Syncronizing the Carbs -how do I know?

[thecount]

So being on the bike now for 2 1/2 months, and it's a 2005 with 31,000 KM (Canada eh!), what signs or issues would I feel, hear or experience about the Carbs and in Synch or out of Synch?

 

IS this really a do it yourself project? and cost of the necessary tools/equipment?

[Redneck]

You probably won't be able to tell any thing. If the carbs are correctly synchronized it will run smoother get better mileage. After they are adjusted then you will be able to tell the difference. The do it your self part is just personal preference I prefer to know they are in sync for myself.

[royalstarjac]

If they've been out of sync since you got it you might not notice. You might just think that is how the bike runs. If they're badly out of sync you might notice lack of power, rough running/idle or sputtering.

 

If you can't sync your own carbs then you probably can't tie your own shoes. It really is that simple. It's a 10 minute job. Equipment can be had for $100 or less which pays for itself the first time you use it. Many people use the Morgan Carbtune. I use a TwinMax.You also need a loong phillips head screwdriver.-Jack

[Stoutman]

Mine will backfire under deceleration if the carbs are out of syn. It has not done that since my first do-it-myself carb sync. The tool pays for itself after two uses when compared to having the dealer do it. Most people check/adjust their bike more frequently than the service manual says. The big advantage is that this bike really purrs when the carbs are well synchronized.

 

Best of luck.

[T.J.]

I have an 04 and this is what I notice when they go out of sync. It doesn't start as easy and I feel vibration in the handlebar's while riding. I just synced mine last week and it starts much quicker and the vibration is gone.

[Squidley]

I notice your in Waterloo, i know there are some members in the Kitchener area that have a carbtune. Or you can come over to Michigan on Saturday for the Michigan maintenance day and we'll do it there. You could also come to my house as I live across from Sombra.

[thecount]

If they've been out of sync since you got it you might not notice. You might just think that is how the bike runs. If they're badly out of sync you might notice lack of power, rough running/idle or sputtering.

 

If you can't sync your own carbs then you probably can't tie your own shoes. It really is that simple. It's a 10 minute job. Equipment can be had for $100 or less which pays for itself the first time you use it. Many people use the Morgan Carbtune. I use a TwinMax.You also need a loong phillips head screwdriver.-Jack

 

 

Easy on the shoes! Boots, velcro and duct tape! Man's best friend.

 

On the advice. Thank you all. Sounds like this is worth the tools investment and time to do the job.

 

Squidely,

Thanks for pointing out the Kitchene Connection. May be able to track down some assistance.

 

This weekend does not work for a run over to Michigan, even thought I would love to get there. Friday and Saturday booked solid with meeting related to work stuff.

[Squidley]

Squidley,

Thanks for pointing out the Kitchener Connection. May be able to track down some assistance.

 

This weekend does not work for a run over to Michigan, even thought I would love to get there. Friday and Saturday booked solid with meeting related to work stuff.

 

 

Might want to PM Brad T, he's there in Kitchener

We'll get hook up with you soon.

[BradT]

Missed this post, as we were busy before we left for Maintenace day.

 

Steve we will catch up with you soon.

 

BRad

[Kandaje]

Greetings...

 

Tools required? Depends on your year - I hear the Harley envy versions (2nd Gens) use a #2 phillips Screwdriver - While, At least on my 1st gen - a simple straight blade Screwdriver...

 

Other than that - About $3 worth of Equipment - Including clear plastic hose available virtually EVERYWHERE - A wooden yardstick - which are surprisingly hard to find these days - Or just yank up one of those Yard-stick-like pieces of wood with the red ribbon at any new housing development. OR a very large piece of cardboard, A staple gun, some viscous red fluid or used motor oil, and about 20 minutes...

 

The Yard-stick has lines on it. The Survey stick or cardboard? Well, you scribe a line where the fluid that follows the universal law of fluids within a gravity well levels out - just in case you are like me - and need magnifying lenses over your eyes to see anything within 3 feet of your face. The line helps you quickly discriminate that one carb sucks worse than the other...

 

OR

 

If you have more money than sense - you can get one of those nifty $100 contraptions with Mercury just in case you want to inflict cancer on all the neighborhood stray cats - though personally I prefer open puddles of Anti-freeze to dispose of them...

 

Here's the simple and easy way:

 

Take your bike to a dealer shop and pay $300 to have them turn 3 screws - That's $100 a screw - If you think that's a bit expensive - And it is! I know a girl down at the bowling alley that charges MUCH less for turning a screw... What? Yeah but - She only works on harleys though...

 

 

The hard way:

 

You actually physicly attach the 2 ends of the plastic hose to the vacume nozzles on your intakes - and measure the DIFFERENCE between them and adjust that DIFFERENCE using those above mentioned 3 screws. Using the universal principle that fluids within a gravity well always tends to seek it's own level. You did put some of that viscous fluid in the clear plastic tube - LAST NIGHT - right? (you did it last night so that it looks neat...)

 

In other words - Syncing Carbs - SUCKS. And it's that Suction that you measure. When one carb sucks more than the other carb - the Fluid that follows the universal principle - won't appear to - thats where the screwing comes in.

 

It should - if you are competent - take more time to actually SHOP for the $3 worth of materials - than it would to actually employ them to get your carbs in sync - all in all, about 20 minutes - including the mandatory beer and smoke break...

 

Of course - KNOWING which screw to turn when - a really complicated procedure that costs MILLIONS of dollars to discover and billions of man-hours to accomplish, the wife is whining her satanic fool head off about how you SHOULD be cleaning out the gutters and taking out the garbage instead of spending quality time with your REAL girlfriend -

 

Trust in the engineering abilty and logic of the Japanese Engineers which designed the bike - After all - there are ONLY 3 screws to choose from - 1 on the left side - and 2 on the right - You get 3 guesses and only 2 count...

 

Now Like I said above - If it takes you longer than 5 hours - that's 3.5 hours of shopping, 1 hour of building your DEVICE ( stapling the tubeing to the stick or carboard without puncturing it and putting in enough viscous fluid) and 30 minutes of actually turning screws like the girl I know down at the bowling alley - Then you should choose the easy way - Or just post WHERE your funeral arrangments are made - No doubt, many of us will show up and drop a little something for your widow and kids....

 

 

Yes - It really is - Just that simple - Or complicated - depending on your point of view...

 

 

Here's the science:

 

When you twist your right wrist - 4 butterfly valves in your carbs - open. Allowing fuel and air into the cylinders. The object of the carb-sync game is to get those 4 butterfly valve all opening at the same time and rate of flow. That Rate of Flow is the suction that your clear plastic tube measures. The viscous fluid that you put in the tube last night will raise on one side - If it sucks more - Ahem - if the rate of flow is higher...

 

You turn screws - on the BANKS of carbs - 1st the #1 (left rear) and #2 ( the one thats static - left front) THEN the #3 and #4 and then you sync the 2 banks - the left side with the right side. (#2 and combined #3/#4) As I said - only 3 screws - and only 2 guesses count...

 

Assuming you did it correctly - all 4 carbs are now in sync. They all draw the same amount of air and fuel at the same time. And as Aunt Martha says - That's a very good thing....

[Seaking]

Greetings...

 

Tools required? Depends on your year - I hear the Harley envy versions (2nd Gens) use a #2 phillips Screwdriver - While, At least on my 1st gen - a simple straight blade Screwdriver...

 

 

 

Of course - KNOWING which screw to turn when - a really complicated procedure that costs MILLIONS of dollars to discover and billions of man-hours to accomplish, the wife is whining her satanic fool head off about how you SHOULD be cleaning out the gutters and taking out the garbage instead of spending quality time with your REAL girlfriend -

 

You turn screws - on the BANKS of carbs - 1st the #1 (left rear) and #2 ( the one thats static - left front) THEN the #3 and #4 and then you sync the 2 banks - the left side with the right side. (#2 and combined #3/#4) As I said - only 3 screws - and only 2 guesses count...

 

Assuming you did it correctly - all 4 carbs are now in sync. They all draw the same amount of air and fuel at the same time. And as Aunt Martha says - That's a very good thing....

 

I do my own synch after I had someone show me how it's done, however you've added a lot of 'layman' version talk to the process that does indeed make it easier to follow and understand.. thanks =)

 

The ONE thing I could add to all this is that while turning the proper screws is to NOT push on the screws while turning.. the mechanical tendency is to push into a screw while we turn it to prevent the screw driver tip from stripping it out. However, if you do this while adjusting the carb screws, you impart pressure on the screw making everything change as you are physically displacing the adjutors. (next time you guys synch your carbs, simply push on those screws without turning and you'll feel the diff.. not good)

 

So using the proper phillips screw driver and finger tip turning pressure (no push) will give you a more accurate result..

 

Took me a while to figure this one out.. I thought it might have just been me and my big hands but some locals were doing the same thing without realizing it..

 

Just an added note..

 

Cheers

[timgray]

Does anyone have any clear photos of wher you hook up the tubes for the Carb sync?

 

also one thing is unclear to me. You sync 1 to 2, then 4 to 3, but how do I know that 3 is synched to 2? what if #3 is the one that is way out of balance? and how do you sync left to right? that is very unclear from everything I have read.

 

Everything else seems understandable. I made a clear tube U a couple of feet long, put some ATF in it to get about a foot of fluid in there and then take the 5-6 feet of tube and connect to carb 1 and 2 and make the two sides level with each other. Do I then disconnect from 1 and 2 and then connect to 3 and 4 and do the same? Or do I keep it on 2 which is the refrence and move to 3 and banace 3 to 2 and then 4 to 2?

 

thanks all for the help, I just need this last bit cleared up.

Edited September 10, 2008 by timgray

[Freebird]

Did you see this thread?

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=258

 

It is for the second gen but the connection points are in about the same place. Screws are a bit different though.

 

You know, we REALLY need a great write-up with pictures of the procedure for the first gen bikes. It would be great if one of you first gen riders could do it and then I would add it to the first gen tech library.

[jemorrisonjr]

What about gas fumes? is it out of sync or just the mix is wrong is there is a lot of gas smell?

[mini-muffin]

If you're smelling gas it's probably running rich.

 

Margaret

[BigBoyinMS]

What about gas fumes? is it out of sync or just the mix is wrong is there is a lot of gas smell?

 

In the simplest terms, syncing the carbs doesn't change the fuel mix... it's basically adjusting the idle on each carb to be the same.

[utadventure]

Does anyone have any clear photos of wher you hook up the tubes for the Carb sync?

 

also one thing is unclear to me. You sync 1 to 2, then 4 to 3, but how do I know that 3 is synched to 2? what if #3 is the one that is way out of balance? and how do you sync left to right? that is very unclear from everything I have read.

 

Everything else seems understandable. I made a clear tube U a couple of feet long, put some ATF in it to get about a foot of fluid in there and then take the 5-6 feet of tube and connect to carb 1 and 2 and make the two sides level with each other. Do I then disconnect from 1 and 2 and then connect to 3 and 4 and do the same? Or do I keep it on 2 which is the refrence and move to 3 and banace 3 to 2 and then 4 to 2?

 

thanks all for the help, I just need this last bit cleared up.

 

The directions in the Service Manual are pretty straight forward on the 1st Gens. and is available to download from here on the website in the Tech Section.

 

You sync 1 and 2, then 3 and 4, next (here's where having 4 connections is nice) you use the third adjustment screw to match 1/2 to 3/4. When I did mine, using the Morgan Carbtune, once I matched the two sides together, the meter then showed some slight changes in the matching of 1 to 2 and 3 to 4. In just a few minutes I was able to move back and forth to the different sync screws and get all 4 cylinders matched.

 

Dave

[theander]

Well, I bit the bullet and purchased the Carbine for my 07 RSTD. Read your post on proceedure and everything went smoothly! Carbs were a bit out of sync, but nothing major. Thanks for the well thought out instructions!