bike chase

[Patch]

This video viewed at 1/4 speed shows pretty much what happened.

Keep an eye at the top right for speed; then watch the left hand as the bike meets up with...

 

[BlueSky]

Yeah, ram a motorcycle with your police car for what, speeding. Why not just pull up beside him and shoot him. Same result.

[SpencerPJ]

Fun video, but it sure did not seem as they were doing those top speeds. Looked about 1/2 what was posted. And ya, ramming a bike, speeding or not, not cool. I guess we don't know the story, maybe the dude just shot someone and fled a scene, then I'm cool with stopping him.

[bpate4home]

Fun video, but it sure did not seem as they were doing those top speeds. Looked about 1/2 what was posted. And ya, ramming a bike, speeding or not, not cool. I guess we don't know the story, maybe the dude just shot someone and fled a scene, then I'm cool with stopping him.

 

Even if he didn't shoot someone I tend to side with the law on this one. He was given plenty of opportunity to stop. He put more than just his life in danger.

[saddlebum]

Even if he didn't shoot someone I tend to side with the law on this one. He was given plenty of opportunity to stop. He put more than just his life in danger.

Agreed, he had more than ample opportunity to pull over and given the number of red lights he went through he was a danger to anyone on that road. It also does not state why he was being chased and as stated earlier it could have been for a violent crime for all the viewer knows. In Toronto crime rates specially shootings are going up at a scary rate and mostly because our politicians are wasting time on gun control when they should be putting their efforts into gang control. My theory is crime is a cash cow for lawyers and our government favors their income over public safety.

Our liberal government wants to spend a billion dollars on tighter gun control for responsible citizens rather than put the money directly into gang control. The time before the last time they were in power they spent 5 billion on a gun registry for legal owners and it accomplished nothing yet here they are again pursuing the same useless coarse of action. they even want to ban the every day pocket knife. In the meantime the real criminals get all sorts of legal rights and representation that allows them to get away with murder, Literally!

[bpate4home]

Agreed, he had more than ample opportunity to pull over and given the number of red lights he went through he was a danger to anyone on that road. It also does not state why he was being chased and as stated earlier it could have been for a violent crime for all the viewer knows. In Toronto crime rates specially shootings are going up at a scary rate and mostly because our politicians are wasting time on gun control when they should be putting their efforts into gang control. My theory is crime is a cash cow for lawyers and our government favors their income over public safety.

Our liberal government wants to spend a billion dollars on tighter gun control for responsible citizens rather than put the money directly into gang control. The time before the last time they were in power they spent 5 billion on a gun registry for legal owners and it accomplished nothing yet here they are again pursuing the same useless coarse of action. they even want to ban the every day pocket knife. In the meantime the real criminals get all sorts of legal rights and representation that allows them to get away with murder, Literally!

 

Not a gun debate but Thomas Jefferson has been quoted as saying 'Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws makes things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailant; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for the unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.' Needless to say I think he was a pretty smart guy and the quote still holds true today.

 

I personally had a discussion with a MS13 member, at least he had the tattoo and his coworkers attested to it, about conceal and carry. He basically said that he did not like the Texas laws about conceal and carry and that he, while with the gang, was much less likely to attack someone that was an unknown or not a rival if they thought the person might be packing. They didn't want to get shot either. That gives more weight to the quote above.

[Patch]

A couple of things, take note of the left turn at 2:25

He is trying to run as tho he on a sport bike.

this bike is also tuned way fat, my hearing pick it up; when he at WOT the bike is running in tune but, when he de- accelerates

the unspent charges light in his pipes causing increased engine braking (back pressure past the exhaust valves) slowing the bike!

Now just past 5:15 he blew his shift, watch him hunt with his left leg.

 

Remember hes running gear transferred torque, the bikes mass maybe be 20% of the patrol car; the P.C. is running hydraulic torque output so he has to brake to match the deceleration of the bike,,, and not slide or loose control!

Again this is just physics and we all know what its like car verses bike... I skip over inertia mass in motion blablas but there still in play..

 

I copied this from the YouTube page below: Also slow the playback speed by clicking on the gear settings lower right and choose .25 for speed at 5:15 and watch closely.

 

Berkeley County Sheriff's Office South CarolinaA Berkeley County deputy has been placed on leave after colliding with a speeding motorcycle during a chase Wednesday night (Pursuit 04-19-2017), resulting in a wreck that killed the rider.Video footage, which the Berkeley County Sheriff's Office posted Thursday on YouTube, appears to show the cruiser hit the motorcycle twice during a crash that officials attributed, in part, to the rider's sharp braking. The clip does not show the deputy swerving to avoid a collision, but officials said the contact did not appear purposeful.Robert Lee Clark Jr., 30, of Giles Drive in Goose Creek lost control after colliding with the sheriff's SUV and hit another car. He died at the scene. He was not wearing a helmet.He had been wanted for speeding.Marijuana also was found on his body after the wreck around midnight on South Main Street in Summerville.Deputy James Vansant is on administrative leave as the Sheriff's Office conducts an internal review of his actions, an agency statement said, and the S.C. Highway Patrol is investigating the wreck.The deputy's report and the agency's statement indicated that the collision was not deliberate. Sheriff's policy bars such contact during pursuits. "Deliberate contact between vehicles or ... ramming ... will be prohibited unless such actions are specifically authorized by a supervisor," the policy states. "Such actions may be approved only when the use of deadly force would be authorized."In a report, Vansant said he was looking out for speeding motorists on College Park Road when he noticed the motorcycle going 66 mph in a 45-mph zone.Clark didn't pull over for the deputy's lights and sirens. His motorcycle accelerated, the deputy reported. It made quick lane changes, slowed abruptly at times and ran red lights."Speeds reached ... 111 mph at times with the motorcyclist slamming on the brakes and then speeding away several times," Chief Deputy Mike Cochran added in the sheriff's statement.The pursuit stretched over eight miles and more than five minutes to South Main Street.At one point, the video showed the deputy's Ford SUV pulling close to the motorcycle.The deputy soon reported approaching another car, later identified as a Dodge Neon. The deputy said Clark was trying to pass the Neon."The motorcycle slowed very quickly and started" changing lanes, Vansant wrote. The motorcycle contacted the front right passenger side of my ... police vehicle and then accelerated."To sheriff's officials, the motorcyclist appeared to have missed a gear while shifting, causing it to slow and hit the deputy's SUV.A satellite-estimated speed reading on the video showed the cruiser going about 90 mph just before the wreck and 64 mph within seconds of the crash.The motorcycle hit the Neon and the curb. Clark was thrown to the sidewalk.Paramedics soon pronounced him dead.The county coroner later pulled a marijuana cigarette, a pipe and a few bags of the drug from Clark's clothes, the report stated. The marijuana weighed nearly 2 ounces.✋ About the video / Community guidelines ✋ This footage is NOT intended to be violent or glorify violence in any way. We are sharing the footage STRICTLY for the purposes of news reporting and educating. Video Leak Police publish news reporting videos, educational, Under Mini Documentary form. Public safety, to expose an injustice, documenting or foster debate about important events.♦Disclaimer: Video posted strictly for educational and information purposes only♦***For any concern or Copyright Issue*** Please *Message me* › https://www.facebook.com/videoleak01/ orhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbQ4... Follow Video Leak Police on:https://twitter.com/VideoLeak1https://www.facebook.com/videoleak01/

[Patch]

Eh Guys feel free to vent whats on your mind on these W.H. threads I post.

It's just friends sharing so there's comfort and growth to opinion, whether or not we agree with one another!

 

So Past the bread and Ma, we need's more butter;)

[SpencerPJ]

"He had been wanted for speeding. Marijuana also was found on his body after the wreck"

 

Sorry, so if this police man chased this guy like this for speeding only, he needs to be prosecuted for manslaughter and hung at the court square. I'll be the first to stand up for our LEO, but this is a case of an officer that feels above the law. The officer is the one who chased this guy (minor offense of speeding) causing unsafe conditions in city streets. There's always a day to find him and deal the punishment for his speeding. Again, if he was fleeing a homicide scene, I'd have a different take, but he knowingly was simply chasing a speeder.

[ecbaatz]

"He had been wanted for speeding. Marijuana also was found on his body after the wreck"

 

Sorry, so if this police man chased this guy like this for speeding only, he needs to be prosecuted for manslaughter and hung at the court square. I'll be the first to stand up for our LEO, but this is a case of an officer that feels above the law. The officer is the one who chased this guy (minor offense of speeding) causing unsafe conditions in city streets. There's always a day to find him and deal the punishment for his speeding. Again, if he was fleeing a homicide scene, I'd have a different take, but he knowingly was simply chasing a speeder.

 

 

It takes two to have a chase. If either would have stopped, no chase. Both can be blamed, however, we pay police to enforce our laws. So I put more of the blame on the cyclist for not stopping.

[BlueSky]

A while back a local city police officer was chasing a speeder, over drove his driving skills, and wrecked killing himself. The runner was charged with murder, a ridiculous charge in my opinion. Chasing a speeder at stupid speeds on city streets should not be allowed. It just isn't worth the risk to everybody else. If the guy speeds, he will be caught sooner than later.

[Patch]

Even if he didn't shoot someone I tend to side with the law on this one. He was given plenty of opportunity to stop. He put more than just his life in danger.

 

So, why is it that so many of us that walked one side once upon a time - walk that thin blue line now with a list to defend it openly?

 

Spence once again you inspire a story from me, tho to be truthful I have a couple around this;)

 

A decade ago a local constable found himself in a dark yard responding to a home invasion.

This was in my neighborhood, the officer gave the commands he was trained for and of course the perp feeling sure of himself went to stab the officer, the officer alone, he fired killing the perp.

The following morning the airways were full of chatter "about the big bad cop"... So I took pen and paper and wrote a letter.

I went to every door, and asked them to read and sign it, by noon it was delivered to the Chief with our gratitude and support for the actions of this constable!

 

Some time later I was asked by the Chief why I did what I did; I told him about the women that instilled a right in me, I also told him about something I had never whispered to anyone ever before: "I was 14 when I drew my first serious blood; I was alone, it was dark......."

 

Back to this video: at first I thought as you mentioned, should he be playing it differently? Do you know guys that that is not his call... It is the watch supervisors call to break off pursuit.

 

I am on the side of a death sentence for those that deserve it but, an eye for an eye does not bring back A life. I know based on other posts of yours you likely know this too Spence.

Manslaughter in this case I could not agree with either, he was following his duty as I see it.

Could it have been handled differently? Yes! But Monday Morning Quarter Backing is just frustration spoken aloud.

[Patch]

agreed, he had more than ample opportunity to pull over and given the number of red lights he went through he was a danger to anyone on that road. It also does not state why he was being chased and as stated earlier it could have been for a violent crime for all the viewer knows.

in toronto crime rates specially shootings are going up at a scary rate and mostly because our politicians are wasting time on gun control when they should be putting their efforts into gang control.

my theory is crime is a cash cow for lawyers and our government favors their income over public safety.

our liberal government wants to spend a billion dollars on tighter gun control for responsible citizens rather than put the money directly into gang control.

the time before the last time they were in power they spent 5 billion on a gun registry for legal owners and it accomplished nothing yet here they are again pursuing the same useless coarse of action. They even want to ban the every day pocket knife. in the meantime the real criminals get all sorts of legal rights and representation that allows them to get away with murder, literally!

yep!

[cowpuc]

I watched this vid several times and noticed right away that the Officer made contact twice in the vid (1st time @5:23 in).. The second time he was hit hard enough to loft his front end and causing him to lose control and crash.. I did some digging and found out that the LEO claimed contact only happened once. A little more digging revealed the below investigation by a retired LEO motorcycle cop who clearly was troubled by the incident (found in quotes).. A little more investigation = appears a Grand Jury refused the case and accepted the officers explaination.

 

 

""""

Retired police sergeant John Clayton spent 26 years in law enforcement, including 17 years in the traffic division for the Charleston Police Department.

Clayton says he spent 10 of those 17 years on the department's motorcycle patrol. He’s also a nationally certified police motorcycle instructor. On Friday, he watched the video from beginning to end. Afterward, he said the video raised serious concerns for him as a former police officer.

"Based on what I've seen so far, I would have cancelled the pursuit,” Clayton said. "The risks are too heavy. The difference between a motorcyclist and a car is if a motorcyclist wrecks, he's got one way to go and that's down."

According to the Berkeley Count Sheriff’s Office pursuit policy, employees must weigh the risk to public safety and seriousness of the crime before pursuing. Even then, a supervisor must approve.

"It's a traffic violation. It's speeding,” Clayton said. “In Charleston city we would have never pursued this motorcycle. It just wouldn't have happened."

When the video comes to the final moments of the chase prior to Clark’s wreck, Clayton says it appears to him Deputy Vansant’s vehicle actually makes contact with Clark’s motorcycle twice.

The sheriff’s office and Deputy Vansant in their official statement and incident report said that there was only one instance of contact between Clark’s motorcycle and Vansant’s vehicle.

“The deputy bumped him the first time, then he bumped him a second time,” Clayton said. “I didn't see where the deputy swerved to the left. Based on the video alone, you can't tell if it's intentional or not.”

Berkeley County’s pursuit policy prohibits “deliberate contact between vehicles unless specifically authorized by a supervisor,” and only in a situation where “the use of deadly force” would be approved.

“This didn't have to happen,” Clayton said.

Deputy Vansant is currently on administrative leave. The S.C. Highway Patrol is investigating the incident.

[SpencerPJ]

 

I am on the side of a death sentence for those that deserve it but, an eye for an eye does not bring back A life. I know based on other posts of yours you likely know this too Spence.

Manslaughter in this case I could not agree with either, he was following his duty as I see it.

Could it have been handled differently? Yes! But Monday Morning Quarter Backing is just frustration spoken aloud.

 

You're right, and you do know me...

 

I guess I just vented because here in the midwest, seems too often that the leo's can do as they please. Side subject, there ability to speed 70 in a 55, no chance of consequences, not one obeys the posted speed limit, not one! I absolutely despises leo's that find themselves above the law, they are examples of our judicial system and should be held to much higher standards then they are. I guess we get what we pay for..

[Patch]

I watched this vid several times and noticed right away that the Officer made contact twice in the vid (1st time @5:23 in).. The second time he was hit hard enough to loft his front end and causing him to lose control and crash.. I did some digging and found out that the LEO claimed contact only happened once. A little more digging revealed the below investigation by a retired LEO motorcycle cop who clearly was troubled by the incident (found in quotes).. A little more investigation = appears a Grand Jury refused the case and accepted the officers explaination.

 

""""

Retired police sergeant John Clayton spent 26 years in law enforcement, including 17 years in the traffic division for the Charleston Police Department.

Clayton says he spent 10 of those 17 years on the department's motorcycle patrol. He’s also a nationally certified police motorcycle instructor. On Friday, he watched the video from beginning to end. Afterward, he said the video raised serious concerns for him as a former police officer.

"Based on what I've seen so far, I would have cancelled the pursuit,” Clayton said. "The risks are too heavy. The difference between a motorcyclist and a car is if a motorcyclist wrecks, he's got one way to go and that's down."

According to the Berkeley Count Sheriff’s Office pursuit policy, employees must weigh the risk to public safety and seriousness of the crime before pursuing. Even then, a supervisor must approve.

"It's a traffic violation. It's speeding,” Clayton said. “In Charleston city we would have never pursued this motorcycle. It just wouldn't have happened." ABSOLUTELY IRRELEVANT !

When the video comes to the final moments of the chase prior to Clark’s wreck, Clayton says it appears to him Deputy Vansant’s vehicle actually makes contact with Clark’s motorcycle twice. WITHOUT OBJECTION!

The sheriff’s office and Deputy Vansant in their official statement and incident report said that there was only one instance of contact between Clark’s motorcycle and Vansant’s vehicle. OBJECTION; THE VIDEO SHOWS THE 2 MOMENTS OF IMPACT CAUSED BY THE MISSED SHIFTING AND THE DECISIONS MADE BY CLARK FROM THE MOMENT HE FAILED TO YIELD AND CHOSE TO PASS THE NEON ON THE RIGHT!

“The deputy bumped him the first time, then he bumped him a second time,” Clayton said. OBJECTION!

“I didn't see where the deputy swerved to the left. Based on the video alone, you can't tell if it's intentional or not.”

Berkeley County’s pursuit policy prohibits “deliberate contact between vehicles unless specifically authorized by a supervisor,” and only in a situation where “the use of deadly force” would be approved.

“This didn't have to happen,” Clayton said. THERE IS NO PROOF OF A DELIBERATE INTENTION BY OFFICER VANSANT THE ONLY ACTS OF DELIBERATE INTENTIONS IN EVIDENCE WERE THAT OF CLARK.

Deputy Vansant is currently on administrative leave. The S.C. Highway Patrol is investigating the incident.

 

Thanks Puc for the work you brought forward to this thread! I capped my replies as to not mistaken them only.

My point is as it has always been, we cannot undo what has already been done so, if we can't undo it then perhaps we need to view it differently. The evidence is seen on the videos, the reality of Vansent's thinking at the time remains his personal property. Should of would of and could of matter not as pertains to this piece of history but; may serve a purpose as was the intent of its release, towards education and debate;)

Good post Puc;)

[Patch]

You're right, and you do know me...

 

I guess I just vented because here in the midwest, seems too often that the leo's can do as they please. Side subject, there ability to speed 70 in a 55, no chance of consequences, not one obeys the posted speed limit, not one! I absolutely despises leo's that find themselves above the law, they are examples of our judicial system and should be held to much higher standards then they are. I guess we get what we pay for..

 

No such law representative will represent my blue line with that attitude, my pen would be to support the law period.

 

I think things are changing as we learn our and stand on our rights. If the law can't be enforced with balance then the person behind the badge is the problem. If not the pen to paper and get the code amended;)

[venturesome]

That was a disturbing video. I can only say that in this circumstance, when someone had to die, given all the choices of those that might have been killed, the biker was the best choice.

May he rest in peace.

I like riding.

I like riding fast.

Sometimes I speed.

Whether right or wrong, I pull over when blue lighted by Police. If the Police are wrong, I take it up at the Police Station.

I'm 75 years old. So far the Police have been right, I was wrong!

Ride Safe and Enjoy. Don't be stupid.

Edited February 26, 2020 by venturesome

[Patch]

That was a disturbing video. I can only say that in this circumstance, when someone had to die, given all the choices of those that might have been killed, the biker was the best choice.

May he rest in peace.

 

 

Yep, he'll be bragging all the way about how he didn't let them take him... Too many times I've heard the bragging about how some fought the law and the law won !!?? Selfish behavior even to those on the 1% side

[uncledj]

The cop and the speeder were both wrong.

The speeder shouldn't have been speeding, ...as we all sometimes do.... and then he shouldn't have ran when the lights went on...as some of us have....

Having said that, once the chase begins, I can't imagine it ending well for a biker on a big heavy bike.

Further,...once the chase begins, the bikers blood was up and he'd be much more prone to taking chances, especially with 4000 lbs of cop car with a pushbar trying to ram him.

The biker was stupid / reckless, but he didn't deserve to die.

 

The cop saw the speeder and flipped the lights on. Once he did, especially if he'd gotten the license plate, he shouldn't have gotten into a high speed chase over a simple speeding violation. How did the cop think this was going to end? He CERTAINLY shouldn't have been trying to bump the bike. Seems like he wanted to kill the biker. I understand that the LEO would have had his blood up as well, but part of his job would be to control that. If he's unable to control his temper, he shouldn't be in that position. By continuing this chase, the cop, endangered not only the bikers life, but the lives of other drivers as well.

 

I've run across good cops and bad cops in my life, and I can't imagine a good cop running this biker down.

 

 

[SpencerPJ]

Well said Uncledj, well said

[Marcarl]

So my thoughts, for what they are worth, is: Why did the biker not stop? Did he think it was fun to try to outrun a cruiser, or was he into something that deserved but didn't want a closer investigation. The biggest fault lies with the biker, he should have pulled over long before the end to save his bacon. The lights he ran were each on their own, suicide for himself, the cop and any others that might have legally got in the way, The cop has a job to do,, uphold the law,,, sure the infraction was minor, but the start of the pursuit changed all that, it's called resisting arrest if you will. The real culprit was the biker, and he could have changed the whole issue by pulling over and paying the piper,,, but then maybe the piper was to be paid lots more than just a simple speeding ticket.

This vid demonstrates to all of us that when you run (sometimes our first tendency) all does not necessarily end well, and that would strengthen our resolve to end it before it starts.

[RandyR]

It almost appears to me that towards the end of the chase, the motorcycle may have been running out of gas? did anyone else see that, or is it just my imagination?

[RDawson]

I have some mixed feelings on these chases. As somebody who has dealt with the consequences of these kinds of things it makes you think. I've cut people out of wrecked cars, zipped body bags, and loaded many in ambulances after crashes. On one hand chases are dangerous but when police aren't allowed to chase it encourages people to run creating more issues. When the guy runs from a minor infraction the Leo doesn't know why he's running. Does he have a reason, is he a wanted person, warrants, drugs etc. We recently had a crotch rocket take out 3 cars and suffered life altering injuries trying to run from a cop that wasn't after him. The officer was responding to assist on a fire call in a highly occupied building, kid saw blue lights and ran. He tied up police resources, an ambulance, and a fire unit that was needed on the original call. In a small town where there are limited resources to start with it endangers more lives than just the ones on the road. With only 10-12 firefighter's on duty, 1-2 available ambulances, and few officers on the road at a time the heart attack, the child hurt, the pregnant mother in labor, the person trapped in a burning building have to wait while we deal with the imbecile that ran. I don't have much sympathy left for the runner.

Do I break the law speeding? Yes I do, I also pull over when lighted. I haven't had a ticket in years but deserved the ones I got and more I didn't get because I pulled over a was truthful with the Leo's.

Trying not to be political but I believe in corporal punishment, swift and strong. He earned what he got, I hope it will make others stop and think this could be me if I run.

[BlueSky]

Well, if killing the guy was justifiable, then what other minor offenses are worthy of killing the perpetrator? Sounds like Saudi Arabia.