Why Wear A Mask

[saddlebum]

20 hours ago, bpate4home said:

From the CDC, a memo that stated 6% of the COVID death total was actually due to only the COVID 19 virus.

6% may sound low but of 4.5 million world wide deaths, that is still 270,000 world wide,  38,255 Americans, 1,614 Canadians all of which died directly from covid with no underlying issues, that alone is an unacceptable high number of deaths, that for all we know could maybe have been preventable.

Edited August 29, 2021 by saddlebum

[saddlebum]

5 minutes ago, uncledj said:

 (Can't live without my Venturider fix)

On that we can agree whole hardheartedly

[bpate4home]

2 hours ago, saddlebum said:

I got your point and rephrased to what I hope is more acceptable and less offensive as I only wish to present a point of view, not offend anybody.

Thanks @ChiefGunner & @saddlebum. Speaking for myself I don't think the person has been born that can offend me, maybe tick me off a little but never offend. LOL 

[bpate4home]

49 minutes ago, saddlebum said:

6% may sound low but of 4.5 million world wide deaths, that is still 270,000 world wide,  38,255 Americans, 1,614 Canadians all of which died directly from covid with no underlying issues, that alone is an unacceptable high number of deaths, that for all we know could maybe have been preventable.

I think you still have to take this as a whole of the population. That number is more like 0.0125% in the US. Unacceptable? Where I agree with this is in that it does not happen without Humans creating it though Gain of Function work. We all live to die, it is inevitable and sad but true.  BTW I read a chart from WHO the other day and now I can't find it. It listed the Flu and Pneumonia both having more than 2x the number of deaths attributed to it than COVID though the first 4 or 5 months of the year. Wish I could find that now. I found that stupid meme that was supposedly based on it but I want the report again. 

[ChiefGunner]

1 hour ago, saddlebum said:

6% may sound low but of 4.5 million world wide deaths, that is still 270,000 world wide,  38,255 Americans, 1,614 Canadians all of which died directly from covid with no underlying issues, that alone is an unacceptable high number of deaths, that for all we know could maybe have been preventable.

Since you want some facts, here you are from the CDC regarding just flu cases in the US alone, not worldwide.

“CDC estimates that the burden of illness during the 2019–2020 season was moderate with an estimated 38 million people sick with flu, 18 million visits to a health care provider for flu, 400,000 hospitalizations for flu, and 22,000 flu DEATHS  (Table 1).”

And those numbers are for a moderate flu season. It has been around for how many millennium with a vaccine (one properly tested) for decades.  This does not even take into account the annual pneumonia deaths.

And despite all this, do you go into lock down every flu or pneumonia season? What about demanding people wear masks or isolate? Where’s the demand for flu injections?  Especially considering those 2 illnesses have killed and DO kill annually far more people than have ever died of covid.

The hyperbole just doesn’t match the facts.

Remember that YOUR quoted number of deaths from covid is NOT an annual tally but a RUNNING tally. Therefore the simple flu numbers posted completely eclipse covid.

Edited August 30, 2021 by ChiefGunner

[bpate4home]

I just found these quotes from recent articles:

CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walenksy and others have cited studies saying that the vaccines don’t necessarily prevent transmission of COVID-19, but have stated that the shots limit the severity of the illness.

and

 

a preprint Israeli study that found that previous COVID-19 infection provides better protection against the Delta variant than any of the COVID-19 vaccines.

“SARS-CoV-2-naive vaccinees had a 13.06-fold increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta variant compared to those previously infected, when the first event (infection or vaccination) occurred during January and February of 2021,” the study reads.

Again, When do we stop calling it break through infections?

[bpate4home]

One additional note: I don't believe that many here will change their mind. For me it is never about changing someone's mind on their own beliefs. If you feel you need or want the vaccine for whatever reason that's fine. If you feel you don't want the vaccine for any reason that's fine too. But know this I will never discriminate or berate you either way because it is our own choice in the end. At this point anyone of us could be a carrier, vaccinated or not. 

[Du-Rron]

Yall ... please keep telling me the death of any antivax/anticovid person is just for fear mongering and that no such deadly virus really exists.

https://sanangelolive.com/news/health/2021-08-28/freedom-defender-caleb-wallace-dies-covid-19

Yall.. please keep telling me that 74% of the 62% of 100% of those folks that get covid just have a really bad horrible cold with long lasting side effects (death) is just a figment of my uneducated imagination. Tell me again how falling in the bathtub or the effects of the common flu are much worse.

https://sanangelolive.com/news/health/2021-08-27/famous-texas-game-warden-dies-covid-19

Yall... please keep telling me that the vaccination is in itself deadly or is just hooey and will provide no protection  against Covid at all, when in my own home town that Covid is running rampent.  (Texas statewide in general)

https://sanangelolive.com/news/health/2021-08-28/six-unvaccinated-patients-die-covid-19-one-day

Yall... I live and work here in San Angelo.  I see with my own eyes what is going on around me.  Please tell me this is just a bad dream.

https://sanangelolive.com/news/health/2021-08-27/high-covid-infections-continue-plague-san-angelo

 

 

 

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by Du-Rron

[WildBill1]

On 8/25/2021 at 2:20 AM, ChiefGunner said:

This is “Hog Wash”/“Bum Wad” people don’t believe this crap!  She is not even a MD!  She is a PhD.  Short for “Post Hole Digger “!!!

[ChiefGunner]

14 minutes ago, WildBill1 said:

This is “Hog Wash”/“Bum Wad” people don’t believe this crap!  She is not even a MD!  She is a PhD.  Short for “Post Hole Digger “!!!

Well it’s pretty obvious her qualifications and insight are far above your opinion. Your opinion is valid in that it is yours however, hers however has earned credibility.

https://www.informedchoiceaustralia.com/post/uncensored-dr-janci-chunn-lindsay-ph-d-molecular-biologist-and-toxicologist

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner, this lady is advocating in this quote, you presented, to treat folks with "Ivermectin", an over the counter de-wormer for farm animals available at Tractor Supply.  This is what Caleb Wallace did and what he advocated others to do, (please see the plethora of articles I have attached which mentions this).  It didn't work.  Aren't we past that yet.  In addition to Ivermectin costing very little, according to the lady, may I also point out, that at this time, a Covid vaccination is completely FREE of charge to anyone wishing to have one.  Unless you have some Ivermectin already around for deworming your mule, a Covid vaccination is the lower cost alternative for humans.

 

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by Du-Rron

[ChiefGunner]

12 minutes ago, Du-Rron said:

@ChiefGunner, this lady is advocating in this quote you presented, to treat folks with "Ivermectin", an over the counter de-wormer for farm animals available at Tractor Supply.  This is what Caleb Wallace did and what he advocated others to do.  It didn't work.  Aren't we past that yet. 

 

 

Nowhere in that article does she advocate Ivermectin.  Nice “red herring” to divert away from the real concern of sterility, blood clots and other issues.  What we do have that we know works best is hydroxychloroquine.  It’s been safely used for 50 years and is inexpensive and no side effects.  But that’s not acceptable is it?

Edited August 30, 2021 by ChiefGunner

[RDawson]

5 minutes ago, Du-Rron said:

@ChiefGunner, this lady is advocating in this quote you presented, to treat folks with "Ivermectin", an over the counter de-wormer for farm animals available at Tractor Supply.  This is what Caleb Wallace did and what he advocated others to do.  It didn't work.  Aren't we past that yet. 

 

 

This where the political argument resides in me (no I’m not offended). My wife had Covid in January, normally any respiratory virus kicks her hard, knowing that her dr ordered the antibody plasma infusion and Hydroxichloroquine (spelling?) that Trump was ridiculed for endorsing and prescribed me Ivermectin (human tablet dosage). She came thru it better than the usual cold virus and I never got it despite no change in how we lived. Did the meds work, were we lucky, I’m guessing we’ll never know for sure but I was willing to take my chances with the future. Too many unknowns and I believe both sides are responsible for not being totally truthful with the facts. 

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner, no, at this time Hydroxychloroquine is not.  Plus, it also costs a fortune, which is out of the realm of this ladies article advocating low cost use.  Horribly expensive compared to the 5 Billion doses of the vaccination already given and cannot be made in the needed quantity either.

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-cautions-against-use-hydroxychloroquine-or-chloroquine-covid-19-outside-hospital-setting-or

 

https://www.goodrx.com/hydroxychloroquine

 

 

[ChiefGunner]

7 minutes ago, Du-Rron said:

@ChiefGunner, no, at this time Hydroxychloroquine is not.  Plus, it also costs a fortune, which is out of the realm of this ladies article advocating low cost use.  Horribly expensive compared to the 5 Billion doses of the vaccination already given and cannot be made in the needed quantity either.

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-cautions-against-use-hydroxychloroquine-or-chloroquine-covid-19-outside-hospital-setting-or

 

https://www.goodrx.com/hydroxychloroquine

 

 

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2021/06/09/hydroxychloroquine-study-n2590700

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner I might also add that you should not just "Self-Treat" with Hydroxychloroquine.  You must get sick with Covid, put in a hospital, and then to be in a very elite group to get any.  The Vaccination is free, for anyone over 12, and is designed to keep you out of the Hospital.  In San Angelo, please read carefully, San Angelo I say, the dead ones are currently the unvaccinated ones. 

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner... I dont want to go to the Hospital with severe Covid .... at all.

 

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner, put it this way.  The Covid Vaccination will probably keep you out of the hospital, and if you do go in you probably wont die.  I believe if you get a vaccination you wont have much to worry about, even here in San Angelo, for the next fer months until it is time for a booster.

If I should have to go to the hospital, and I can "improve my survival chances", which is what your link says, and really what it comes down to, then at that time I would personally tell the doctors to give me anything they got, as much as they can, as fast as they can.

The debate is staying out of the hospital in the 1st place by getting a vaccination that is also free (as your ladies article advocates low cost health car) , the debate is not, what expensive, rare, drugs you give a person that is on the dead-roll once they get in the hospital.

 

 

[ChiefGunner]

13 minutes ago, Du-Rron said:

@ChiefGunner I might also add that you should not just "Self-Treat" with Hydroxychloroquine.  You must get sick with Covid, put in a hospital, and then to be in a very elite group to get any.  The Vaccination is free, for anyone over 12, and is designed to keep you out of the Hospital.  In San Angelo, please read carefully, San Angelo I say, the dead ones are currently the unvaccinated ones. 

Did you not read that the vaccine has caused blood clots and does cause sterility?

Oh, and let’s not forget the proven fact that those who have had covid whether mild or severe and recovered have stronger immune response than any given by a vaccine and therefore do not need to be vaccinated.

Edited August 30, 2021 by ChiefGunner

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner I wish I knew how to quote on this thing, but wrong again on the fertility thing

https://www.muhealth.org/our-stories/does-covid-19-vaccine-affect-fertility-heres-what-experts-say

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/planning-for-pregnancy.html

 

I really dont know how to quantify your remark of the 0.00008% of folks not getting covid at all by the Vaccination process and having a weak(er) immune system, vs, those folks that have caught covid and remained standing.  Even if you have had Covid in the past, it is recommended for best protection to get a Covid vaccination right now.

[Du-Rron]

@ChiefGunner... in the article you presented... she advocated ivermectin.....

[saddlebum]

13 hours ago, bpate4home said:

Thanks @ChiefGunner & @saddlebum. Speaking for myself I don't think the person has been born that can offend me, maybe tick me off a little but never offend. LOL 

and it is often those we love the most that tick us off the easiest but thank God there is no shortage of forgiveness and understanding in this life. We only need to make use of it. 

Edited August 30, 2021 by saddlebum

[bpate4home]

This just made me laugh. 

[saddlebum]

 

12 hours ago, ChiefGunner said:

Since you want some facts, here you are from the CDC regarding just flu cases in the US alone, not worldwide.

“CDC estimates that the burden of illness during the 2019–2020 season was moderate with an estimated 38 million people sick with flu, 18 million visits to a health care provider for flu, 400,000 hospitalizations for flu, and 22,000 flu DEATHS  (Table 1).”

And those numbers are for a moderate flu season. It has been around for how many millennium with a vaccine (one properly tested) for decades.  This does not even take into account the annual pneumonia deaths.

And despite all this, do you go into lock down every flu or pneumonia season? What about demanding people wear masks or isolate? Where’s the demand for flu injections?  Especially considering those 2 illnesses have killed and DO kill annually far more people than have ever died of covid.

The hyperbole just doesn’t match the facts.

Remember that YOUR quoted number of deaths from covid is NOT an annual tally but a RUNNING tally. Therefore the simple flu numbers posted completely eclipse covid.

Ok so let me get this straight ;

1. we have 38,00,000 with the flu so adding another 38,900,000 covid cases is ok even though we now have 76,900,000 sick people
2. We have 22,000 flu deaths so adding another 637,280 covid deaths is ok
3. of the 22,000 flu deaths how many had no underlying issue versus 38,255 covid deaths with no underlying issues

I fail to understand how these flu statistics justify accepting covid numbers as acceptable losses. It  only increases the number of sick people overall. Keep in mind covid does not displace other illnesses, it adds to the total number of sick people adding to the burden of our health providers. who in many cases due to either bureaucracy or cost cuts are already overworked.

Also, I was not making a point of statistics but trying to point out that percentages are relative to the gross number involved 6% off 100 is only 6 but 6% 0f 1,000,000 is 60,000. Therefore using percentages to make a point or comparison, is mute at best. You could say 10% of regular flu victims die while only 5% of covid victims die but if you only have 100 flu victims at 10% that is only 10 people but if you have 1000 covid victims even 5% that is still 50 people.

[Argo]

36 minutes ago, saddlebum said:

 

Ok so let me get this straight ;

1. we have 38,00,000 with the flu so adding another 38,900,000 covid cases is ok even though we now have 76,900,000 sick people
2. We have 22,000 flu deaths so adding another 637,280 covid deaths is ok
3. of the 22,000 flu deaths how many had no underlying issue versus 38,255 covid deaths with no underlying issues

I fail to understand how these flu statistics justify accepting covid numbers as acceptable losses. It  only increases the number of sick people overall. Keep in mind covid does not displace other illnesses, it adds to the total number of sick people adding to the burden of our health providers. who in many cases due to either bureaucracy or cost cuts are already overworked.

Also, I was not making a point of statistics but trying to point out that percentages are relative to the gross number involved 6% off 100 is only 6 but 6% 0f 1,000,000 is 60,000. Therefore using percentages to make a point or comparison, is mute at best. You could say 10% of regular flu victims die while only 5% of covid victims die but if you only have 100 flu victims at 10% that is only 10 people but if you have 1000 covid victims even 5% that is still 50 people.

saddlebum,

All deaths are a tragic no matter the cause.

I believe the point that is trying to be made is the extent that the "measures" that have been and are currently being made mandatory for entire populations are well out of proportion to the actual death rates when compared to other viruses etc.

This is what causes people to question the reasons that these actions are taking place. I for one see far too many things that are coming to light after the fact that make me question the true motives of those "in charge". For me it goes much farther back than 2019.

Argo