Why we do our own maintenance

[RDawson]

I received Skydoc's valve kit yesterday, went through the bike and need 2 shims not in the kit. That's where the fun began. I called every Yamaha and Honda shop along with a few independents within a 2 hour drive, none have shims and most didn't know what I was asking for. How does a dealer with a service dept do all the scheduled maintenance they've signed off on without knowing what a 25mm valve shim is? Yamaha shop service mechanic told me it must be an extremely old bike to use them.

[rbig1]

well the local shop here said that other brands use the same kind of shim. they have a good supply of them. if they don't have the size you need you have to buy 5 of them.

[luvmy40]

I am extremely lucky to have an excellent Yamaha dealership near by. They take time to help me locate parts from local sources when I can't find them anywhere else. They trade shims for my XJ and XVZ bikes free of charge and have even fronted me several on one occasion. My only complaint with them is that their EGA system is broken and they do not plan to repair it. I asked if they'd sell it to me but they said they could not.

[grubsie]

I received Skydoc's valve kit yesterday, went through the bike and need 2 shims not in the kit. That's where the fun began. I called every Yamaha and Honda shop along with a few independents within a 2 hour drive, none have shims and most didn't know what I was asking for. How does a dealer with a service dept do all the scheduled maintenance they've signed off on without knowing what a 25mm valve shim is? Yamaha shop service mechanic told me it must be an extremely old bike to use them.

 

I do my own maintenance so I have an excuse to keep my wife from driving me crazy. Or to keep me from driving my wife crazy?

 

If I were you, I would get in touch with Skydoc and give him a piece of your mind. How dare he not have all the shims you need! Just kidding.

 

You can get the shims you need here as a last resort, but they are expensive. https://www.yamahapartshouse.com/oemparts/a/yam/50046873f8700209bc79639f/valve

 

or you can get some from this guy much cheaper on ebay if he has the sizes you need. https://www.ebay.com/itm/25-mm-Valve-Shims-Yamaha-Honda-Triumph-and-others-QTY-3-MANY-SIZES/163416041290?hash=item260c5ae74a:g:vv4AAOSwe9Fb~LNh:rk:1:pf:0

[cowpuc]

Me and @videoarizona do our own maintainin cause we are two cheap geezers that actually like getting greasy :backinmyday:!! Of course, there is also that going and spending the money we save in resturants and on gas for the bikes but,,, yea,, basically its cause we are cheap :banana: and like working on bikes,,, and stuff :banana::banana:

 

[Flyinfool]

If you get really desperate and have the next thicker size, I have the technology to grind a shim down to size for you. When I did my bike I really cheated and made shims in sizes that have never been available.

[cowpuc]

If you get really desperate and have the next thicker size, I have the technology to grind a shim down to size for you. When I did my bike I really cheated and made shims in sizes that have never been available.

 

You lop eared engineering marvel varmint walking around with a Surface Grinder in your right pocket .. Probably got a Bridgeport Mill in the left pocket and an Engine Lathe with all the tooling in your jacket

When I grow up I wanna be just like my neighbor and buddy Flyinfool,, ,, minus the Wisconsin White Washer though cause I don't have ice in my veins :guitarist 2::moon:

 

I think your offer to custom up some shims is awesome Jeff:thumbsup: .. The kind of stuff that makes being a club member here so much fun!!

[Flyinfool]

Actually I keep the surface grinder in my right jacket pocket, The lathe in my left pocket, the vertical Mill in my right pocket, and the horizontal mill in my left jacket pocket.

 

And the WWW does not even get to go in a pocket, it is a busy machine, always running.

[RDawson]

Mega2500 (Gary Bakker) has come to my rescue and sending a couple shims. Where else can you get online to vent about local dealers and get offers to machine shims or get parts mailed to you? All before I had time to order new shims. Reminds me of an old post (Marcarl maybe) about free mechanic advice and parts. Thanks all.

[Vickersguy]

I'm having a blast restoring my '83 Royale. It's hard to wrap my mind around the fact this bike is one month younger than my son and I'm a Grandfather now. It's amazing what good condition this bike is in. Yeah, it's got some small cracks in the fairing that I've repaired with fiberglass and some scuffs that won't rub out, but all-in-all, it's in great shape. The new seat cover really spiffs it up. I'm into the valves now and getting the hang of it again. Last time I did this was on my CBX in '86. I love working on these old bikes almost as much as driving them.

Grubsie beat me to the shim kit request. So to any members who could bring themselves to share one with me, it sure would help. I also live about 5 hours drive from any dealer who has the slightest idea what a 25mm. shim is for. The Yamaha dealers around here have out board motors and ATV's . Not a bike in sight. I didn't think bout checking the Honda dealers. That's next.

[djh3]

Those shims are still used today in bikes. The V-Max uses them several Hondas and suzikis. So if a dealer says they dont have them in stock, they are s#itting someone if they do a service check.

[CaseyJ955]

3 reasons to do our own maintenance;

 

1. Someone has to do it, plenty of shops are no longer taking clients with "classic" or "vintage" machines.

 

2. Stop me if you have heard this before... If you want it done right you do it yourself.

 

3. The sense of accomplishment/keeping wrenching skills sharp/being the cheap old-ish bastard that I am. It runs against my nature to pay someone to do something I can do myself.

 

I'm not at that point where I'm to old to do it yet and I'm not acquainted with a tech that I would trust to do it right. The way I grew up and the ****ty cars/bikes I have been through, one will damn well learn how to fix things. It was just an integral part of being a motorist of cages or bikes. Knowing how to fix things at home as well as along side the road (I used to be an HD guy). I believe that maintaining the bike is part of the motorcyclist experience. I wont say bonding with the machine but I'm not sure how else to put it.

[Chaharly]

It seems to me like every time I go to the mechanic it ends up being 3 or 4 times more expensive than I was told, or what it should be. So I do pretty much all my work myself, unless I need a scanner. Then I'll run up town for that. As far as working on my bike goes, after I had B&B Cycles in norfolk put a back wheel on, and they managed to seperate the outer part of the rear brake rotor from the inner part (its a semi-floating rotor which means its riveted together) When i took the wheel off I could shake the rotor and it would freely move in 2 seperate pieces) and then telling me it wasn't like that when they put it back together, I'm absolutely done with having other people work on my stuff. I was leaving for California one week after I had them put the tire on and had to scramble to get a new rotor, which in turn wasn't the right one, but I used it anyways (Stupid)

[saddlebum]

If you get really desperate and have the next thicker size, I have the technology to grind a shim down to size for you. When I did my bike I really cheated and made shims in sizes that have never been available.

Out of curiosity would surface grinding shims not eliminate a good portion of the surface hardness or are they hardened all the way through.

[djh3]

@Flyinfool I have a bunch of big like 280- 290 and 300+ shims. If you grind them down to the more usable sizes (I think what the 260 range) would they loose the temper?

[cowpuc]

Out of curiosity would surface grinding shims not eliminate a good portion of the surface hardness or are they hardened all the way through.

 

Flyinfool I have a bunch of big like 280- 290 and 300+ shims. If you grind them down to the more usable sizes (I think what the 260 range) would they loose the temper?

GOOD QUESTIONS IMHO!!

 

Gotta try and get this in here before Jeff or another Guru jumps in here. If I were doing this job, had a surface grinder in my pocket and needed shims cause I couldnt find new I would probably grab my old Starrett 0-1's, work off a good clean surface before I hit the magnetic clamp on the grinder and, choosing the most worn surface to grind on if there was one, run em down to tolerance needed by taking the stock off one side. Mic em up so I knew what I had, take the edge off the edges of the fresh grind if I had lost radius (maybe with a hone stone) and then I would place the shim in the bucket with the freshly ground surface facing downwardly into the bucket where it has nothing actually wearing on it. Leaving the factory surface upwardly in the cup would maybe leave a good factory surface to contend with the rotational wear/pressure from the cam lobes meeting them , at least in my grossly negligent back yard feeble mechanical mind

 

Now lets see what the guru's say ,,, uuuuu hooooo,, @Flyinfool,,,

[Flyinfool]

The shims are case hardened. Typical case hardening goes .015 to .030 deep. At the factory they are ground to finish size after hardening so there is no way to know how much case is left. I am sure that a range of sizes is made from each batch just by grinding a bit more. So they will all have different thickness of case left. This is why I will only go down 1 or 2 sizes to be sure that there is plenty of case left. One size is 0.05mm or just under .002 inch. I did a test once and took off .010 and did not go thru the case. In use if the case were to thin it could start tot break up and that would be bad. I always grind the side that has the size marked on it, and then mark the new size. Of course it has to be a good shim that I am starting with. You need to measure the shim with a good micrometer, NOT a calipers. You have to check to be sure the center and edges are the same thickness, IF the center is thinner at all, then that shim is worn out. A caliper will only measure the edge thickness and can not get to the center. I have measured shims that had the center warn as much as .005. If you were to install one of these after measuring with a calipers or believing the printed size your clearance would be .005 to big. When you are shooting for .006, that is a LOT to be off.

 

Of course when you install a shim it should always have the marking down so that the cam will not wear off the marking.

[Flyinfool]

DANG, @cowpuc typed faster than me,,,,,,,,,,,,,AGAIN.......

[cowpuc]

DANG, cowpuc typed faster than me,,,,,,,,,,,,,AGAIN.......https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=115223

 

Thats just cause you were outside in the WWW shed finishing up the tweek on those nozzles,,,, noticing that fluffin ya gave us today,, looks like ya about got er dialed in.

 

Speaking of crazy stuff,,, you know what a good set of old school 0-1 Starrett Mics go for (talking real deal stuff,, like we used back in the 60/70's - not the fake stuff).. Look em up a second ago,, 600 bucks sound right Makes me feel like a dinasour, some great memories though,, I LOVED machining,,, would have never left itf the trades wouldnt have x3 my wage just for climbing steel to tig up a bunch of high pressure boiler walls.

 

I gotta SHUT UP,, another one... :ignore::ignore::ignore::ignore:

[cowpuc]

DANG, cowpuc typed faster than me,,,,,,,,,,,,,AGAIN.......https://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=115223

 

One more thing before I do though,,,, Tip is standing behind me APPLAUDING your little paint can man message brother!!