cowpuc

I am sure they are paying the tab for an outside insurance agency to underwrite the service contract instead of carrying it in house.. Definitely wayyy cheaper I am sure.. That being the case, they (yamaha) can fall back on the underwriter of the service contract if there are issues and force you to deal with the insurance company instead of debating issues with their customers.. Sort of like how home owners insurance companies hire outside claims adjusters to handle claims = the claims adjuster can freely turn down a claim with no reprisals toward the Insurance Company as its not actually the Insurance Company who is turning ya down,, its the Claims Adjuster... Song and dance and when it happens,, the little guy always looses unless,, of course,, in the end,, the manufacturer steps up to the plate (which Mom Yam might do) and accept responsibility but,, legally they dont have to.. Learned all this the hard way... Another note: I heard about a company,, dealership I think - not a company,, who was selling EVERYTHING with a life time warranty.. Think it was a Polaris Indian shop in Minnisota - maybe.. Anyway,, their deal was - whether you wanted it or not - a lifetime warranty was given with all new bikes.. Of course,, this lifetime warranty was NOT a ""factory warranty"" - it was/is an ""extended warranty service contract"" = two totally COMPLETELY different critters.. Ya know, this would be a really good topic for a whole new thread.. Maybe even something that could be pinned somewhere.. These service contract warranties are getting to be extremely popular in the large capital expenditure vehicle world and it would be great to watch and hear how folks experiences unfold as they try to use them.. I know that I have had very bad experiences with this same type of idea,, more of a scam than a warranty IMHO, with places like Best Buy when dealing with Computers... Things aren't always what one reads in those extended service contract warranties IMHO - now adays even the best of sales persons in those joints cant sell me an extended warranty .. Be a shame to trust something like that on a cross country trip when your miles from home and urgently need help only to find out that it was a known fact the extended warranty service contract you were trusting wasnt worth the paper it was written on (could work the other way though) = just some thoughts.. *** Considering the logic behind what I just wrote and knowing that Harley Davidson does have a full 2 year FACTORY warranty on their bikes and Mom Yam's FACTORY warranty is only half of that,, I am gonna have to change the standings with my debate with @Big Lenny: Now its: +1 Puc:big-grin-emoticon: should have quit while you were ahead ya lop eared Lenny varmint = the fire under that pot is perfect - pass me another dog will ya

Permission to quote you in my signature as shown Kretz?? That is AWESOME and deserves to be quoted IMHO!

SAAAAAWOOOSHHHHH:thumbsup::thumbsup::clap2: See Tip,, see now how I was telling ya why I struggled so hard in College Algebra,,, SWAAAAWOOSH that stuff went right over my head!! This guy Kretz is a smart lop eared math varmint I tell ya,, ol Puc is gonna have to keep a weathered ol scallywag eye on this one!!! THANKS KRETZ = you just solved one of lifes greatest mysteries for me!!! Seriously,, makes perfect sense - greatly appreciate that and have it memorized to explain to my friends next time we are sitting around a camp fire counting our toes to see how many bullets we each got left for the next day of deer season

My reckoleck on that is,, at least from what the factory guys in Sturgis told me,, the 5 year warranty is in fact 1 factory and 4 extended service contract BUT - they both come with the purchase of the scoot and are not separable - the bike comes with 5 years of warranty.. IMHO,, Yamaha has always had the best warranty on the market,, seconded by Honda by definitely seconded.. I have watched HD song and dance their way around many issues with both myself (years ago had a brand new Low Rider and not to long ago brand new Buell) and with friends brand new scoots (current/present day = LOTS of problems in honoring warrantys) and have personally watched Polaris do even worse then Harley (watched our local Polaris Dealer kick Polaris to the curb because of this). I grew up with a VERY honorable, trustworthy Yamaha shop in the area. The people who owned it were amazing and, bar none - if you had problems with a Yamaha while it was under Warranty - they covered it and dealt with Mom Yam... This new breed of warranty (extended service contracts) may be a whole new animal - no idea about that - but if Yamaha handles it like they have their factory warrantys = I think Lenny makes a very very good point with his warranty debate... +1 = Lenny IMHO:big-grin-emoticon:

Toss another log on the fire,,, grab the martian mellows and the hershy bars cause I am preparing for smore () action Lenny.. Just to be fair and giving ya another chance to sharpen your stick,, here's another article I just bumped into for investigative purposes: http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/2018-yamaha-star-eluder-bagger-first-look-review On a side note,, as you scroll down to read the article - note the advertisement words that those folks at Suzuki chose to use = 1/4 page down = right side... Look familiar:icon_smile_question

That Guzzi is bad to the bone!!!!

You know,,,,, you could at least share some highlights from the read with your ol buddy,,, maybe even some insite on what you do or dont like like about it:icon_lurker:.... Come on Lewis,, dont be shy,,, no ones gonna nip ya:guitarist 2:

Prayers Up my brother!!! Get in there and get that puppy fixed Lewis!!!

Right there with Rand,,, something that endlessly amazes me about retirement is how much faster time seems to disappear.. IMHO, when I was a kid it seemed like days would drag on like years... Like a ride around the block on my peddley bike took weeks to complete when in fact it was just a mere 6 hour journey between lunch and supper.. Nowadays it seems like a whole summer just went by like the swoosh of a healthy summer breeze = mere seconds have passed.. That is one of the reasons I have switched over to doing a LOT of videoing of our lives.. Having a chance to go back and replay some special times shared between two best friends is turning into one way of slowing things down some,, at least IMHO... On another note = Prayers Up for all those facing the fangs of Irma down yonder!! Gods speed my friends!!!

:bowdown: Love the way you think!! NICE LENNY!! Dad gum flat out NICE JOB!! Only thing that could be better would be if you and I were sitting around a camp fire,, some where out on the South Dakota prairie with our feet propped up and burning hot dogs while we're :stickpoke::witch_brew: this out = WHAT A BLAST!! Not to change the subject but it used to be there would be no less than a hundred of us doing exactly that.. Now look,, it appears its just down to you and me:puzzled:.... Anyway,, this :stickpoke:,, ,, aint over ya lop eared well versed touring scoot loving varmint,,,,, just gotta give the geezer a chance to do some ciphering (back is tired from bending over using my toes to try to keep up with ya) BUT - ye be warned,, I aint out of hot dogs yet!!!!!

The answer to that eludes me.. I am still suspicious that Arlen Ness or someone else from Polaris jumped ship when they closed out their horrible selling air cooled belt drive big T-twin motored Victory line and somehow landed in Yamaha's Design group.. If so, if would be a short jump from there for someone who had lost their Vision to get into the naming of this new scoot,, IMHO. It sure seems like things have changed HUGELY since the days of iconic naming of the legends like the Banshee, Fazer, V-Max, Venture or even that little rippen moped appropriately named the Zuma or that little kids three wheeler named the Tri-Zinger...

Dear Mom Yam: I,,,,,, oh,,, wait a minute,,,, I dont have to retype that letter,,, I can just copy/paste the letter here to make sure you get your mail.. Copy/pasted from this thread: http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?132122-Something-else-new-is-coming-next-week/page2 it reads: Dear Mom Yam If you are monitoring this thread please jump back to post #9 herein and note that, while being able to continue eluding the masses in their ability to predict or even remotely understand your reasoning for the introduction of your 2018 V-Twin, belt drive, air cooled "touring" bikes,, your wayward son here in Michigan is no longer being eluded.. Proven by my amazingly accurate prophetic prediction back in number 9. I simply put into action everything you taught me thru the years about avoiding being eluded and, even though I was intitially thrown off the trail at the unveiling in New York by you putting the model name "Venture" that was built upon your mighty V-4 platform onto a V-Twin scoot , I am now clearly back on track in my ability to avoid being eluded.. THANK YOU!! Mom,, I want you to know that my self confidence has also returned. So much so that, while eluding your eluding ways and KNOWING that I was right in my prediction that you were going to continue chasing HD and go after their Street Glide market, I stopped at a Harley shop last weekend and picked up a copy of the introduction to their 2018 line up. Knowing HD would have their MSRP stated clearly in that catalog (you taught me eluding avoidance so well, HD gave up trying to elude me a long time ago) I brought one home just so I could snap some pics of those prices for you. Internally, similar to Polaris with that bike they are doing the same thing with - you know, the one with the fairing that looks like a sheet of plywood with lights painted on it, I knew you were going to attempt a toe to toe stand with The Motor Company on comparable models.. After looking at the MSRP on this Street Glide market clone - I am very glad I did.. I have a hunch that you have dropped your professional marketing staff (more on why the reason for that doesnt elude me either in a second) so please take a peek at the attached pics and note those MSRP quotes from HD.. Upon doing so you will probably note that you, like Polaris has done, have actually priced these new machines above and beyond that of the competitor you are trying to take customers from,, did those numbers elude you? I am sure realizing that The Motor Company has been able to produce low budget, extremely low RnD cost, very simple in design and concept (right out of the early 1900's as a matter of fact) motorcycles and sell them at prices that even an exotic Auto Manufacturer would be jealous of is unnerving. Ya gotta not let this get to you Mom, fact is, the reasoning for their ability to do so has eluded master marketeers for years - even to the point that some would say that HD's pathway to success in this great eluding is the Worlds 8th wonder.. I know and am sure that by copying HD's methods and finding you no longer need to employ Marketeers and RnD staff of your own (probably even were able to be rid of 70% of manufacturing staff as producing air cooled V-Twin's is that much easier) because it would seem that just doing what ever HD is doing and all will be well probably seems right.. Mom,, I think you may want to listen to your son in Michigan and dont continue in that practice - don't elude yourself.. What I am eluding too is this.. Take a real close look at the MSRP prices in the pics.. Come in at 30% lower than comparable scoots of the HD line on these new ones but, understand that even at that - big twin air cooled buyers are usually not effected by $$'s = means nothing to them (thats the great eluding fact = theres way more to the HD phenomenon of being able to get into peoples pockets than eluded to) - you will probably still have a hard time clearing out the product like you did with the Strats/Roadliners/Raiders/Warriors and Roadies.. Dont give up,, once ya clear em out,, hire your RnD guys back, fire who ever came over from Victory with visions of that fairing look that eludes a lot of people, grab the prints on the water cooled 1700cc V-Max and get to work producing a touring machine that will blow past an 1800 Gold Wing like the 1st Gen Ventures would dust off the Gold Wings of their day and age.. Drop a sexy fixed wing fairing on it ONLY put it on a rail system so it opens like the hood of a car exposing EVERYTHING from air breather to spark plugs = making it the easiest touring bike on the planet to work on.. Focus on ease of maintenance across the board so real touring people dont have to waste a week of their touring vacation just to get an oil change... In other words,, return to your roots,, build something for us that REALLY does turn the touring world upside down!! Do you get what I am eluding to? Your eluding son Puc

I had the same thing happen years ago and spent some time figuring out what was going on.. In the end,, I discovered that the sharp edge of the pot hole I had hit actually caused belt slippage/damage in my tires.. Finding this required me to raise the bike, wack the brake calipers with a rubber mallet hard enough that I could back the caliper pistons off enough that the wheel would spin free and then spin the tire and watch for lateral movement in the tire. Belt slippage is not uncommon in car tires, just occasionally watch cars when they are in front of you and you may also notice a tire on one of them moving slightly side to side. Fortunately in a car, this slippage can usually just barely be felt (a lot of folks dont even realize they have an issue) and is not discovered until the tire goes flat from air leak around the damaged area.. Since discovering that bike tires are vulnerable to the same flaws or damage, I have had several instances of belt damage thru the years and now know to check them closely when experiencing an incident like you bring up.. Also,, while your checking the tires, watch your rims very closely too as rim damage is also not uncommon after nailing a sharp edged pot hole like you describe.. Wanna hear a short funny story about something similar to your situation? Ok,, read on.. Years ago I was out playing Destry Abbott (iconic KX500 Baja racer) on my own KX500 here in Michigan.. While CTFW in the dirt at speeds in excess of 80 mph I nailed a hidden tree root while jumping from a huge pot hole on a two track. The tree root lofted my scoot clearing some 130 feet of air/distance before touching back down (no joke - I actually paced it off).. After I landed from the launch, I got off my bike, leaned it up on its side stand (after market) and against a tree and spun the front tire = 4 inch long bend in the front wheel,, rear wheel had a matching bend!! When removing the tires to pull the spokes to lace on some new wheels I noticed that my Dunlop "52's" had taken so much impact that they too had been cut thru on the beads from the impact!!! CHECK THOSE TIRES CLOSELY GRUBBY = you dont want to experience a flat tire ride now to go along with the pot hole experience,, IMHO of course..

Dont sound good at all... In my line of thinkin = two ways of lookin at it bro.. 1. Flight before fight or 2. Fight before flight Fight before flight might constitute going on the offensive.. Gotta ask yourself though,, are they really worth it? Ya know,, if you do hunt em down one by one like in the movies,, the rest of your life will be spent on the other side of the bars inside that place you just retired from... Your wife, family and those precious grandkids may not appreciate that, even your friends like me wouldnt enjoy that.. That thought is exactly why I dont carry bro,,, just to easy for some low life to provoke = BANG and then = click,, the doors lock behind ya... Flight before fight might just mean the big sell off,, what the heck - dont sound like your dealing with majorly intelligent forms of life - you could probably haul your brother stuff out, put it in storage, tack a for sale on his property and a few days later put a huge sold sign on it and they would back off.. Maybe have some out of town friends show up and act like they just bought the place,, get some Good Will furnishings and haul em in like they were moving in,, you know the routine - dog n pony show it to convince the idiots its no longer in the fam.. Do they know where you and your family live? May have to do the same thing if possible - getting a bullet in the back would not be fun.. No doubt = tough stuff = PRAYERS UP BROTHER!!

Dear Mom Yam If you are monitoring this thread please jump back to post #9 herein and note that, while being able to continue eluding the masses in their ability to predict or even remotely understand your reasoning for the introduction of your 2018 V-Twin, belt drive, air cooled "touring" bikes,, your wayward son here in Michigan is no longer being eluded.. Proven by my amazingly accurate prophetic prediction back in number 9. I simply put into action everything you taught me thru the years about avoiding being eluded and, even though I was intitially thrown off the trail at the unveiling in New York by you putting the model name "Venture" that was built upon your mighty V-4 platform onto a V-Twin scoot , I am now clearly back on track in my ability to avoid being eluded.. THANK YOU!! Mom,, I want you to know that my self confidence has also returned. So much so that, while eluding your eluding ways and KNOWING that I was right in my prediction that you were going to continue chasing HD and go after their Street Glide market, I stopped at a Harley shop last weekend and picked up a copy of the introduction to their 2018 line up. Knowing HD would have their MSRP stated clearly in that catalog (you taught me eluding avoidance so well, HD gave up trying to elude me a long time ago) I brought one home just so I could snap some pics of those prices for you. Internally, similar to Polaris with that bike they are doing the same thing with - you know, the one with the fairing that looks like a sheet of plywood with lights painted on it, I knew you were going to attempt a toe to toe stand with The Motor Company on comparable models.. After looking at the MSRP on this Street Glide market clone - I am very glad I did.. I have a hunch that you have dropped your professional marketing staff (more on why the reason for that doesnt elude me either in a second) so please take a peek at the attached pics and note those MSRP quotes from HD.. Upon doing so you will probably note that you, like Polaris has done, have actually priced these new machines above and beyond that of the competitor you are trying to take customers from,, did those numbers elude you? I am sure realizing that The Motor Company has been able to produce low budget, extremely low RnD cost, very simple in design and concept (right out of the early 1900's as a matter of fact) motorcycles and sell them at prices that even an exotic Auto Manufacturer would be jealous of is unnerving. Ya gotta not let this get to you Mom, fact is, the reasoning for their ability to do so has eluded master marketeers for years - even to the point that some would say that HD's pathway to success in this great eluding is the Worlds 8th wonder.. I know and am sure that by copying HD's methods and finding you no longer need to employ Marketeers and RnD staff of your own (probably even were able to be rid of 70% of manufacturing staff as producing air cooled V-Twin's is that much easier) because it would seem that just doing what ever HD is doing and all will be well probably seems right.. Mom,, I think you may want to listen to your son in Michigan and dont continue in that practice - don't elude yourself.. What I am eluding too is this.. Take a real close look at the MSRP prices in the pics.. Come in at 30% lower than comparable scoots of the HD line on these new ones but, understand that even at that - big twin air cooled buyers are usually not effected by $$'s = means nothing to them (thats the great eluding fact = theres way more to the HD phenomenon of being able to get into peoples pockets than eluded to) - you will probably still have a hard time clearing out the product like you did with the Strats/Roadliners/Raiders/Warriors and Roadies.. Dont give up,, once ya clear em out,, hire your RnD guys back, fire who ever came over from Victory with visions of that fairing look that eludes a lot of people, grab the prints on the water cooled 1700cc V-Max and get to work producing a touring machine that will blow past an 1800 Gold Wing like the 1st Gen Ventures would dust off the Gold Wings of their day and age.. Drop a sexy fixed wing fairing on it ONLY put it on a rail system so it opens like the hood of a car exposing EVERYTHING from air breather to spark plugs = making it the easiest touring bike on the planet to work on.. Focus on ease of maintenance across the board so real touring people dont have to waste a week of their touring vacation just to get an oil change... In other words,, return to your roots,, build something for us that REALLY does turn the touring world upside down!! Do you get what I am eluding to? Your eluding son Puc

Less than an hour to go and we FINALLY get to see what the new shaft drive, water cooled, 1700cc V-Max motored SST (Star Stratoliner Touring) looks like!!!! :bikersmilie::bikersmilie::bikersmilie:

So,, is that Kansas City on the map the Kansas City from the song,,, Ohhh I'mm goin tah Kansas City - Kansas City here I come - day got some purdy little ladies and I'ma gonna - get me one?? If so,, doesnt it also go on to say something about trying to figure out how the singer is gonna get there???? Wonder if he ended up takin a Venture?? Also,, Ty,,, is the basis for that song the reason why your path leads right thru the heart of the City?? :big-grin-emoticon:

If that is what the delay is all about (to my knowledge they have not come out and said the glitch I recorded is actually the reason but I do think that is a distinct possibilty) I really do think it is AWESOME of them to not release the scoot to the public until they get to the bottom of it.. Not all manufacturers are that worthy IMHO... Not defending the way they chose to market this thing in any way but I do think it is noble of them to do everything they can to get it right in the first place.. Dont get me wrong Dave,, you KNOW me,, electronic gismo's and bling mean nothing to me on my touring scoots,,, certainly not the game changer in making a scoot the machine that is gonna turn the touring world upside down or make it the best touring machine in the history of motorcycling BUT - if they are gonna market them as such = it is AWESOME that they are doing all they can to insure all those electronics are in good working order before someone heads out cross country on one..

I personally think it would have a far higher chance of selling, even with the futuristic Victory looking front end IF they would have turned the touring world on its nose with the first, for real,,, 100% pure muscle touring machine in the form of a shaft driven, water cooled 1700cc V-4 highway eater - something that would make even the most cronic - afraid to smile pessimistic gear head grin from ear to ear every time he wickt' it up.. Something that would earn the respect of even the young sport bike riders .. I know,, hard to do because of things like Hp/weight ratio's and all that BUT = in these modern turbo days,,, Mom Yam could of offered a Venturette non boosted and a boosted Venture or something like that.. It's amazing what is happening these days in those circles.. Auto Makers are FINALLY catching on to the free ummpphh available with boosting, something that the Trucking Industry has been aware of for years.. A small boosted 6 banger now in a Ford PU can and does produce higher Hp and FtPd numbers on the dyno's than the big blocks of just a few years ago - all while maintaining pretty amazing fuel economies.. Mom Yam has a perfect platform for such a thing with that 1700 V-Max motor and they could of actually turned the touring world upside down if they only,,,.. :322:Shut off the mail, stack on the camping gear, tip the bars in and down like a good set of 6 bends, :173:snuggle in against mama on the back seat and head for Bodega Bay via Glacier,, con an ice cream cone or two out of those lop eared west coast VR varmints, run off a couple back tires chasing there and back again,, unpack the scoot when ya get home, crank the bars back up to race mode, baggerize it by pulling the trunk off, beat up on your buddies with their bigger motored scoots and then head to Martin Dragway to pull some 10's in the quarter for some end of season fun runs..

and by that time you and I will be drag racing our electric motored, battery powered walkers down the hall ways of some back yard grumpy old mens club and the big :stickpoke: of the day will be which is better tastin.... Life is grand!!!!:banana::banana::banana::banana:

A number of years ago a really close friend of mine who also was Chief of Police in an outside area came here to testify on behalf of another loved one who had found himself in a severe legal situation.. I got a little rattled during a deposition in that case at the lack of concern for truth and honesty in the investigation.. THANKFULLY My Chief of Police friend, who was VERY knowledgeable of how the system functions, took me aside and reminded me that the modern system is concerned very little with truth or honesty but is all about "winner take all" (his words - not mine).. A point I have NEVER forgotten and the very foundation for why I am very very careful about if/when I pack.. At the end of that crisis after being found innocent but broke, the person who was being investigated found himself in front of the judge inquiring into the legal basis for the "customary and normal" charges his attorneys had charged his estate.. It seems that some of those charges averaged well over $1000 an hour.. He found no reprieve for the fee's and costs that had been levied but told me later that when the Judge asked him what he thought a reasonable hourly attorney fee should be and he responded with $100 an hour,, the Judge responded with any ""attorney that would work for less than $500 an hour is an attorney you would not want defending you" and that "customary and reasonable fee's begin there". Prayers Up brother!!

:bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown: Now THATS what I am talking about!! Very very well put there Riv!! THANK YOU for the feedback!! By the way,, I LOVE FiFi and can see why you couldnt pass er up brother!! She's got that look of "feed me some open road - I'm hungry" written all over her purdy face!!

Your N. Muskegon varmint buddy who DEFINITELY,, even if he knew who Pete was and NO WAY on God's green earth would of spent 30 large on 2 wheels with a motor any way has done turned sissy MiRider.. Been watching the weather since we chatted about said 's and,,, just couldnt do it... Dont count me out yet though ya lop eared Harley named Candy riding good hearted buddy varmint friend of mine!! Got some other late fall MGnEM idea's in the makings!! For the love of Pete (sorry Randy = couldnt resist:happy34:) DO NOT winterize that purdy TriGlide yet MiRider!!

I still cant help but think it all boils back down to major change in who/what we are as a people.. I think somehow, the pros and cons of the digital/computer/information age may also be at play here and not just thru robotics in manufactering (all though - that has had a huge effect for need for laborers) but even more so on what a satisfying lifetime now consists of.. Back when I was a kid I was so broke I couldnt pay attention but, because of my love for motorcycles I spent every dime I could muster on any form of two wheels with a motor I could afford (picking blue berries, paper route,, playing poker ). When I turned 16 I woke my mom up at 7 a.m. and said "get up!! I HAVE to get my license!! and my best buddy (had a license) rode my Honda 350 down to the DMV so I could get my Cycle Endorsement on the same day.. Folks = to me = ALL of that was done as an act of getting to FINALLY find out how freedom feels = it was a MUST DO!! Thing is,, at that point in our local area's era,, LIFE was just like that everywhere - again,, IMHO.. Fast forward to the present day and age = human beings (teenagers and millenials are human beings too ya know) no longer seem to find the fulfillment needs for their search for finding out how freedom feels in that same way.. Times have changed.. Many folks find happiness in life by racing motorcross, fishing, hunting, ice skating, ski diving, swimming, playing tennis, robbing banks, stealing cars and on and on and on DIGITALLY!! I personally think this and this alone has had a HUGE impact on our sport.. Also,,, do to this AND because of the inherent dangers associated with even attempting to walk across a roadway = many of those same human beings simply have no use for even a drivers license.. Back in my early days,, if a young person didnt want a drivers license their parents would probably have taken them to an ER to find out what was wrong with em.. As usual,, I am probably way out there and shallow minded with all this ,,, but I still think that we are experiencing an actual change in the paradigm of what constitutes the fulfillment of the pursuit of happiness...

Finally (at least for this little opportunity to yak with one of my lop eared long distance touring varmint buddies) I gotta ask,, who is "Pete" ?