YamahaParExcellence

(Sniff, sniff)...."Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" (Sniff, sniff.....) Blowing nose....wiping eyes... Joe reaches for another Kleenex....., "a question...how many freakin' cousins do you have? Wait...wait....don't answer...I don't need an answer...."

Puc...a deep down and dark---->Life secret... I have always wanted to own a classic BMW, horizontally opposed, air-cooled, from the day of my being in grade 9, onward. I would see a teach at our high school ride in on a 1967 or 1968 or '69 BMW 500 and/or 600, (not sure now...a long time ago...) the one with the ignition switch at the top of the headlight housing. Cantilever front naked suspension. Black..with that GORGEOUS enamel black and white BMW logo on both sides of the tank. Gawd.....gawd...I wanted one. Guys were dreaming about the good looking gals at school. I was dreaming of that new BMW 600 waiting for me...at the Beemer Dealership. That was the love of my life back then... Fast forward...to today. The closet thing to that, would be the RT1200...and gawd help me...if I ever rented that bike to ride...because a human being has limits...and the Devil knows and acts on that....and if it would be ANYTHING like the boy of the past thought it might...I'd be cutting a cheque at the dealer I rented from...and would be needing a good divorce lawyer...30 minutes after bringing it home... So..will I actually Bucket List/Rent that RT1200. HELL NO. Will I ever (Bucket List) take the Bavarian Tour with the BMW Factory...on the Beemer of my choice? HELL NO! That's not going to happen...I soon will be retiring...and I don't want to put a local divorce lawyer's daughter through college, or part pay for her wedding....not GOING TO HAPPEN! That...honestly...is my 'dirty little life secret' that until now only has been voiced, in the Confessional. "Whew...it feels so GOOD to finally come clean after all these years! Wow...everybody should do this, and Let 'er RIP! "Freedom...I am FREEEEEEEEEEEE!" Joe

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You betcha! My red van, my red Kawa, my just traded in red Wing, my favorite sweater, shirt...tie...they all agree. No argument, here....and oh...let's add the new RED SVTC to the fold. (Check Mark!), "and oh...when I get embarrassed, my RED face!" Joe

ChiefGunner brings up a good point that we sometimes forget. It's not only about Venture generations...but how dang big is the target engines to compare for heat output? All bikes tested, would have to be at least the highest common denominator...that being...all at almost 1,800 cc's... That's one metric alone that can skew any one-on-one end results. He brought up a very valid point. Some past generation Venture riders..say that their ride is cooler..ok...but besides the very obvious cooling formats of both the old and the 3rd Gen...isn't the 2nd Gen at least having 25 % less C.C. capacity? That alone, would skew results, to my way of thinking. I honestly think after reading all the posts, from other's and reviewing my own, is simply and elegantly...this: Owning a motorcycle, or even trying to convince one to buy or reject based on mechanics or electronic features, OR EVEN PERCEIVED OR APPLIED HEAT TO THE RIDER.....like the BORG......is futile. Totally futile. It is a toy after all, and a luxury item, unlike a car. It's ALL about the emotional and fun 'return' on owning that bike, that snow mobile, that boat... Bottom line...and always will be.....There are ten absolutely, the same, bikes in a row. The only difference in them, other than------->...same engine, same heat output, same saddle, same, same...the only difference for dang's sake, is the COLOR. Guess what...I picked the red one. Guess what...you picked the yellow one. Same bike..all the other bikes get picked up by another 8 riders...same bike...we ride away on different colors, is all. We ride, what attracts us. That's my new M.O. lol. If a guy or gal goes by on a skate board. ROCK ON! And it can be any color THEY WANT....LOLOLOLOL. Yep...new easy-peasy Joe-M.O. I won't try to convince anybody that the should be looking at the SVTC. They already have to WANT to...you can lead a horse to water...blah, blah..but yep..you can't make them drink. (large smile spanned across this entire post)! "Ride 'em, Cowboy!", 50cc, or 1800.cc...just ride 'em...

But...what if the rider's name is Will Robinson? I can see that come upon the screen...."Danger, WILL ROBINSON! Danger!...and oh BTW, your cable bill is one week overdue, and your wife wants you to pick up some milk, on the ride home...".

You know Puc...from my thread here...I am going to look up that vacation bike rental site that even has Harley's for rent in Hawaii...and JUST FOR, AND BECAUSE...and I really want to know...will be to rent (even with owning soon what I consider the actual top of the rider food chain, IMPO) on our next family visit vacation to L.A. and Phoenix...instead of a car...perhaps Diane and I, will (I'll pitch this to her...I'm thinking she is game...) rent a Road Glide Ultra..or an Electra Glide Ultra...whatever they have with a tour trunk...and whip around the Valley. (I before meeting her, lived in Van Nuys, Encino, North Hollywood, Santa Monica, etc) and then via a stay (for Mexican Town!!!!) in San Diego, will motor along 10 to Phoenix. That's where I think we can turn the bike in, and fly out of. So...I finally will get the 'what's it like to ride a Harley' off of my chest. Not to report it was either great or crap forum comments...nope. Just as a bucket list life event. Done deal...

"Absolutely...well said. That is why I for the most part discounted a lot of the YouTube Demo day YouTube bloggers, for that very reason. They were what...on the bike for 15-20 miles...and not mainly upon the interstate whereby this bike was bred and born to run? Sure ,you're going to experience some heat...but from some of the comments, wow...you'd think it was going to have you suffocate, cook your calve or thigh, like Prime Rib, or bodily, keel over in the saddle. I watched with more attention to how the bike seemed to accelerate, and bank in turns. The sound...the instrumentation. Did I focus on the heat comments at a red light? Not one bit. That..quite frankly is to be expected on such a massive cubic inch asset....my take, anyways."

Absolutely agree. that all rider experiences should be and hopefully will be posted. I wonder...could a person, put on a stand-off custom heat shield on the aft exhaust pipe that might work out better for their experience over the OEM? Also, that is the reason that I went for the lower wind deflectors. The more control to vector wind inwards, to wash over the metal, the better the heat management. I think that anybody that thinks about buying this ride...should seriously consider factoring in as a cost, the lower wind deflectors. To my mind, a very wise usage of customizing funds.

Chief Gunner...what a most informative post this is...and very well thought out logistical flow. Most encouraging to a new owner, but with having to date put no miles upon the actual bike. Totally agree that this bike with such a large displacement is going to put out natural heat. But..without even riding the bike..my wife and I have faith...that Yamaha had so much at stake,(so many millions of R and D, into this bike..) that if they thought by test track and camouflaged, real-world riding...if they thought for one second that to most median/metric riders, being air/oil cooled was going to be fatal to the bike..they never would have proceeded and brought the bike to market. They're not idiots! So...your in-depth rider (over 5,000 miles ) experience, properly mimics what in theory, my wife and I thought would be ours. Great to read...and most encouraging! Thanks for posting. I intend to revisit this thread, and post my/our rider comments to what we found, in taking this beaut down the road. I especially reacted to your comment that this is not by design, meant to be an every day, purchased for this event...a stop and go, commuter ride. Absolutely...that was in our mind..that for the most part..you are always going to be moving, whether at 30 mph..or at 80 mph. Yep...your actual account, parallels our 'expected' usage profile. Great to read...! Post Edit: BTW, Chief...tried to PM reply you...and I keep getting this error : Sorry YamahaParExcellence, you are not allowed to post links in PM's messages. Can't seem to get a reply out to PM's.... I have no links in the reply box, message body...so no joy... The only way to give you an acknowledgement, was this...I just can't get PM replies to be accepted by the forum system.

I really tried to nail down my HD rep yesterday with how much of a bang-for-the-cooling-buck was cooling the cylinder heads...and how that affected the cockpit. As stated..he said, sure, it helps...but the real game-play, was in '17...(funny, the year the Mich 8 and water head cooling (back up strategy, but a good one!....hmmm..) when they moved both Cat's aft of the co-rider's foot boards, so downwind of the cockpit and both riders. He said that was the secret to a much cooler ride. I'm going to have to ask my Yama dealer, exactly where on the SVTC are both Cats? I thought that they were also, aft and below the cockpit, proper.

Ok..will attend that thread, from further on. Good idea!

BTW Yooper...with your 150 miles sojourn in...what's your personal take on the rear cylinder exhaust temperature when riding? Yours, or your co-riders? Did it affect either of you, or your enjoyment factor?

Thanks for the reply. That is how I figured it would go down...as you say, or by means of two..as my alternative. I just didn't' understand why someone would loosen off the bar clamp so much, that the handle bars would free-fall by its own weight, to strike upon the tank. I just would never, and have never loosened off a clamp (like the handlebar clamp) to have that chance happen. That's what I am going to do then...merely and slowly back off the torque, until you can tap, it down or up into your personal preference, and then torque wrench the clamp to specs. I'm still going to place mechanic's pads on top of the tank...for due diligence...but don't expect to have to use them as a 'whoa...that was close!' moment. Thanks

Hi Puc, last night after you posted, I grabbed my trusty, dusty, cup of coffee and hunkered down, and read his entire contribution. As I was reading...it truly dawned on me...that (because this person is a unique individual), he found that the heat was uncomfortable for him. Also the stock seat became uncomfortable for him, in as early as 30 miles, and he needed to use his Air Hawk pad upon it. Also, that I read, this person suffers from joint stiffness, has a sore neck after hours in the saddle, and of course this can adversely affect his comfort, perhaps on any ride. So what did I glean from that article, more actually than his personal likes, and of course dislikes...is that (including mine!) we are giving our own personal usage and opinion, and how the bike (any bike) affects...US. He could have handed that bike to another rider, and he/she would (who is to say?) never even bring up any sort of heat issue making him/her, feel body-uncomfortable...because in his/her case,...quite frankly, it didn't! Will ChiefGunner and I have the exact ride experience? Frankly, I don't know Puc. We are two individuals...different body sizes, different tolerances to wind, heat, pain, musculature...all of that. I doubt our riding feed-back will be mirror images. So, in a nutshell, I think that as you say...as you say, ....everybody can read about another's riding experience on any blah-blah bike...can read about their unique interaction, likes and dislikes about said bike....but...what only and truly matters...is what the due diligence rider thinks about the bike, either on faith...and intelligent expectation, or even better yet, as you say, RIDE THE BIKE (if able to do so..() BEFORE YOU LAY OUT THE COIN! In Canada, I have never found dealers willing to allow you to ride their stock. I have seen this many times on YouTube videos in the States. Yes..we have manufacturer demo day rides...but for the any-time-you-want event...that to me, was never (to date) offered. So, all my bikes over the last 50 years, were purchased by going to the dealer...sitting on the floor model...interacting only on that level...but riding out upon the road? Never happened, as an every-day, customer walk in. Oh..I should correct that...for new bikes. For a used bike, yes, you could ride it. Just not new stock. Up here, anyways.

Wow..interesting post. I didn't want to really try and dicker yesterday either, for I had no real intention, of entering honest negotiations....and if so, that would have been bad form. After all info and opinions gleaned from my thread, I 'just had to know' the lay of the land, Harley-wise..so paid a visit. I clearly saw that the rep was hungry to land a deal, but still, and clearly stated, no negotiations on price...here's the MSRP, and that's that. He was talking about giving me some lee-way (barter trade in other words) through issuing a HD gift card. For how much, was never extended in our intercourse. I'm just about to call, to clarify if we were indeed talking about the Road Glide ULTRA model, regarding if the actual radios, (Sirius Sat and C.B.) come standard and operate at MSRP. I'll report right back ASAP. Also Freebird, none of those modules, or the heated seat and grips, were ever offered as a deal incentive or sweetener...not a one. It was like...at HD, this is what we do...and you're gonna love it! I'll get right back... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Post Edit, Puc...Freebird, everybody reading this, I JUST got off with my HD dealer that I was talking to yesterday, but even another rep who just confirmed: ...and For the 2018 model year the Road Glide ULTRA...stock, MSRP and sitting on the floor, DOES NOT COME WITH FULL SIRIUS, OR C.B. CAPABILITY. YOU MUST PURCHASE THE ADD-ON RADIO MODULES that I indeed accurately related in my original top post. The BoomBox 6.5 is only as MSRP, 'compatible' if you should wish to have Sirius Sat or C.B. capability. Again, this IS information given to me for the ULTRA, not the standard Road Glide. They do not have those two radios, as fully capable on the 2018 model of this bike. He and She said, that ONLY the CVO this year comes with Sirius, and a three month subscription, just like the Yamaha SVTC (in Canada) comes with. BTW, this was a female rep that I spoke with. So two reps verified, it only comes with the capability should you wish to have those two functions. Want them...and it's adding at extra cost, the modules for both radios.... So..accurate info, Puc. At least for stated, in Canada for 2018. Interesting side note, I asked about that CVO model...over $50,000.00 CDN, and it only had the Sirius Module already installed, ready to go...with subscription, but not the C.B. module. You still at that price level, had to pony up to put in the C.B. module to allow you that function. I have no personal issues with HD as a brand. None whatsoever, and probably would have gone that route, had I not had a successful conclusion to my waiting at the alter on the SVTC, but in no way, Puc, does an HD, at MSRP, come even close to the feature set, on a 2018, to 2018 with a Yamaha Star Venture Trans Continental model. Even the CVO...the Harley top of the food chain...doesn't have Harley Davidson (in Canada) giving you for the MSRP, a working C.B. radio...you..(can't believe this, actually) still need to pony up, and buy and (labor cost) have the C.B. module and antenna installed.

Yep...will take it there

What about if the rider was holding both grips..and somebody else loosened off the hold down...then you move it up or down to your position...and they immediately, properly torque the nuts down. Would that work...or is the whole handlebar so heavy, it could slip out of your hands once loosened and chance strike the tank?

To be able to demo (a serious demo...)like renting a car for a weekend...too bad you really can't do that with bikes...would be great, but I don't know if your description of wanting to get 'burned/baked' would apply to myself or my wife. We anticipate engine heat, and in our leading up to, and following after, our summer core riding season, will certainly welcome it. Puc..I just can't imagine that Yamaha with so many (I'll play it safe...) hundreds of hours in wind tunnels...and perhaps as long, in camouflaged live riding scenarios, would allow their good name to even be laid out on a scale, to balance, if there was a serious, again, a serious heat issue with this bike, under most median riding/touring conditions. Yes...if i was running down in Death Valley in June or July...there might be issues with this bike. Heck, there would be issues with my 750cc Kawa 4, under the same meteorological conditions. But..in real life, would I even attempt to run in places that even having a helmet on, would have sweat POURING down my back...well no. I just would not consider it. So for my wife and I...we'd only plan to take on Phoenix in the months of May..(so to get down there, through Oklahoma without blizzards) and so on. For those that live in Florida...year round, I wonder if I would even HAVE a bike...but then again, some down there, ride without brain protection...so perhaps that's their gamble to a heat management solution. Now...without any prior experience with a large bore air/oil cooled V-Twin motor...all my comments, are rather subjective. No riding experience to back any of them up. That will this summer, be taken care of...and I will sort of blog, as we go. I will also be totally truthful and honest. If there is no discomfort felt to either myself or my wife...as to engine heat output...which of course there will be generated...then I will happily blog that. If there is...I'll eat crow...and state in hindsight, this was a mistake for us, in hindsight. My wife and I carefully scoured every written article or blog that we could find on matters of large bore V-twin touring and ownership...and could not find one article that absolutely by language warned you of perhaps a risk of physical harm (burns to the flesh) Most said that the engine and exit exhausts, generated heat...so be warned of that. But Puc...so did every other bike that was air/oil cooled that I have ever owned...with some having a displacement of 1000cc's. Right now in Ontario, around Toronto, it's getting to be nominally 60-66 F...and that is what I expect to ride home in. I'm going to make notes...of my comfort zone, with each 5 degree rise of ambient temperature this summer...as well as the humidex. It will be interesting to log and track. My take, my intelligent take, even having not even ridden a mile on the SVTC...is that we won't have any condition, that will foment regret. If anything, Puc...comfort. Not a wish to burn/cook/braise/swelter...but a gentle warmth that actually stimulates good blood circulation. That is what we anticipate sitting behind those two humongous cylinder towers... I'll let you know...as the miles and months pass. Open and honest, it will be....

Puc, I have one difficulty with one of your poll selections. The one about Ventures/Eluders are sold out in my area. Yes...and no. Some dealers still have an Eluder. That actually was not the model in Ontario, in rare supply. It was the SVTC...so, my answer to that poll would be...Yes...for the SVTC. Still some Eluders on showroom floors around Toronto and greater area. There was one red SVTC I was watching in London, Ontario...but it now has a 500.00 hold deposit on it...so technically, it is also gone. That huge Yamaha dealer will be getting no more '18's this year...and is totally pissed off. I spoke with his wife...they are having great call-in traffic, on the SVTC's, but no bikes to offer those possible clients. What a situation to be in....terrible. All of the Eluders that I have been playfully monitoring around Toronto...are still alive on the showroom floors. I think Canadians are more into full tour..than baggers. Just my seeing what's happening on the Eluder front, in around Toronto. Post Edit: This brings me to a pondering point. If you say that in your area, the uptake for the SVTC has been anemic...why would not Yamaha USA...TRANSFER those units out of American dealerships..and not fulfill demand north of the border?!? To have them sitting there...with people looking for one, in Ontario...this is plain nuts...look how long it took for Yamaha to fill my order...just nuts... Anyways, a thought...

Chief...can you address the question about real life, heat generation on your SVTC. How did it feel to you, on your 80F day ride? Both Puc and I would be very interested on your reply to this question. Did you find it in any way uncomfortable, to the effect that it was foremost and always on your mind during your time in the saddle? Thanks. Joe

Right...those gloves were going to be used on my Kawasaki ZR7S, Chief..but for my gal...she could use them at her seating position on the SVTC. BTW...can you please comment right now, if you have found during your 5,000 miles so far..if generated engine heat...has in any way affected your pleasure, or 'quality' of your riding experience, even at that day of 80F? Puc and I are in discussion that that can be a minus on the 'want this bike' ballot. What has your personal experience been, so far?

About the heat ...Puc...I have not heard one person talk about heat so bad...that it marred their ride, from forum members here lucky enough to have been riding. Also...heat certainly gets generated from my 4 cylinder air/oil cooled Kawa...but nowhere near any level of true notability. Just a slight air temp rise, totally comfortable. Also to mention, that my ZR-7S's engine sits completely out in front of me, in the air stream...and comes back on me. Heat? Nothing to even mention. Actually, I don't even think about it... I think that the members here, are honest enough, that if they had any type of heat, at a level of rabid discomfort...they would certainly make mention of it. Nobody has...ChiefGunner has over 5,000 miles of active riding...and nothing from any of his posts...is where heat comes front and center...to the point that ruins the ride and experience. I certainly will honestly say, if I find any engine heat...to be a red flag. That only helps another's decision. I will say that heat was a killer on the Ultra's (the rep's words) on as late as the 17's...for on the 18's...they moved the cat's back behind the co-rider's foot boards. I think it was 17, or perhaps the 16 model year. I asked about the twin cool...and he said that it does help, but it was actually moving both CATS back behind the cockpit that really made a difference to both the rider and co-rider. I didn't even know, of course that HD did that...but he quickly mentioned what has changed on the Ultra model, to effect a cooler cockpit environment. The CATS...were the killer here, according to him, and not so much the top end of the motor...for that is only what is partially cooled. I wonder where the CATS are on the SVTC. Aren't they actually below the bike...and in the open air flow, unhindered? Chief...wanna step in here? Where are the CATS on your bike? BTW, Puc...I did go for the heel and toe...and that was about just over $500.00 dollars to put on. That, if taking everything else as standard equipment, vs. the HD ultra...would be IMHO, a drop in the bucket. Also to be fair, one would have to add (which I did also) the rear brake pedal, rather than the prong that comes standard. That was around $208.00 so let's say I have to add $700.00 to the SVTC. Certainly a far cry from to bring the Ultra up to the feature set of the SVTC. I think that we have to discount what we ourselves would want to have on the bike...in other words, whether one would want to add heated seats and grips to the Ultra...but...if this is a fair feature set comparison...we must. For the same (as you point out) within a few hundred dollars MSRP...which bike, has the greatest and varied features as regards the 'opponent'. Clearly the SVTC out strips the MSRP Ultra. I will get clarification on those two radios, tomorrow, that you can be sure...but all the other items that were discussed by me, with the sales rep...was basically rattling off what comes with the SVTC..and his advising me of what it would cost, to add those features to the Ultra (for delivery). Apples to apples... Joe

I'm going to call the dealership tomorrow..and ask them once more...about the feature set as standard....will post the results of that conversation. We were talking about the Ultra...that was clear...and he said that the Boombox 6.5 has the built in capabilities..but only if you add the modules... I call for clarification from another person at the dealership. Oh...also, we were standing over the bike..and it had the tour box on it. Only the Road Glide Ultra has that...for the other ones...are merely baggers.

Puc..I intend to call the dealership once more...and seek clarification that indeed he was speaking to me about the Ultra...as he heard me ask about. That was the only model I was interested in. I'll report that clarification ASAP. He did keep mentioning that the Ultra (he used that word) has the capabilities to integrate the modules...but as stock from the factory...you do not have those radios. I'll report back tomorrow.

Great suggestion. I'll call them about it. Or..I might just wanna get out of there...and ride home. I'll check my version against yours, next week..and if mine is newer (was just fresh baked off the Yama assembly line..) then you'll have the FYI. If yours is...then I will have them update at the 600 mile oil change, and drive belt tension check.