Patch

part 4/4 So not much left to do at this point except play time with my carbs! You can see below in the pics my carb tuning, the results are “funtastic” because- bringing these old bikes back is fun and also rewarding! One of the pics will be hard to read, it is a scope or dynamic mode of the combustion cycle base on manifold pressures, all I can say is that its as good as I’ve seen on any engine in a long time, very pleased! The other you see the spread on the sync, what you don’t see is I had to switch to 2-20 cmHg just to find them, then the final set was upscale 20-40 I think standard is 33? Anyways I traded sync low for 3000 RPM, overall this works best for me, at idle they are very close even cold, even with enricher slightly on. I am prone to WOT when cracking the whip, so a low sync for me is .......! Earlier I mentioned compression means nothing without the low pressure, I’d like to share this with you folks. Of course mechanics understand this but tuners live this, there is no tuning without balance, without balance an engine is a put-put (not sure that English)! Combustion: pressure, seating, heat, duration(s), timing(s), velocity, these are what I was after, this is what was corrected! So how or why does a simple yet time consuming soak address these issues most, don’t understand? It’s pretty simple and I will stay as short as I can: 1st the rings, they are actually spring rings and they float, they also need to rotate, how about cupping; an engine not properly stored will develop “stuck ring” issues! It will free itself! I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard that? It may eventually, who knows, what we do know is that it’s not springing, not rotating and it certainly can’t cup or expand (design dependent) to lock in compression. Also it is not symmetrical as it travels up and the walls, so we are effectively wearing the wall out of cylindrical! 2nd valve seats, some of them have been clamped shoot for X years, they develop mild corrosion preventing proper seating, again you won’t be able to achieve good compression! Yet there is more to it, compression will slip past a seat when it builds to its near maximum, this means it moving fast,- up and out the wrong way, and when it is not suppose to move at all it stay put, squished tight in the combustion chamber, with resulting compression heat till ignition; now it moving past where it knocks against the throttle plate! Older Suzi’s cough when they are cold its excepted and understood, my bike was coughing warm at idle and it was steady and for the most part only on #1 ! There is no more cough, cold or warm, box or no box, period! 3rd we need velocity, that is why valve timing and duration is such that the valve opens after TDC. An engine will burn fuel even at 120 or 100 PSI With enough force to cycle the piston stroke, but it cannot do so efficiently with a CV carb; it will also negate most of the vortex, so mixing at or for “stoichi”, forget about it, it’s a put-put not a sports machine! My Venture is a fun ride now, it moves quick now, engine braking is spot on smooth and sure footed! Also I shifted into 5th at a 100 KLm and though surprised to be there (in traffic) I was able to pull out and accelerate without shifting? Also I can start out in 2nd it pulls out like my old 1st did!!! Please don’t read in to this as that, it is more than it was designed to be; I am merely saying overall I am happy with bringing it back to and experiencing the original specs! I hope this helps some of you wanting the challenge of getting your old bike back up on her legs; my Venture was the 3rd engine this year for us that went through this, the other, had even less millage then mine, one of which is a modified engine Suzi sport touring more R than F and a Suzi V twin. My Venture cost me this year, new oil and filter, I’ll also have 4 new boots whenever sock is available and 4 piolet screw, let’s say $160.00. Now bring this to a shop see what happens, most likely a chem down the tank? Good luck with your project, if I can help, ask. SG/Patch’s

Part 3 Ok I have been through this many times and know what to do and want to share this with you! The 1st time I did this, I was 15, was on my Norton there have been many projects since those innocent days;) Time to soak the top ends, it’s that simple! Do this to your bike after a long storage as part of the process of getting the Bike’s back into proper shape, it will go a long ways to bringing back the power. The 1st soak for me is always Kerosene/lamp oil, let it soak for 12ish hours, after 4 hours just give it a quick blip with the starter, ZERO ROTATION: the idea is to crack it or shock it, so the fluid will continue to penetrate! Here is how the process goes: Also and throughout this I fill the intake ports- each soak includes these ports, very important! Remove spark plugs; do not re-install them at anytime - while you have – fluids - above a piston, never!! Using a funnel poor in the Kerosene one third -1/3- of a cup into each cylinder! Likely after 12 hours the fluid has seeped past and is now in the oil pan; if not, you can choose to blow it out or rotate the engine and it will pump out, catch it with rags! Using the starter you can now rotate the engine 4 or 5 time: no spark plugs install the cylinders they are free to vent! Now at this point I use Deep Creep, what a good versatile product this stuff has turned out to be! I spray for 4 seconds into each cylinder through the spark port, usually after 2 hours of soak this fluid creeps down. Now you are ready for another compression check, here’s how mine went: #1 = 230 I have a picture of the gauge I used below, this is why we never install a spark plug when soaking an engine! #2 = 230 #3 =160 better but not accurate yet also just being stubborn! #4 = 170 perfect and standard I installed the carbs after a bench sync I blew out #s 1,2,4 checked for fluid in #3 using a red 1/8 vacuum house, and just the bottom of the hose appeared wet; there was NO measurable level of fluid in #3 ! I brushed the plugs clean and ran it for 10 minutes @1000 rpm to raise engine temperature, pulled all the plugs again then gave them all another 4 second spurt of deep creep and let it sit overnight. Thursday morning I blew them all out did a compression check, and they were standard on 1, 2, 4, 160 still on #3 , bummer! Once again I installed the plugs and let it run for 10 minutes @1000 rpm except I let it cool for 20 minutes I ran it again for 20 minutes then pulled #3 plug let it soak for another 30 minutes with Deep Creep and then blew it out installed the plug and ran it again, this time till the cooling fan came on, I shut it off turn the shop fan on to cool it, pulled the plug checked the compression, and bingo #3 170 standard you can see the pic below however it caught the flash so... but it’s there! SG/Patch's

Well you did the right thing Clive! In the end we are a sum of our experiences! I do know what being blown of a highway is like. I also have had many bikes and many trips under my belt. Setting up a bike for the individual rider is different rider to rider. I don't think any bike any make any where, is a perfect set up for everyone, so I am particular to how a bike handles and have reason to change my windscreen, so I did this I took it out yesterday specifically went through a wind corridor in a bluff area. While it is always a sobering experience up there I thought it handle better in those wind gusts and to boot I enjoy the feeling of the air moving over my shoulders, I know I'm on a bike! 90% of my time riding is one up. As for the the paint scheme, that is my bike, not a show bike for original condition;) Cheers man

part 2 2014 no time to ride or for projects, bummer. This year after 4 projects rapped up this spring I pulled her in to the shop, here is what I found: A persistent cough on #1 Dripping gas from the main (needle/emulsion tube) #1 & 4 #3 slide consistent pulse? At 950 RPM Carb body very dirty I pulled the plugs 1, 2, 4 were in decadent shape #3 was nearly spotless? Checked for spark, excellent? Removed the carbs, a note that I know many of you know; remove the CPV hose completely, why fight or risk bending/cracking or breaking something you will only have to wait for in the mail. At the top of the carb is a small plate about 2 ½” X 1 ¼” with 4 screws I found this is easy to remove while the carbs are still secured, using an impact with a #2 Philips with the tip ground down OR a drywall Phillips bit works as well! Sliding the carbs out the left side you will have fair access to the linkage with a dental pick, at least this worked for me, I’m sure there are other ways. I soaked the carbs in lamp oil over night, usually this helps loosen old screws as well as soften the scum up, and then I soak them in a warm bath for 30ish minutes. Presoaking for us in our little shop helps keep the bath clean with less junk to filter out or through parts, also means we heat the bath less, so less evap! Anyways you’ll likely struggle with the bracket screws even with impact and #1 Phillips, be ready to drill, I use a punch type extractor, quick, easy and it’s a sure bet. The carbs inside were much nicer than expected, clean blows, no real varnish, gates were nice, (one thing we see often with stock pump system, verses constant gravity) what I did find was the O-rings for the tubes were finished, AND a missing Piolet jet screw, on #3 ! Also #4 was 7 ½ turns out, yikes! I replaced the O-rings and I had a set of piolets in stainless but the threads are shorter by a 1/3 so I replaced it and am waiting for new piolets! The slides, well the pistons are very good so are the needles, the boots are worn; I am waiting for an email regarding re-stocking I will replace all 4. In the meantime I patched them using ½’ X ¼” patches from my shop gloves; they work well for this with a thin coat of liquid gasket, the patch is placed on the outside of the boot and the liquid gasket is place on both sides, I’ve done this many times, never a failure –BUT the boots are old and tend to be slower, so, while many won’t notice this- it is still in play and will make a difference when cracking the whip! While the carbs were soaking I did the compression checks, here’s what I found: #1 = 150 not terrible and hopefully the worst of it #2 = 120 ok I have to admit I was feeling sheepish around about then #3 = 60 that’s sixty! Going to stop the ride for a minute; I want to stress this point with the hopeful members. It is far better to know this then not to know: only hover over a bike wondering why the heck you can’t keep up, hard to start, slow to get on her legs, can’t use 5th, and your gas mileage is pretty OK but it reeks! Here’s my trip, compression is a must- no doubt we need to keep this up –BUT compressing is nothing without the resulting LOW PRESSURE! Throttle response is all important, it will bear you down into a twisty, tweaking it through it will help you maintain knee drag, it will quickly lift you up and out of a twist, it will pull you through the buffering of a semi, up a hill, the only thing more important than throttle response, other than common-sense are properly working brakes! Let’s remember bike are sport machines they need to be run within design limits, period! #4 190 Because I have and use the shop manual I can clearly see the picture for this engine. I have only one cylinder within spec. Would any of you like to take a stab at which one it is and why, regardless of how many post go by? I think if you are willing to then you will gain from the mechanics here as they chime in with their experiences at the end! Sorry thought I had uploaded pics from my phone.... I'll add the patched boots tonight!

Part 1 of 4 ? Hi there, so this write-up is about our Venture Royal, the work behind it, what it took to not just get her back to running condition, but rather get her back to the responsive touring bike I’ve read (had yet to experience) she is! First things I did was try to ready it the 1st season for a short trip up and in BC with my boys. I went through the wiring one plug at a time; things seemed to be in pretty good shape! What I like about doing this with a “new to me bike” is that it formularises me with the systems and what might go wrong, where it is located and in a pinch if need be, I can sort through a problem quickly while on the road! Next I move on to the brakes and suspension, here is some of what I did: Drained ALL the hydraulic fluids- brakes, clutch, forks, and “fork air lines” Chained out the front springs with some I had from another project Changed the brake pads front and rear Change the dif oil, Changed steering stem bearings Disassembled the air control panel, cleaned with contact chemical Replaced burnt lights and fuses Replaced the tires Changed out the handle grips for 1” rubber/chrome type, I need the larger grips as my R/hand is a rebuilt unit. Some 30 years back I had a one on one with a hydrant;( You know they said it was my fault? Even though I assured them I wasn’t the fool that placed it there? Hydrants go on the inside of a bend! Not the outside of a bend!( Lubed the drive shaft spline with synthetic grease- I have come to respect the synthetic grease for each application where grease is called for; it stays put, stays bright in color, resists washing out- even when exposed to solvents, and in my experience maintains a cooler bearing, and also important is that it remains consistent- I add it to all my replacement bearings with an epoxy syringe! Took it for a ride, I found on the Mountain roads when the suspension was properly set and with 2 up and camping gear she could sweet talk a twist very well; however I was disappointed in the thrust! SG/Patch's

Read all the posts to your thread and must say, you have received some very good advice! Something I do a lot of is abandoned bikes, -next to my ear a vacuum gauge is my favorite tool! The vacuum gauge you describe is designed for use with a "plenum chamber" that is why you are seeing a difficult to read "readings"! You can not use this for syncing the carbs! However you can use this to read fuel pump pressure! Also if you spend the membership fee I will tell you the results of the vacuum gauge readings and how to come up with the two numbers nessary to move forward! SG

Hello fellow Venture owners. This is our 1st and only Yamaha, -and a bike that has always peeked my interest. I found this one 2 years back in a small town on the Northern edge of Alberta; a one owner bike 73K (klm), left in the yard for I think 4 or 7 years rarely run! My ride back was a tough one mainly due to weather, I left there late drove much of the night in a cold rain, prairie winds and on old tires. l I found that a steady wind on the beam was something this bike could handle well, providing the wind was steady, gusts or confused winds which we get plenty of, I found that the windshield and trunk seem to get pulled on:( unlike like my old Cade. By the time I got home I had a dislike for this windscreen! I seem to hunt for my line in a curve found this to be "un-relaxing" simply did not like all the opaque lines the eye finds looking through it, also that the factory height causes the flattish top to drag rather than lift flow over. So like many of you I am making changes to it- here’s pic's of the 1st change, likely by the time I finish tuning it, it will be close to the blacked out area. For the record I wear a full-face helmet, it hides my years;) and I also ride sport bikes so enjoy some draft! I have some interesting engine work I just completed which I'll post later, good information for someone getting their Venture ready for touring after a long park! SG

I found this suspension tuning guide/lingo I think many of you will like. http://www.mrcycles.com/custompage2.asp?pg=suspension S/G

Thinking if this is just a sudden event, I would compression test 1st, warm engine 5 rotations if that shows well or at least even Peder schedule is the way to go. S/G

Petder thanks for post the video. I have done quit a bit of work on my bike and was disappointed when this started to happen, I only remember this experience once before on the 1st mono swing arm 500 back early 80s. Here is my VR experience over the past two weeks, new Shinko tire 120klm felt like the rear was running on ice, after 300klm on them they settled down, on the Q2 here in Alberta last week- now have 1500 klm on the tires I went to pass a double tanker on the HW when the weave hit hard and fast at 125klm, now had some weight in the compartments a little heavier on the right saddle, I am light weight eased up and backed off. Same ride say 800 klm later, less wind I would only get a mild weave at 130klm nothing else changed but the extra milage and the wind. I like the tires mind you there sticky wet and dry quiet too, so I will monitor her behavior near future see what if any changes. Now I have to tell you I checked the brace for loose fit or cracks when I parked that night, having already checked the swing arm! I've had my old Cade way faster with more load in the bags and trunk never experienced weave, it has the super brace. S/G

Hi Mralex, the thing is you have good diaphragms if you were to stiffen the springs you would only slow the opening of the slide as for the closing of them that would be mute. The springs are simply a balance between low pressure and high pressure. You didn't mention your compression results and the reason I asked is as you know the other side of that is expected vacuum, for example are the valve seating are the rings sharp enough to vacuum enough so that the CV carb's can work within there limits. Now heres one for you, my son and I just did a small road trip and before leaving, he road the Kat 1100 which we have played the carbs many times with different configurations, he was saying that the rpms weren't behaving well and that the milage seemed some what off, but that the power band was strong all the way through! So pull the air box ran the carbs through there paces, heres what I found the number one slide had the lower washer/bushing that the spring seats to incorrectly placed and acted as a shim, like lowering the needle clip or seating the needle high. So what I expected when I saw the gas jetting through at under 3000 was a worn needle or seat that would be what you are refering to with your thought of stiffening the spring seating the needle with more pressure. If you don't see gas jetting out or a "wet ring around the jet at low rpm's then there is no problem there, if you do than check needle for ware or out of round jet! Tracking down poor milage isn't easy but the compression results are a good place to start, next is valve lash, when that meets the bench mark then you tune the carbs accordingly. Hope this helps you figure out what is a miss with the bike. S/G

God that there movement is controlled, or you might need more then springs. Springs are a tuning nightmare if you needed to then if it were me I would make sure they are exactly the right part #. Like Flyinfool said clean inspect them and roll the needles on a clean flat surface, again I use wd for that and a lint free rag. S/G

Evan did you check the o-ring's at the solenoid, there are 3 back there under the trunk/seat. Also if there is oil in the fork air line you will get a false reading when you air them up, and it will appear that you have a leak but not necessarily. S/G

if it were I experiencing this problem, I would remove the carbs using small drill bits I would measure the gap between throttle plate and housing 1st what is the gap and are they=, next I would remove each slide clean them with wd and a lint free cloth, I would roll each needle one by one insuring each is straight with no ware they should be shiny each should be reassembled the same, if not then let the group know, last I would change the gaskets for each manifold I would suspect them as a likely cause. put all the caps back on the vacuum ports. By checking the position of the throttle plate with the drill bits you will be starting the bike with synced carbs, it's rough and only the 1st setting of the plates but thats a must, after that you sink to the pressure differential by syncing them at rpm. That's how I do it and I do it often, I also use a vacuummate unit "I love that that thing" you ruled out the enricher! S/G

My experience would say no. why do you need to change them? have you done a compression test? S/G

Riding for many years, many bikes, many friends, many shapes sizes some with- some without the common courtesy of a roach I prefer to ride alone now or with my boys. As time has passed I have mellowed towards other people (s) spoken aloud thoughts that would better serve the privacy and echo of their own minds. I have also raised two boys now men, mild mannered respectful adventuress, aware that not all youths road their trails! I believe in this would lay their future protective response to such an experience to their protected ones. We are who we become because of what will we have had to overcome, and the will to move forward; I have come to believe firmly! So make peace with it, accept yesterday, if we want respect we need to respect others and what makes them, them, we don't have to be their friends accept their judgement's or even remember them! May the voices in your head be happy ones;) enjoyed the post, thanks S/G (Patch's)

Thanks dingy, I just found that out while tracing the lines back, I have never come across this before! So regardless of the cc volume, inches decide! That is what I've done in the past just wanted to be confident based on Venture rider experience. S/G

Hi guys, I'm combining two questions in this post looking for a short cut to solving front end problems! 91 Venture Royal 68000klm one owner sat for about 10 years: I have been going through the bike cotter pin to cotter pin, have found and fixed many small items like suspension controls, control panel, suspension pump and solenoids (oil found in front solenoid) all is working well with the system NO ERAS; read many post about fork springs and hate to ask but, 410cc gave me 8 1/4 r/fork 9 1/2" L/fork I top them off to "equal" 8 1/4" by adding about 35cc then added 30 cc to each and finished of with 7 1/2" on both, left fork having 475cc right having 440cc! Would your experiences say for this bike I made the right choice? Next not sure on is front brakes, wanting to change out fluid I hooked up my gear to the right cal till I had a clean flow, but the left will not operate, I pulled the cal and it is operating fine NO sticking, it must be from the spitter. Is there a known problem up there? Thanks Guys S/G

Thanks stanG for sparing me the same fate of luck; seems like if it's not women steering our luck it's our bikes;) For next time though you might try this: 1/8" x 2" spring toggle you'll need the 2", move out of it's seat the 1/2 round cup bushing inside the casing, ( we r adding a rattle but) drill a 5/16 hole at the base of the stand between the two mounting holes ( a little tricky as the stand is angled) insert the toggle screw I added a star washer for bite through and past the original factory thread, assemble the stand remaining cup bushing and rubber boot' add a touch of grease not much to the cups, screw the spring toggle on let the screw thread go pass past 1/8", pinch and insert the toggle into the mirror housing, insert a small driver through the same 5/16" hole as you passed the screw head through tighten up move it around and tighten till working well. If it were to loosen some day and you used a star washer you should be able to re-tight a bit by rotating the mirror while on the bike or maybe grab the screw head with small pliers set while you rotate the housing but it's a small thread don't over do it!! see u around S/G

Mirror issue: snapped the retaining screw seems simple enough to repair if I new how to remove the mirror lens, without braking? S/G

Thanks guys I found the problem tonight easy fix, tires are next. S/G

Thanks Dan, out of curiosity is there a sticky on rebuilding the front shocks, are there known issues? S/G

Hello everyone; Just acquired A 91 Venture Royal low mileage (67000KLM) one owner bike. Known issues were "shocks don't air up" and a couple electrical bugs (fixed), the best description of the fork during my 800klm homeward is there is no shock absorber period! So I followed the manual for adjusting the shocks after arriving home and managed to air them up seem to work I was not able to bottom them out after which, but they seem too mushy! 24 hours later I checked the monitor it read .08 however I could bottom out the front shocks just rocking back and forth with out much effort! Question is folks for long distance peace of mind what does your experience suggest for a fix right the first time? Thanks Side issue regarding windshield and wet weather, would some argue for cutting down the windshield below eye level l for wet night time riding, I prefer full face helmets for touring. S/G