Front end "WOBBLE?" ALSO my introduction

[TURBOVEE6]

Thank you all for the warm welcome i have received, i just purchased my 1999 Yamaha Royal Star. I am not new to the Yamaha family as i have owned three. First one is my 2005 Road star i purchased it new in 2006 and have nearly 120,000 miles on her i have made quite a few mads including super wide white walls and 2" suspension lower. I also own a 2006 Yamaha V-Star 650 Custom, it is my brothers but i consider it mine as he hardly rides it, we bought both his bike and my road star together and in that time he has put about 10,000 on it of which probably 1/2 were by myself. The third yamaha i had was a 1982 Yamaha seca XS400 I bought it as a a project and ended up putting way more money into it than i would ever get out , i sold it 2 weeks ago and used that money to by my 1999 Royal Star Venture. I also have a 1997 Triumoph Daytona T-595 Now as for my suspension WOBBLE!!! I like to take turns fairly quickly i like to really lean into them, I have had to replace the floor board (Spurs i call them in the parts fiche they are called moles) twice on my roady. Anyhow riding it yesterday as i leaned into a turn it felt like the front forks TWISTED as i went into the turn, the bike bobbled but i caught her and got out of the lean i was in. So at the next stop light i turned handle bars to see if i could see anything loose like maybe the axle nut but all appeared to be good, then i took and shook the handle bars, rapid short left to right stroke and noticed the front wheel of the forks seemed to continue to wobble or twist AFTER i would stop. Also the faster i would do that the harder it appeared the bottom of the forks would twist and wheel shake. Has anyone expierienced this?? also ruts on the road seem to GRAB the tire and give the bike a wobble.I have D404 front and rear but am in oricess of ordering Shinko Tour master 230's. Any help is GREATLY APPRECIATED thank you in advance and to all of you that celebrate HAPPY EASTER HAVE A GREAT DAY

[Marcarl]

Two things I would check before anything else, the first would be the steering head, making sure the bearings are not pitted and properly greased and the proper tension on the bearings. Too loose on the bearings will make the whole front end seem loose and ready to let go.

The other would be to look at using a narrower front tire which often helps with the steering issues on the 2nd gen.

[videoarizona]

As just mentioned....check the steering head bearings..there's not much difference between to tight and to loose.

BUT, before I did that, I would go over the front end with a fine toothed comb. Check all bolts for tightness...including the front axle. Loosen everything and re-tighten to spec. Somewhere along the line that should cure the problem. If it doesn't, then the forks need to be rebuilt. It's easy if you want to take the time and all the needed info is here on the forum. Plus if you get stuck...we can help. You can get parts on line at various vendors. Boats.net is one.

 

I suggested you start from scratch...to help you establish a baseline for your services done on the front end. Not that things go wrong with these scoots...very dependable. But with a baseline, when you do have an issue...you won't have to rely on memory for what you've done.

 

Tires....I love the Shinko 230's...however this bike is a bit heavy for those. They will run just fine, but the rear will wear quickly, as the 230 is a great, rain riding, soft riding tire. Soft means more wear.

 

My suggestion: Go with the Shinko 777HD tire. Make sure it's the HD version. Longer wear and they ride wonderfully on these heavy bikes. I had a new pair on a journey from Arizona to Michigan. Chicago sent a nail my way and the rear tire bit the dust. Replaced with a 230 (all they had) and I see wear after only 4K miles. Shinko has the 777HD in stock in our stock sizes and they work well. I'm running the stock size up front and like the stability in heavy winds with trucks zooming by!

But tires are like oil...we all have an opinion....for what it's worth...

 

Welcome to our group!

 

david

 

Edited April 21, 2019 by videoarizona
spelling of course

[BratmanXj]

I have the same year and the front end "flex" is something I've always felt in this bike since I purchased it. I've rebuilt the front end and did steering head bearings and it has made the controls smoother but the flex is still there. I did go from the stock 150/80-16 front wheel to a Stratoliner 130/90-18" wheel and tire and that lessened the "wobble" when you shake the handlebars but its still there. To the best of my knowledge no one makes a fork brace for these bikes but I feel that there should be one to tie the forks together and give some torsional rigidity.

[baylensman]

+1 on the Shinko DH tires 9 bikes since i was 16 and this is the first rear that took me over 5K miles (i'm just shy of #300 ).

+1 on the thinner than stock front tire.

 

the "wobble" must be unique to the 99 models, as I've had a 96 and an 07 the 96 i replaced the sacrificial skegs on the floor boards before giving it to my son.

The somewhat heaver 07 i've only scraped a few times, but the 07 did wobble at about 15K miles. i had to tighten the steering head. As mentioned the difference between too tight just right and too loose is about 3/4 turn all told.

[Marcarl]

I've had a number of 1st gen in my shop and did the back and forth swing on the front end with it off the ground. Each one showed signs of wanting to fly off onto the floor somewhere when shook hard. To me it seems the nature of the beast. All off them did real well on the road once the head bearings were serviced and adjusted properly. Even they ones with a super brace did the 'in the air loose wobble'.

[cowpuc]

IMHO, weak or sacked fork springs can add significantly to that horrible loose front fork feeling. I know all my 1st Gens the OEM springs that I pulled from them looked like Ink Pen springs.. After tossing in a set of Progressives with an inch of preload they become a different bike.. Not as easy to take corners at speed as Maggie my R1 but definitely an improvement over stock - even 2 up and loaded down for CTFW in the mountains.. I also found that 12 weight oil and using a syringe to get the oil levels to match between forks helps too.. I also check the fork bushings when doing the swap to make sure there is no play there as well - even a little wear in those puppies can cause a lot of loose feeling at the grip tips..

[BratmanXj]

I've had a number of 1st gen in my shop and did the back and forth swing on the front end with it off the ground. Each one showed signs of wanting to fly off onto the floor somewhere when shook hard. To me it seems the nature of the beast. All off them did real well on the road once the head bearings were serviced and adjusted properly. Even they ones with a super brace did the 'in the air loose wobble'.

 

IMHO, weak or sacked fork springs can add significantly to that horrible loose front fork feeling. I know all my 1st Gens the OEM springs that I pulled from them looked like Ink Pen springs.. After tossing in a set of Progressives with an inch of preload they become a different bike.. Not as easy to take corners at speed as Maggie my R1 but definitely an improvement over stock - even 2 up and loaded down for CTFW in the mountains.. I also found that 12 weight oil and using a syringe to get the oil levels to match between forks helps too.. I also check the fork bushings when doing the swap to make sure there is no play there as well - even a little wear in those puppies can cause a lot of loose feeling at the grip tips..

 

As speed the bike doesn't feel loose, just heavy but there's nothing we're gonna do about the size of this bike. When sitting at a stop light and you give the handlebars a good tug back and forth you'll feel the front end give 2-3 more oscillations before coming to rest. I think CowPuc 's comment about fork springs might give some relief, but most touring bikes have gone up to larger fork tubes for more rigidity and I think its just the nature of the bike.

[luvmy40]

Doesn't anyone make an after market fork brace?

[BratmanXj]

Doesn't anyone make an after market fork brace?

 

Not that I've found for the 2nd Gen

[Condor]

If I remember correctly the early '99's had an issue with the bottom bearing race weld breaking, but haven't heard of any complaints in years. I've put a just a few miles in the twisties on my '99RSV and never noticed any wobble. MOF this is the first thread, that I'm aware of, that brings the subject up. First thing I'd do is check for a loose steering head.....

[TURBOVEE6]

Thank you all for your input, i was thinking the same thing,but before i went and tore here all down wanted to have people with some knowledge put in their input. On order are head bearings fork seals and 5W fork oil which is what Yamaha calls for. As no one mentioned going thicker on the oil im going to guess 5W is what is preferred. As for those who recommended the shinko 777HDs , i have already mounted the 230 on the back so I am going to stick with it and see what kind of wear i get. At average of $85 a tire if i get 5000 out of it ill be happy,HECK until Avon quit making the Gangster WWW i was paying $200 EACH TIRE for my roady, so price isnt a prob and i do prefer a softer tire . ANy other input on this is GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!!!! Thank you all again

 

$teve

[videoarizona]

Steve, my apologies...I forgot about the shock oil. I upped mine to 10wt when my forks were rebuilt on the RSV. Much better. I think the bike needs it.

 

Also, I run maybe 2 lbs of air in front and 25lbs in rear...35lbs, 2 up...and like the ride.

 

Get yourself one of those progressive type air pumps.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Progressive-Suspension-GP3-60-0-60-Gauge/dp/B000WJEORY

 

Nice in that you can air up the shocks with real time pressure reading and you don't lose air when you disconnect. You can find them at all different price points...

You don't want to use a larger pump...can blow the seals quickly.

 

Let us know how your rebuild comes out!

[TURBOVEE6]

I Already installed the 5wt before i saw this post As i cannot find the balance kit and making one up will take some trial and error,what i think what i will do is get about 3 psi in both front forks then take two air chucks connect them together with a section of air hose and simultaneously press them on to the shrader valves to equalize the pressure. Thanks again for all your input !!!

[Shaggy6801]

Sorry a little off topic but I was wondering where you had your exhaust made or bought them from

[larrydr]

I had a steering wobble on my 83 1200 , first thing I did was check the steering head bearings ...

The front / steering head of the bike is major part of keeping safe on the road .

I spent $75.00 including the grease to replace the steering head  bearing , that is a small amount of dollars to spend to keep your bike handling well

[saddlebum]

8 hours ago, larrydr said:

I had a steering wobble on my 83 1200 , first thing I did was check the steering head bearings ...

The front / steering head of the bike is major part of keeping safe on the road .

I spent $75.00 including the grease to replace the steering head  bearing , that is a small amount of dollars to spend to keep your bike handling well

Is the bike handling properly now?

Edited June 22, 2021 by saddlebum

[larrydr]

14 hours ago, saddlebum said:

Is the bike handling properly now?

Yes ..Handles great....I have 120 ,  70 , 18   on front ....150 , 80 , 16  on the rear

I dropped the rear of the bike  1 1/2 inches  ,,,moved the shock mount pin 1/2 inch lower

There 5 1/2 inches clearance above the rear wheel

4 3/4  clearance  from the ground to the bottom of the shock at  15 ps   6 inches clearance at 20 psi at the rear shock