Am I allowed to ask......

[kevin-vic-b.c.]

.... about a guy name Sonny? I had been following a Facebook page about our bikes and it seems a fellow who "owns" the page has quite the hate on for VR.org and will not permit people on "his" page to refer others to this site. He seems to have a big issue with $12.

I guess it just peaked my curiosity is all.

[XV1100SE]

I had a "run in" with him when I posted a link to VR.org to answer a question for someone on his site. I don't find Facebook to be very friendly to doing searches on a forum. You try to help someone and he reacts that way.

[kevin-vic-b.c.]

I had a "run in" with him when I posted a link to VR.org to answer a question for someone on his site. I don't find Facebook to be very friendly to doing searches on a forum. You try to help someone and he reacts that way.

 

Totally agree. The layout here is by far the best way to share information. I also follow a VStrom forum with pretty much this same layout and both are great.... the people here are best though.

 

Like you said.... just trying to help others with the little I know after a dozen years playing with these bikes.

[XV1100SE]

I've heard others say the same thing about his attitude. He is quick to jump all over people who don't share his opinions.

[XV1100SE]

See this thread....from 2013 - https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?77424-Blowing-off-steam&highlight=sonny+facebook . See post 19, 31, and 54

[XV1100SE]

Also see https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?44230-vr-org-facebook&highlight=sonny+facebook post 13 from the "Sunman" in 2010 where he says he "The goal of the facebook page, is two fold, first to give all Venture and RSTD riders and fans, a page and presence on facebook, and secondly to introduce them to this site." (meaning VR.org).

[XV1100SE]

...and.... https://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?37271-My-RSTD-custom-project-(Caution-nekkidness-inside)&highlight=sonny+facebook

 

He had 231 posts on vr.org....and was here yesterday even though he is an expired member :

Join Date - 05-16-2007

Last Activity - yesterday (08-14-2020)

Last Post - 01-10-2010

 

Doesn't like us helping people by referring to articles here but still checks out VR.org.

 

Sorry Sonny....but we are here to support other riders of Ventures and RSTD. Doesn't matter what site you refer people to whether here or your facebook page. Gotta help each other.

[cowpuc]

Interesting,, this is Sonny Rattan/Sunman writing as a member in our club back in 2010:

 

I am Sonny Rattan. I have been a member of VR.org for quite a few years now. I ride a 2006 custom RSTD. I made the Yamaha Venture and RSTD facebook group quite a while ago. The goal of the facebook page, is two fold, first to give all Venture and RSTD riders and fans, a page and presence on facebook, and secondly to introduce them to this site. Believe it or not, there are many Venture and RSTD riders who don't know about this site. That is evident from the amount of people who find the facebook group, and show up here, or send me messages. I am glad to introduce them to the site, that has been such a great help to me. A separate facebook group for Venturerider.org, would only be found by people who alread knew about this site, my facebook group is about people who like the bikes first. It is a fan page of the bikes. I was asked to change the name of the group somehow, it is called

 

"Yamaha Royal Star Venture and Tour Deluxe Fans, and Owners"

 

Which I would assume would encompass all of you on facebook. I think the name is appropriate for what it is. Don is the admin of the group, I asked him about it before I did it. Not sure why anyone wants to change it.

 

and, surprisingly,, if I am understanding all this correctly,, this is the same Sonny Rattan/Sunman writing now on "his" facebook page with the exact same name as above of ""Yamaha Royal Star Venture and Tour Deluxe Fans, and Owners"" written today, 8-14-20..

 

and he wrote:

"I now come to something that may bother some of you. I do not want links and referrals to another Venture Rider internet site. Specifically the paid site. I was a long time member there for many years and even paid when Don needed help. But seriously, in this day and age, who pays to be on a bulletin board? And at 4K plus members at $12 a head, well you do the math. All the files should be available here in our files section it has so many. I am not comfortable sending our members to a site where they will be required to pay to be a part of it. Remember, these files were not created by the site owner they were gathered FREE from the internet and posted there. Some members from that site threatened me when I would not allow them to advertise here. Michael Brady posted there that he and some guys should come to Canada and knock on my door if I won't let him and Dave Watson advertise here. So yeah, don't post links to that site. Period. Everything you need is here, and if you are a member there, no problem. Your choice. If you tell people they should sign up there...you get the picture.

I want to also let you know that if you believe you understand the rules and you are comfortable helping to apply them to our page, let me know I could use a moderator or 2. Even just to have a break!"

 

In this rant of his I noticed he mentions Brake Pad.. Many of our club members will remember Mike/Brake Pad and know Mike has not been active in the club for quite some time as he suffered a bad accident on his Wing and no longer rides.. I spoke to Mike not long ago, he is doing much better and is still his lovable self. In Brake Pads defense here I find it hard to believe that Sonny/Sunmans reference to Mike could possibly be current? I highly doubt it.. If I am correct in my summation that it is not current but simply something that happened a long time ago I feel sorry for Sonny and his inability to let Saigon's be bygones. Life is to short for extreme drama and the type of division that he is promoting.. IMHO, especially during this time of upheaval in the world, one would hope and pray that as a motorcycling community we could debate pro's and con's of motorcycle brands/models, share information about them and enjoy our sport together without this type of nonsense.. It has always been vr club code that no political/religion discussions would be tolerated,, for obvious reasons.. Its a sad state of affairs when we are now asked to no longer even talk about motorcycles within the ranks of the larger biking community .. I also noticed that Sonny mentions our archived tech info and that the info was gathered by our club freely from the internet.. I take issue with that.. Much of the info in our tech area is derived by contribution from club members past/present and future and is an accumulation of hundreds of hours of experience from the contributors thereof.. "The internet" as it were, is simply a vehicle for connecting us lop eared varmints together and, until Artificial Intelligence is completed,, the internet is still garbage in/garbage out,, in itself it has no way of diagnosing bike issues or coming and rescuing one of us if we break down or pray for us if/when we are in need.. It is up to each one of us to decipher what is truth and what is not, truth matters..

I also take issue with the idea that our club takes a stand that if you dont pay,, you cant play.. First of all,, as far as I know Freebird still has entrance into our club set up with a 100% FREE trial period.. All a person has to do to access our tech info and also inquire/participate in discussions concerning MOTORCYCLES is take advantage of this free trial.. 2ndly, I know for fact that if one so chooses not to contribute a buck a month in club dues after that free access has expired that he/she is in no way hounded to do so.. And then finally,, and I REALLY need to say this cause Don is friend of mine who deserves to have the truth told about him,, I am one of numerous club members who,, after mentioning to him that at the time I simply could not afford the dollar a month club fee, he completely and totally marked me paid and continued to do so until my finances improved.. That is the truth and,, even though it seems that in this day and age many people are doing all they can to run and hide from it,, IMHO,, TRUTH MATTERS..

[XV1100SE]

...All the files should be available here in our files section it has so many. I am not comfortable sending our members to a site where they will be required to pay to be a part of it. Remember, these files were not created by the site owner they were gathered FREE from the internet and posted there. ...

 

Here Sonny admits to taking the documents on VR.org and putting them on his Facebook page. I take exception to this as I have written and submitted "how to" documents TO VR.org....NOT to his Facebook page. I would think that the documents in the tech section BELONG to VR.org and are not free to the world to repost or take credit for them.

 

Sonny...if you are reading this I ask that you remove any document I wrote and posted on VR.org from your Facebook page. Anything I wrote I have NOT given you permission to use on your Facebook page. As the author of those tech articles I own or gave ownership to VR.org.....NOT to you.

[RDawson]

I went and checked, I never joined that page and won’t. It’s worth more than a buck a month just to not hear the attitudes you get on most sites. The fun here is just a bonus, the knowledge is priceless.

[SpencerPJ]

Sounds like a loser. Maybe the Boss can block his IP address?

[CaseyJ955]

A buck a month I think for most folks is an automatic hard no. My first reflex was not to pay, but the content and quality input is worth it. There is another factor I'll bet many have not thought of. I pay a dollar a month here and the worst thing I see running is googleapis, which does not appear to be a anything really bad in spite of being google. Anything google makes me distrustful and I've blocked virtually all of it at the DNS level, but blocking this one here seems just to disable like/thanks.

 

Anyway. a popular Vmax forum runs googletagmanager and doubleclick. I was a supporting member there before that. The forum used to be pretty clean but it changed hands. Since I noticed doubleclick running I very very rarely use the forum anymore even though doubleclick is wildcard blocked at a DNS level on my server and tagmanager is blocked on 99% of the sights I visit.

 

A popular FZ09 site I just perused. Viglink, taboola, gumgum, vertiscope, ribicon, captify, Google anylitics and scorecard research beacon. That makes the Vmax site look clean. That is a lot of junk!

 

Reuters runs nativo, integral ad science, google tag manager, chartbeat, segment and admantx on a ramdom story I clicked on this morning.

 

Anyway. Don is running the cleanest .com sight I have ever seen on the internet, anywhere. There is a transparent price to use it without all the underhanded tracking, adserving or datamining.

 

Blocking junk rarely breaks a sight or some functionality, but rather than to cease tracker/beacon blocking I just decide that if a business page wont operate without it's trackers I simply choose not to do business with that person/business.

 

He could run some of this junk in the background and monetize a bit more, and pretty likely virtually nobody would notice it. It's worth a buck, really it is. If more webmasters worked this way I would probably be a supporting member of other forums too. But, this is NOT the case. This is the only forum I support currently and these are the biggest reasons why. I will never ever knowingly pay for someone to track me and advertise to me. $1/mo is a small price to pay for so much quality, regardless of what some guy I've never heard of says on FB. Maybe if he plagiarized technical write-ups from this sight to FB there may be a resource within FB. I'm not sure FB allows plagiarism, maybe a good Q for FB.

Edited August 15, 2020 by CaseyJ955

[Freebird]

Folks, I think there is more to his discontent than he is saying. He got upset when I asked him to stop posting his Venturers calendars for sale on our VentureRider Facebook page. I guess after that he started badmouthing me and our site. I really hadn't paid attention to it and didn't know about much of it until this thread. I don't let that stuff bother me too much but him coming here and copying stuff shared by our members without their consent is another matter. If those same members wish to share it on his page then of course they are more than welcome to do so and not hard feelings from me. It sounds like he just copies and posts it to his page and never asks though. For that reason only, I have banned his IP address from this site. Of course there are ways around that but I'm not going to get into some nonsense feud trying to constantly find and block him. It is what it is.

[Freebird]

A buck a month I think for most folks is an automatic hard no. My first reflex was not to pay, but the content and quality input is worth it. There is another factor I'll bet many have not thought of. I pay a dollar a month here and the worst thing I see running is googleapis, which does not appear to be a anything really bad in spite of being google. Anything google makes me distrustful and I've blocked virtually all of it at the DNS level, but blocking this one here seems just to disable like/thanks.

 

Anyway. a popular Vmax forum runs googletagmanager and doubleclick. I was a supporting member there before that. The forum used to be pretty clean but it changed hands. Since I noticed doubleclick running I very very rarely use the forum anymore even though doubleclick is wildcard blocked at a DNS level on my server and tagmanager is blocked on 99% of the sights I visit.

 

A popular FZ09 site I just perused. Viglink, taboola, gumgum, vertiscope, ribicon, captify, Google anylitics and scorecard research beacon. That makes the Vmax site look clean. That is a lot of junk!

 

Reuters runs nativo, integral ad science, google tag manager, chartbeat, segment and admantx on a ramdom story I clicked on this morning.

 

Anyway. Don is running the cleanest .com sight I have ever seen on the internet, anywhere. There is a transparent price to use it without all the underhanded tracking, adserving or datamining.

 

Blocking junk rarely breaks a sight or some functionality, but rather than to cease tracker/beacon blocking I just decide that if a business page wont operate without it's trackers I simply choose not to do business with that person/business.

 

He could run some of this junk in the background and monetize a bit more, and pretty likely virtually nobody would notice it. It's worth a buck, really it is. If more webmasters worked this way I would probably be a supporting member of other forums too. But, this is NOT the case. This is the only forum I support currently and these are the biggest reasons why. I will never ever knowingly pay for someone to track me and advertise to me. $1/mo is a small price to pay for so much quality, regardless of what some guy I've never heard of says on FB. Maybe if he plagiarized technical write-ups from this sight to FB there may be a resource within FB. I'm not sure FB allows plagiarism, maybe a good Q for FB.

 

Thanks for the observations and kind comments. No, as you stated, I do not run any hidden background software to monetize the site. The only thing I run is an Ebay link thing but it doesn't amount to anything.

 

There are a lot of things I could do to further monetize the site but it has never been about the money. Heck, I could have sold the site a few years ago when I was offered about $30 or $35 thousand dollars for it. I decided that I just couldn't do it.

 

I fight the spammers every single day here. There are hundreds of banned spammers in the database. I wake up every morning and check the registrations. Most are from China but a few from about anywhere else that you can imagine. 99.9% are caught and banned. before they ever post. I still get probably 5 or 6 every day.

[RDawson]

Thanks Don. There is a reason the respect here noticeably present.

[Freebird]

Just a quick note. I misspoke about the calendar issue. Sunman contacted me and said that he never sold the calendars and has never been a member of the Venturers. I'm not sure who I was thinking about but am sure that it wasn't him. I apologize.

[XV1100SE]

He may not have sold the calendars but did he copy the tech documents?

[grubsie]

Now I know why every time I posted links to here from a particular facebook page, my post was deleted. Thought I was breaking some kind of rules for the page. Apparently, it must be a "none posted, hurt his feelings rule". I started pointing people here in a roundabout way so as to not get deleted. Now i have to go back on fb to see which site it is so I can push the limits. I don't give a damn I get banned from it.

[saddlebum]

I bumped into Sunman on the road some years ago about the time Don started asking for membership fees. It was at a Tim Horton's. I saw this guy riding a Venture and struck up a conversation with him were at some point I asked him if he was aware of venturerider.org. Boy you would think I kicked a hornets nest. He told me he had, was a member and who he was on the site but quit and proceeded to give me the whole rant about why and his beef about the $12 membership fee. The same rant Puc just posted in post #8 . Needles to say I could not get out of there and back on the road fast enough.

I am surprised after all this time that this pot is still boiling.

Edited August 16, 2020 by saddlebum

[Freebird]

OK folks, I'm not going to say much more on this subject. Sunman is unable to post here so obviously cannot defend himself. I will just report what he told me and that is the end of it as far as I'm, concerned. He sent me a message which I replied to. The message stated that he never sold calendars and that he was never a member of the Venturers. I believe that to be the truth. There was somebody selling Venture calendars and I asked them to please stop but upon thinking back, I THINK I remember now who it was and know for sure that it wasn't Sunm,an.

 

He requested my telephone number so that he could call me and discuss this. I sent it to him and he did call. He was very cordial and said that he had no problem at all with me or VentureRiders but that he had an issue with paying for information on the Internet. I may not have that exactly right but I think that is the gist of it. My answer was that I didn't understand why people in general feel that everything on the Internet is free. Yes, many sites are free to the end user but nothing is free. It is paid for in many ways and in the case of websites, many are paid for by advertising. That is why Facebook and most forums are covered with advertisements. Facebook makes millions of dollars a year by feeding you ads and at least attempting to track what you do. The members here voted long ago to keep our site clean and not cover it with ads. I agree and we have stuck with the $1.00 per month. An additional benefit is that it helps to keep the spammers away. We still get a few because of the free trial but nothing like we would have if it was all free.

 

As for the copying of our tech articles. All I can tell you is what he told me. He says that he has never, not a single time, copying a tech article from here and posted to his board. I don't know him really and can't vouch for it one way or another but it is possble that other participants have copied things from here and posted there. I just have no proof either way. I could join his page and look to see who posted the articles but to be honest, I'm not going to take the time to do that.

 

So that's all I know and really don't care to continue the conversation.

[cowpuc]

OK folks, I'm not going to say much more on this subject. Sunman is unable to post here so obviously cannot defend himself. I will just report what he told me and that is the end of it as far as I'm, concerned. He sent me a message which I replied to. The message stated that he never sold calendars and that he was never a member of the Venturers. I believe that to be the truth. There was somebody selling Venture calendars and I asked them to please stop but upon thinking back, I THINK I remember now who it was and know for sure that it wasn't Sunm,an.

 

He requested my telephone number so that he could call me and discuss this. I sent it to him and he did call. He was very cordial and said that he had no problem at all with me or VentureRiders but that he had an issue with paying for information on the Internet. I may not have that exactly right but I think that is the gist of it. My answer was that I didn't understand why people in general feel that everything on the Internet is free. Yes, many sites are free to the end user but nothing is free. It is paid for in many ways and in the case of websites, many are paid for by advertising. That is why Facebook and most forums are covered with advertisements. Facebook makes millions of dollars a year by feeding you ads and at least attempting to track what you do. The members here voted long ago to keep our site clean and not cover it with ads. I agree and we have stuck with the $1.00 per month. An additional benefit is that it helps to keep the spammers away. We still get a few because of the free trial but nothing like we would have if it was all free.

 

As for the copying of our tech articles. All I can tell you is what he told me. He says that he has never, not a single time, copying a tech article from here and posted to his board. I don't know him really and can't vouch for it one way or another but it is possble that other participants have copied things from here and posted there. I just have no proof either way. I could join his page and look to see who posted the articles but to be honest, I'm not going to take the time to do that.

 

So that's all I know and really don't care to continue the conversation.

 

I have said it over and over and still have not found a way to express this wholly.. That little buck a month is soooo valuable to me,, as member, because of what you wrote above but also because it seems to cut out a LOT of naysayers that really dont want to be here anyway. One thing that life has taught me, and something I tried to implore to my children in raising them, was that people seem to act different,, think differently, hold a more healthy perspective of value and be more responsible when they have skin in the game.. Even if it is just a buck a month, it matters.. It sort of follows along the line of one of Cosners lines in Water World saying "nothings free in water world" cause isn't..

Thanks for handling that one Boss and keeping the peace in so doing.. Also appreciated your humble, open apology = you gotta a ton of class brother = YOU DA MAN!!

Back to boring everyday life of putting up with that pesky Kanuckian Moderator @Marcarl.. Speaking of club members voting on stuff Don,, I wonder if it may be time to take a vote to see if its time for Carls next cat scan? I think another one of his cat's may have escaped..

[saddlebum]

I have said it over and over and still have not found a way to express this wholly.. That little buck a month is soooo valuable to me,, as member, because of what you wrote above but also because it seems to cut out a LOT of naysayers that really dont want to be here anyway. One thing that life has taught me, and something I tried to implore to my children in raising them, was that people seem to act different,, think differently, hold a more healthy perspective of value and be more responsible when they have skin in the game.. Even if it is just a buck a month, it matters.. It sort of follows along the line of one of Cosners lines in Water World saying "nothings free in water world" cause isn't..

Thanks for handling that one Boss and keeping the peace in so doing.. Also appreciated your humble, open apology = you gotta a ton of class brother = YOU DA MAN!!

Back to boring everyday life of putting up with that pesky Kanuckian Moderator Marcarl.. Speaking of club members voting on stuff Don,, I wonder if it may be time to take a vote to see if its time for Carls next cat scan? I think another one of his cat's may have escaped..

Well @cowpuc I am inclined to believe that due to covid and resulting lack of meet and eats and rallies the cat just decided that going from a practice audience to being the main audience for Marcarl's speechifying was just more than it could handle and is currently hiding under some neighbors porch.

 

BTW just for the record I have no issue with the dues. What we get out of the site is worth it in my book and if it helps to safeguard our web site from annoying pests, even better.

 

Now back to the vote ----I vote NAY----as it would be unfair to the CAT

Edited August 16, 2020 by saddlebum

[cowpuc]

Well cowpuc I am inclined to believe that due to covid and resulting lack of meet and eats and rallies the cat just decided that going from a practice audience to being the main audience for Marcarl's speechifying was just more than it could handle and is currently hiding under some neighbors porch.

 

BTW just for the record I have no issue with the dues. What we get out of the site is worth it in my book and if it helps to safeguard our web site from annoying pests, even better.

 

Now back to the vote ----I vote NAY----as it would be unfair to the CAT

 

:crackup:

 

Wanna hear another really great one Bum?

Having to do with this thread and what has or has not been copy/pasted from our club files and whether or not this "Sunman" charactor is or is not still supportive of our club:big-grin-emoticon:? A quick check in his facebook pages "files" revealed this .. So much for not wanting any of his facebook members to be encouraged to check out VR

 

Read this:

 

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/venture_west%20flyer%20and%20registration%20form.pdf?token=AWzd8n1gNmINeKlIB_Uwnmi6li0YoBhdWwlxk81hVLC5mycc9LsQilvNMIt9HfVHnFbDp7lar4aKYfgElZaueJAF5AGSw8R5wbqFhUESLuIGWHFQKtk6v7GgG_HJRP1SqmxS3-xdzMxPfvBOb2360SBrEsa3u1qKMFgaC9M1oF3tqOXUqcx2Td6vYNOsXcref6zfc1vypYFqX8OapWt4Ai_vGQKljFpBpNhet-2TvbY6Nh7kt2CKWDUb55y06N5q5_aw0BsFpofOjYRQssXV9h38sSC-piLR79BoTUsM8saDfA

 

I think we should thank him

[Marcarl]

:crackup:

 

Wanna hear another really great one Bum?

Having to do with this thread and what has or has not been copy/pasted from our club files and whether or not this "Sunman" charactor is or is not still supportive of our club:big-grin-emoticon:? A quick check in his facebook pages "files" revealed this .. So much for not wanting any of his facebook members to be encouraged to check out VR

 

Read this:

 

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/venture_west%20flyer%20and%20registration%20form.pdf?token=AWzd8n1gNmINeKlIB_Uwnmi6li0YoBhdWwlxk81hVLC5mycc9LsQilvNMIt9HfVHnFbDp7lar4aKYfgElZaueJAF5AGSw8R5wbqFhUESLuIGWHFQKtk6v7GgG_HJRP1SqmxS3-xdzMxPfvBOb2360SBrEsa3u1qKMFgaC9M1oF3tqOXUqcx2Td6vYNOsXcref6zfc1vypYFqX8OapWt4Ai_vGQKljFpBpNhet-2TvbY6Nh7kt2CKWDUb55y06N5q5_aw0BsFpofOjYRQssXV9h38sSC-piLR79BoTUsM8saDfA

 

I think we should thank him

Link don't work for me.

[XV1100SE]

That link prompted me to sign in with my Facebook ID. I'm already logged into Facebook so...sorry....not going there. I trust you Cowpuc....just not the Internet. I work in computers and try to be careful where I go. That is different when following Carl on a ride though - Him I trust to take me new and interesting places....and following him I'll go where he goes. Marca would't let him wander too far off the safe path.

 

I take it from your post Puc that he has copied files from here.

 

I think there were a couple posts early in the days of VR.org that came from Venturers but as I recall they were posted with permission. And if someone posts a link to another site, no one on here seems to mind.

 

As Don said....enough said on this subject. These aren't the droids you are looking for.