What brand of Premium, are you planning to feed this bad boy?

[YamahaParExcellence]

I have had really great luck with Canadian Shell Nitro +, 91 octane. The great bonus of using this premium, over the competition, is that it is totally ethanol/methanol free. It is pure petroleum. That means, that you will extract the greatest KM's/Mileage from this brand, over others that still have up to 20% ethanol/methanol, due to the less BTU energy of that blended content.

 

Note: In Canada, Shell does NOT use ethanol/methanol in this premium offering. I can't speak with authority for if that is true throughout the United States. I can't seem to find, any Shell website or information that states that for a fact. You can in Canada. So...no performance robbing and wear-upon-the combustion chamber/valves ethanol/methanol, at least in The Great North Wonder! Ethanol/methanol is deadly hard on valves in particular, Just ask the many owners who purchase gas within the scope of the U.S. Eastern Seaboard. There, it is laced with it...and plenty of reports from those that live there, of burnt valves, corroded and pitted upper chamber within the combustion chambers of their engines. When I tour in the original '13'...I cringe at fill up!

 

So, for my SVTC, I'll always keep a look out down the road to keep it sipping exclusively, the above premium brand. I use it in my car, and also in my Sport Tour, 2004 Kawasaki ZR-7S. Both run like a dream with it.

Cheers,

Edited March 31, 2018 by YamahaParExcellence

[Flyinfool]

In the USA there are a few stations that carry the crap free premium gas. There are also a lot of areas where it does no matter what brand you get they all have corn mixed in by law. Where I am, the nearest ethanol free gas in any grade is over 100 miles away. You can go to http://www.pure-gas.org to find stations with real gas.

 

Does the new engine require premium gas?

[djh3]

Most alchol free gas I have found here in USA is 90 octane. I can get some 110.......if I take a can to the airport.

[YamahaParExcellence]

In the USA there are a few stations that carry the crap free premium gas. There are also a lot of areas where it does no matter what brand you get they all have corn mixed in by law. Where I am, the nearest ethanol free gas in any grade is over 100 miles away. You can go to www.pure-gas.org to find stations with real gas.

 

Does the new engine require premium gas?

 

Yes it does, 91 octane, minimum.

Yes, unfortunately, I have seen where your state and/or location within the state can dictate whether the gas is laced with Ethanol and/or whatever. For myself, in using only Canadian Shell Nitro + (plus) fuel, I have gained around 15-20 percent better fuel mileage over even the same company's regular grade (which in Canada, does contain up to 20 percent Ethanol). The Shell Premium Nitro + costs in Ontario about 11 cents a liter more, over regular...but with the better fuel mileage I have made...it actually is cheaper to run, in the summer months, and at best, the 11 cents cancels out in the winter months, by the better fuel mileage that pure gas affords you. The fuel also has friction and cleaner modifiers that also boosts your best output. So, for myself, in doing the math...it costs me no more, or even less, than running adulterated fuel in the form of regular grade. I even run it in the lawn mower and weed whacker. 5 percent more weeds bite the dust. (just kidding, lol) Everything runs very well, with it, and you don't get the lawn-mower, weed-whacker, chain-saw carburetor jet corrosion from the Ethanol, or Methanol...and hard starting...or no starting. Since I switched all my gas engines to the premium...one pull on the mower or weed whacker...and I'm off to the races.

 

Cheers,

[Condor]

Just went to the link and did a search for Sacramento CA and we have one station?? Tognotti's, but it's an auto parts store and the fuel is 110 octane. Av'gas.. So it looks like I'm stuck using the 15% cr@p. My truck mileage has gone to hell in a hand basket since they went to the 15%. Leave it to Kalifornia to screw things up....again!!

[Flyinfool]

Naaaa, Kali did not screw it up again, it was already screwed up, they just screwed it up some more....................

[Condor]

Naaaa, Kali did not screw it up again, it was already screwed up, they just screwed it up some more....................

 

Being from Wisconsin you have no idea.....

[Kretz]

I have had really great luck with Canadian Shell Nitro +, 91 octane. The great bonus of using this premium, over the competition, is that it is totally ethanol/methanol free. It is pure petroleum. That means, that you will extract the greatest KM's/Mileage from this brand, over others that still have up to 20% ethanol/methanol, due to the less BTU energy of that blended content.

 

Note: In Canada, Shell does NOT use ethanol/methanol in this premium offering. I can't speak with authority for if that is true throughout the United States. I can't seem to find, any Shell website or information that states that for a fact. You can in Canada. So...no performance robbing and wear-upon-the combustion chamber/valves ethanol/methanol, at least in The Great North Wonder! Ethanol/methanol is deadly hard on valves in particular, Just ask the many owners who purchase gas within the scope of the U.S. Eastern Seaboard. There, it is laced with it...and plenty of reports from those that live there, of burnt valves, corroded and pitted upper chamber within the combustion chambers of their engines. When I tour in the original '13'...I cringe at fill up!

 

So, for my SVTC, I'll always keep a look out down the road to keep it sipping exclusively, the above premium brand. I use it in my car, and also in my Sport Tour, 2004 Kawasaki ZR-7S. Both run like a dream with it.

Cheers,

 

Can't say for certain but I believe most regular gas 87 octane contains "up to 10%" ethanol. Most, afaik 91 oct in Canada is ethanol free. (I think that's what a lot of marinas sell for boat owners. Costco 91 here in BC is ethanol free as is Chevron 93 (or is it 95?) but some on here advise against using the higher octane gas as it burns at a different temp & may cause unintended problems. I always thought using a higher octane gas was better but it seems not. Pretty sure someone will chime in with the why's & wherefore's.

Flyingfool seems pretty up on all that stuff.

I use regular but every so often run a tank of 91 through. For any storage period I try to have non ethanol in the tank & carbs & also use seafoam occasionally.

[Flyinfool]

Can't say for certain but I believe most regular gas 87 octane contains "up to 10%" ethanol. Most, afaik 91 oct in Canada is ethanol free. (I think that's what a lot of marinas sell for boat owners. Costco 91 here in BC is ethanol free as is Chevron 93 (or is it 95?) but some on here advise against using the higher octane gas as it burns at a different temp & may cause unintended problems. I always thought using a higher octane gas was better but it seems not. Pretty sure someone will chime in with the why's & wherefore's.

Flyingfool seems pretty up on all that stuff.

I use regular but every so often run a tank of 91 through. For any storage period I try to have non ethanol in the tank & carbs & also use seafoam occasionally.

 

Running premium in a bike designed for regular will only empty your wallet faster and possibly even reduce available power. In this case the engine design in the new Venture calls for 91 octane so you must use premium or you run the risk of damaging the engine.

[djh3]

As I have mentioned before. My Victory calls for 91, does it get it all the time? AH nope I forget all the time except for my 2 strokes all my scoots have been regular gas. What it does mess with is ignition and therefore the emissions. Is your regular fuel bike going to die if using premium? Probably not. Us old motor heads were of the school of thought high test burned hotter/better. When actually it is opposite. Lower grade fuel burns quicker so to speak and higher grade fuels have a higher ignition point thus takes more to get it to burn. But if I remember right burns more completely when it gets going.

[YamahaParExcellence]

In the USA there are a few stations that carry the crap free premium gas. There are also a lot of areas where it does no matter what brand you get they all have corn mixed in by law. Where I am, the nearest ethanol free gas in any grade is over 100 miles away. You can go to www.pure-gas.org to find stations with real gas.

 

Does the new engine require premium gas?

 

Wow...this is fantastic! THANK YOU for posting this site. I have captured it..and will use it on our planned routes with our iPad. I would go out of my way, to avoid Corn pollutant,....the car and bike killer...as well as performance robber.

[YamahaParExcellence]

Just went to the link and did a search for Sacramento CA and we have one station?? Tognotti's, but it's an auto parts store and the fuel is 110 octane. Av'gas.. So it looks like I'm stuck using the 15% cr@p. My truck mileage has gone to hell in a hand basket since they went to the 15%. Leave it to Kalifornia to screw things up....again!!

 

Wow..15 percent? So in California, the poor residents pay for 15 percent of their tank's volume, as basically worthless added weight, but not much more to propel the vehicle. What a rip off! But then, anybody who has to fill with this polluted gas, is being ripped of...anywhere it happens!

[YamahaParExcellence]

Running premium in a bike designed for regular will only empty your wallet faster and possibly even reduce available power. In this case the engine design in the new Venture calls for 91 octane so you must use premium or you run the risk of damaging the engine.

 

I would respectively have to disagree with you. I also run Shell Premium Nitro + in my 87 octane rated Kawasaki ZR-7S 750 four. Not only do I have better power in the mid-range, but I have also picked up 15-20 percent better fuel mileage per gallon. Not only that...but within two tankfuls, a slight idle stutter was absolutely gone, with turbine smooth idling , ever since. I now burn nothing else in this bike, and the same will be for the SVTC when I get it. For my van, the same. As for to empty your wallet...the added miles you get running a pure petroleum product, over using 87 Regular (with an Ethanol component)...cancels out the front-loaded cost...because I don't visit the pumps as fast , as when I ran Regular, with Ethanol. Just my findings and experience. After you paid around three tankfuls of ethanol-free Premium (if you can get it in your area) you won't be shell-shocked by the pump meter...and all will seem normal, lol. I know...I know... I still get a kick outta thinking my gas gauge needle is stuck at Full, on the van, lol. With premium, it takes its sweet time, starting the climb down...

[Flyinfool]

It is not the octane that is giving your boost in performance and MPG, it is the ethanol free that you are seeing. If you could compare to 87 octane ethanol free your results would likely be a lot different. mid throttle is not a good place to measure a power difference unless you are able to measure and know that the comparison was done with the throttle plates at exactly the same opening angle.

 

I keep a gas log for my truck, In 300K+ miles I could tell you exactly how much gas went thru it, what brand and what cost etc, I ran a semi scientific test in my truck where I ran premium for 1 full year to get all the weather conditions that we see here in WI and wrote down all the info at every fill up. After that full year, yes the premium got better gas mileage, but not by enough to justify the cost. The truck does have an engine computer to adjust the fuel thru the EFI and spark timing to be able to make some use out of the higher octane gas, and I did notice a bit more power and less engine knock while pulling a RV.

[YamahaParExcellence]

It is not the octane that is giving your boost in performance and MPG, it is the ethanol free that you are seeing. If you could compare to 87 octane ethanol free your results would likely be a lot different. mid throttle is not a good place to measure a power difference unless you are able to measure and know that the comparison was done with the throttle plates at exactly the same opening angle.

 

I keep a gas log for my truck, In 300K+ miles I could tell you exactly how much gas went thru it, what brand and what cost etc, I ran a semi scientific test in my truck where I ran premium for 1 full year to get all the weather conditions that we see here in WI and wrote down all the info at every fill up. After that full year, yes the premium got better gas mileage, but not by enough to justify the cost. The truck does have an engine computer to adjust the fuel thru the EFI and spark timing to be able to make some use out of the higher octane gas, and I did notice a bit more power and less engine knock while pulling a RV.

 

 

Oh, yes, I understand that. That's the common mistake many make...that the octane rating gives better performance (but I have to say more on that, actually)....

 

I agree on a technical merit with what you are posting here, but I still have to say, that (and I guess we always have to caveat) in my case, Fly, the mileage gain I am getting because of the Ethanol free gas mixture is practically cancelling out the 10-11 cents per litre more, that I pay, with using the Shell Regular, which does have Ethanol content up here in Canada. If it's not to the exact penny, it practically is, so the added cost is no longer a deciding factor on whether I use the Shell Premium Nitro + in my Dodge Caravan, my Kawasaki ZR-7S, (have to with my coming SVTC) and all my other power equipment around the nest.

 

Now, just an interesting comment about my present air/oil cooled 2004 Kawasaki------>After having first started using it in the Dodge Caravan...and to great success, smoother running engine, quick starts, great power...blah, blah...I got to thinking...well, being that my new (this was last October) SVTC actually required 91 octane, what about trying this premium IN the air/oil cooled ZR-7S. So...I did...I waited until around fumes...and then filled up. Within the first ten miles from the pump...the very first thing I noticed...under hard (entering Highway 401) acceleration coming off the on-ramp...was how **quiet** the top end of the engine, now was. This isn't placebo effect. It's either the same level of engine glitter, or not. What the heck?!?!? Then it dawned on me...that noise I could have been hearing, was a somewhat not-100 percent clean and stable flame front across the piston crown. That was with 87 octane and ethanol laced. Hmmmm....

 

Could I have had a very small amount of 'pinging' going on...pre-detonation, or..during the flame front...pockets of faster ignition over the top of the piston crown? And...this contributing to the 'normal' sound of the motor since the first mile placed upon it, back in 2004? Hmmmm....

 

I ran three full tankfuls of non laced, non ethanol blended 91 octane gas through the air/oil cooled 750-four. I made sure that I had full throttle events, as well as cruise and easy acceleration during those three tankfuls...very mindful (with a mental footprint of the SOUND of the motor, or how busy the sound was from the top end.)

 

Fly...I then with purpose went back to fumes...and filled up with Regular 87 (ethanol laced)...and lo and behold...within 2 miles...(the carbs (the bike has four) contents running through the premium in the bowls)) I was back to my louder, busier, 'past normal' engine sound(s). Hmmmm.... could part of that making up of that sound...be very mild ping...low level knock? Non optimum flame front across the fuel ignition? Perhaps all...and less engine life, greater wear upon the valve seats, or more 'normal' maintenance required because of that...but not truly thought of....in the past process and use.

 

Back to a fill of the Premium Shell Nitro +------> again...quieter in operation.

 

This is what I derived from that...that even if your bike can operate on 87, without possible hard pre-detonation(knock/ping)...it does..and will run better, cooler, having the best advance ignition it can just past TDC...without any computer retarding of such. (The Kawa has such a feature, like most cars of today...and has anti-knock sensors that can and will retard the timing, if knock is noted.) It also adjusts the ignition and valve timing on the fly...quite the system, for 2004! So, I wished, that I would have been running this Premium in my rated 87 octane engine, from the get go, and will do so from now on. I do believe from my experience, that no matter what, you do get obvious, or..not so obvious benefits from running a premium fuel, that has a higher octane rating over 87, if only, it is added anti-knock/added reduction of the engines ability to retard the ignition event, live, on the fly.

 

So my argument for using the premium, is not solely based on whether the engine CAN be run with an octane rating of 87....but that DESPITE that rating, there are benefits, obvious, or subtle that running the Premium Nitro + will afford. It will be interesting this summer, under the hottest ambient temperatures, to see how my Kawasaki 750 will run...sound, etc...when air/oil cooling is in play. Of course for the SVTC...it is a fait accompli. You absolutely must run with that 91 octane rating, to prevent destructive pre-ignition of the 10.5 to 1 compression ratio. No cost burr under my saddle in that I run with the 91 in everything already.... I could imagine though..it causing a grimmace on those that are considering, or had bought the bike to know they need to feed it with Premium whatever...lol!

Edited April 3, 2018 by YamahaParExcellence

[Flyinfool]

I still say that most of what you are noticing is due to being ethanol free as opposed to the added octane. Since the bike does have a computer it is likely that it is always riding the knock sensor and the 91 lets the ignition advance farther to actually make use of the added octane. In an antique system of fixed timing and carbs like the 1st and 2nd gen Ventures have you will pick up performance from the ethanol free and loose some performance from the added octane. the net result will likely be better on many fronts to run the ethanol free, I would if I could get it.

 

Whenever I travel with the truck I always bring a couple of 5 gallon gas cans to give the engines at home a treat.

Mt truck being a Flexfuel will sense ethanol free and really take advantage of it.

[YamahaParExcellence]

I still say that most of what you are noticing is due to being ethanol free as opposed to the added octane. Since the bike does have a computer it is likely that it is always riding the knock sensor and the 91 lets the ignition advance farther to actually make use of the added octane. In an antique system of fixed timing and carbs like the 1st and 2nd gen Ventures have you will pick up performance from the ethanol free and loose some performance from the added octane. the net result will likely be better on many fronts to run the ethanol free, I would if I could get it.

 

Whenever I travel with the truck I always bring a couple of 5 gallon gas cans to give the engines at home a treat.

Mt truck being a Flexfuel will sense ethanol free and really take advantage of it.

 

What you feel, could be very well what is happening. Ethanol-free fuel being burnt. But, having that octane at 91, gives me an emotional hug, better than at 87. Especially with an air/oil cool bike, let's say, should I wish to ride back down to Phoenix for a family reunion and such. SVTC for sure...and will continue using this fuel, with my ZR-7S... It just runs so well on it, and I do (pure gas...) get a longer range out of that tank, even if it being ample to begin with. With Shell Premium Nitro +, on the Kawa, solo, with soft bags, I get 60 plus mpg. A very economical bike for a cheap weekend, or full week getaway, when the wife doesn't want to ride. She will not ride upon my 'crotch rocket'. I keep telling her...hon...it's a SPORT's TOUR... Her reply..."yeah, lol..whatever...". Well, the insurance company calls it a Sport's Tour. They don't insure 'crotch rockets'. Doesn't faze her...lol. Gawd, I love that gal!

 

Cheers,

[mabeline]

Maybe it's been mentioned before somewhere here. If you pull into a gas station and it has the usual multiple choices for gas (reg,premium, super premium), and the last guy filled with reg. How much reg are you getting before you get premium? How much does the hose and pump hold? If you put in 10 litres or 2 gallons are you getting a half gallon of reg or maybe almost a gallon of reg before you get the expensive stuff?

[YamahaParExcellence]

Maybe it's been mentioned before somewhere here. If you pull into a gas station and it has the usual multiple choices for gas (reg,premium, super premium), and the last guy filled with reg. How much reg are you getting before you get premium? How much does the hose and pump hold? If you put in 10 litres or 2 gallons are you getting a half gallon of reg or maybe almost a gallon of reg before you get the expensive stuff?

 

Actually, not even much of a 1/4 liter. Next time you want to check, just grab the handle....and put the tip of the hose, upon the ground. Nothing but dribbles comes out. The actual pump housing has very little volume...so your're good to go. If you want to try a tankful, you need to pass at least two tanks, with you running to at least an 1/8 of a tank left, to get the ethanol out of the tank. But, I got better mileage from the first tank...and even better from the second. This is all I use now...and I'm use to the price...so no sticker shock at all. My Dodge Caravan, and my Kawasaki ZR-7S has never run better. Same for the snow-blower, lawn mower...all of your power equipment. I will pay initially to say bye-bye to any adulterated gas blend. As much now as possible, we're Ethanol-free around here...

[Condor]

Maybe it's been mentioned before somewhere here. If you pull into a gas station and it has the usual multiple choices for gas (reg,premium, super premium), and the last guy filled with reg. How much reg are you getting before you get premium? How much does the hose and pump hold? If you put in 10 litres or 2 gallons are you getting a half gallon of reg or maybe almost a gallon of reg before you get the expensive stuff?

 

Hmmm... Never even gave that a thought before... In the old days when gas prices started to rise people were turning off the pump and then draining the hose. The next guy to use the pump always got stuck with a couple of cents when he lifted the lever and the hose filled... I don't think that can be done any longer with the newer nozzles. Anyway it still didn't take much to fill the hose back up. The ambient regular left from the last delivery can't be all that much, and by the time it get's diluted in the tank it's gotta be insignificant... And the cost has to be figured on the difference between the two grades, not the entire gal price... Good thought tho-....

[mabeline]

It was a question that was brought up one time over coffee. Because some guys I know say" my bike won't run on anything less then premium". I know it won't be much and cost is only pennies, but curious how much 5 ft. of hose, the pump, and the plumbing in the pump stand would hold !?

[YamahaParExcellence]

It was a question that was brought up one time over coffee. Because some guys I know say" my bike won't run on anything less then premium". I know it won't be much and cost is only pennies, but curious how much 5 ft. of hose, the pump, and the plumbing in the pump stand would hold !?

 

Again, by my experience Mabeline, not much volume to make any difference as the other poster pointed out. If your own bike is rated for 87 octane, that's all you need, for instance, Regular blend...but, with saying that, you truly get robbed of MPG and torque performance, because the amount of thermal burn, BTU rating, is not as high, in Ethanol, as it is in pure petroleum. So...while it might cost you 'front end'...more on the pump cash read-out, it pretty much 'rear end' cancels out by the better MPG , and therefore less times per month, you attend the pump. So let's say for argument that it is not a one for one cancel out...but that in reality, that gallon of Premium (I only use if I can ...Shell Premium Nitro + (or Plus)) will end up costing you even 5-7 cents more...after your better MPG is factored in, and you're back at the pump...I think that that is a great value for the fact that your engine will be cleaner, top end...valves bodies, valve seats, and that the gas I am referring to, already has the largest amount of friction modifiers (top end lubricant and cleaners), you don't need to buy after-market cleaners and conditioners, such as MMO, or SeaFoam, or even the actual Top End Lubricant bottles, some add to their gas for that very purpose.

 

If you do use those products, like I formerly did..(I was a SeaFoam junkie, lol) than you actually ARE in the green...by buying the aforementioned Premium, you ARE saving cold hard, cash.

 

Cheers,

[Flyinfool]

I found a couple of European websites that say there is about a half of a liter in the hose and filter. So the first 17 oz of your purchase is whatever the last person got. This is IF it is a single hose pump. Most of the stations that I have found that have pure premium have it on a stand alone pump so the last person got the same thing you are after.

 

An interesting tidbit that I ran into last night. I was working on my truck and had the reader hooked up to the OBDII port, while scanning thru looking for the parameter that I needed I ran across one for ethanol content of the fuel. My truck is a FlexFuel so it has to be able to measure the ethanol content so that it knows how much fuel to dump in. All of the pumps around here have a sticker stating "UP TO 10% ethanol added". My truck is measuring the fuel that was in it at 15.1% ethanol. That could explain my recent drop in MPG. Just another way for the oil companies to cheat us out of a bit more cash. I will try some different brands over the next few fills and see if it stays the same.... My bike will not be happy about the extra ethanol.

[YamahaParExcellence]

I found a couple of European websites that say there is about a half of a liter in the hose and filter. So the first 17 oz of your purchase is whatever the last person got. This is IF it is a single hose pump. Most of the stations that I have found that have pure premium have it on a stand alone pump so the last person got the same thing you are after.

 

An interesting tidbit that I ran into last night. I was working on my truck and had the reader hooked up to the OBDII port, while scanning thru looking for the parameter that I needed I ran across one for ethanol content of the fuel. My truck is a FlexFuel so it has to be able to measure the ethanol content so that it knows how much fuel to dump in. All of the pumps around here have a sticker stating "UP TO 10% ethanol added". My truck is measuring the fuel that was in it at 15.1% ethanol. That could explain my recent drop in MPG. Just another way for the oil companies to cheat us out of a bit more cash. I will try some different brands over the next few fills and see if it stays the same.... My bike will not be happy about the extra ethanol.

 

What a great find...and a good post to us all. I also suspected that 'up to' was such a scam. Yeah right... Fly...on my Dodge Caravan (also Flex capability), I saw such an improvement when going to Shell Premium, from Shell Regular...that I am seriously kicking myself, that for all these years, I could have received the benefits, but simply, never even explored it with a tankful. I can't even take credit for doing Due Diligence on the subject. If it wasn't for a chap at work, raving about how good all his power and car, motor-home, riding lawn-mower, etc was running now, and can be started month to month with one pull...I still would be running with Regular and never knowing how much less MPG I was getting. It is a rip off, totally. It costs them practically nothing to slip in a 10-20 % volume into your 20 gallon gas tank...and literally, steal 20 percent of each dollar,of each gallon of fuel.

 

Put another way, if you pick up a Kraft (I know they all do....but I buy Kraft...so will speak on what I know as a fact...) can of granulated Parmesan Cheese, and read the label...and see the word Cellulite or Cellulose as a component...well folks...guess what? That Cellulite is a by product of WOOD! Yes...yep...cellulose and is in a treated edible form. What?!?!?!? Why would that be there? FILLER...you are buying modified for consumption....wood fiber, masquerading as Parmesan Cheese. They all do this...all rip us off.

 

Another consumer rip-off, like how gas companies and governments, rip you off on your fuel dollar by padding your gallon with 10-20 % crap Ethanol liqueur ....is coffee. In Canada, coffee manufacturers can add yep...modified wood products, (Cellulose) to your coffee can in a government-set amount...and GET AWAY WITH IT! They all use it as filler IF, they decide to add it......so are you getting that so called X-amount (ounces) of 100 percent pure, coffee in that can? Nope. Are you getting a discount for crap that is not coffee in that coffee can? Nope... The percentage of bulk/filler mind you is not very much...but that if it is there...you are being taken to the bank. Oh the joy of being a modern day, Consumer....

 

Back to fuel. You can at least with fuel, remove Ethanol from your tank...by seeking out a blend that does not contain a single drop. I wish I could do that also for my Parmesan Cheese. Simply...I can't! (Well..yes...if I buy a chunk and grind it myself...then yes, LOL) To be fair...only then. LOL!

Edited April 6, 2018 by YamahaParExcellence

[Condor]

Wanna see just how much ethanol in in gas. Take a look at this.