Done at 65000 miles?

[BlueSky]

Well, I missed the soft top. So you are telling me that he sold the car with a hardtop for $4,000. I bet he made somebody happy. It will hurt trying to sell the car without a soft top with a frame though.

Randy

 

The used car dealer sold it quickly. Comparable Miatas a couple years newer around Raleigh were listed for up to $13k. I don't know who is paying so much for those. They are great sports cars but.........

[Venturous Randy]

Miatas are almost as seasonal as motorcycles. With top down weather coming, the price of Miatas go up. I split my daily driving between my Miata or Infinity and I have put a bit more miles on my Miata in the last four years. We have not put many miles at all on Linda's Miata, but we did loan it my daughter in law while she gets her transmission fixed. That should put some miles on it.

For those that just do not want to go the trike route, a Miata is a great option.

Randy

[Chaharly]

The big twin HD engines, specifically speaking of the Pan/Shovel's, Shovels, Evo's and Twin Cams (I know nothing of the 4 valve Milwaukee 8 - have yet to get my grubby little fingers on one and know from experience that the Flat Heads and "J" motors take a LOT of on road tweekin to keep em going) were/are actually pretty solid motors for an Air Cooled V-Twin with a "fork n knife" rod arrangement. My 78 Shovel Lowrider had just over 100K on her when I offed her to build a garage back in 82. I won her brand new on a Job Site raffle and rode the socks off her. For a Bowling Pin bike (AMF) she proved amazingly durable. Yes,, I did have to spin some wrenches to get er there and YES, the next owner was aware that the next 50k was gonna get pricey as the bottom end was spinning really loose.

The Evo's proved even more durable than the Shovels due to some top end changes and the Twin Cam's even more so IF the rider/owner knew about the oil pump/Cam Chain Tensioner issues (major crisis if not) and addressed them headon. I have own numerous T.C.'s, built one with a gear drive blower on it and they always left me with good vibes.

The key to HD is to realise their limitations in design. If your gonna alter em (building HD's is FUN cause EVERYTHING imaginable in "building needs" is only a click away - also, HD puts out a Performance Parts Book every year - FOR FREE - that has a TON of building stuff in it WITH DYNO GRAPHS showing the builder what to expect - it's lists of cam grinds w/ or w/o valve over lap is to die for), it's best to understand piston speed, RPM limits, have a good idea of where/what your looking for in challenging those speeds and get friendly with Loctite and Torque Wrenches and understand that all gains get charged x2, once up front in time and money and then in loss of how long the engine is going to last - nature of the beast. The better bet, especially for the touring rider IMHO, is to just run em stock (except for tuners to tune for effeciency) and be happy with the 60 to 75 horses you have to work with. Get use to short shifting in the low R torque range and, as a result, shifting a lot.

Now for the Yamaha,, yep,, 200k,, no problembo.. Get this Corporal Newkirk,, I know this will cause pause for some folks but in over 1 million miles of riding out 6 1st Gen's (still working on #6 ) I have NEVER set the valve lash. I have had to do a fair amount of "updating" in my time but those were just early model design flaws that had to be done. Truthfully,, I was very hard on my bikes and asked wayyyy to much of them BUT,, they took a licken and kept on ticken. Truthfully,, knowing what I know about them (1st Gens), I have no doubt that by following the factory maintenance schedule and actually being mindful of groan. moans and maintenance needs,, these V-4 touring scoots will/would/should/could see +400k if ridden reasonably. IMHO, another huge secret to getting there is not letting the bike set for long periods of time and keep it away from power washers.

THanks for the post Corporal!! Talkin scoots is fun!

 

You've never done the valve adjustment?

[snyper316]

Ok two questions, @cowpuc are you saying you never adjusted your valves? Also what's the deal with pressure washers?

 

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[RDawson]

Ok two questions, cowpuc are you saying you never adjusted your valves? Also what's the deal with pressure washers?

 

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Hey snyper not to jump Cowpucs question but how's Tinker after the lay down? As far as the pressure washing they inject water where you don't want it. I've seen electrical pieces shorted and water pushed past seals on lots of equipment over the years. A friend has a mower shop that makes a fortune off mower decks where the blade bearings go out from pressure washing. Another common one is Chevrolets with the evap canister valves under the cars get taken out by car washes with the under body blast. If you go in a parts store here asking for an engine light scan the first question they ask is if you used the local carwash lately.

[snyper316]

Well I got all the pieces for her but I've got leaks around the water pump both oil and antifreeze so reorder print and gaskets. I've got oil leaking from around where the gasket is. Then the antifreeze is shooting from the top of the water pump cover. I went to snug some bolts down the longer 3 and heard a snap.[emoji25] THE crack is at the motor.. I'm thinking rtv gasket maker to seal between the motor and water pump assembly. Oil wasn't leaking till I took it apart.

 

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[cowpuc]

You've never done the valve adjustment?

 

I have done a lot of valve adjusting thru the years Cha,, just never ever found it necessary on a 1st Gen Venture to get my $$'s worth out of em. The early Honda CRF's were probably the worst of the worst about holding valve lash tolerance (followed not to far behind was the early YZF's) IMHO and it was an every other weekend resetting of the valves on those things. Personally (and this is just another Puc opinion so take it for what's its worth), I attribute the minimal wear on the valve train/lash that I have noted on the Venture to: over sized shims, not having to spin them up to high in the R's to get good performance, multi valves (4 valve heads) = less spring pressure needed, and keeping clean oil in it.

Wanna hear something really funny? The guy who owned Tweeksis (1st Gen we are riding now) was a real meticulous lop eared varmint. The guy who I got the bike from forwarded all of Tweeksis's log books that that previous owner had compiled thru 60k miles of ownership. During that time this champ (DenDen was his screen name here I believe) did all kinds of things to Tweeksis: amazing things like fixing 2nd gear, full Barnette clutch, Marks collector, full stainless update on lines and on and on and on.. One of the things I noticed in his notes was his love for playing with the valve lash.. It's been a while now but I think, last count, he had set the valves on Tweeksis no less than 8 times (what is really funny is, of all my never adjusted valves Ventures all ending up at well over 200k upon retirement, she has the noisiest valve train I have ever had in a Venture .. Of course,, I know that this is not necessarily a bad thing (you ever solids in a car or owned a Flat Head HD you will find out that loose valve lash is wayyyy better than valve face burning tight ) in that it really doesnt hurt anything except for performance.

[cowpuc]

Ok two questions, cowpuc are you saying you never adjusted your valves? Also what's the deal with pressure washers?

 

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Hey snyper not to jump Cowpucs question but how's Tinker after the lay down? As far as the pressure washing they inject water where you don't want it. I've seen electrical pieces shorted and water pushed past seals on lots of equipment over the years. A friend has a mower shop that makes a fortune off mower decks where the blade bearings go out from pressure washing. Another common one is Chevrolets with the evap canister valves under the cars get taken out by car washes with the under body blast. If you go in a parts store here asking for an engine light scan the first question they ask is if you used the local carwash lately.

 

I have done a lot of valve adjusting thru the years Cha,, just never ever found it necessary on a 1st Gen Venture to get my $$'s worth out of em. The early Honda CRF's were probably the worst of the worst about holding valve lash tolerance (followed not to far behind was the early YZF's) IMHO and it was an every other weekend resetting of the valves on those things. Personally (and this is just another Puc opinion so take it for what's its worth), I attribute the minimal wear on the valve train/lash that I have noted on the Venture to: over sized shims, not having to spin them up to high in the R's to get good performance, multi valves (4 valve heads) = less spring pressure needed, and keeping clean oil in it.

Wanna hear something really funny? The guy who owned Tweeksis (1st Gen we are riding now) was a real meticulous lop eared varmint. The guy who I got the bike from forwarded all of Tweeksis's log books that that previous owner had compiled thru 60k miles of ownership. During that time this champ (DenDen was his screen name here I believe) did all kinds of things to Tweeksis: amazing things like fixing 2nd gear, full Barnette clutch, Marks collector, full stainless update on lines and on and on and on.. One of the things I noticed in his notes was his love for playing with the valve lash.. It's been a while now but I think, last count, he had set the valves on Tweeksis no less than 8 times (what is really funny is, of all my never adjusted valves Ventures all ending up at well over 200k upon retirement, she has the noisiest valve train I have ever had in a Venture .. Of course,, I know that this is not necessarily a bad thing (you ever solids in a car or owned a Flat Head HD you will find out that loose valve lash is wayyyy better than valve face burning tight ) in that it really doesnt hurt anything except for performance.

 

Yeppers Snype,, as explained to Cha above,, never not ever did I do valves on one of my 1st Gens.. Also as mentioned by Cha above,, Power Washers can be deadly to bearing life if not used VERY carefully.. Personally, give me a used bike that has multiple years of road grime on it anyday over a bike whose owner uses a Power Washer to keep his steed clean.

This is probably wayyy out there to some but,,, think of it this way,, lets just talk about one area to keep it simple,, lets think about the grease seal on the right hand side of the rear wheel that serves as a seal against the bushing that captures the bearings of the rear axle. What happens when an unsuspecting owner, wanting to keep his scoot looking tops, hits that area with a power washer? Water can be forced past the seal and into the center of the hub where it can promote all kinds of funny corrosions. IMHO, the seal that the water got past is not only designed to keep stuff out, it also serves to keep stuff in,, therefore,, the water moved into the area by the pressure washer is probably going to have to be phyisically removed by the owner or corrostion can (and does) happen.. Now think of allll the little bearing and bushing surfaces on the bike and then remember,, I haven't even mentioned electrical/electronical components as Cha started to mention...

[Chaharly]

I have done a lot of valve adjusting thru the years Cha,, just never ever found it necessary on a 1st Gen Venture to get my $$'s worth out of em. The early Honda CRF's were probably the worst of the worst about holding valve lash tolerance (followed not to far behind was the early YZF's) IMHO and it was an every other weekend resetting of the valves on those things. Personally (and this is just another Puc opinion so take it for what's its worth), I attribute the minimal wear on the valve train/lash that I have noted on the Venture to: over sized shims, not having to spin them up to high in the R's to get good performance, multi valves (4 valve heads) = less spring pressure needed, and keeping clean oil in it.

Wanna hear something really funny? The guy who owned Tweeksis (1st Gen we are riding now) was a real meticulous lop eared varmint. The guy who I got the bike from forwarded all of Tweeksis's log books that that previous owner had compiled thru 60k miles of ownership. During that time this champ (DenDen was his screen name here I believe) did all kinds of things to Tweeksis: amazing things like fixing 2nd gear, full Barnette clutch, Marks collector, full stainless update on lines and on and on and on.. One of the things I noticed in his notes was his love for playing with the valve lash.. It's been a while now but I think, last count, he had set the valves on Tweeksis no less than 8 times (what is really funny is, of all my never adjusted valves Ventures all ending up at well over 200k upon retirement, she has the noisiest valve train I have ever had in a Venture .. Of course,, I know that this is not necessarily a bad thing (you ever solids in a car or owned a Flat Head HD you will find out that loose valve lash is wayyyy better than valve face burning tight ) in that it really doesnt hurt anything except for performance.

 

 

Well I was going to do the valve adjustment while I had the one valve cover off replacing the seal but I think I'll skip it then. You're lucky to have such a meticulously kept tweeks! Even if she'll never see a valve adjustment again! Also, I know you ride your ventures just as hard (harder probably) as I do. If anyone can attest to not needing an adjustment its gotta be you. I'm at 54000 miles now, we'll see if I can squeeze another 150k out!

[RSTDdog]

Well I got all the pieces for her but I've got leaks around the water pump both oil and antifreeze so reorder print and gaskets. I've got oil leaking from around where the gasket is. Then the antifreeze is shooting from the top of the water pump cover. I went to snug some bolts down the longer 3 and heard a snap.[emoji25] THE crack is at the motor.. I'm thinking rtv gasket maker to seal between the motor and water pump assembly. Oil wasn't leaking till I took it apart. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190315/88f1445aec4a923f5bfb1154cd7bf2bd.jpg

 

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I would not use RTV silicone gasket maker in that location. I would use Yamabond 4. Excellent sealant and the excess levels and clings to surrounding metal and doesn't ball up and break off like RTV silicone. They use Yamabond 4 to seal crankcase halves on two stroke motors for this reason. (hondabond 4 is the same product, I do not know the manufacturer generic name for this product.). The OEM yamaha gaskets that have gray sealant preapplied to them, that is Yamabond. If the gasket has pre-applied sealant, you don't need to add more except for where your crack is. Make sure everything is clean when reassembling.

[BlueSky]

I wouldn't want to push my luck with the valve adjustments like cowpuc. If you burn a valve, that would ruin your day much more than an occasional valve adjustment.

[cowpuc]

Well I was going to do the valve adjustment while I had the one valve cover off replacing the seal but I think I'll skip it then. You're lucky to have such a meticulously kept tweeks! Even if she'll never see a valve adjustment again! Also, I know you ride your ventures just as hard (harder probably) as I do. If anyone can attest to not needing an adjustment its gotta be you. I'm at 54000 miles now, we'll see if I can squeeze another 150k out!

 

I wouldn't want to push my luck with the valve adjustments like cowpuc. If you burn a valve, that would ruin your day much more than an occasional valve adjustment.

 

Sky is SPOT ON here Cha = there aint NO WAY I was even remotely suggesting that anyone that even remotely cares whether they drop a cylinder, or two,, or three for that matter , on a cross country tour attempt such a thing. GOOD POINT SKY! My Venture adventure since day one has been all about answering the incomplete question of how hard, how far, how much utter abuse can I push one of these $500 scoots - DEFINITELY not something to consider if one really cares. My Venturedom has been all about riding them as far as possible with as little maintenance $$$'s as possible to get as much bang for the initial as possible and, when it croaked, grab another $500 1st Gen with no 2nd gear and keep on CTFW. I made my living spinning wrenches/running a dealership/working on bikes - the very last thing I EVER wanted to due or was willing to do was spend my spare time working on a beat up old Yamaha ..

I will say this though Cha,, and I REALLY mean this,, if had er down to stickin in those new gaskets up there to slow down leaks (another pointless endeavor as far as my riding needs on a $500 1st Gen goes = oil is cheap and I have found that after ya get a couple hundred thou on em and have never changed those gaskets = oil changes almost becomes a thing of the past - you just watch the oil warning light as ya throttle up and when the oil light comes on as the oil rocks off the sensor ya stop and refill = there is a point where the leaks equalize to the oil change intervals so ya just keep adding oil = no more oil changes = happens at just over 200k IMHO ) I would DEFINITELY NOT close er up without rolling the cam lobes on each valve away from their shim bucket and at least slipping a feeler gauge under it = in my world,, not doing so would be inviting Murph to my party and I dont ever do that!!!!

[snyper316]

How hard is it to adjust these valves? I've adjusted valves in other bikes but you simply used a wrench. I know these you need special tool to kind rotate into place so you can change the shimms. Looks fairly simple. I'm also torn I'm thinking about chopping tinker up.. But I lack creativity, I have in mind what I want to do tho. Just putting into her is another thing. My other issue is I love to have my bags and tour pack. But I think she looks better without the tour pack. After the wreck skinned her up a bit I've thought more about what I want to do. But the plastics are in pretty Damn good shape believe it or not. So far no duck tape holding stuff together. So I'm lost right now.

 

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[Chaharly]

How hard is it to adjust these valves? I've adjusted valves in other bikes but you simply used a wrench. I know these you need special tool to kind rotate into place so you can change the shimms. Looks fairly simple. I'm also torn I'm thinking about chopping tinker up.. But I lack creativity, I have in mind what I want to do tho. Just putting into her is another thing. My other issue is I love to have my bags and tour pack. But I think she looks better without the tour pack. After the wreck skinned her up a bit I've thought more about what I want to do. But the plastics are in pretty Damn good shape believe it or not. So far no duck tape holding stuff together. So I'm lost right now.

 

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The hardest part is getting to the point that you can get the valve covers off. To change the valve shims you need a shim too that will push the valve shim's holder away so you then just pop the old shim out and replace it. Real easy to do. I did it on my 99.

 

I think on my MK1 i can do it with the carbs still on

[Chaharly]

Sky is SPOT ON here Cha = there aint NO WAY I was even remotely suggesting that anyone that even remotely cares whether they drop a cylinder, or two,, or three for that matter , on a cross country tour attempt such a thing. GOOD POINT SKY! My Venture adventure since day one has been all about answering the incomplete question of how hard, how far, how much utter abuse can I push one of these $500 scoots - DEFINITELY not something to consider if one really cares. My Venturedom has been all about riding them as far as possible with as little maintenance $$$'s as possible to get as much bang for the initial as possible and, when it croaked, grab another $500 1st Gen with no 2nd gear and keep on CTFW. I made my living spinning wrenches/running a dealership/working on bikes - the very last thing I EVER wanted to due or was willing to do was spend my spare time working on a beat up old Yamaha ..

I will say this though Cha,, and I REALLY mean this,, if had er down to stickin in those new gaskets up there to slow down leaks (another pointless endeavor as far as my riding needs on a $500 1st Gen goes = oil is cheap and I have found that after ya get a couple hundred thou on em and have never changed those gaskets = oil changes almost becomes a thing of the past - you just watch the oil warning light as ya throttle up and when the oil light comes on as the oil rocks off the sensor ya stop and refill = there is a point where the leaks equalize to the oil change intervals so ya just keep adding oil = no more oil changes = happens at just over 200k IMHO ) I would DEFINITELY NOT close er up without rolling the cam lobes on each valve away from their shim bucket and at least slipping a feeler gauge under it = in my world,, not doing so would be inviting Murph to my party and I dont ever do that!!!!

 

That's a good idea puc. I'll definitely slip in feeler gauges in between and see what i got for clearance. If theyre just on the edge of tight I'll leave em. I'm only replacing the front valve cover gasket because it was PUKING oil over the years, i still have all the plastic dudads on the rear two cylinders

[cowpuc]

That's a good idea puc. I'll definitely slip in feeler gauges in between and see what i got for clearance. If theyre just on the edge of tight I'll leave em. I'm only replacing the front valve cover gasket because it was PUKING oil over the years, i still have all the plastic dudads on the rear two cylinders

 

Cha you got that gasket already? Our White Wash is FINALLY getting down there to the point that I think I can get into my storage barn out back, I am going to make an attempt at locating a part I'll be sending to another friend (thought I forgot about ya didnt ya @bongobobny ) if it survived the winter ok and I think I may have at least one of the brand new OEM top rubber gaskets (its the one with the cam end caps molded into it) that came with Tweeksis that I would gladly send you for your project. Not sure if its front or back (or if it matters - we can check PN's and see if it matters) and I may have both... Let me know if I need to do a little more diggin while I am out there in The Bike Cave

[snyper316]

I got my oring, impeller shaft, and got everything sealed up on Tinker as far as the water pump. Rode her around naked and had antifreeze coming out of the weep hole. So guess I'm gonna have to order a water pump assembly to stop all this crazy leaking. No more then what's coming from that hole might just plug it. There just enuff coming out of that hole it claim a spot again. Annoying really. But I've got other issues I want to a dress before she is ready for the road again. Like checking the valve shimm while replacing the valve gaskets.

 

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[snyper316]

Ps kidding about plugging that hole. Hopefully 3rd times the charm[emoji23][emoji23]

 

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[Chaharly]

Cha you got that gasket already? Our White Wash is FINALLY getting down there to the point that I think I can get into my storage barn out back, I am going to make an attempt at locating a part I'll be sending to another friend (thought I forgot about ya didnt ya @bongobobny ) if it survived the winter ok and I think I may have at least one of the brand new OEM top rubber gaskets (its the one with the cam end caps molded into it) that came with Tweeksis that I would gladly send you for your project. Not sure if its front or back (or if it matters - we can check PN's and see if it matters) and I may have both... Let me know if I need to do a little more diggin while I am out there in The Bike Cave

 

Yeah I've already got one on the way. Front and rear are the same. Really appreciate it though! How far out of spec would you consider too far that i should contact skydoc

[cowpuc]

I got my oring, impeller shaft, and got everything sealed up on Tinker as far as the water pump. Rode her around naked and had antifreeze coming out of the weep hole. So guess I'm gonna have to order a water pump assembly to stop all this crazy leaking. No more then what's coming from that hole might just plug it. There just enuff coming out of that hole it claim a spot again. Annoying really. But I've got other issues I want to a dress before she is ready for the road again. Like checking the valve shimm while replacing the valve gaskets.

 

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Ps kidding about plugging that hole. Hopefully 3rd times the charm[emoji23][emoji23]

 

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I'm nobody's mother Snype but my experience in doing a water pump repair on these things has been one that usually requires new bearings, seals, shaft and impeller to successfully get er to stop seeping once they start. As I recall (been a while), there is a Ceramic seal on the water pump end of the endeaver that you really want to handle with care. I also use a light grease when installing seals to give a little xtra protection on the shaft from it spinning against the seal lips.. Not sure on the O-Ring unless we are talking an o-ring on a cover?

[snyper316]

I'm nobody's mother Snype but my experience in doing a water pump repair on these things has been one that usually requires new bearings, seals, shaft and impeller to successfully get er to stop seeping once they start. As I recall (been a while), there is a Ceramic seal on the water pump end of the endeaver that you really want to handle with care. I also use a light grease when installing seals to give a little xtra protection on the shaft from it spinning against the seal lips.. Not sure on the O-Ring unless we are talking an o-ring on a cover?

Yeah well it wasn't seeping until I changed the impeller. And I guess I should have looked it up before I put it all together I ended up looking it up after I put it all together to find out why it was seeping out of the weep hole![emoji25]

 

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[cowpuc]

Yeah I've already got one on the way. Front and rear are the same. Really appreciate it though! How far out of spec would you consider too far that i should contact skydoc

I really have never done one Cha so I have no idea what Yamaha spec is on em but, having done numerous other scoots, I would say anything less than 2 thousandths on the intakes and 3,, maybe 4 thou on the exhausts (that would be .002, .003, .004) and I would call them dangerously tight. IMHO, valves/seats usually wear tight - not loose and it's the runnin tight that leaves the valve open a tad and poof,, burned valve. That said,, probably not be a bad idea to check Yam spec to see how close of guess that is,,, you got a Shop Manual? I can look it up real quick if you need me to, just a short walk downstairs - open a file cabinet - open the book to check with Mom Yam

 

You are welcome on the offer!!

[snyper316]

I really have never done one Cha so I have no idea what Yamaha spec is on em but, having done numerous other scoots, I would say anything less than 2 thousandths on the intakes and 3,, maybe 4 thou on the exhausts (that would be .002, .003, .004) and I would call them dangerously tight. IMHO, valves/seats usually wear tight - not loose and it's the runnin tight that leaves the valve open a tad and poof,, burned valve. That said,, probably not be a bad idea to check Yam spec to see how close of guess that is,,, you got a Shop Manual? I can look it up real quick if you need me to, just a short walk downstairs - open a file cabinet - open the book to check with Mom Yam [emoji106]

 

You are welcome on the offer!!

I just open mine and type valves! lol tell you older ones still believe in books. [emoji87]

 

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[cowpuc]

Yeah well it wasn't seeping until I changed the impeller. And I guess I should have looked it up before I put it all together I ended up looking it up after I put it all together to find out why it was seeping out of the weep hole![emoji25]

 

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BUMMER!! I cry real tears when that happens to me brother:missingtooth:!! Its not cold there is it? Any chance we might be talking about seeping from the drain valve spiderweb hoses

up above the oil filter and right under the center of the bottom of the radiator?? I only ask that cause my 1st Gen's all really loved to seep from there when setting in the snow up in the mountains... Always stopped when warmed up but overnight, they could lose a LOT of antifreeze!!

 

[Chaharly]

Well when i did my valve job on the 99 i remember they were all in spec except for one or two and they were both so close to being in spec i wondered if i should have even changed them. I've got the manual and they've got that nifty little table to tell you which valve to switch it too.