Worst luck...

[s.tyler58]

You guys showing off all your work on 83's is killing me this weekend. So, I got the clutch slave replaced, I've got the Helicoil installed to put the cover back over where the slave is and am waiting till Tuesday for the gasket to show up. Figured well I've got to bleed that clutch so I'll get started. The Allen wrench spun inside the hole of the second bolt on the lid after fitting and removing perfectly the first bolt on the lid. Took off and made two stops to get a good 5/64 drill bit and easy out. Drilled twice, not deep enough to get a grip. Drilled one more time, good nice deep enough hole to get the EZ out into and snapped the Cobalt drill bit off in the hole I drilled. Now I'm hosed. How do you drill with a Cobalt drill bit in the hole? Took out my quarter-inch bit, drilled the head off the bolt so I can get the lid off and now you see where I'm stuck. I'm clueless. Tried vice grips no luck. I guess I need to look for a clutch Reservoir or anybody want to make me an offer for an 83 with a whole lot of money stuck in it?

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[s.tyler58]

My neighbor is a mechanic thinks that if I can get that Reservoir off he can try to weld a nut onto the top of that Bolt and maybe get it out that way. I guess I better order a clutch master cylinder huh?

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[zagger]

Not bad luck - it's just old stuff. You will eventually be happy that you didn't ditch it.

I looked on ebay and found this one: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1983-83-Yamaha-Venture-XVZ1200-XVZ-1200-Left-clutch-master-cylinder-lever-perch/263443751565?hash=item3d5678a28d:g:JlcAAOSwmudaBdfj

Getting broken bits and taps out of a hole can be a real misery. I don't think that I have ever been successful. Broken drill bits and taps are pretty brittle and it seems like they continue shattering as you try to hang on and twist them out.

 

If the fluid level window is cracked into a million pieces (like your current one), I would suggest removing it and plugging the hole. I vaguely remember that a nickel fits pretty good. I used some kind of epoxy to hold it in place - something resistant to brake fluid. I just looked to see the coin denomination on my bike but I had squished epoxy over it. Sorry, I don't remember the epoxy I used, it has been a long time. Probably not the typical hardware store stuff that isn't resistant to anything. Looking through my shop inventory, I'd guess that I used an epoxy called PC-7. https://www.amazon.com/PC-Products-167779-Two-Part-Multipurpose/dp/B008H4QSAW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1519674954&sr=8-1&keywords=epoxy+pc7

Otherwise, this might be a good time to become friends with McMaster Carr - they have everything.

 

You might be due for a miracle but if not, you might want to consider starting over with a reservoir that doesn't have anything stuck in it! Don't give up just because of stupid little stuff like this.

zag

[SpencerPJ]

I agree with Zagger completely. You certainly can try the weld nut, some have fair success. Before you buy a used one, its not like that is under pressure, I'd put it together and make sure everything else is working. I would rig it with a radiator hose clamp, zip tie, or something temporary just to hold lid on and contain fluid. make sure the other repairs worked. You'll get it

[BlueSky]

I think every time I've ever tried to use an EZ out, it snapped off. Just replace the master cyl. Plenty of parts bikes out there. I bet a member has one in his garage. Maybe cowpuc? I did something similar with mine and bought another master cylinder from a member. Just irritating, not consequential.

[s.tyler58]

I agree with Zagger completely. You certainly can try the weld nut, some have fair success. Before you buy a used one, its not like that is under pressure, I'd put it together and make sure everything else is working. I would rig it with a radiator hose clamp, zip tie, or something temporary just to hold lid on and contain fluid. make sure the other repairs worked. You'll get it

I guess I can start pulling the old radiator off and put on the one Orlin sent me. I'm going to order one off eBay but they talk about it needing rebuilt so I want to order the rebuild kit but I have no way to hone anyting...

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[s.tyler58]

It's 59 degrees here in Omaha today which I think is just stressing me out about Springs going to get here before I'm ready... I am going to try that hose clamp thing and at least get my clutch slave filled up and the lines filled

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[WildBill1]

You guys showing off all your work on 83's is killing me this weekend. So, I got the clutch slave replaced, I've got the Helicoil installed to put the cover back over where the slave is and am waiting till Tuesday for the gasket to show up. Figured well I've got to bleed that clutch so I'll get started. The Allen wrench spun inside the hole of the second bolt on the lid after fitting and removing perfectly the first bolt on the lid. Took off and made two stops to get a good 5/64 drill bit and easy out. Drilled twice, not deep enough to get a grip. Drilled one more time, good nice deep enough hole to get the EZ out into and snapped the Cobalt drill bit off in the hole I drilled. Now I'm hosed. How do you drill with a Cobalt drill bit in the hole? Took out my quarter-inch bit, drilled the head off the bolt so I can get the lid off and now you see where I'm stuck. I'm clueless. Tried vice grips no luck. I guess I need to look for a clutch Reservoir or anybody want to make me an offer for an 83 with a whole lot of money stuck in it?

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180226/472bd48fe3de5ed740a9061192d74f26.jpg

 

Man, You got plenty to grab hold of there just heat a little with a propane pencil flame put a small pair of vise grips on it and hold your mouth right and screw it out.

[s.tyler58]

Man, You got plenty to grab hold of there just heat a little with a propane pencil flame put a small pair of vise grips on it and hold your mouth right and screw it out.

I had my ears "just so" but must have held my mouth wrong! I didn't think I could heat the body without heating the bolt but I'll give that a try.

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[BlueSky]

While you are thinking about it , keep spraying it with penetrating oil.

[7 lakes]

You might also try freezing it and then gently warming it the next day. Amazing how much aluminum moves with temp. I have a bike in the future project shed that had a head stud broken off from the PO`s impatient removal. After I unloaded it I backed the stud out with my fingers, apparently the result of the parts temp cycling in an unheated but dry shed for a couple years. I've had real good luck with breaking things free using temp cycling.

 

I would leave it in the freezer overnight and then gently warm the corner around the bolt while avoiding heating the bolt as much as possible.

 

Another approach is heat the entire thing, soak with penetrating oil, let cool, repeat until it breaks free or until you get tired of screwing with it and replace it.

 

Tim

[s.tyler58]

Man, You got plenty to grab hold of there just heat a little with a propane pencil flame put a small pair of vise grips on it and hold your mouth right and screw it out.

Isn't brake fluid flamable?

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[zagger]

Isn't brake fluid flamable?

 

Keep in mind that just below the reservoir is the cylinder with various little sliding seals that produce pressure when you pull the lever. Aluminum conducts heat very readily and as you attempt to heat one area, you are quite likely to overheat the little seals that aren't designed to take any heat. In my opinion, the effort to save your old junky reservoir probably isn't worth it. Of course, it could be an interesting life experiment which you wouldn't have if you simply got one that worked!

 

You will look back on all of this as a minor blip in your total rehab effort. Mine was as junked up as yours and I cannot remember much of anything about fixing it!

zag

 

Oh yeah, I forgot your question. The answer by checking on google:

Brake fluid does burn. DOT3, DOT4, and DOT5 all burn, and all about the same. It's not an explosive fast burn like gasoline, but a slower burn like vegetable oil, or a bit faster than candle wax.

Edited February 27, 2018 by zagger

[WildBill1]

Isn't brake fluid flamable?

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

 

Yes it is . Can't have your cake and eat too only the Trumps are lucky with that oh well forgot no politics here. Remove the brake fluid before heating and not a lot. Also, if you want to cool that stud quick give it a shot of brake Kleen solvent.

[cowpuc]

,, I always LOVED putting a whoopin on stuff like that Ty,,, giving it the old 1 - 2 punch and if it don't pan out - oh well,, bail and start from scratch!

 

At this point, if it was mine I would take my largest set of good vise grips, I would snap the jaws closed on those vise grips and then lay the face/nose of them on my bench grinder or belt sander and I would grind a really good flat surface on the face of the vise grip jaws. Keep in mind I am talking about the nose/face part - not the side of the jaws. I would then place this freshly manicured jaw nose against the face of the res body along the edge of the O.D. of the broken screw with the drill bit in it.. I would squeeze and adjust my vise grip setting as I squeezed while lightly pushing down on the vise grips to maintain a perfect contact with the res face while garenteeing I am getting max bite on the screw.. When the vise grips finally snapped closed I would twist slowly but firmly to the left (lefty loosey) while feeling for and watching for any slippage of the vise grips on the stud (as small as the screws are for that cover = probably break before slipping).. I would take extra special care to make sure the only motion that was happening while using the vise grip was rotational = no leaning/torqueing sideways - patience.. It'll come out... Its just had the ole brake fluid between steel and aluminum going on for a long time = sort of creates its own nightmare but it will come out..

Sound like fun or should I go do some digging and see if I can come up with a do over for you? I rebuilt the one on Tweeks a couple times so it could tag along with us on her 300k miles of fun and it was still working when Tweeks donated her carb bank heart to her sister - should be still totally functional as far as I know.. Another REALLY cool thing about these old 1st Gens that I have ALWAYS appreciated = it was like Mom Yam knew upfront that a wanna be biker wrench spinner like yours truly was gonna end up working on the thing - probably out in the of the desert or wayyyy up on a mountain when fixing something too - Murph being Murph and all that.. IMHO,, Mom Yam being like that shows up in places like the clutch master we are talking about = x2 10mm bolts and the clutch perch is free from the bars (not attached to the grip control unit like many many other bikes). 12 mm banjo releasing the clutch line and unplugging the clutch switch.. If memory serves me correctly,, not much to it. If this sounds like a direction you want to go just P.M. me a shipping address and I will do what I can A.S.A.P. so you can get out there and CTFW!!

Puc

[cowpuc]

Not bad luck - it's just old stuff. You will eventually be happy that you didn't ditch it.

Don't give up just because of stupid little stuff like this.

zag

 

[s.tyler58]

,, I always LOVED putting a whoopin on stuff like that Ty,,, giving it the old 1 - 2 punch and if it don't pan out - oh well,, bail and start from scratch!

 

At this point, if it was mine I would take my largest set of good vise grips, I would snap the jaws closed on those vise grips and then lay the face/nose of them on my bench grinder or belt sander and I would grind a really good flat surface on the face of the vise grip jaws. Keep in mind I am talking about the nose/face part - not the side of the jaws. I would then place this freshly manicured jaw nose against the face of the res body along the edge of the O.D. of the broken screw with the drill bit in it.. I would squeeze and adjust my vise grip setting as I squeezed while lightly pushing down on the vise grips to maintain a perfect contact with the res face while garenteeing I am getting max bite on the screw.. When the vise grips finally snapped closed I would twist slowly but firmly to the left (lefty loosey) while feeling for and watching for any slippage of the vise grips on the stud (as small as the screws are for that cover = probably break before slipping).. I would take extra special care to make sure the only motion that was happening while using the vise grip was rotational = no leaning/torqueing sideways - patience.. It'll come out... Its just had the ole brake fluid between steel and aluminum going on for a long time = sort of creates its own nightmare but it will come out..

Sound like fun or should I go do some digging and see if I can come up with a do over for you? I rebuilt the one on Tweeks a couple times so it could tag along with us on her 300k miles of fun and it was still working when Tweeks donated her carb bank heart to her sister - should be still totally functional as far as I know.. Another REALLY cool thing about these old 1st Gens that I have ALWAYS appreciated = it was like Mom Yam knew upfront that a wanna be biker wrench spinner like yours truly was gonna end up working on the thing - probably out in the of the desert or wayyyy up on a mountain when fixing something too - Murph being Murph and all that.. IMHO,, Mom Yam being like that shows up in places like the clutch master we are talking about = x2 10mm bolts and the clutch perch is free from the bars (not attached to the grip control unit like many many other bikes). 12 mm banjo releasing the clutch line and unplugging the clutch switch.. If memory serves me correctly,, not much to it. If this sounds like a direction you want to go just P.M. me a shipping address and I will do what I can A.S.A.P. so you can get out there and CTFW!!

Puc

I sent you a private message. But somehow it said it was from me to you, but it had your picture by my name and your picture by your name so I hope it's okay and gets to you. I have a pair of pointy vice grips that get right down tight to the surface I'm trying to unscrew out of. I think I just pinched the top of the bolt closed over the bit that stuck inside of it.

 

And then I see another guy with the new to him 83 that he just bought and I keep thinking, " they only made like 2200 of the 83's and we're going to run out of them before I get all the parts for mine!"

 

in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[Flyinfool]

I am both cheap and stubborn. Some times it is just the principal of the challenge at hand, sometimes it is worth it to spend more on the tools to fix it that what it would take to just buy a new one.

 

If the vice grips and PB Blaster do not work and you manage to break off the stud that is still showing, you can drill out a cobalt drill bit and the screw. To do so you will need preferably a milling machine but a drill press could work, forget trying to do it by hand held hole shooter. You will need to use a 3 flute solid carbide drill bit or center cutting end mill and lots of cutting oil. Do not break off the carbide in the hole. The only thing that can cut carbide is diamond. Or find someone that has access to an EDM machine which will cut/burn thru any metal that conducts electricity.

 

You can try heat on the master but take all of the rubber and plastic parts off first or they will melt. You have to completely disassemble it.

 

And when you are done having fun with new toys, then get a hold of @cowpuc and Tweeks.

[zagger]

Or you could just get a new one without a hardened steel thing stuck in the aluminum threaded hole.

zag

[7 lakes]

And then I see another guy with the new to him 83 that he just bought and I keep thinking, " they only made like 2200 of the 83's and we're going to run out of them before I get all the parts for mine!"

 

It can seem like that sometimes, but there are lots of parts out there for these things. One advantage is that the venture isn't the bike that is being bobbed or otherwise modded heavily as many other vintage bikes are, so bikes get parted out or sold on Craigslist instead of becoming "street trackers" or something. Another is that so many parts are shared between the first gens, and in some cases parts from the later years are upgraded. For instance, I run Venture auto cam chain adjusters in the XS100s because they're an upgraded unit and more reliable than the originals, and they're also easier to get cause the Ventures had two each and lots more bikes made.

 

Its just a matter of research and asking questions, and this is the right spot for it!

 

Tim

[s.tyler58]

I am both cheap and stubborn. Some times it is just the principal of the challenge at hand, sometimes it is worth it to spend more on the tools to fix it that what it would take to just buy a new one.

 

If the vice grips and PB Blaster do not work and you manage to break off the stud that is still showing, you can drill out a cobalt drill bit and the screw. To do so you will need preferably a milling machine but a drill press could work, forget trying to do it by hand held hole shooter. You will need to use a 3 flute solid carbide drill bit or center cutting end mill and lots of cutting oil. Do not break off the carbide in the hole. The only thing that can cut carbide is diamond. Or find someone that has access to an EDM machine which will cut/burn thru any metal that conducts electricity.

 

You can try heat on the master but take all of the rubber and plastic parts off first or they will melt. You have to completely disassemble it.

 

And when you are done having fun with new toys, then get a hold of @cowpuc and Tweeks.

One of my best friends is a tool maker. I just need to pull it off and walk over to his shop and he'll have it out in half an hour for me. He wouldn't let me leave until it was completely right. He likes to show off that way! All the brake fluid is gone, having drained out through the slave over the last few months. Flashpoint! Brake fluid has a lower flash point than gasoline. That's good knowledge to have thank you.

 

...in the Eternal scheme of things, this isn't even the blink of an eye.

[cowpuc]

THEIR COMIN BEANY:big-grin-emoticon:!!!!! Parts are on their way Ty!!! Sent em Priority USPS - should be there in a couple days

[bongobobny]

OMG, I totally forgot about Beanie and Cecil!!!

[cowpuc]

OMG, I totally forgot about Beanie and Cecil!!!

 

 

:scared:

 

 

:big-grin-emoticon::big-grin-emoticon:

[zagger]

Ok, I'm just impatient. Have you tried to get the thing out yet?

zag