Shut down China

[zagger]

 

Time to make those bastards pay the price. I'd suggest stopping all imports from China immediately. They have started a secret war with the rest of the world.

zag

[BlueSky]

Well, thanks to our trade agreements and government allowing our corporations to close our factories and move them to China, we are almost totally dependent on China for so many things. Even if our China bought and paid for congress would put a stop to it, it will take a long time to extract ourselves from this dependency.

[BlueSky]

Corporations are and have been bringing in skilled workers for decades under the H1B visa program whether or not there were similarly skilled people in the USA. They work for less and will take more crap. Plenty of unskilled workers coming here all the time.

 

https://www.ifers.org/h1b.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwm9D0BRCMARIsAIfvfIboX0kY9druS1NyI0ZZywDlQQ5hy6dPakjOH1Iw_NGppQVRZ_PvlswaAkhFEALw_wcB

[bpate4home]

Amen!

 

Personally I hold the past/previous NWO U.S. admins and current fragments of those same admins at a higher accountability platform than that of even the CCP.. The CCP only bought/stole jobs/manufacturing/trade secrets and even American soil that those disloyal admins sold to them or allowed them to steal.. It is not the CCP that has changed and become evil pirates - they have been and always will be Communists,, it is a sad portion of America that has changed - IMHO of course.

With all this chatter now about bringing our jobs home to America something else occurred to me.. Before the CCP Virus, our National unemployment rate had fallen to

[XV1100SE]

Lets go back a few years....when most products used in North America were made in North America. Appliances, electronics, clothing, footwear, toys. After WWII people were buying cars, the "new fangled" appliances that made life easier. People were working and had money....and wanted higher wages....and higher and higher.

 

Companies competed with each other in lower prices, requiring lower cost manufacturing, lower labour costs. To do this manufacturers moved production off-shore... Japan, Taiwan, China. Companies moved programming and tech support overseas where labour was cheap and because the work was contracted out the North American companies didn't have to pay health care and could blame working conditions (think sweat shops, child labour) on the overseas companies. But unless they were caught the companies let it continue and denied knowing about it....as long as they were making profits, as long as their investors were making money off the stocks. It was all about the almighty $, at the expense of the North American labourer.

 

Look at the Big 3 automakers (and I don't mean Toyota, Honda, Volkswagon).... they moved production to Mexico to take advantage of the lower labour costs. Look what happened to places like Michigan. Governments play games with the numbers....don't take into account the production workers that used to work at Ford and GM making $20+ per hour and are now working part time at McDonalds flipping burgers for minimum wage - they are counted as employed. And those that gave up looking for work have fallen off the labour market numbers because they are no longer actively looking for work.

 

Blame who you want....it isn't just previous governments, not one party or the other....but companies, investors, and even purchasers. Consider the cost of manufacturing in North America vs overseas. You want the price of your sneakers, appliances, cell phones to go up in price considerably? It was said that if Apple (U.S. company that moved a lot of their production and sourcing of electronic components to China) moved production back to North America the cost of an iPhone would go up several hundred dollars. If you are an Apple fan...and you were looking at two identical iPhones, one made in China and a couple hundred $ cheaper than an American made iPhone....which would YOU purchase?

 

Don't tell me you'd support "made in the U.S.A." if it was going to take money out of your family's pockets, reducing what your family had for food or anything else. This is why we are where we are at with overseas production. And that product made in North America....is probably designed overseas now too. And good luck trying to find something manufactured in North America....unless it is a Toyota, Honda, or Volkswagon.

[zagger]

Blame who you want....it isn't just previous governments, not one party or the other....but companies, investors, and even purchasers.

 

Don't tell me you'd support "made in the U.S.A." if it was going to take money out of your family's pockets, reducing what your family had for food or anything else.

 

That is the dilemma, isn't it? We take actions which make sense in our "free world economy" viewpoint, but the results may slowly crush us. I think that I would immediately return all essential manufacturing (like manufacturing of medicines) to the US. Even something simple could be a problem since our capabilities may have become so poor that we are not able to deal with anything. Pretty scary situation if the producer decides to turn the screws.

 

I would cut those boys off regardless of the cost. The alternative is slow suicide. What a situation!

 

I have nothing against the Chinese people but I completely distrust their government. Years ago I built my own electronics company and happened to bring my kids to a northern Wisconsin ski hill. An old Chinese guy was working to clear tables in the cafeteria and I started to chat with him. Turned out that he was running from the Chinese government of that time since he was Christian and that was illegal in China. I drove back up to northern Wisconsin to pick him up, found him a place to live, hired him at my company, and tried to prove that he had made the right choice by coming here. It was fairly painful since he wasn't able to do anything that needed to be done in our electronics production. Just an old guy a long way from his family. The point is: these Chinese government freaks have been grinding their people for many years. It is totally time to shut them down.

zag

[Patch]

 

 

 

Blame who you want....it isn't just previous governments, not one party or the other....but companies, investors, and even purchasers. Consider the cost of manufacturing in North America vs overseas. You want the price of your sneakers, appliances, cell phones to go up in price considerably? It was said that if Apple (U.S. company that moved a lot of their production and sourcing of electronic components to China) moved production back to North America the cost of an iPhone would go up several hundred dollars. If you are an Apple fan...and you were looking at two identical iPhones, one made in China and a couple hundred $ cheaper than an American made iPhone....which would YOU purchase?

 

Don't tell me you'd support "made in the U.S.A." if it was going to take money out of your family's pockets, reducing what your family had for food or anything else. This is why we are where we are at with overseas production. And that product made in North America....is probably designed overseas now too. And good luck trying to find something manufactured in North America....unless it is a Toyota, Honda, or Volkswagon.

 

You make some valid points Don, however I was in fortune 500 when I experienced 1st hand CSA dropped enforcing their own statutes. We in the MFG industry were befuddled wondering what was to come of our industry standards. This started with the lease on Hong Kong....

 

In your second paragraph tho we here know we pay Canadian premiums on everything including service because of our small base. Yet without accepting and expecting some bumps in the road we are distended to stay a small base without need to import people to grow the country (tax burden sharing) because we haven't the MFG. And yet we still suffer GST even after it did what it was to do, then expire. So yes I do pay a premium and will likely continue to pay more then a fare share, like the rest of Canadians.

Edited April 14, 2020 by Patch

[CaseyJ955]

I have been quietly (or not so quietly) voting with my wallet, even before it was trendy. I think I've had enough inferior junk made under non-existent quality control from possibly toxic materials to last at least two more lifetimes. It does not have to be made in the USA, but it best not be made in China. I rarely even to go the stores that sport an overabundance of Chinese stuff, like Walmart and Target et al. I recently went to Target to find a couple reusable travel mugs and some kitchen utensils, they have tons of stuff, all made in China, even some items that carried premium price tags were made in China. I left empty handed because they had NOTHING made outside China at any price point. Too bad, I'm willing to spend more to buy quality items from my neighbors and allies. These prices I saw should fetch quality made versions of the these items. If we dont start thinking about how we spend our money then we get what we deserve.

 

I will continue to do my part by buying non-Chinese made products. We cant force China to stop sending that crap over here if all we do is stand in line to buy it up. We have to wise up or this will keep getting worse. It's sad that most of the US dept stores are now doing what Walmart does with all the Chinese stuff. Quality items are out there, the internet is really great for finding them and even finding local retailers that focus on quality and not junk with high profit margins.

 

I do like the adage that the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. China has been conducting themselves and running business like this for decades. As long as we keep buying what they are selling we can only expect more of the same and THAT will be on us. Now that there is a light shining on this problem, thanks in large to current events, we'll see if that helps to change anything. I'm optimistic, I think it we are going to see some changes.

[Freebird]

Folks, I know that there are some who don't like the rule but it is the rule. This is purely political and you know full well it is not allowed here.

[zagger]

Folks, I know that there are some who don't like the rule but it is the rule. This is purely political and you know full well it is not allowed here.

 

Well, it seems to me that we are all trying to deal with a life/death issue. Where I live, everything is shut down and neighbors get online if anyone stops at our house and a car is in the driveway. I guess we will eventually find out how many Venture riders are left after this. Since news is obviously censored, I thought it would be good to pass on the latest findings to my friends. I guess that I don't see the political aspect, unless you are in the Chinese ruling party and don't like the obvious evidence that the virus spread was both created and concealed. Now the reports are 21 million dead in China. This isn't a republican/democrat thing - this is just simple survival.

zag

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20200406190917/https://n5ti.com/health/1233/

Edited April 14, 2020 by zagger

[BlueSky]

Folks, I know that there are some who don't like the rule but it is the rule. This is purely political and you know full well it is not allowed here.

 

Political but not partisan.

[XV1100SE]

Sorry Freebird...my response was not intended to be political...just a comment on the market and how companies went where lowest production costs were.

[Marcarl]

Watch your tongues boys!!!!! This thread might live if we keep it informative and supportive, but if or when it goes off the rails,,, it's history!!

[zagger]

Spend an hour and watch the video (post #1 ). Pretty sobering.

zag

[Patch]

You know well my stance Freebird; some opinions simply deserve challenge.

Thank for the caution without deletion.

[Patch]

I don't know Zag? I read the report and see how they tied it all in together but still if China Mobile only holds 60% of the business (which is a lot) how then can they tie the other 40% into their estimated tally?

That's a big number to hide.

[CaseyJ955]

I can see some political overlap, but at it's core it's just doing the math. What have we learned does not reflect well on China, again. A lot of politically incorrect truth is being tamped down. This is not the first China virus, and seeing how China is going back to business as usual it will likely not be the last. Off the top of my head we had the Asian Flu, SARS, H7N9, several flu strains and a handful of others I cant recall. This is a pattern with some predictability, it will happen again if we continue to enable the behaviors and soften the facts. This Chinavirus knows no political boundaries, everyone is fair game, and the next Chinavirus will likely be just as all inclusive.

 

Politics and personal views aside, we better start learning whatever we are going to learn, and fast! I hope the very mention of China does not make this political, but it's a vital piece to the puzzle. It cant be ignored unless we are totally cool with this happening again in a few years. There is a political goldmine here, but it looks like we have largely avoided that to focus on just the facts. I hope this can go on. Thank you for the warning shot before shutting it down.

[Patch]

OK Puc so I am an outsider, looking in.

 

I did not expect to influence your thinking on this matter!

You used this chain of words:

"what many in our country would consider operating within our country's creed.. " Many think about it.

[cowpuc]

OK Puc so I am an outsider, looking in.

 

I did not expect to influence your thinking on this matter!

You used this chain of words:

"what many in our country would consider operating within our country's creed.. " Many think about it.

 

I get that brother,, I was just explaining my perspective of how/why things are the way they are in the States these days in a little more detail similar to what you did with your response to my original post...

Also, I was only referring to you being Canadian with Canadian historic understanding and myself as an American with an American citizen understanding as far as my outsider looking in comment.. DEFINITELY NOT AN OUTSIDER LOOKING IN CONCERNING VR, hope that comment didnt sound that way!! Personally I love you and your culture and its many differences to that of my own existence here in the U.S.A. As an outsider looking into the way your countries parlimentary rule functions I am dumber than a duck.. Still though, I have ALWAYS enjoyed many friendships with my Canuckian brothers and certainly do not consider them any less of my friends because their way of life is different to that of my own, common respect.. Make sense?

[Patch]

I get that brother,, I was just explaining my perspective of how/why things are the way they are in the States these days in a little more detail similar to what you did with your response to my original post...

Also, I was only referring to you being Canadian with Canadian historic understanding and myself as an American with an American citizen understanding as far as my outsider looking in comment.. DEFINITELY NOT AN OUTSIDER LOOKING IN CONCERNING VR, hope that comment didnt sound that way!! Personally I love you and your culture and its many differences to that of my own existence here in the U.S.A. As an outsider looking into the way your countries parlimentary rule functions I am dumber than a duck.. Still though, I have ALWAYS enjoyed many friendships with my Canuckian brothers and certainly do not consider them any less of my friends because their way of life is different to that of my own, common respect.. Make sense?

 

Well really we don't know what the heck they are suppose to be doin either!

 

OK Dear we've gotten thru another squabble xo

[Marcarl]

Be careful,,, discussion is nice, but,,,,,,

[cowpuc]

Well really we don't know what the heck they are suppose to be doin either!

 

OK Dear we've gotten thru another squabble xo

 

,,,

[Patch]

Timeline is missing something important; after taking country away from the indigenous people already living there and then kicking the British out.

 

As much as some would like to make United States into a Christian nation aligned with "my personal form of Christianity", this is not a Christian nation. Some founding fathers may have had strong personal beliefs, but they worked hard to keep those beliefs out of the founding documents. They created a secular goverment because of the dangers of combining church and state that were learned from church/state goverments in Europe at the time. Didn't a lot of folks leave England to get away from religous persecution?

 

The Consitution is a secular document with no mention of Christianity. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;" Article VI prohibits religious tests as a requirement to hold a goverment posoition.

 

"Unalienable rights endowed by our Creater" - Purposely generic langange that could apply to all religious groups.

 

As for present leadership spearheading a Christian revival; that someone honestly believes this is hard for me to fathom. Even though we hear current leadership publicly supporting a very small handfull of Christian belief buzzwards, when balanced against their words and actions the current leadership is far further from a Christian moral belief system than any adminstration in my lifetime. What color was Jesus, what language did he speak, where was he born, what did he think about the poor, what did he think of wealth, what did he think of foreigners and what would he think of us now?

 

Daniel, I whole hearty agree with the intent found in this post!

Separation of government and religion is a must. Canada has some shady history before the late 60's.

 

I have a thought held back from last evenings exchange, I quot it now not for debate rather because I found it striking to my way of comprehension:

"Word Of God and overlay it over our Constitutional Republics founding documents"

The U.S. Constitution is a much envied promise to the people; and for those that make the time to appreciate the efforts at that time in world history. Overlaying it verses amending it cannot do her heart beet justice. Even tho this act by the people for the people is not mine as a Canadian; I would promise my life to defending it as tho it were, because it means that much to the world. I believe sincerely this is why she will always be in need of defending.

 

Cheers

[DanielM]

Daniel, I whole hearty agree with the intent found in this post!

Separation of government and religion is a must. Canada has some shady history before the late 60's.

 

I have a thought held back from last evenings exchange, I quot it now not for debate rather because I found it striking to my way of comprehension:

"Word Of God and overlay it over our Constitutional Republics founding documents"

The U.S. Constitution is a much envied promise to the people; and for those that make the time to appreciate the efforts at that time in world history. Overlaying it verses amending it cannot do her heart beet justice. Even tho this act by the people for the people is not mine as a Canadian; I would promise my life to defending it as tho it were, because it means that much to the world. I believe sincerely this is why she will always be in need of defending.

 

Cheers

 

Hey Patch, I am intimately familiar with shady side and good side of Canada's history. Proud to be a Canadian. Was recruited by an American company to move to DC area 19 years ago to work in tech and have been here ever since. Married an American and 5 out of 9 kids live in states and 4 are up in Canada. I know for a fact the company I work for would rather have found someone less expensive and local if they could have.

 

Completely agree that the U.S Constitution is to be envied. We need to keep pushing a little bit every day to better live up to its ideals.

 

Sent from my SM-G975U1 using Tapatalk

[zagger]

I have zero idea why religion is having any input into this discussion. We are living through a time when a country who is searching for more control has either purposely released a virus to the world or done so through incompetence. Apparently, it appears that the virus contains genetic aspects which could only have been derived from a laboratory. If that doesn't give you a moment to think - I don't know what would.

 

I'm hoping to survive this and I hope the same thing for all of my VR friends. Gonna spend the afternoon hauling my wife's garden junk to the dump. Should be a zoo since it has been closed for months. Only one car at a time into the drop off area.

zag