Another discussion about delinking the brakes.

[luvmy40]

This may sound random RE: the thread title, but here goes.

 

My '83 Standard seems to have every piece of added "Bling" available. The plastic is all busted in some one way or another, though it has all been repaired enough to be serviceable if not pretty. All the extra chrome is what makes this 36 year old bike look great fro 10 feet away.

 

Random, Right?

 

So here's the question; I am considering delininking the brakes simply for ease of maint. when I replace all of the 36 year old hydraulic hoses. The front MC will need to be upgraded in the process, unless I am mistaken.

 

Is there a suitable upgrade MC that will fit with the chrome MC covers that are on the OEM MCs?

 

Here is a picture of the bauble in question:

 

I have always hated the way the bar mounted MCs look and Yamaha's are especially hideous in their natural state. One of the things I loved about the '81 XJ750RH, SECA was the front master cylinder being a remote(hidden), cable operated set up.

 

Thanks for any input in advance.

[Prairiehammer]

If you retain the stock '83 calipers, there is a 50/50 chance you may not have to change the front brake master cylinder. Some have retained it with no issues. Others have found they didn't like the feel and/or there was too much travel in the lever. Like I say, it is a crap shoot.

If you decide to change the master cylinder assembly, go with the MKII master cylinder. It is 14mm bore versus the MKI ½" bore.

Your master cylinder reservoir cover will fit identically on the MKII master cylinder reservoir.

[luvmy40]

Thank you! I'll keep my eye out for an '89+ front MC.

[CaseyJ955]

When I delinked I left my MKII MC alone, it's enough, even with the R6 calipers, if you get all the air out it should be about perfect. I have insane stopping power. If I could have fit it into the budget for this bike I would have used Skydocs brake delink kit which inludes new lines and the other bits but I ended up reaching into a box of lines and robbing a splitter off a parts Vmax for the front line split. If I had to do it again I would buy the kit though honestly.

 

I say try it first, then if you cant get it right the MKII MC should work great. Now is a great time to throw on some EBC HH pads too!

[CaseyJ955]

Thank you! I'll keep my eye out for an '89+ front MC.

 

If all MKII are 14mm then an 86+ should work or did they not go to 14mm until later on in MKII production?

[Patch]

If you retain the stock '83 calipers, there is a 50/50 chance you may not have to change the front brake master cylinder. Some have retained it with no issues. Others have found they didn't like the feel and/or there was too much travel in the lever. Like I say, it is a crap shoot.

If you decide to change the master cylinder assembly, go with the MKII master cylinder. It is 14mm bore versus the MKI ½" bore.

Your master cylinder reservoir cover will fit identically on the MKII master cylinder reservoir.

 

I hope you had to look that up? Sometimes between you and Bongo I doubt I've ever worked on a Venture. Maybe my diet, I must need more bata something?

 

Luv, I would build a long term feasibility plan for the bike. Not too long ago you thought maybe time to look at a replacement bike? Hard to do I know but if this girl isn't bringing it to you any more then maybe that itch is what needs attention?

 

Have you already deleted the antidive system?

[luvmy40]

No, other than replacing the short hose from the rear MC to the steel line everything is stock and, as far as I can tell original.

 

As far as replacing the bike? I'd only go that route if she had some catastrophic engine failure. Short of pulling the engine and cracking the cases, I'll make repairs and upgrades as time and money permits. She's running well and starting to look nicer everyday. Maybe, if I were to luck into a great deal on a MKII, I'd consider having 2 Ventures.

 

I have a long list of things I want and shorter list of things I need to do to her. The hydraulic lines are the top of the need list. I'm pushing my luck every time I ride her right now and I am well aware of that fact.

Edited September 21, 2018 by luvmy40

[bongobobny]

You might want to consider finding a set of fork lowers from an MK2 and then replace those anemic MK1 calipers with some R1/R6 calipers!! Unfortunately, that also includes replacing your front rotors with MK2 ones. A big plus is using the MK2 electric anti-dive solenoids instead of those power robbing hydraulic ones...

[luvmy40]

I gotta say, I'm not sue why the Gen1 MK1 brakes have such a bad reputation. I have plenty of braking ability and the linked brakes don't seem to have any detrimental side effects. I have ridden many thousands of miles with far worse brake systems.

 

I don't want to delink because I don't like the linked system. It's simply a matter of ease of maintenance and the fact that Skydoc_17 has line kits available only for the delinked setup. He offered to make up a set for me to keep the original configuration, but I just think it will be easier in the long run to upgrade my front MC and use the kit he has already developed.

 

ETA: I'm not sure the hydraulic anti dive system has ever been all that great. The '81 SECA had a similar system and I could not feel any difference in dive with it active or disabled.

 

Progressive springs are also high on my list of "need".

Edited September 21, 2018 by luvmy40

[cimmer]

I haven't de-linked my 89 brakes but I did rebuild all the master cylinders, calipers, clutch slave and also replaced all the rubber brake lines with steel braided hoses. I have no trouble locking up both wheels if I apply the brakes too fast and all at once. I personally think that replacing the old worn out rubber brake lines is one of the best improvements that can be made to the brake system. Before I replaced them, I could grab a brake line and apply the brakes and feel the hose expand in my hands. To me this translated to loose of braking pressure and volume to the calipers and attributed to less braking action.

Just my 2 cents worth..

 

Rick F.

[Flyinfool]

On my 88 when I delinked the brakes I did not like the mushy feel of the front brake. while rebuilding the master I noticed a lot of pitting of the bore. 3Times I bought a used MC and all 3 were pitted beyond honing and rebuilding. So I gave up and bought a new after market 16mm bore master. I never did get around to installing it before I sold the bike. I still have it if you are interested.

[luvmy40]

On my 88 when I delinked the brakes I did not like the mushy feel of the front brake. while rebuilding the master I noticed a lot of pitting of the bore. 3Times I bought a used MC and all 3 were pitted beyond honing and rebuilding. So I gave up and bought a new after market 16mm bore master. I never did get around to installing it before I sold the bike. I still have it if you are interested.

 

 

Will my shiny MC cover fit?

[Flyinfool]

I will have to pull it out to check, but I really doubt it. That does not mean that you can not take the cover off of this one and sand and polish it then clear coat it to stay shiny. Heck you could make the whole thing shiny if you were that ambitious.

[gggGary]

Cuz I'm lazy, can you just delink the rear MC, cap port to front use it for just the rear? Does it get too touchy?

is there still a de-link "kit" available?

Checked the bins and I have a pair of braided lines to do the front, need to dig for a dual length banjo bolt.

[jasonm.]

I have owned the same Venture Royale for more than 30 years. Approx. 28 years ago I did all of this delinking in 1 week. One of the 1st things was delinking the brakes. It's a simple volumetric law. You running 2 calipers instead of One . You must use a larger master for proper feel and power. I got new early 90's FZR1000. Bore is at least 16mm. Plus ON 1300's the left and right calipers are different bores, and I got calipers from and 90 FJ1200 to make things equal. But they needed to be shimmed(washered) for perfect alignment to the rotors. Put in HH pads.The brakes are more powerful & controllable. Lastly I put SS lines on. With all my mods to suspension , brakes , engine and more. I ride with Ducati and other sport riders...they envy me. It's the best 800# sport bike out there. No chicken strips on my tires...

[gggGary]

Anyone add a switch to the anti dive electrics for some AB? testing? wheres the best place to do a switch or disconnect?

Thanks for the heads up on two different front caliper sizes I did not know that!

I'm experiencing a somewhat random "crash" from the front end, hit a bump ripple etc and BAM sounds, feels like I hit a wall. Not getting a strong brakes on correlation with the bangs. And I'm not holding front air pressure, pump it, ride and check, it's back to zero, not sure where to look first. I have little clue as to maintenance history of this bike. Pads are good, no evidence of fork seal failure. It's "dry" and shiny under the gaiters.

[cowpuc]

Anyone add a switch to the anti dive electrics for some AB? testing? wheres the best place to do a switch or disconnect?

Thanks for the heads up on two different front caliper sizes I did not know that!

I'm experiencing a somewhat random "crash" from the front end, hit a bump ripple etc and BAM sounds, feels like I hit a wall. Not getting a strong brakes on correlation with the bangs. And I'm not holding front air pressure, pump it, ride and check, it's back to zero, not sure where to look first. I have little clue as to maintenance history of this bike. Pads are good, no evidence of fork seal failure. It's "dry" and shiny under the gaiters.

Sounds like its time to trade in some Yamaha ink pen springs for a good set of progressives to me. Maybe check neck bearing torque in the process...

[gggGary]

Gen 1, MK1 and MK2 = 11-1112

 

Gen 2 = 11-1144

 

#luvmy40 Thanks for the correction!

 

Anyone use OTHER springs? like from a Harley or sump'n?

Asking for a COB, cheap old b_____

Edited July 5, 2020 by gggGary

[luvmy40]

Progressive Suspension part Nos.

 

Gen 1, MK1 and MK2 = 11-1112

 

Gen 2 = 11-1144

[Flyinfool]

If you put in the progressive springs with a 1 inch spacer, many people find that they need NO air pressure. This way you fix the soggy springs and the air leak all in one step.