Flyinfool Posted July 13, 2014 Share #26 Posted July 13, 2014 Looked roughly at some other costs. It would be somewhere between $100 and $125 shipped to lower USA. If there is enough interest I will research it further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a1bummer Posted July 13, 2014 Share #27 Posted July 13, 2014 I had made a swivel for my trailer some years back. It comes in real handy when parked on uneven ground and the bike is on it's side-stand. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronMike Posted July 14, 2014 Share #28 Posted July 14, 2014 The hitch or drawbar I have now is pretty long. It really aids in maneuvering and the way it tows. So length is actually good. How fast can you make one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowpuc Posted July 14, 2014 Share #29 Posted July 14, 2014 i tried to warn you that getting my gears grinding is dangerous........ that is flat purdy!! Nice fool, really really nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 14, 2014 Share #30 Posted July 14, 2014 Lengthening the drawbar isn't a good idea. (think palming a ratchet head compared to palming the end of a ratchet ), quite a bit more force, the longer the lever. Frame damage could occur. If you could keep the drawbar the same length, it would work. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dacheedah Posted July 14, 2014 Share #31 Posted July 14, 2014 I bought one of these [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Freedom-Pivot-Ball-Trailer-Hitch/dp/B0053H9088%3FSubscriptionId%3DAKIAIAA4MWUJXHBYFRNQ%26tag%3Dsquid1315721-20%26linkCode%3Dxm2%26camp%3D2025%26creative%3D165953%26creativeASIN%3DB0053H9088]Amazon.com: Freedom Pivot Ball Trailer Hitch: Automotive@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/5133Zzlh8PL.@@AMEPARAM@@5133Zzlh8PL[/ame] and I hate it so I took it off. It will fall to one side. I have never had a problem with standard ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted July 14, 2014 Share #32 Posted July 14, 2014 The total length of the Swivel Ball Mount would be just 4.3 inches longer than the current home made stinger that I have, and this Swivel Ball Mount is actually .25 inches shorter than the commercial one sitting on the shelf at Auto Zone. I have changed the design to always have the center of the ball on the same centerline as the bike, regardless of how the ball mount is rotated. This will mean that the center of the ball will never be different from the center of the bike. This will prevent the feeling that you get from the type shown above that lets the ball tilt back and forth allowing the pull to be off center, or allowing the coupler to move back and forth possibly upsetting the bike. This will also lower the center of the ball about 1.7 inches from what I have now. I do not think it will be an issue with my trailer. Other trailers the ball height is more critical. It would not be difficult to raise this up to keep the ball height but still have it rotate on center. I just have to add the step up or down before the swivel part. But adding a step to change height will also add about 2 inches to the length. I still do not think that the extra 2 inches of length will be an issue. I am wide open for questions comments and snide remarks, even constructive or destructive criticism will be accepted. I am not designing this to full Class I standards. No one will ever be pulling a 2,000 lb trailer with their bike and this Swivel Ball Mount. I hope. I would not hesitate to plug this into a cars receiver and pull a 1,000 lb trailer. Still a lot more than any bike should ever be pulling. it is not just the trailer weight that must be considered in a design like this, there is also the dynamic loading. How many Gs of braking or acceleration or turning can the tow vehicle generate. Also there are the impact forces of the trailer and/or bike hitting a bump or pot hole to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beltfed50 Posted July 14, 2014 Share #33 Posted July 14, 2014 The Bushtec pin is the neatest tow connection I've ever seen, including kingpins & 5th wheel hitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted July 14, 2014 Share #34 Posted July 14, 2014 The Bushtec pin is the neatest tow connection I've ever seen, including kingpins & 5th wheel hitch. It may be neat, but when you go non standard it drastically limits your options in an emergency. Only another Bushtec owner can pull your trailer for you, and you can only ever help out another Bushtec owner by pulling his trailer for him. The same is also partly true for weird trailer electrical connectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 14, 2014 Share #35 Posted July 14, 2014 The total length of the Swivel Ball Mount would be just 4.3 inches longer than the current home made stinger that I have, and this Swivel Ball Mount is actually .25 inches shorter than the commercial one sitting on the shelf at Auto Zone. I have changed the design to always have the center of the ball on the same centerline as the bike, regardless of how the ball mount is rotated. This will mean that the center of the ball will never be different from the center of the bike. This will prevent the feeling that you get from the type shown above that lets the ball tilt back and forth allowing the pull to be off center, or allowing the coupler to move back and forth possibly upsetting the bike. This will also lower the center of the ball about 1.7 inches from what I have now. I do not think it will be an issue with my trailer. Other trailers the ball height is more critical. It would not be difficult to raise this up to keep the ball height but still have it rotate on center. I just have to add the step up or down before the swivel part. But adding a step to change height will also add about 2 inches to the length. I still do not think that the extra 2 inches of length will be an issue. I am wide open for questions comments and snide remarks, even constructive or destructive criticism will be accepted. I am not designing this to full Class I standards. No one will ever be pulling a 2,000 lb trailer with their bike and this Swivel Ball Mount. I hope. I would not hesitate to plug this into a cars receiver and pull a 1,000 lb trailer. Still a lot more than any bike should ever be pulling. it is not just the trailer weight that must be considered in a design like this, there is also the dynamic loading. How many Gs of braking or acceleration or turning can the tow vehicle generate. Also there are the impact forces of the trailer and/or bike hitting a bump or pot hole to consider. Jeff, Hopefully you took my post as a comment. That's what it was intended to be. I'm just worried about the additional stress exerted on the frame of a second gen. A car receiver's mounting points are a lot stronger... Which brings up another point. Check and blue loctite the bolt's around your receiver. One of mine was loose; another missing altogether.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted July 14, 2014 Share #36 Posted July 14, 2014 I bought one of these Amazon.com: Freedom Pivot Ball Trailer Hitch: Automotive and I hate it so I took it off. It will fall to one side. I have never had a problem with standard ball. Yup, me too..... Love it!! And I can pull any MC trailer and not have to worry about dropping the scoot. I did cut a turn too tight and hit a hard curb coming out of a rest stop in Nevada on the way to Cody. The left side of the trailer became airborne but nothing came of it. Bike never flinched and I didn't even slow down.... I also layed the bike on the crash bars at a gas pump...don't ask... and trailer never even hic-cupped... Yes it will cant to one side a bit but doesn't bother a thing when towing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tx2sturgis Posted July 14, 2014 Share #37 Posted July 14, 2014 It may be neat, but when you go non standard it drastically limits your options in an emergency. Only another Bushtec owner can pull your trailer for you, and you can only ever help out another Bushtec owner by pulling his trailer for him. The same is also partly true for weird trailer electrical connectors. And whats with the cars all having a different ignition key? You cant lend or borrow a key that will work...same with tires and wheels... Dang non-standard stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted July 14, 2014 Share #38 Posted July 14, 2014 I have already loaned my spare tire to someone and it worked well enough to get them out of the woods and back to a town. :rasberry: If everything were standard then there would only be one model of everything to choose from. Some things function best if they are non standard, like a key........ :moon: :moon: :moon: :rasberry: :rasberry: :bang head: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tx2sturgis Posted July 14, 2014 Share #39 Posted July 14, 2014 I have already loaned my spare tire to someone and it worked well enough to get them out of the woods and back to a town. :rasberry: If everything were standard then there would only be one model of everything to choose from. Some things function best if they are non standard, like a key........ :moon: :moon: :moon: :rasberry: :rasberry: :bang head: Of course my point was that you can ride a motorcycle for 50 years and never come upon a situation where you need to pull another rider's Bushtec trailer. So going non-standard on the hitch is always a non-issue...really. My Tag-Along from D&P uses the same type of heim-joint hitch as the Bushtec and it is a nice design. Theft-resistant too since most other bikes will not be equipped to tow it. It uses a locking cylinder so its pretty secure when attached to the bike, and doesnt have any slop or rattle in the connection. It also allows more lean differential between bike and trailer...and doesnt ever 'bind-up' in a turn. In my opnion, its a much better design for motorcycles than the lawn-tractor/boat trailer style that most riders use. Jeff the only issue I see with your design is that it might cause a bit of binding if and when the rider needs to back up while turning. Things might get jammed up....just sayin it could happen. The swivels that are incorporated on the trailer drawbar are always in-line with the thrust force...where your idea might get its fore-and-aft forces imparted to the bearing sideways. Maybe a spring-loaded 'return to center' feature? Dunno....just thinking out loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted July 14, 2014 Share #40 Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) I have twice in the last 3 years towed someone else's trailer for them. If they had a non standard configuration it would not have happened easily. That is why I have mentioned it. You may well go 50 years, I seem to have it come up once every other year. Actually since the ball is aligned with the receiver there will be even less side force than in a "normal" configuration and the bearings are so over rated that even if there was side force is would be completely a non issue. The bearings are rated for 2100 lbs of working load EACH. That would be a lot of side force. Edited July 14, 2014 by Flyinfool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 14, 2014 Share #41 Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) Yup, me too..... Love it!! And I can pull any MC trailer and not have to worry about dropping the scoot. I did cut a turn too tight and hit a hard curb coming out of a rest stop in Nevada on the way to Cody. The left side of the trailer became airborne but nothing came of it. Bike never flinched and I didn't even slow down.... I also layed the bike on the crash bars at a gas pump...don't ask... and trailer never even hic-cupped... Yes it will cant to one side a bit but doesn't bother a thing when towing.... Condor you Dang tease... went to look at/buy one an they are out of stock... EDIT gonna pass on that too many bad reviews... Edited July 14, 2014 by CaptainJoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 14, 2014 Share #42 Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) Actually... If one if one could find a 1 1/4" square shanked spindel/hub assembly, it could be modified easily for this use. And be rebuildable... https://www.google.com/search?q=1%22+square+spindle+hub&rlz=1C1AVNA_enUS569US569&espv=2&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=aV3EU63EIY2GyATp5oKYBQ&ved=0CG4Q7Ak&biw=929&bih=498 *Edit* Smallest I could find was 1.5 x 5 long.... shank could be milled down to 1 1/4"? inch square x 5" long and drill hole for pin. Only thing left to fabricate would be the 90 deg metal shelf for the ball. Would bolt together with lugs. Edited July 14, 2014 by CaptainJoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted July 15, 2014 Share #43 Posted July 15, 2014 I thought about using 1" taper bearing from a trailer mounted into my own housings. The spindle and hub would work but be very heavy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 15, 2014 Share #44 Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) I thought about using 1" taper bearing from a trailer mounted into my own housings. The spindle and hub would work but be very heavy. I agree, to heavy bulky... Does this application even require the use of bearings? It's not like it is going to be rotating continuously? Perhaps a square straight spindle, threaded and cap nutted on the end, inserted into a square piece 2" long sporting a grease zerk. Could then weld a plate on to accommodate ball shank? Wouldn't be any heavier/bulkier than stock. Edited July 15, 2014 by CaptainJoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted July 15, 2014 Share #45 Posted July 15, 2014 EDIT gonna pass on that too many bad reviews... And I bet 99.9% of those slams are from individuals that have never even used one, have huge imaginations, and think they're engineers. Just like me until I actually tried one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 15, 2014 Share #46 Posted July 15, 2014 And I bet 99.9% of those slams are from individuals that have never even used one, have huge imaginations, and think they're engineers. Just like me until I actually tried one... The clanking around comments are what put me off. That would unnerve me pulling that +400 lb Bunkhouse trailer. Does yours clank? Probably shouldn't be so quick to judge. Reviews are very much like opinions and a$$....., everyone has one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tx2sturgis Posted July 15, 2014 Share #47 Posted July 15, 2014 I agree, to heavy bulky... Does this application even require the use of bearings? It's not like it is going to be rotating continuously? Perhaps a square straight spindle, threaded and cap nutted on the end, inserted into a square piece 2" long sporting a grease zerk. Could then weld a plate on to accommodate ball shank? Wouldn't be any heavier/bulkier than stock. Brass or Teflon bushing!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJoe Posted July 15, 2014 Share #48 Posted July 15, 2014 Brass or Teflon bushing!! Either... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted July 15, 2014 Share #49 Posted July 15, 2014 The clanking around comments are what put me off. That would unnerve me pulling that +400 lb Bunkhouse trailer. Does yours clank? Probably shouldn't be so quick to judge. Reviews are very much like opinions and a$$....., everyone has one. Quite as a church mouse. 4000 miles and didn't know it was there until I'd see it while checking the rear view.... So now I'm curious. Why would a standard 1 7/8" fit tighter than the tilt ball would??? Same coupler...same size ball....??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronMike Posted July 15, 2014 Share #50 Posted July 15, 2014 Brilliant! The design of yours puts gravity to work for you compared to the one he posted from Amazon. It's going to naturally want to stay where you want it to be, yet allow for a tipover. I want one! The total length of the Swivel Ball Mount would be just 4.3 inches longer than the current home made stinger that I have, and this Swivel Ball Mount is actually .25 inches shorter than the commercial one sitting on the shelf at Auto Zone. I have changed the design to always have the center of the ball on the same centerline as the bike, regardless of how the ball mount is rotated. This will mean that the center of the ball will never be different from the center of the bike. This will prevent the feeling that you get from the type shown above that lets the ball tilt back and forth allowing the pull to be off center, or allowing the coupler to move back and forth possibly upsetting the bike. This will also lower the center of the ball about 1.7 inches from what I have now. I do not think it will be an issue with my trailer. Other trailers the ball height is more critical. It would not be difficult to raise this up to keep the ball height but still have it rotate on center. I just have to add the step up or down before the swivel part. But adding a step to change height will also add about 2 inches to the length. I still do not think that the extra 2 inches of length will be an issue. I am wide open for questions comments and snide remarks, even constructive or destructive criticism will be accepted. I am not designing this to full Class I standards. No one will ever be pulling a 2,000 lb trailer with their bike and this Swivel Ball Mount. I hope. I would not hesitate to plug this into a cars receiver and pull a 1,000 lb trailer. Still a lot more than any bike should ever be pulling. it is not just the trailer weight that must be considered in a design like this, there is also the dynamic loading. How many Gs of braking or acceleration or turning can the tow vehicle generate. Also there are the impact forces of the trailer and/or bike hitting a bump or pot hole to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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