good, at 6.1", but that more acute rake makes the stock bike just a bit harder to roll into a turn. (Think of those choppers we all used to love, with the 40-45 degree rakes that made the front forks extra long and the bike almost impossible to turn.) The lowering kit makes it all a bit easier, moving the COG back and helping the rider use their weight to get it into a turn. Won't make it turn any sharper, but a bit easier. Now that I've ridden both, I can honestly say that maneuvering and slow speed hard turns are a bit easier on the Venture that has been lowered. Seat height also plays a part. I believe the standard seat height on a stock Venture is 29.5", which is actually high by today's standards for a touring bike. My lowered one, compressing the pillow top, it goes down to about 28", much more tolerable. My Indian Roadmaster, the stock seat height is 26.5", and with the lowering kit I had installed, it is now 25.75", which is very low. Obviously I can throw the bike into turns rather easily, even though it has a wet weight of 930 lbs. I also can scrape the fishtail pipes if I'm not careful. Fortunately, the Roadmaster comes with a Fox rear air shock, capable of 0-120 lbs., so one up I keep it around 60 lbs., and two up I jack it up to around 75-80 lbs. Ironically, the Venture has a wet weight of 869 lbs., about 60 lbs. lighter than the Indian, and yet the Indian is easier in the twisties. As a third example, a 2019 HD Ultra comes in wet at 910 lbs. But it also has the rider a bit more forward on the frame, which changes a lot and in my mind, makes it harder to handle. My 2015 Ultra Limited Low was awkward to me. I only owned it for about 9 months. Of course, other things are in play, like wheel base, tire size, how high the engine is mounted in the frame, etc., but above are the basics. For instance, my Triumph Rocket III was one of the hardest bikes I ever owned to throw into a turn, mainly due to the 240MM rear tire which only wanted to go straight. Hard to get it off that large flat contact patch and onto the rounded part of the tire. In any case, it's all good, and I plan on changing the oil in my new lowered Venture today, as well as change the final oil. Brake pads are on the way... And I still plan on letting my Yamaha dealer balance the carbs and do a plug change, since I believe the plugs must be original and I'm pretty sure the carbs are now out of balance just a hair. Like I said in an earlier post, "Lower mileage, lower maintenance..." People think too much in terms of miles, and not enough in terms of time.

Condor and Freebird: I wondered about that the first minute I saw it, the pipes ran so much lower than my 05'. I asked, he didn't think so and I believe really didn't know, but with that doggone pillow-top seat, it seemed just as hard to throw a leg over, but once on, it definitely to my body seemed lower. If I just measure the pipes to the ground, maybe 1" lower? I have not gotten into it enough yet to know, but it would also be why it seems to handle better than my Midnight, and seems to be a bit better into turns. I have my Indian Roadmaster lowered 3/4", and cannot imagine owning another Roadmaster without lowering it. On this Yamaha and my Indian, I ride "in" them. On the Midnight, I tend to ride "on" that bike. Still just fine, but there is a difference. I'll keep it lowered, and good to have a couple of experts chime in to confirm what was in my mind, but didn't say because I just didn't know. Thanks!

In my other thread, "Updates to my "new" 05 Midnight Venture, I mentioned a Craigslist listing in my area, and how it kind of made me upset that I had just missed it, and bought the Midnight down in Georgia instead. (Hmmm, Midnight in Georgia, I like that!) In any case, last Sunday as my wife and I were leaving church, I mentioned to her how I was still a bit upset that the 09 Yamaha Venture showed up on CL just a couple of days after I had committed to the 05 Midnight. She surprised me by saying, "Well, why don't we just go and look at the bike? Call him this afternoon, see if it is still up for sale..." (Have I mentioned that I love this woman?!) So I called, and an older man answered. Here's the short story on the bike... Sold in Dalton, Georgia in late 2009, (original bill of sale from 2009 was still in the trunk net pocket) Apparently he kept it for a few years, didn't put many miles on her, and sold her to a friend of the guy who now owned it, a minister they referred to as "Brother Fred".(It's a Southern thing.) Brother Fred soon realized that he was way too committed to his job to put on many miles, so four months ago he sold it to the fellow I called. This fellow was a Harley rider for most of his life, along with his wife, but suffered a stroke about a year ago, and had gone through a pretty intense rehab. On the surface, he seemed normal, so he thought that maybe if I try something nice, but maybe a bit easier to handle, I could ride again? (I wouldn't have picked a Royal Venture, but that's just me. Maybe a 750 Honda Shadow or something...) Anyway, he buys the bike four months ago, puts a tank full of premium in it, and about 300 miles later, realizes he is still suffering a bit from the stroke, and the reflexes he needs to ride a bike are no longer there. In addition, his wife becomes diabetic, and they realize their riding days are over. He puts it up for a bit more than he paid for it, listing it at $6500 with 10,000 miles on her. The original owner paid $17,000 for the base bike in late 2009, and added $1858 in accessories, including passing lights, visors for all lights and turn signals, highway pegs for both rider and passenger, LEDs under the fairing (which I have not seen on yet, they come on with the key, but I have only seen it in daylight), the CD player, and the driver backrest, that little wing on the top of the trunk with red led strip, plus cables and headsets for helmets for the intercom. Pretty loaded up, to be honest. Strange to see a cassette player on a 2009. Heck, strange to see a carbonated bike in 2009! I enter the picture, and he says Tuesday, July 2nd would be a good day to see the bike. I live in Cleveland, TN, he lives in Hixson just North of Chattanooga, about 35 miles from my house. We show up and he's got a 25 year old Miata in mint condition, a convertible Thunderbird in mint condition, a 94 Ford pickup with one of those full cabs, (two full seats and doors, AND an eight foot bed, in very, very mint condition, polished concrete floors in his garage, and this Venture that would not look out of place on a showroom floor. I'm wondering how I am going to get him off his asking price of $6500... We introduce, take a good look at the bike, and I finally start her up and she coughs a bit, seems a bit off, and I think to myself, the carbs are not balanced. It revs up fine, and he says once warmed up, it is fine, but I have my opening. Also, the original CD player, for some reason the original owner had it located in the left side bag, and although the cable is there, the CD player is still in the box, looking like it came out years ago. Still don't know if that runs. I take a look at the bottom, clean as a whistle, no leaks. I am struggling to find any scratches, anything to help me lower this price. Finally, I see that the oil is not new. In my experience, low mileage bikes suffer from LACK of maintenance, not proper maintenance. So I bring out my best Richard Rawlings imitation where he claims you can buy a $20,000 car for $10,000 if you have the cash visible in your hand. I pull out $6000 and offer it right on the spot. He complains that is less than he paid for it. I say I can't remember ever making money on a motorcycle, (not true), but he has heard that trick before. We go around a bit before settling on $6100. NADA puts this bike somewhere in the $6200 range, with accessories on her, so OK by me. I agree to pick it up on Wednesday, giving me time to get the title and plate work done, and get an insurance binder. We write a bill of sale, trade the money, he gives me the title, and off we go. I picked her up on Wednesday, and my wife followed me home. Since it was almost empty, I filled it up with premium and added a good dose of Seafoam, to see if the carbs would clear up a bit. Gear whine was present, and it shifted loudly for my ear, but shifted easily. Handling was excellent, I had put 6 lbs, in the front forks and 25 lbs, in the rear. My wife said when we got home that no smoke of any types came out of the exhaust, and no, I didn't come close to scrapping pipes. Overall, it is now parked until I can get the oil changed with a new filter. As hot as it has been, it will get 20-50, not synthetic, with a new genuine Yamaha filter. I also will change the shaft drive fluid right away, and I will put synthetic in there. Everything works well, neutral is easy to find, and if I can quiet the whining a bit with new oil and a dollop of Motokote, I'll be happy. Oh, and it needs new brake pads. I would imagine these are the original pads. Did I steal it? Maybe...These are going for more than they are worth, (According to NADA not, but try to get this bike from any dealer for this price.), since people like them, they ride well, and they are known for putting on tons of miles. On the way home, I would realize that I would be doing 70 in a 55 quite often. A real mile eater. But for now, it is parked until oil, filter and final fluids are changed, and new pads installed. Then we'll have some fun. My wife still likes the black one better, but she does love this "Metallic Seashell", as Yamaha called it. I call it Champagne and Black. I don't know if the discreet pinstriping is stock or not. Oh, and he threw in two very nice helmets which never fit the new owners, (but these did!!), already wired up with the intercom headsets and mics. And one extra cable. He really is giving up riding...The ladies one looked totally unused. And yes, Condor, you were right...these are addicitive. No more bikes for me for a while. Here's a couple pics. Sorry it is parked tight into the others. My load of walnut for my woodworking business gets in the way.

Thank you for all the tips and suggestions. Looks like I might be busy in the coming months!

That's a nice bright light, Leo. I may have to consider that, since my Venture didn't come with the fog lights/bar. Just a headlight out there. Not enough, considering I'm still running the original style bulb. I don't normally ride at night, but still, in the daytime, good to have something that catches eyes...I always run my Indian with all three lit up. Those LED's put out a good amount of light.

Patch: Motokote says that it puts a coating on all metal surfaces. Of course that would include cylinder walls, but it would explain the ease of shifting that most of the Indian folks I know experienced, (me included), a few miles after adding Motokote. Of course the worry is that it will coat the steel plates on the clutch, and make the plates with the actual clutch material slip, but so far, over the months reading about experiences on the Indian forum, this is not what happens. And it certainly has not happened to me so far on my Indian, nor my Venture. I've been using it in my Indian for a little over two years now. The only thing I really noticed is that my mileage went up about 2 MPH, but that could also be just the engine breaking in. Either way, I'm sold. Others opinions will vary. For the record, I am NOT a big additive guy, and waited quite a few weeks, reading reviews, before I put any of it into my Indian. Then I put it in my lawnmower and that improved. But then I remembered how expensive it is, and said the heck with my weed whacker and leaf blowers!