SilvrT Posted June 6, 2017 #1 Posted June 6, 2017 After reading the posts about the new venture and seeing so many stating they dislike belt drive, I'm curious to know what y'all think is wrong with them? And why do y'all think the shaft drive is better? Let's also hear from the PRO side of the fence too... (well at least this ain't an oil debate... )
CMCOFFEY Posted June 6, 2017 #2 Posted June 6, 2017 I have only had 1 belt driven bike (2006 Harley 1200R). I did not hate it but their was a slight lag to the power being out to the wheel. It felt almost like a sling shot at times. Shaft drive is much more instant with the power. Although I know it is possible to strip out gears, I just trust it more when I am fooling around; which I do often.
Mopar4ever Posted June 6, 2017 #3 Posted June 6, 2017 Absolutely nothing against belt drive here, in fact I like it. Like a chain without the drawbacks. JMHO
snyper316 Posted June 6, 2017 #4 Posted June 6, 2017 Drive it down a gravel road and you will find out real quick why people dont like them, I have helped many in the 2000s when there belt snapped... its not fun loading a big bike in the back of a truck specially the bigger custom one some guy had....
Mopar4ever Posted June 6, 2017 #5 Posted June 6, 2017 Drive it down a gravel road and you will find out real quick why people dont like them, I have helped many in the 2000s when there belt snapped... its not fun loading a big bike in the back of a truck specially the bigger custom one some guy had.... Maybe I'm just lucky, but ran a Kawi 454 for a year up in the north country, where I lived 40km from town on a gravel road. Had a hell of a time keeping tires on it, but not a single problem with the belt. Again, might just be lucky.
videoarizona Posted June 6, 2017 #6 Posted June 6, 2017 Drive it down a gravel road and you will find out real quick why people dont like them, I have helped many in the 2000s when there belt snapped... its not fun loading a big bike in the back of a truck specially the bigger custom one some guy had.... :sign yeah that:my friend with the HD Ultra wont ride down dirt roads..... Get a stone in the belt... You are toast. I have no problems with belt drive. I'm not taking a 900 pound beast out in the desert anyway.
snyper316 Posted June 6, 2017 #7 Posted June 6, 2017 :sign yeah that:my friend with the HD Ultra wont ride down dirt roads..... Get a stone in the belt... You are toast. I have no problems with belt drive. I'm not taking a 900 pound beast out in the desert anyway. Hell my question is will this 1/2 ton bike make it up a mountain and with belt drive, I know pucster wouldnt be able to take it where we can get our bikes, I know I wouldnt dare trying to take that bike to Joplin Falls...
camos Posted June 6, 2017 #8 Posted June 6, 2017 After reading the posts about the new venture and seeing so many stating they dislike belt drive, I'm curious to know what y'all think is wrong with them? And why do y'all think the shaft drive is better? Let's also hear from the PRO side of the fence too... (well at least this ain't an oil debate... )As has been mentioned, belt drives are vulnerable to damage although if they have adequate guards then that might not be a hugely immediate problem. Perhaps not such a problem for a bar hopper however, losing a belt in the middle of nowhere could be life threatening. Also, belt drives will not last for 10 to 30 years without replacement. Belt drives are inexpensive and should get the power to the road better than a shaft. There is less mass so more instantaneous power on the throttle and also less roll on off the throttle. Exactly what is needed in a sport bike, not so much in a touring bike. It's really a cheap out solution that is not particularly suitable for a real transcontinental touring bike.
Du-Rron Posted June 6, 2017 #9 Posted June 6, 2017 I like belt drives. Had a few. However... rock meet belt... Up to $1000 for repair. Rock meet shaft drive. Shaft drive says, "huh, what did you say?" Tenere has a shaft drive for a reason. Mega tour bikes should have shaft drive for same reason.
Yammer Dan Posted June 6, 2017 #10 Posted June 6, 2017 Here in West by God we go up Dirt roads cross creeks go thru mud holes and I'll keep my SHAFT!!!
videoarizona Posted June 6, 2017 #11 Posted June 6, 2017 Interesting article on comparing drives. I replaced the rear tire on my VStar 95Tourer last month. The belt was easy to get to. Hoping the new Venture is designed same way. There is no reason the rear end has to come apart just to replace a belt!
CaseyJ955 Posted June 6, 2017 #12 Posted June 6, 2017 Interesting article on comparing drives. I replaced the rear tire on my VStar 95Tourer last month. The belt was easy to get to. Hoping the new Venture is designed same way. There is no reason the rear end has to come apart just to replace a belt!. Because a belt has no master link, on some bikes lots of disassembly is required to R&R it. As a counterpoint A shaft drive would zap power the bike probably cant afford to loose and the weight of a pumpkin, shaft and housing would add weight this bike cant afford to gain. IMHO a belt was the sensible option for this machine, based on what we know so far.
Flyinfool Posted June 6, 2017 #13 Posted June 6, 2017 It depends on what materials the belt is made from. Kevlar is a popular belt reinforcement. Kevlar has some interesting properties. It grows when it gets cold. So if you get out west and drive from the desert to a high elevation where it is cold, could the belt loosen enough to slip? One slip and the belt is toast. Or if you go from a mountain to deep hot valley will the belt tighten up enough to bind the bearings. The weak link on most timing belts is the teeth. How will ti take a sudden application of torque, like when you take off quick from a stop light, and the back tire slips a bit as it is crossing the wide white paint line and then just as suddenly 18 inches later, hits good pavement again. will that shock load rip the teeth off of the belt?
videoarizona Posted June 6, 2017 #15 Posted June 6, 2017 It depends on what materials the belt is made from. Kevlar is a popular belt reinforcement. Kevlar has some interesting properties. It grows when it gets cold. So if you get out west and drive from the desert to a high elevation where it is cold, could the belt loosen enough to slip? One slip and the belt is toast. Or if you go from a mountain to deep hot valley will the belt tighten up enough to bind the bearings. The weak link on most timing belts is the teeth. How will ti take a sudden application of torque, like when you take off quick from a stop light, and the back tire slips a bit as it is crossing the wide white paint line and then just as suddenly 18 inches later, hits good pavement again. will that shock load rip the teeth off of the belt? Had that happen to me on VStar.. At full throttle. No problems with belt.
SilvrT Posted June 6, 2017 Author #16 Posted June 6, 2017 Drive it down a gravel road and you will find out real quick why people dont like them, Get a stone in the belt... You are toast. In the case of the new Venture, note that the belt has guards on it to prevent that from happening.
BigLenny Posted June 6, 2017 #17 Posted June 6, 2017 One of the first places i went to last night after the announcement was the Victory owners site theVOG.net. These are people who ride belt drive, air cooled v-twins all over the nation, and don't think twice about it. As stated on the post above, these folks are crazy excited on what they saw from Yamaha yesterday. They will buy it and not think twice about it not being a V4, or water cooled. This is the market Yamaha wants/needs to pull buyers from to stay in the full dresser market. If they had went the other way (V4, shaft drive, water cooled), they would be trying to pull buyers from Goldwing, BMW K1600GTL, and other assorted sport tour bikes. They simply aren't going to pull very many of those folks. And, the market isn't very large with those bikes. When I go on vacation, and I went on one again this past March to Key West, the ratio, and I'm not over estimating this at all, of v-twin, air cooled, belt drive full dresser touring bikes on the road is easily over 80% of the bikes I see. And, I think really the percentage is higher. And, the vast majority of those are Harleys. Then the remaining 20% is made up of Goldwings, and other non v-twin bikes. It appears Yamaha believes, and I think I agree with them, that they must tap into the huge V-Twin market to stay alive in the full dresser touring market. So, what Yamaha has created is a beautiful bike that has a honkin, high quality, torque filled V-Twin to appeal to the vast V-Twin market, but they also designed the bike to look a tad more futuristic, which might just draw a few folks from the Wing, and the K1600GTL. We'll see. Having said all of that, I too wish it was a V4, water cooled, shaft drive beast. But, I'm beginning to start to understand why they did it.
Rick Haywood Posted June 6, 2017 #18 Posted June 6, 2017 I am guessing one dvantage at least for me is the Belt Drive won't lock up your back wheel if it breaks.
snyper316 Posted June 6, 2017 #19 Posted June 6, 2017 I am guessing one dvantage at least for me is the Belt Drive won't lock up your back wheel if it breaks. You have a point.... Because our drives literally have no where to go if they break. Sent from my LG-K371 using Tapatalk
SilvrT Posted June 6, 2017 Author #20 Posted June 6, 2017 One of the first places i went to last night after the announcement was the Victory owners site theVOG.net. These are people who ride belt drive, air cooled v-twins all over the nation, and don't think twice about it. As stated on the post above, these folks are crazy excited on what they saw from Yamaha yesterday. They will buy it and not think twice about it not being a V4, or water cooled. This is the market Yamaha wants/needs to pull buyers from to stay in the full dresser market. If they had went the other way (V4, shaft drive, water cooled), they would be trying to pull buyers from Goldwing, BMW K1600GTL, and other assorted sport tour bikes. They simply aren't going to pull very many of those folks. And, the market isn't very large with those bikes. When I go on vacation, and I went on one again this past March to Key West, the ratio, and I'm not over estimating this at all, of v-twin, air cooled, belt drive full dresser touring bikes on the road is easily over 80% of the bikes I see. And, I think really the percentage is higher. And, the vast majority of those are Harleys. Then the remaining 20% is made up of Goldwings, and other non v-twin bikes. It appears Yamaha believes, and I think I agree with them, that they must tap into the huge V-Twin market to stay alive in the full dresser touring market. So, what Yamaha has created is a beautiful bike that has a honkin, high quality, torque filled V-Twin to appeal to the vast V-Twin market, but they also designed the bike to look a tad more futuristic, which might just draw a few folks from the Wing, and the K1600GTL. We'll see. You're so right about that! Practically every where one goes, what do you see most of? Harleys! From my perspective the new Venture has all the things I prefer. If they went with the V-max motor then it would be much heavier as well as top heavy which adversely affects low speed handling IMO. The only thing that would prevent me from buying one is if it had poor low speed handling. I doubt it would since it has a low center of gravity and low seat height. As for engine heat, ya, when it's above 85 degrees you notice it but primarily in stop and go traffic but at least with the Victory, once I removed the CATs and had it dyno'd, the heat wasn't all that bad. Once you're in temps hovering around 100+ it's hard to tell if the heat is from the engine, the pavement, or just the air. Just standing on a corner and it's friggin HOT! It will be interesting to read what new owners/riders have to say about "engine heat" ...
CaseyJ955 Posted June 6, 2017 #21 Posted June 6, 2017 950lb bike ....shaft drive best option for a touring bike...VMax 4 cylinder motor Touring bikes often go several hundred miles in a day in all weather and are running for hours....liquid cooled is best....VMax liquid cooled motor As for the horsepower lost by a shaft....simple solution....throw more horsepower at it. VMax motor even slightly de-tuned would drive a 950lb bike. It is interesting reading on some of the other forums. Victory people say this is what Victory should have put out - fix all the issues they've had. That is people who have driven nothing but a v-twin. As a fellow rider who has had the "bells and whistles" of a bike made for touring (RSV) there were only a few things they needed to do for a true third gen. Guess you don't miss what you never had. I think you and I are on the same page. It should have V4 and shaft drive. I figured the motor would be retuned for more voluptuous lpw end torque, better MPG (the gen2 Vmax gets pretty ****ty mpg too) and still have robust satisfying midrange poke (rather than not even having a midrange) and of course double that minivan-esque redline. It eludes me. My comment about belt drive being the correct choice was with consideration that the rest of the bike is what it is. Honestly I would have no real issues with this bike if Yamaha were more transparent about even the most basic info during development and they shoulld have never called it a Venture, or even hinted at it. As a now former Yamaha customer I resent the hell out of that. Why did it have to be a big secret grand unveiling, we're all.grown ups, not children on Xmas morning. ****ing talk to your customers Yamaha, no more secrecy and games. Just tell us whats happening, we're grown men and women and we can handle it. Dicks. Im not sure why Im ranting at them, they sure didnt listen before and I dont think tbey are going to start now. On the other hand whoever here buys one, still love ya bro/sis.
RSTDdog Posted June 6, 2017 #22 Posted June 6, 2017 I think belts are fine. The New Venture has belt drive because it is based significantly on the Stratoliner greatly reducing tooling costs by using parts already in the bin. Its also lighter cheaper and pretty darn reliable. You can see the difference in retail price between air cooled Vtwin belt drive and Liquid cooled V4 Shaft Drive. Simply go to yamaha's website, click on the new Venture, hit the compare to link (you can pick up to two), add the Vmax from 2013 and Stratoliner from 2013 (or whatever the last year was). The difference in MSRP for those bikes (Strat and Vmax) which are essentially similar featurewise except for power plant and final drive(Warrior is probably a better comp) will explain why the Vmax motor and shaft drive are not in the new Venture.
djh3 Posted June 7, 2017 #23 Posted June 7, 2017 I dont dirt track my 800#+ bike so rocks in the belt not likely. Squeaks yea, adjustment keep longevity. Just like changing the gear oil. Pros and cons both ways I guess. I dont have a problem with either one, you just have to know what your getting in for. Shaft has a bit of clunk and slack like in turns when not under power, my belt dont seem to have that issue. I do find it odd the 3rd gen is not water cooled. I would have thought emissions would have driven it that way to get head temps up for emissions. I wonder how hot them cats/exhaust will get. Thats the biggie on the XCT. I have discon the O2 sensors on mine and it seems to help a bit.
N3FOL Posted June 7, 2017 #24 Posted June 7, 2017 One of the things I don't like about a Belt Driven motorcycle is the fear of having a belt break while I am hundreds of miles away from home in the middle of the night. I do a lot of night riding as well, so I want to have the peace of mind that my bike will not break down in the late nights and early morning hours. I also don't like replacing a belt drive....I heard it is not the easiest task to do as a DIY. With that said, I am very happy with my '07 knowing that I have a shaft driven bike and a proven motorbike. I may have to wait awhile until new owners of the transcontinental motorbike put out their likes and dislikes about the bike in the long term.
Kirby Posted June 7, 2017 #25 Posted June 7, 2017 Haha , I'm thinking I should order the plastic parts and make my 09 RSV into a 2017 Star Venture. Only got 97,000 miles on the old gal and she'll still do over a 100 corrected mph in 4th gear. I like the looks and the features of the new bike, but they never should have named it a Venture with the v-twin engine. Just my 2 cents worth.
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