Engine noise

[ZOEYDOG]

Was wondering as I am coming from a wing does anyone notice lifters sound a little loud when accelerating when bike is warm. This my first air cooled bike runs great was out in 32 Celsius for a 400 km ride .So curious is this normal.It does not affect performance and when cruising at 70 MPH

It is quiet and smooth also not noticeable when idling only on accelerating

[American]

Was wondering as I am coming from a wing does anyone notice lifters sound a little loud when accelerating when bike is warm. This my first air cooled bike runs great was out in 32 Celsius for a 400 km ride .So curious is this normal.It does not affect performance and when cruising at 70 MPH

It is quiet and smooth also not noticeable when idling only on accelerating

 

Yes you will here the top end of the engine on most V-Twins. Nothing to worry about.

[ZOEYDOG]

Yes you will here the top end of the engine on most V-Twins. Nothing to worry about.

 

Thankyou sorry about the 2 posts can't figure out how to delete one

[cowpuc]

Zoey, IMHO - under a load/during accellaration is usually where spark knock will peak its ugly head if its gonna happen. No idea what your using for fuel and/or what spec is for fuel grade on the new one but for an experiment you may want to try some higher octane fuel just to see if it helps.

[CaseyJ955]

The 3rd gen is still new to us, but generally speaking Puc is correct as usual! It is indeed normal for air cooled mills to have a little more audible mechanical sound. The water jacket enjoyed by liquid cooled engines also makes for great sound deadening. Like that buttery smooth, eeriely quiet wing you just came off of. If your hearing pinging, or pre-ignition/detonation (not exactly the same thing but oft used interchangeably) then that could be ****ty fuel/wrong grade, faulty timing or excessive heat in the combustion chamber, which is not unheard of with traditional air cooled engines. I would not suspect a mechanical fault on a brand new bike but if what your hearing is a pinging, esp when hot, I would probably take it in to be assessed since its a brand new machine, but if what your hearing is a faint lifter/valve train noise then that could be the normal sound of an air cooled twin, or air cooled almost anything. If the dealer has another Venture or Eluder maybe they will allow you to tale a spin to get her good and hot amd see if it sounds similar. Good luck and congrats on the new scoot!

[American]

He is likely not hearing spark knock but rather the upper valve train is what he is hearing, Yamaha to my understanding even designed the valve covers to provide some sound deadening to help quite down top end of the engine.

 

Spark knock is easy to identify, it will be like a pinging sound like if you go to your silverware drawer in your kitchen and grab a hand full of silverware and dropped it back down into the drawer by sliding out of your hand the metallic sound it makes is very close to what engine ping sounds like.

 

I can hear the upper valve train on my Star Venture and it is not engine ping. If you want to try and deaden the sound some more a full synthetic oil like Redline might help a little bit but you are likely always going to hear some sound from the upper valve train on this engine. I rather like it myself, the mechanical sound it emits is like music to me. Those eight valves all playing a symphony of mechanical engineering. Between that and the low rumble of he stock exhaust this bike makes perfect engine music.

 

As to the fuel just put in premium, the cost difference to fill up the 6.6 gallon tank is at most two dollars if you ran the tank completely dry

Edited May 8, 2018 by American

[ChiefGunner]

He is likely not hearing spark knock but rather the upper valve train is what he is hearing, Yamaha to my understanding even designed the valve covers to provide some sound deadening to help quite down top end of the engine.

 

Spark knock is easy to identify, it will be like a pinging sound like if you go to your silverware drawer in your kitchen and grab a hand full of silverware and dropped it back down into the drawer by sliding out of your hand the metallic sound it makes is very close to what engine ping sounds like.

 

I can hear the upper valve train on my Star Venture and it is not engine ping. If you want to try and deaden the sound some more a full synthetic oil like Redline might help a little bit but you are likely always going to hear some sound from the upper valve train on this engine. I rather like it myself, the mechanical sound it emits is like music to me. Those eight valves all playing a symphony of mechanical engineering. Between that and the low rumble of he stock exhaust this bike makes perfect engine music.

 

As to the fuel just put in premium, the cost difference to fill up the 6.6 gallon tank is at most two dollars if you ran the tank completely dry

 

Mind if I “chime in” here? First, the bike was DESIGNED to run in PREMIUM ONLY. Any lesser grade WILL give you issues. Second, while I know there are some superior lubricants out there, the Yamaha WARRANTEE states that “ONLY Genuine Yamaha Products MUST be used.” If you want to go synthetic (as I do) you’ll have to use Yamaha’s Synthetic. Failure to use ORIGINAL YAMAHA SPECIFIED products is cause for loss of Warrantee coverage!!

 

JJust RE-READ the Warrantee. After it specified “YAMAHA ORIGINAL PARTS”, it said “LIKE & KIND”. I must’ve missed that. So, that being said; as long as it meets or exceeds Yamaha’s specifications we’re GOOD TO GO! Of course that means the next oil change I AM SWITCHING to MOBIL 1 SYNTHETIC!

 

THANK YOU Freebird for causing me to revisit what I thought I’d read.

Edited May 8, 2018 by ChiefGunner
CORRECTION

[BlueSky]

Mind if I “chime in” here? First, the bike was DESIGNED to run in PREMIUM ONLY. Any lesser grade WILL give you issues. Second, while I know there are some superior lubricants out there, the Yamaha WARRANTEE states that “ONLY Genuine Yamaha Products MUST be used.” If you want to go synthetic (as I do) you’ll have to use Yamaha’s Synthetic. Failure to use ORIGINAL YAMAHA SPECIFIED products is cause for loss of Warrantee coverage!!

Youll HAVE to wait 5 years before you can try something else.

READ the warranty requirements!

 

I've never heard of a warranty depending on buying the manufacturers brand oil. Must have something to do with how hot the oil gets.

[Freebird]

Yamaha can say what they want but it would never hold up in court. This has been beaten many times. As long your chosen oil meets the specs required, they cannot deny warranty based on you using a different brand. I use Mobil 1 synthetic in everything I own and will continue to do so. There are consumer laws that make that very clear and Yamaha and other manufacturers very well know it and would never choose to fight that battle.

[ChiefGunner]

Yamaha can say what they want but it would never hold up in court. This has been beaten many times. As long your chosen oil meets the specs required, they cannot deny warranty based on you using a different brand. I use Mobil 1 synthetic in everything I own and will continue to do so. There are consumer laws that make that very clear and Yamaha and other manufacturers very well know it and would never choose to fight that battle.

 

Im just quoting them. It’s not my view.

[cowpuc]

I only mentioned spark knock as a possibilty cause normal valve train noise is usually not load dependent in my little bit of experience.

I am no Strat motor expert but I do seem to recall hearing about valve noises being produced by them do to automatic decompressors on the exhaust lobes of the cams.. I know for a fact (techs at Sturgis told me so) that the SVTC shares valve/top end parts with the other 113's and I wonder if the design for decompressing the engine for start up was carried over and if that is what is being heard..

[ZOEYDOG]

He is likely not hearing spark knock but rather the upper valve train is what he is hearing, Yamaha to my understanding even designed the valve covers to provide some sound deadening to help quite down top end of the engine.

 

Spark knock is easy to identify, it will be like a pinging sound like if you go to your silverware drawer in your kitchen and grab a hand full of silverware and dropped it back down into the drawer by sliding out of your hand the metallic sound it makes is very close to what engine ping sounds like.

 

I can hear the upper valve train on my Star Venture and it is not engine ping. If you want to try and deaden the sound some more a full synthetic oil like Redline might help a little bit but you are likely always going to hear some sound from the upper valve train on this engine. I rather like it myself, the mechanical sound it emits is like music to me. Those eight valves all playing a symphony of mechanical engineering. Between that and the low rumble of he stock exhaust this bike makes perfect engine music.

 

As to the fuel just put in premium, the cost difference to fill up the 6.6 gallon tank is at most two dollars if you ran the tank completely dry

 

Thanks everyone for their info. It is definitely not pinging That sound I know makes sense it could be valve train noise.I only use premium but may switch stations also does not decrease performance. Had first service done at 1300 KMS and they used Yamalube and a Yamaha filter. Loving this new bike out handles my 2001 wing one or two up. On the highway in the wind not near as much blowing around it is so far best machine I have owned.

[American]

Actually Yamaha could win a court case against you on this, the kicker is Yamaha is required to provide the oil for free for the duration of the warranty period per the Magnuson-Moss warranty act.

 

A manufacture may control what part you are allowed to use but in exchange for that while the vehicle is under warranty the manufacture has to provide said part(s) free of charge to the customer because they are denying the customer choice of aftermarket parts.

 

I bet no one is getting free oil from Yamaha during the warranty period.

[Zelthian]

While I know there are some superior lubricants out there, the Yamaha WARRANTEE states that “ONLY Genuine Yamaha Products MUST be used.”

 

Can you post a pic of this from the warranty? I'm ashamed to say I can't find my copy.

 

That said, in the specifications in the owner's manual (page 11-1), it states "Recommended brand: YAMALUBE". It does not say "Required".

 

Also, in the YES warranty (various forms found here: https://www.yamaha-motor-yes.com/tsncs.jsp), it says (in the 48-state version), "Follow Yamaha guidelines for the quality and type of fuel, oil, and lubricants used. Failure to follow guidelines in the appropriate owner’s manual may result in denial of certain claims." Quality and type; brand is not specified, nor is there at that point a recommendation for YAMALUBE.

 

The only gap I have in my documentation is the text of the base 1-year warranty. I'd be very curious to see the wording therein.

[CaseyJ955]

Thanks everyone for their info. It is definitely not pinging That sound I know makes sense it could be valve train noise.I only use premium but may switch stations also does not decrease performance. Had first service done at 1300 KMS and they used Yamalube and a Yamaha filter. Loving this new bike out handles my 2001 wing one or two up. On the highway in the wind not near as much blowing around it is so far best machine I have owned.

Sounds like your golden then. Its a completely different engine than the 1800 6 pot and this is just one of those differences that fall under normal operation. You may notice I said valve sounds rather than noise. I have owned plenty of air cooled cars and bikes and the sound of a properly adjusted valve train does not offend me, I find it almost musical. On this bike and oils, I think i would only use oils that meet mfr requirements, regardless of oil brand, at least until there are more of these on the road and more is known about the durability of this new line of engines. Giving a mfr any grounds for denial of warranty may not be a great move IMHO, at least not just yet. For a mfr to legally deny a warranty claim they must prove that what you did contributed to the failure. If you have an engine failire while using oil outside mfr specs you may very well be sole owner of the hot oily pieces scattered all over the blacktop. Brand of oil is not the issue, but correct spec is. Just like if you ise "incorrect" oil and then experience an electronic failure there is precious little chance a judge would allow a mfr to void your claim. It may vary from state to state but this is what I have seen. As the miles pile on and if certain failures become known they may have a hard time denying a claim anyway. I would wait a bit before playing with oil specs, just my .02.

[ZOEYDOG]

Sounds like your golden then. Its a completely different engine than the 1800 6 pot and this is just one of those differences that fall under normal operation. You may notice I said valve sounds rather than noise. I have owned plenty of air cooled cars and bikes and the sound of a properly adjusted valve train does not offend me, I find it almost musical. On this bike and oils, I think i would only use oils that meet mfr requirements, regardless of oil brand, at least until there are more of these on the road and more is known about the durability of this new line of engines. Giving a mfr any grounds for denial of warranty may not be a great move IMHO, at least not just yet. For a mfr to legally deny a warranty claim they must prove that what you did contributed to the failure. If you have an engine failire while using oil outside mfr specs you may very well be sole owner of the hot oily pieces scattered all over the blacktop. Brand of oil is not the issue, but correct spec is. Just like if you ise "incorrect" oil and then experience an electronic failure there is precious little chance a judge would allow a mfr to void your claim. It may vary from state to state but this is what I have seen. As the miles pile on and if certain failures become known they may have a hard time denying a claim anyway. I would wait a bit before playing with oil specs, just my .02.

I am only going to use Yamaha oils and filters they may cost a little more but this way I do not have to worry about warranty. As you said I just need to get used to the engine sound after all this is first v twin after riding Goldwings for 36 years. But glad I made the switch

[CaseyJ955]

I am only going to use Yamaha oils and filters they may cost a little more but this way I do not have to worry about warranty. As you said I just need to get used to the engine sound after all this is first v twin after riding Goldwings for 36 years. But glad I made the switch

Safe is good, its not a cheap bike so piece of mind is nice. I dont figure it will take long to get used to, it does have torque but pretty different power delivery. I'll bet coming off a wing there will be readers very interested in your thoughts and reviews as you rack up some miles.

[ChiefGunner]

Can you post a pic of this from the warranty? I'm ashamed to say I can't find my copy.

 

That said, in the specifications in the owner's manual (page 11-1), it states "Recommended brand: YAMALUBE". It does not say "Required".

 

Also, in the YES warranty (various forms found here: https://www.yamaha-motor-yes.com/tsncs.jsp), it says (in the 48-state version), "Follow Yamaha guidelines for the quality and type of fuel, oil, and lubricants used. Failure to follow guidelines in the appropriate owner’s manual may result in denial of certain claims." Quality and type; brand is not specified, nor is there at that point a recommendation for YAMALUBE.

 

The only gap I have in my documentation is the text of the base 1-year warranty. I'd be very curious to see the wording therein.

 

I amended my earlier statement after I saw it say “like and kind”. My bad. That means I’m switching up to Mobil 1 Synthetic in my next oil change.

[Freebird]

I truly hate Yamalube. I've tried it and my experience was that after as little as a thousand miles, especially in hot weather, shifting became more difficult, finding neutral was more difficult, valve noise increased, etc. I just hated it. When I bought my first RSV back in April of 1999, the first service was included in the deal. I had it serviced a day before leaving on a few hundred mile trip from Texas and touring Eureka Springs, Arkansas and surrounding areas. I could hardly wait to get back home and change it to Mobil 1. I've used Mobil 1 for close to 20 years and it is all I use in my vehicles. I use the Racing 4T in the RSV. Haven't looked at the specs on the third gen but the Mobil 1 VTwin would likely be the choice for it.

 

In my opinion, there is no way that Yamaha would attempt to deny a warranty claim due to the use of Mobil 1's motorcycle specific oil. They would have very little chance of winning that battle. At any rate, it is a chance that I am always willing to take. Warranty or not, I buy and use my vehicles for my personal enjoyment and anything that takes away from that enjoyment is not worth me fussing over. I'll use what I think is best and worry about the other stuff should it ever come up.

 

I will say one more thing. I had an issue with one bike to the point where I ended up filing a lemon law suit against Yamaha. That was around 2001 or so and part of the final settlement was me signing a non-disclosure agreement. I can tell you though, the subject of "what oil I used" was never brought up.

[American]

This is right out of the 2018 Star Venture service manual:

 

Recommended brand Yamalube SAE viscosity grades 10w-40, 10w-50, 15w-40, 20w-40 or 20w-50.

 

Recommended engine oil grade API service SG type or higher, JASO standard MA.

 

Of course every manufacture recommends their own brand of engine oil.

 

Notice Engine oil also lubricates the clutch and the wrong oil types or additives could cause clutch slippage. Therefore, do not add any chemical additives or use engine oils with a grade of "CD" or higher and do not use oils labeled "Energy Conserving II".

 

As long as you are using an oil that is SG or higher with the JASO standard MA you are good to go.

[Zelthian]

That means I’m switching up to Mobil 1 Synthetic in my next oil change.

 

I researched a bit of this today, and oddly enough, the V-Twin 20w-50 synthetic (Mobil 1) isn't JASO MA rated, though the Racing 4T 10w-40 synthetic is (see attachment).NAUSMobil-1-Motorcycle-Oils.pdf

 

I thought this might be a trend, as Castrol says its 20w-50 "has been engineered and tested for performance in Harley-Davidson® motorcycles". But when you look at the specs, it IS JASO MA rated (MA-2, even): https://www.castrol.com/en_us/united-states/motorcycle-oil/motorcycle-engine-oil/4-stroke-engine-oil/power1-v-twin-4t.html

 

I found it very odd on Mobil-1's part that the 20w-50 V-Twin synthetic omitted this.

 

The manual does recommend at least Standard JASO MA (and API service SG type or higher).

Edited May 9, 2018 by Zelthian
SG, not AG

[American]

Just for information on the Yamalube oils:

 

10w-40 is conventional all purpose oil.

 

20w-50 is conventional all purpose oil.

 

10w-50 semi-synthetic.

 

20w-50 semi-synthetic.

 

15w-50 full synthetic.

 

So Yamalube comes in either semi-synthetic or conventional oil in 20w-50 so if you don't want conventional oil but want to run 20w-50 make sure you are getting the semi-synthetic version of Yamalube 20w-50.

 

If you want to run full synthetic you only have 15w-50 as your choice in Yamalube.

 

This is for those who only want to run Yamalube brand oil.

 

Redline synthetic oil meets Yamaha's SG or higher requirement and it meets the JASO MA standard, so Redline is another choice if you want to run full synthetic engine oil. I have run Redline synthetic oils in all my vehicles for years, I run Redline 0w-20 in my wife's 2016 Honda Civic Touring with a Turbo Charger, I run Redline 0w-40 in my 2016 Ram 2500 with the 6.4 liter Hemi engine, I ran Redline 10w-40 in my old 2013 Victory Cross Country Tour, I ran Redline 20w-50 in my 2016 Harley Davidson Ultra Limited Low as well as Redline Primary oil and Redline Transmission oil as the Harley has three separate holes to fill.

[American]

I researched a bit of this today, and oddly enough, the V-Twin 20w-50 synthetic (Mobil 1) isn't JASO MA rated, though the Racing 4T 10w-40 synthetic is (see attachment).http://www.venturerider.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=112492

 

I thought this might be a trend, as Castrol says its 20w-50 "has been engineered and tested for performance in Harley-Davidson® motorcycles". But when you look at the specs, it IS JASO MA rated (MA-2, even): https://www.castrol.com/en_us/united-states/motorcycle-oil/motorcycle-engine-oil/4-stroke-engine-oil/power1-v-twin-4t.html

 

I found it very odd on Mobil-1's part that the 20w-50 V-Twin synthetic omitted this.

 

The manual does recommend at least Standard JASO MA (and API service AG type or higher).

 

I think you mean API service SG or higher.

 

As to the Mobil One V-Twin oil I think Mobil might have developed that for the Harley Davidson because it does not share its engine oil with the clutch and transmission. You can run energy conserving oils in the Harley V-Twin because of that.

 

I prefer the group V synthetic that Redline uses for my engines.

[Zelthian]

I think you mean API service SG or higher.

 

As to the Mobil One V-Twin oil I think Mobil might have developed that for the Harley Davidson because it does not share its engine oil with the clutch and transmission. You can run energy conserving oils in the Harley V-Twin because of that.

 

I prefer the group V synthetic that Redline uses for my engines.

 

Yes, I did, thanks for catching that. I get the same sense about the V-Twin oil. I think it's a tad misleading, given that V-Twins are not exclusive to HD, but that's just my opinion.

[American]

For those worried about Yamaha and feeling you have to use Yamalube when was the last time anyone can document an oil related engine failure that was not because of someone running the engine low on oil.

 

I can't think of any.