more on oil

[mraf]

This is a bit long but a good listen. Makes me want to kick some A.

[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3340274697167011147]The Energy Non-Crisis[/ame]

[Tom]

AMEN on this..I hope this does not become political,its just common sense. We do not need to be dependent on FOREIGN oil and YES we need to find alternative energy sources but until then the people should not be under such a burden as 4-5$ a gallon gas prices or food prices soaring because of a not so well thought ought idea such as ethanol. Drill Here Drill Now Pay Less.

[bongobobny]

The only problem being it takes about 5 years before you can start to refine after beginning to drill. As soon as the oil giants get wind that we are going to be producing our own supply of oil either one of two things wil happen. Prices will skyrocket, crippling our economy even worse, or prices will plumet ending our need to drill, and also making it economically unpractical to drill. We should have started producing our own oil years ago...

[Tom]

The only problem being it takes about 5 years before you can start to refine after beginning to drill. As soon as the oil giants get wind that we are going to be producing our own supply of oil either one of two things wil happen. Prices will skyrocket, crippling our economy even worse, or prices will plumet ending our need to drill, and also making it economically unpractical to drill. We should have started producing our own oil years ago...

This is fairly true..If it would not have been vetoed several years ago we would have been online with oil flowing today..Gotta start somewhere..Cant just wait or we are all hurt no matter what side of the issue each may be on..By the way Bongo,I have been following your health issue and I do believer the prayers are working! If ever I get in that part of the country and you can deal with my southern draw accent I will stop by and say Howdy! Tom Glad you are doing OK!

[Snarley Bill]

heres my take on oil. i'm not really going to worry about it. nobodies going to do a thing about it. worring about it ain't going to change a thing. we got caught with our pants down and there ain't no fix. just a bunch of false dreaming that some one is going to come up with a solution. they're a day late and a dollar short .it just ain't gonna get any better before it gets alot worse. so i'm just going to enjoy riding my bike and do my own conservation to keep my cost of living on an even keel and most of all i'm going to enjoy the hell out of the rest of my life as long as my wife i got our health. i saw this coming along time ago and i'm ready for all the crap they can throw at me. even got my refrigerator box picked out for my second retirement.

[hipshot]

seems to me , i recall that congress, is "grilling", the SPECULATORS, about their unethical practices.

i am with snarly bill, on this one.

ain't no help/hope in sight.

just jt

[PBJ]

I thought thats why we all ride 45 mpg motorcycles to put a thumb in the eye of the oil Barons. Still its a shame that theres no real competitive alternate fuel source out there. Even the electric fuel cells being developed and designed to extract hydrogen from a petroleum based product.. Why hasn't anyone come up with a quick efficient steam generator system quick enough to produce steam to power a generator to run electric motors at each wheel (ala the tankless water heater systems?). Imagine a two wheel drive bike with a motor at each hub!

[paddler]

I am far from being an expert on this, but I have been paying attention. From everything I have heard and read, if Bush would release some of the oil reserves, there would be an immediate drop in oil prices. He says he is holding the reserves for an emergency. With people losing their jobs, stock prices falling again, the transportation industry going down the crapper, including the trickle-down effect, workers just buying enough gas to get back and forth to their jobs - well if this isn't an emergency, I don't know what is!

[az1103]

I thought thats why we all ride 45 mpg motorcycles to put a thumb in the eye of the oil Barons. Still its a shame that theres no real competitive alternate fuel source out there. Even the electric fuel cells being developed and designed to extract hydrogen from a petroleum based product.. Why hasn't anyone come up with a quick efficient steam generator system quick enough to produce steam to power a generator to run electric motors at each wheel (ala the tankless water heater systems?). Imagine a two wheel drive bike with a motor at each hub!

 

Wrong! I for one, am not riding for any other reason than loving to ride. I was riding when it was 35 cents a gallon, and I'll be riding when it's ten dollars a gallon.

But as someone who was in the refinery building business, I can tell you that the fault lies in the overly agressive but thoroughly under-educated approach of the greenheads. The Al Gore types got us into this but they won't be getting us out! You can't legislate and mandate your way out of this one - There is no perpetual motion machine-nor will there ever be one. And any conversion of energy necessarily uses more energy. An electric motor does not use less energy if you still have to charge a battery. Where do you think that comes from!!!!!????? Yes indeed , the same old hydrocarbons.

If those morons in congress had approved new drilling, some nuclear power plants, and encouraged and not mandated some intelligent conservation along the way, we wouldnt't be up the creek right now.

You can't mandate invention! and particularly of these pie-in-the-sky perpetual motion schemes that most polititians want to see. The problem is they are thoroughly ignorant of science and natural processes, they only excel in the bla-bla-bla department, just like most greenheads. Just plain hopelessly uneducated!!!

[Freebird]

Come on now folks, let's not turn this into a debate about which party is to blame, which president is to blame, etc. A blind hog could have seen this coming 40 years ago and nobody on either side has done anything.

[Venturous Randy]

Hey Freebird, aren't you in the "numbers" selling business? Have you been selling a lot of "4's" lately?

RandyA

[Freebird]

LOL...yea...I'll have to admit that the number 4 has been the biggest seller in that product line. I don't work on commission though so it really hasn't helped me personally. Actually, we sell a lot of the changeable letters but it's a very small part of our business. A lot of the stations have gone to the electronic signs.

[PBJ]

I 'm sorry but i wasn't really talking about some pie-in-the-sky pertual motion machine . I was speculating on a system new and different and possibly capable of being made. When the first internal combustion engines were invented they were large cumbersome monsters. No one ever imagined them powering personal transportation in their inception.Today they have been refined to highly effiecent machines and getting better. A system like i was thinking of would only need to super heat water in a line the size of a metal break line. The heat energuywoud come from a battery yes until the generator started to turn genrating electricity to continue the heater process. Of course there would be eventual loss's in the process but water super heated in small quantities is not that out of question or impossible just because no one else ever thought of it before.. We'll never get ourselves out of a dependency on one energy source unless we open our minds to new possibilities. We need more men Like Henry Ford and Thomas Edison were iventors of the univented ,not redesigners of things alrady invented. :innocent:I hope I said that diplomatical.

[mraf]

I for one am tired of the blame games. Enough already. Like has been said on this forum many times lets stop talking and start doing. I for one will now turn on my new more efficient light bulb. Mow less yard. Drive my bike more. Make lists of things to get when driving to town. Not leave any combustion engine idling for any length of time {waiting for trains}. Recycle all metal and plastics that I can. Stop using chemical fertilizers and "save the World". This whole mess is everyones problem now and if not addressed now our grandchildren will inherit one throughly screwed up world.

But who cares, I've got enough money to do what I want. That is so short-sighted and egotistical.

Wouldn't it be nice if someone,somewhere powerfull enough gave a darn what is happening to our once strong countries. But alas it will never be. For with power comes greed.

[PBJ]

Can't agree more Mraf. I bought a farmhome 25 years ago. Not to to isolate myself and my family from the world but just to get back to a little more efficency. Wood stove in the kitchen, cycle to work, most cars with 4 cylinder engines( American and forgein) Propane for back up furnace, recyled paper and glass long before the blue boxes were around. Simply because like you said, doing is the only way. Whining gets alot of nothin.

 

i'm not concerned so much about who's not doing what. What's more important is what we all can do to help. Together we can accomplish so much more

[1BigDog]

Ive been conserving energy for many years.......Just see how worn out my recliner is....

[Freebird]

I 'm sorry but i wasn't really talking about some pie-in-the-sky pertual motion machine . I was speculating on a system new and different and possibly capable of being made. When the first internal combustion engines were invented they were large cumbersome monsters. No one ever imagined them powering personal transportation in their inception.Today they have been refined to highly effiecent machines and getting better. A system like i was thinking of would only need to super heat water in a line the size of a metal break line. The heat energuywoud come from a battery yes until the generator started to turn genrating electricity to continue the heater process. Of course there would be eventual loss's in the process but water super heated in small quantities is not that out of question or impossible just because no one else ever thought of it before.. We'll never get ourselves out of a dependency on one energy source unless we open our minds to new possibilities. We need more men Like Henry Ford and Thomas Edison were iventors of the univented ,not redesigners of things alrady invented. :innocent:I hope I said that diplomatical.

 

There was actually an article in Popular Science about two months ago about a new steam engine that a guy has patented. He already has contracts with some yard equipment manufacturers. Nothing automotive yet. It doesn't use batteries but does use a small gasoline motor and superheat water. According to the article, it was very fuel efficient.

[Snarley Bill]

Wrong! I for one, am not riding for any other reason than loving to ride. I was riding when it was 35 cents a gallon, and I'll be riding when it's ten dollars a gallon.

But as someone who was in the refinery building business, I can tell you that the fault lies in the overly agressive but thoroughly under-educated approach of the greenheads. The Al Gore types got us into this but they won't be getting us out! You can't legislate and mandate your way out of this one - There is no perpetual motion machine-nor will there ever be one. And any conversion of energy necessarily uses more energy. An electric motor does not use less energy if you still have to charge a battery. Where do you think that comes from!!!!!????? Yes indeed , the same old hydrocarbons.

If those morons in congress had approved new drilling, some nuclear power plants, and encouraged and not mandated some intelligent conservation along the way, we wouldnt't be up the creek right now.

You can't mandate invention! and particularly of these pie-in-the-sky perpetual motion schemes that most polititians want to see. The problem is they are thoroughly ignorant of science and natural processes, they only excel in the bla-bla-bla department, just like most greenheads. Just plain hopelessly uneducated!!!

you said it all perfectly.if anyone ever took physics , physics says it all you can't get something for nothing and there ain't no free lunches. to put it simple. there definately ain't no such thing as perpetual motion. honda's been trying for years to come up with cars that set fuel economy records and so have all the manufacturers. they have hit the brick wall called the laws of physics. bill

[Snarley Bill]

Come on now folks, let's not turn this into a debate about which party is to blame, which president is to blame, etc. A blind hog could have seen this coming 40 years ago and nobody on either side has done anything.

don you are exactly right on. it 's not a political issue both parties have made all kinds of promises. on all issues with no results all they do is bicker sling dirt and call names with no results. i've watched this since the 50's and it's been down hill with the wind with every administration. finger pointing is'nt going to fix this. all americans on both sides and in between need to rally together to fix this problem and i just don't see them getting past their greed to do this. when i was a kid people stood by their country and worked together when the going got tough. now it's party, and get all you can while the gettins good. just don't see any possible fix. it's a whole new mind set now. the fast lane just got to fast. bill

[az1103]

Come on now folks, let's not turn this into a debate about which party is to blame, which president is to blame, etc. A blind hog could have seen this coming 40 years ago and nobody on either side has done anything.

 

Nor did I mention any party in particular. Congresses, and presidents of both parties have dropped the ball for years. If my statement was political in any way, it was only to say that if we could harness all the hot air and useless noise coming out of Washington we would be energy independent for the next 100 years.

But one thing is certain, if you want a problem solved, don't get the government involved for it will only get worse!

And by the way, I happen to be registered Independent. Not "independent Party", Independent.!!!