Bad Stator?

[Schlepporello]

OK. I have absolutely no experience with a stator going bad on my Venture Royale and I have no idea what to look for if a problem is developing. I've heard that on a Gold Wing, when the stator goes out, everything goes out. You're basically dead in the water. I have no idea if that is typical with this bike or not. Here's what I've experienced today. I had to run to the parts house to get some new brake pads for the wife's Geo. Everything went as clockwork. I fred up the bike, drove to the Zone, got the parts, and driv back. I went back out to fire the bike up about four hours later. The bike turn once, then started clicking. I had to use the battery charger to get it fired up. I got it running again and driv it to the cars wash so's I could clean it up a bit. Got done, tried to fire it up, it turned twice and quit. Had to call the wife out to jump start me (I ain't pushin' it). I got it fired back up and took it for an investigative ride. Once the RPM's get over 2 G's, it shows to be charging just below the 3/4 mark on the voltmeter (well above the 12 mark). If I let it idle, the voltmeter drops to just above the yellow mark (well below the 12 mark). When the engine is running 2 G's and above, the voltmeter stays just below the 3/4 mark and does not fluctuate. So what could have caused my problem? Is the stator trying to go bad? The previous owner also had replaced the original battery with one from a Gold Wing. As a result, I have no place to stick the special battery sensor tube. Could this be where my problem lies? Do I just need to get out and ride the bike some more to keep the battery charged up?

[Marcarl]

Sounds like your battery is finished, hard to tell how old a battery is sometimes and if it's used even harder to figure out.

Simple test would be to charge it overnight and then let it sit for 3 to 4 hours, or just turn your headlights on for about 5 minutes. Now check the voltage, and if it has dropped below 12 replace the battery. If it was your stator or regulator then you wouldn't get any charge at any time.

[BOO]

I agree. Sounds like the battery, I would at least clean the terminals just to make sure that's not the problem. Batteries don't last very long on the bikes to start with so putting in a used battery is just asking for trouble.

Sounds like the stater is working as it is suppose to.

Jerry

[Schlepporello]

Thanks guys. Now for my next stupid question.

Where's the best place to buy a new battery?

I've looked on-line at Batteries plus and while they don't show to have any on-line, the website says that it should be in stock in the store. The only one they show for my bike though is for an '85, not an '84. Is there enough difference between the two years to cause a problem?

[ChurchBuilder]

I bought a PC680 Odyssey AGM Battery off ebay. I've never been happier with the starting power I have now. Never a problem even after sitting for over a month.

[bobcat]

I agree that it sounds like a battery....One of the best ways to check the battery is with a hydrometer...

 

About where to buy a battery.....years ago I needed a battery and was new to town..I looked in the yellow pages under battery (duh) and found a hole in the wall battery business that had all sorts of batteries..New, used etc.I bought a new battery for my Venture and had it for 5-6 years..A hydrometer check showed it was getting weak in a couple cells so I bought another and that one has been in for several years now...My point is the batteries I've bought weren't brand names but they were good batteries and a lot cheaper....I've bought all my vehicle batteries from this guy and have not gotten a bad one yet.....

[rhncue]

I always used to get my batteries at Sam's as they are by far the cheapest at something like 29.00. They would last about three years. This last time I got a 680 jell battery off of e-bay for a little over a 100.00 and it's the best battery I've ever had in a motorcycle. In Feb. it was up to around 40 deg so I went out and cranked the bike over and it started. This was the first time it had been started after almost 4 months of winter. It cranked over better after sitting for 4 months in the winter than other batteries have cranked it over in the summer after sitting a day. I'll never go back to a standard battery at any price.

 

Dick

[Squeeze]

Search the Bike on the left Side for a Wire Connector with white or yellow Wires. It should be about where your Knee is. Take your digital Multimeter, set it on AC and 20 Volts Range and measure the Voltages between these Wires. With a fully charged Battery all three Readings should be around 15 Volts with the Bike on Idle. On higher Rpm, the Voltages should rise a Bit, but not over 17.5 Volts each. The Voltages Readings are not that important, more important is that they should be equal.

 

If this checks out fine, mostly your Battery is shot. If the P/O did replace the Battery more recently, the Regulator/Rectifier could be the Culprit.

[Schlepporello]

Thanks guys. I did the traditional tests on the battery between the charger and the hydrometer and it was obvious the battery was bad. I went down to Batteries Plus this morning and grabbed a PC680. I would have done the Ebay thing, but really kind of needed the battery right now. Anyhow, the bike fired right up like a champ, it shows to be charging better at an idle, and even the horn sounds better when I honk it at the cranky old lady down the street.

 

Thanks all for your wonderful help!

[Yammer Dan]

Now that old lady is going to be complaining about those Bikers!!!

[Schlepporello]

Now that old lady is going to be complaining about those Bikers!!!

Naw, just me.

She knows who I am and she runs around with my wife.

[Squeeze]

Good on you, but i'd check and clean the Stator Connector anyway.

[Schlepporello]

Good on you, but i'd check and clean the Stator Connector anyway.

That is the plan.

Thanks!

[wtnewton]

You should do two more checks ... And if either one fails replace the stator ...

 

1. Measure the output voltage at the battery while running at 2000rpm. It should read 14.3 volts or greater. If not then your rectifier may be bad. Search for rectifier test on this site and test it. If rectifier is bad replace it.

2. With bike not running, key off, and the 3 white wire plug disconnected, check the resistance to ground through the stator side of the plug to ground. All 3 wires should read open (OL). If any line reads any ohm value, even a .5 ohm or less, replace the stator.

Also, there should be about .5 ohm between all of the 3 combinations of the 3 wires.

 

My electrical system passed every test but the 14.3 volt test (only 13.5 on my bike) and the stator wires to ground open test ... All 3 were shorted to ground. Changed the stator and all tests are good now!

 

Good luck!

[Pasta Burner]

Old thread I know but similar circumstances. I have not had the chance to do the checks yet till after work. 87 VR all in all great shape just needed some TLC. When I got the bike it fired up fine after playing with it for a few days the battery was low but I chalked that up to me playing with it too much. Charged it and it was fine, a few days later it wouldn’t start again. And again I was playing with and modifying electronic stuff. Charged it back up and haven’t had a problem in a couple weeks. Rode to work yesterday with no issues, today the kid and I went for a ride and sitting on the overpass waiting to make a left turn onto the highway on-ramp the rpms dipped a little and it stalled. Battery was too low to fire it back up. So there we stood in the middle of a five lane interchange, luckily I was able to get to the battery with my pocket monkey and happened to have a jump pack with me because of the weeks earlier issues. Got it fired up and made it home, pulled in the stable shut it down and wouldn’t start. What I was paying attention to on the way home aside from avoiding a stall was the volt indicator, it at a stop just barely was out of the yellow but hit the middle with ease when riding or if I gave it a little throttle. I’ve never had a stator problem, but if it’s working is it just the battery isn’t holding a charge from it? Battery seems to hold fine when charged from the battery charger. Or is it possible the stator isn’t providing enough charge?

[cowpuc]

Sure sounds like the stator, or possibly the voltage regulator to my untrained brain Pasta..

 

Maybe taking a gander on one of my little totally amature video's would be of some sort of assistance.. Please forgive the back yard mechanican, and also please over look that less than stellar video quality (only nay sayer I actually picked up in the comments on this one in over 4k views was "get a tripod" )..Take a peek,, maybe it will help.. In the meantime, I will also take a look at it and see if I missed anything that I think may help you in your cause brother.. If I do,, I will post it up.. Also,, if you have any questions, you can post em up here and I am sure that one of the club guru's will be along to assist or I will try and answer your questions.. Here is the vid:

 

[Pasta Burner]

I do not see the vid, might be cause I’m on my phone. A little update, I did the stator tests, ohms at .6; no continuity to ground; voltage with the plug unplugged struck me as odd. With the DVOM set at 20vac with one probe in a terminal read anywhere between 3 and 8 volts. This happened with each wire. As soon as I got the second probe into another socket the volts erred out and had no reading. This was the same for each combination. Plugged the harness back in and was reading 14.2ish vac at 2k rpm if memory serves correct. At idle 900ish rpm each combination was reading between 11.95 and 12.05.

 

The other thing I took note of when doing the tests and on the ride home was that the volt meter drops considerably when the brake is engaged, not sure how much draw the brake lights should have but it was very noticeable. Mind you the battery hadn’t been fully recharged, just thrown on the charger for an hour or so while I finished up work.

 

I pulled the battery in anticipation of needing to replace it, it’s an Apex. I’ve never heard of that brand and can get an Xtreme replacement from batteries and bulbs in stock. Going to take 10 days to get a Deka in but I’m still not convinced the battery is the problem.

[cimmer]

Are you using the procedure in the service manual to check the stator and its components? There is a copy of the manual in the tech library that you can download and that will help you out. Also do you still have the original fuse panel installed? The fuses have a tendency to get loose in the holders as they lose their tension to hold the fuses tight. Most of us have replaced it with a blade style fuse holder.

Also make sure the connectors for the regulator and stator are clean and corrosion free as that will cause issues also..

Good luck

 

Rick F.

[Pasta Burner]

Thanx for letting me know the service manual has troubleshooting for the charging system. I checked the stator ohms and they were nominal for the spec range. I spent the next two beers searching for the rectifier and thanks to another thread finally found it. Having already showered for the night I’m not laying on the garage floor to do the rest of the tests. I do still have the original fuse block. One of the first things I did was clean and tighten the glass fuses. All are still intact.

charged the battery overnight and it charged up full with no faults. Sitting at 12.8v still at the end of the day.

[Pasta Burner]

so I can’t make heads or tails of what the service manual wants me to test. Those connections don’t seem to exist. I used the testing method described in this thread https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?37884-rectifier-bench-test&highlight=Rectifier+test and everything checks out mostly ok. Using a digital meter in the diode mode two wires consistently measure the same and the other is .003 off. Is that enough to make a difference? Also the connector gets too hot to handle, is that normal? Here is a pic from the service manual, If someone can explain where connection a-e is that might help. As far as I see there are only three white wires.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Pasta Burner

[Marcarl]

Just speaking to the connector here,, if it gets hot, there is a problem. If it's the 3 wire connector on the left side, wires coming from the stator, then take it apart, remove the connector and solder he wires together, making sure they are well insulated. You might have found your problem. While it's apart heck the 3 wires for continuity.

[Pasta Burner]

Just speaking to the connector here,, if it gets hot, there is a problem. If it's the 3 wire connector on the left side, wires coming from the stator, then take it apart, remove the connector and solder he wires together, making sure they are well insulated. You might have found your problem. While it's apart heck the 3 wires for continuity.

Yes this is the three white wire connector. So your suggesting eliminate the connector? One wire insulation was pretty charred but not to the point of failure. Are you thinking the connector is creating resistance, thus heat? I’ve ohmed out the stator side of the connector and it indicates nominal if that’s what you mean by checking continuity. Micro electronics and wiring is my career so none of what you are saying is foreign to me, just making sure I understand. I’m also an Air Force technical order writer so I’m trained to ask “why?” Haha. Thanks for the assistance.

[saddlebum]

Yes this is the three white wire connector. So your suggesting eliminate the connector? One wire insulation was pretty charred but not to the point of failure. Are you thinking the connector is creating resistance, thus heat? I’ve ohmed out the stator side of the connector and it indicates nominal if that’s what you mean by checking continuity. Micro electronics and wiring is my career so none of what you are saying is foreign to me, just making sure I understand. I’m also an Air Force technical order writer so I’m trained to ask “why?” Haha. Thanks for the assistance.

What Marcarl is probably saying is the terminals inside the connector are in bad condition resulting in poor connection. When a lot of currant is passed through it, it will heat up thus indicating the poor connection. Checking a connection like this with an ohmmeter is not always a reliable test because the ohmmeter draws very little currant and as a result may indicate an OK connection when in fact it is not ok because under a heavier load than that placed on it by an ohmmeter it can still fail. There are better ways for testing for a bad connection than using an ohmmeter in a case like this but because of the time and amount of set up involved your just as well off to either replace the connector or just cut it out and hard-wire it as Marcarl suggests. Keep in mind here that depending on the condition of the wire they can sometimes be difficult to solder properly since they need to be clean and free of oxidation for a good solder joint and use rosin core solder not acid flux. If soldering is not working out use un-insulated butt connectors with a good crimping tool and double wall heat shrink tubing with sealer.

Edited May 16, 2020 by saddlebum

[Marcarl]

So to develop @saddlebum's post a bit, there is resistance in the connector which creates heat and it take current to create heat and that results in the loss of current, so a drop in voltage and amperage which you need to charge the system... 'course you know all that, but I just want to show Saddlebum and Patch how smart I can be at times. It doesn't matter which wire goes to which. They are all white, so just put them together and insulate them well. Hopefully this will bring the available current back up to the required voltage at the battery.

Boy!!!! I feel good now!!!!

[cimmer]

so I can’t make heads or tails of what the service manual wants me to test. Those connections don’t seem to exist. I used the testing method described in this thread https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?37884-rectifier-bench-test&highlight=Rectifier+test and everything checks out mostly ok. Using a digital meter in the diode mode two wires consistently measure the same and the other is .003 off. Is that enough to make a difference? Also the connector gets too hot to handle, is that normal? Here is a pic from the service manual, If someone can explain where connection a-e is that might help. As far as I see there are only three white wires.

 

the manual doesnt give the proper location to test the diodes. Looking at the drawing and the chart it should be..

d = Red Wire

a = White wire 1

b = White wire 2

c = White wire 3

e = Black wire.

 

What that test does it to verify that the diodes in the rectifier are good.

 

If the connector is getting too hot to hold then there is corrosion in the connector and it either needs to have the terminals cleaned or the connector replaced.

Some of us here have replaced the regulator with a more modern one that does a better job of charging the battery and supplying current to the electrical system also.

 

Hope this helps..

 

Rick F.