Ever wonder why motorcycle insurance costs so much?

[baylensman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aq2ueILuU9Q&t=292s

[BlueSky]

I think some of those riders were using Cheng Shin tires, the ones with NO grip.

[Kretz]

Ya! Have to wonder why a bike suddenly loses grip for no apparent reason. Tires? Road surface? Spills? (though couldn't see any). Didn't think it was loss of control due to speed.

But some of those accidents you could see coming from a mile off. Riders looking in the wrong direction (or not looking at all), wrong positioning. Hopefully none of us will ever feature on a videolike that.

Just hope all came out of it with not too many injuries.

[MiCarl]

My reaction to a number of those was "how did it lose traction".

 

Then I thought about some of the tires I've seen come into my shop..... Had one guy wore the rear tire on his Gold Wing clear down to the air.

[cowpuc]

My reaction to a number of those was "how did it lose traction".

 

Then I thought about some of the tires I've seen come into my shop..... Had one guy wore the rear tire on his Gold Wing clear down to the air.

 

:sign yeah that::thumbsup:

 

and after you guys get that mystery solved take a shot at the following! I have watched this one numerous times and I am still lost for words and understanding of why the second bike went down... Just makes no sense...

 

Watch carefully starting at 1:17,, makes absolutely no sense..

[BlueSky]

:sign yeah that::thumbsup:

 

and after you guys get that mystery solved take a shot at the following! I have watched this one numerous times and I am still lost for words and understanding of why the second bike went down... Just makes no sense...

 

Watch carefully starting at 1:17,, makes absolutely no sense..

 

 

 

Yeah, I agree. It looks like he intentionally rode off the highway.

[Kretz]

Looks to me like #1 just got too close to the road edge & rolled over it. Seen that before, clip that corner too tight & you're in trouble!

If you look carefully, the second bike rider turns his head right, looking to see what happened & as we know you always look where you want to go... right? I think he looked right/ back & just went there. That's my take anyway.

[MiCarl]

He broke the number 1 rule. Instead of looking where he wanted to go he looked back at the other bike - turned toward it.

[snyper316]

:sign yeah that::thumbsup:

 

and after you guys get that mystery solved take a shot at the following! I have watched this one numerous times and I am still lost for words and understanding of why the second bike went down... Just makes no sense...

 

Watch carefully starting at 1:17,, makes absolutely no sense..

 

I see the biggest problem here is the Harley shakes rattles and rolls, so there for ended up in the ditch, had they been on anything other then a Harley they would have never drove into the ditch.... OK ok makes no sense but hella funny. But still think if they was riding a Venture it would have not even fased them...

[videoarizona]

Looks to me like #1 just got too close to the road edge & rolled over it. Seen that before, clip that corner too tight & you're in trouble!

If you look carefully, the second bike rider turns his head right, looking to see what happened & as we know you always look where you want to go... right? I think he looked right/ back & just went there. That's my take anyway.

 

:sign yeah that:

 

Totally agree. He was watching his buddy go down and he went right where he was looking...off the road. And with no shoulder to speak of, nothing to support his feet...down he went.

[Venturous Randy]

1st of all, that was a steep, sharp curve. Given that, the biggest problem was the 1st rider did not keep his speed up and appears to have bogged the bike down. As noted, the bike in front did appear to do the "go where you look" thing.

As far as bikes loosing traction in curves, I learned a long time ago to stay off painted lines, especially when they are wet.

Randy

[Kretz]

:sign yeah that::thumbsup:

 

and after you guys get that mystery solved take a shot at the following! I have watched this one numerous times and I am still lost for words and understanding of why the second bike went down... Just makes no sense...

 

Watch carefully starting at 1:17,, makes absolutely no sense..

 

There you go Puc, another of life's little mysteries solved for ya!

[stickhandle2]

:sign yeah that::thumbsup:

 

and after you guys get that mystery solved take a shot at the following! I have watched this one numerous times and I am still lost for words and understanding of why the second bike went down... Just makes no sense...

 

Watch carefully starting at 1:17,, makes absolutely no sense..

 

 

My take is both looked down the side and their bikes followed. First bike probably started out looking through the turn then as he entered the focus became on the side and looking down, his partner was ok then watched bike #1 go down and of course as mentioned bikes go where you look.

 

Mike

[cowpuc]

There you go Puc, another of life's little mysteries solved for ya!

 

I hear that Kretz but:big-grin-emoticon:, and not intentionally trying to come across like some kind of a , I dont buy into what's being sold here .. May as well pull a log up by the campfire, grab a hot dog cause,, you know me,, I gotta splain why I say that:Im not listening to..

As I mentioned when I posted that vid - I watched it over and over and could not, for the life of me understand the "why" when talking about that second bike and still hold that view. Reason? I actually thought about the whole "go where your looking" scenario too but, if ya go back and watch that vid in slow motion - it appears that the person steering the 2nd bike never took his eyes off the road in front of him = he did not turn his head and look at his friend who had gone down the hill so the idea that he was going where he was looking just dont fly.. Therefore, still makes no sense.

IMHO, if looked at closely it almost looks like he intentially drove his bike off the road to park his bike and go back to help his friend but was blind as to what was beyond the shoulder. After debunking my own similar thought about turning his head and going that direction, I also thought about sun glare blinding his ability to see the road in front of him but even that proves negative because the vid appears to have been taken on a cloudy day.

In the end, my theory is that what caused the 2nd bike to go down was that it was actually piloted by a very inexperienced rider whose lack of skill development may have been the actual cause for bike 1 to have gone down in the first place. Reason? It appears to me that bike 2 was crowding bike 1 in the corner by following to close and also dropping down the center of the lane they were riding in. I think when bike 2 dropped into the center to avoid the center line of the roadway, the guy on bike 1 caught bike 2's movement in his direction in his mirror and, for a split second, took his eyes off his "line" at a very crucial moment and ended up off the road (it's this very "split second" distraction stuff that old timers like me squawk about when talking about why these new touch screen things might not be healthy for a biker to have on his scoot).

As I mentioned, it does not appear that rider 2 actually did turn and look at rider 1 as he was headed off into oblivion but he did drive around bike 1 as it was heading for the ditch, causing rider 2 to momentarily go out of his chosen "line" across the apex of the corner via the centerline of the road which completely distracted him and forced him into an area of riding technique that he had probably not encountered before and he simply had no idea how to overcome this new obstacle (riding perpendicular across an off camber corner). His discomfort and confusion with this new encounter was so strong that it even forced him to forget to push down or pull in on a brake lever (he easily could have stopped) = one of those instantanious responsive "habits" that you hear some old time bikers talking about developing before a person adventures onto a public roadway.

In the end, I think the bottom line to this one may very well be as simple as rider 2 not having allowed enough space between him and the bike in front of him (rider 1) = a simple matter of tailgating? Or,, put another way,, attempting to ride side by side on twisties similar to The Tail of the Dragon is probably not a good idea

[videoarizona]

OK...I put the video into the edit system computer and did a frame by frame analysis. If the video had been better quality, I could have blown it up then posted the frame by frame results. But as it is, it's to grainy to really see anything at that blown up point.

 

I do believe @cowpuc is right. The 2nd rider "appears" to not be looking back but rather looking forward and to the right. Looks like he was looking for a place to pull over and deliberately moved off the road at an acute angle. At that point, the mystery remains. Why did he turn off at such a sharp angle? Did he not see the drop off from the pavement to the softer dirt? Did he think he could turn off then make a hard left and park parallel to the roadway? Was he thinking about hot dogs and not about his partner on the back?

 

That my edit system can't tell me. Sigh.

 

Once the scoot's weight was committed, the rest was history....

[Kretz]

well it looks then as though it will remain one of life's great mysteries, never to be solved.

And now we won't be able to sleep nights thinking about it!

[cowpuc]

OK...I put the video into the edit system computer and did a frame by frame analysis. If the video had been better quality, I could have blown it up then posted the frame by frame results. But as it is, it's to grainy to really see anything at that blown up point.

 

I do believe cowpuc is right. The 2nd rider "appears" to not be looking back but rather looking forward and to the right. Looks like he was looking for a place to pull over and deliberately moved off the road at an acute angle. At that point, the mystery remains. Why did he turn off at such a sharp angle? Did he not see the drop off from the pavement to the softer dirt? Did he think he could turn off then make a hard left and park parallel to the roadway? Was he thinking about hot dogs and not about his partner on the back?

 

That my edit system can't tell me. Sigh.

 

Once the scoot's weight was committed, the rest was history....

 

Now another point of interest IMHO.. Did anyone also notice that the rider of bike 2 actually demonstrates some pretty interesting slow riding skills.. I noticed that, in his entire movement thru the acute angle that Vaz is referring to, he never did drop his foot down = this is indicitive of someone who has aquired some form of slow riding skills as all of know = dropping a foot during any form of move like this is a no no unless you are coming to a complete stop AND, also notice no brake light = also indicating he had no intent on stopping on the roadway..

I use to do accident investigation for a food warehousing operation here in Muskegon.. It was only one of my many "hats" as Manager of Maintenance Services and, thankfully, we didnt have that many accidents in our truck fleet that I had to deal with but when we did - I LOVED taking the pics, drawing the diagrams and trying to figure out exactly what happened - strictly 100% non LEO and in house reporting for the firm but, non the less, still very interesting all in the interest of training drivers to survive out on the highways..

If this accident were something I would have been investigating back then one of the things I would be looking at from viewing this little vid is the line of site from the centerline of the rider 2's face shield to the external shoulder of the road he rode off from. I would look at things like whether or not he had leather pouches along the joint where his windshield meets the fairing and asking whether or not his field of vision may of somehow been blocked by such a thing = preventing him from being able to see where he was going..

Stuff like this dont mean a whole lot to most folks cause apparently no one was severly injured in this slow motion spill BUT - IMHO, that outcome was very very fortunate.. The rider (and especially the passenger) of the second scoot were actually playing with death because the crushing blow of 1000 pounds of motorcycle landing on a person(s) can take a life very easily.. Good reason for reviewing and learning from this stuff IMHO..

[cowpuc]

well it looks then as though it will remain one of life's great mysteries, never to be solved.

And now we won't be able to sleep nights thinking about it!

 

,, or,, we will all be able to sleep better because we are all thinking about and talking about becoming better riders by it!!!

[Cowboy270674]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aq2ueILuU9Q&t=292s

I know 2 reasons off hand stunt riding and not wearing a helmet even in states that allow that

 

Sent from my SM-G935W8 using Tapatalk

[BlueSky]

I think it's people riding beyond their skill level. Both of those Harleys that went off the road were piloted by riders who didn't have enough riding skills to be riding bikes that big on that curvy road.

[Flyinfool]

In looking at it closely slowed way down, when the 2 riders disappear around the curve they are well spaced, not rally tailgating. The as they come back into view, bike one already has his front wheel off the road and past the point of no return, but his rear wheel is still on the road and the bike is nearly pointed perpendicular to the road. Bike 2 has his right foot on the ground and not on the brake, and follows into the ditch. Due to bike one stopping in the middle of the blind curve everyone behind was hard on the brakes in a curve, which is not the best way to get through a curve. Bike 2 just never expected the stop and ended up to close to avoid bike one.

 

My theory is that bike one slowed to a near stop at the apex of the corner, bike 2 was not able to react fast enough and contact was made, that contact disrupted both bikes enough to end up in the ditch.

 

Hows that for a new twist and a WAG.