New Star Venture

[snyper316]

So it isn't the motor we were hoping for. Other than not having a liquid cooled V4 and shaft drive....it is still going to be a good bike and IS called a Venture. Early reports are that it is heads and tails above the Harley and other brands touring bikes.

 

New members that buy the new model are going to be confused if they read all these posts and think they aren't getting a good bike. We need to welcome them here because this is VentureRider.org and the bike (name) is "Venture" and is meant for touring.

 

I agree that Yamaha should have come back with a liquid cooled V4 and shaft drive. I have an 8 cylinder Mustang GT and frankly half the cylinders (with Eco boost or even 6 cylinders) wouldn't make me want to buy one. BUT they are still called a Mustang and the new Venture does come with that heritage of a full decked out touring bike. It is what it is and we won't see Yamaha change it now. They didn't ask current owners of Gen I/II Ventures who would have started the wish list with a V4....but they talked to VTwin owners that ride Harleys who only know twins.

 

Going back to the Mustang....ask someone who has only ever driven a 4 banger if the Mustang needs 8 cylinders and they would probably say it doesn't. Ask anyone that has driven a V8 and they'd laugh at the idea of a 4 banger in a sporty car. It'd be like buying a computer with half the memory....or being forced to drink decaf coffee instead of regular caffeinated coffee. Or "diet" soda instead of regular.

 

LOL - I'm sure the people here saying the new Venture should have had a V4 remember when Coke came out with the "New" Coke and changed the recipe. It was called Coke....but it wasn't Coke. And unlike Coke drinkers at the time, we aren't a big enough group to get the old Venture back.

I would edit this down but I will point out I would have asked for a 6 cyl configuration.[emoji23] [emoji23] I also would have settled for a V-4

 

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[bongobobny]

NOT MY VENTURE... :crying:

[MikeWa]

If Yamaha wants to take customer base from Harley they still have a long ways to go. They need a much larger dealer network. They need to give service priority to transit riders with problems on the road. They need to have parts and service available nation wide and beyond. There are also many intangibles with Harley ownership. It is more than just 'want to be'. So I question the wisdom of throwing away your customer base to chase one you don't have the resources to win.

 

Mike

[WildBill1]

If you want a new Venture it is what it is that said,, l'm sticking with what I got. I went with the Polaris Indian when they came out that was a mistake. May look for a low mileage Gen 2 trike latter on in life say at 80 plus or so just turned 70 and still enjoy carving the twisties with the best of them.

[cowpuc]

One of the few things that the Star Techy's out at Sturgis were open and clear about was the top end and crank assembly of this new one, it does in fact share components with the Strat/Roadliner/Raider motor - there is a vid floating around here of the cutaway new motor showing its internal components if you wanna see whats going on in there..

That said,, and something else that has been tickling my "why did mom yam do that" button is the sales history of the 113 (and all Metric and domestic V-Twins other than HD for that matter). Like everyone else,, Mom Yam has been chasing the HD market for years,, with LOTS alarming lack of success.. While I REALLY like that great big beautiful 113 inch Strat motor = it never did sell worth a hoot and (at least in the mid west) had an extremely poor resale value.. Fact is,, I have passed up more very nice $3500 dollar 113 inch Strat motor scoots thru the years than I care to mention.. They just didnt work around here.. Also,, thinking back on the days when those machines sat on the Show Room floors,, the dealerships had a VERY hard time getting rid of left overs of all models even though they were 1/2 price (or less in some cases) of a comparable HD model - while the HD models were, at the time,, moving out the doors of HD dealerships like penny candy from a neighborhood candy store... The stuff just did not sell!! Now,, lets talk resale on comparable model years of the V-Max - those puppies have at least held their own on the open market,, even the most ardent HD rider will tell you that as far as Muscle Bikes go - the mighty V-Max stands tall as THE benchmark and,, even in these soft market days - they are one of the scoots that has solid footing = V-4's are bad to the bone,,, I still druel when thinking what could have been done with this new Venture,,,,, getting side tracked again...

When I toss that transparency over the fact that Polaris just closed their Victory production (those were air/oil cooled, big twin scoots = 106 inch) because,, get this,, they simply did not sell (they are STILL sitting in warehouses with left over Polaris Indians waiting for new owners) and,, get this,,, those Victories had a sell point at much less than comparable HD models too - they simply could not shake the HD folks free from the HD tree..

Now, both Polaris with their air cooled Indian repop and Mom Yam with her air cooled Venture repop are going toe to toe with HD again only this time they are doing it with MSRP numbers too??? What in the wild wild world of motorcycling history is happening out there - has the whole place gone nuts?

[cowpuc]

If Yamaha wants to take customer base from Harley they still have a long ways to go. They need a much larger dealer network. They need to give service priority to transit riders with problems on the road. They need to have parts and service available nation wide and beyond. There are also many intangibles with Harley ownership. It is more than just 'want to be'. So I question the wisdom of throwing away your customer base to chase one you don't have the resources to win.

 

Mike

 

HEAR HEAR = EXACTLY MIKE!! Its almost like Mom Yam wants to proactively pursue HD but does not want to lose the small market it already has with us V-4 Venture riders or V-Max riders,, a sort of having their cake and eating it too so to speak - all IMHO of course..

It's interesting if a person pays special attention to the video found in the thread about "Mom Yam firing back" = found here: http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?131825-Yamaha-fires-back-on-why-they-didn-t-use-the-vmax-v4-engine

 

One may notice that at the beginning of this attempt at justifying why they did not use the mighty V-4 and shaft drive in the new one, Mom Yam openly promotes its extensive high RPM/high horse history with the saying "Yamaha Rev's The Heart" and then again,, right at the very end they clearly fall back on that same iconic notion.. Way cool and totally TRUE but any one who watches the video and/or who has actually ridden one of these new ones OR any push rod V-Twin equipped motorcycle has to ask himself,, what in the world are they thinking? What has "revving" got to do with anything herein,,, Mom Yam - you may not realize it but you done threw allllll that sell point out with the baby in the wash = ,,, IMHO of course....

[CaseyJ955]

Customer base is a good point, as a former HD owner I guess I could see tbe appeal of tbe big twin but I never felt it, if that makes sense. My first ride on a warmed up KZ with the 4-1 pipe completely removed my ability to enjoy a narrow Angle twin. So here is another thought, a more toury version of the FJR, its not a V4 but its a stonkin' mill using current technology. Sort of like the difference between a KGT and KGTL. Ergos and wind protection more like a traditional Venture without major changes to the whole platform. Sort of performance of a sport tourer and ergos more remisicent of a purpose built tour bike. I know I'm going way off but a more toury version of the FJR would pacify. Sometimes I just like to bang it off the rev limiter in every gear and feeling the tear jerking acceleration, that ability to pull hard from 80mph while 2up and loaded. My inner child demands it!

 

Sorry about going way off, but an FJR (or my other bike crush, the Connie) with a variant pushed more into touring from sport touring would make me shut my mouth and open my checkbook. Ive had many bikes but this gen1 is easily the most comfy, and even in its obsolescence performs admirably well. I guess I'm just amusing myself (and maybe only myself) with speculation of how Yamaha can make it right with those of us that were disappointed in the 3rd gen spec sheet.

 

Maybe they are working on something as we speak, I hadn't thought of that...

[cowpuc]

Customer base is a good point, as a former HD owner I guess I could see tbe appeal of tbe big twin but I never felt it, if that makes sense. My first ride on a warmed up KZ with the 4-1 pipe completely removed my ability to enjoy a narrow Angle twin. So here is another thought, a more toury version of the FJR, its not a V4 but its a stonkin' mill using current technology. Sort of like the difference between a KGT and KGTL. Ergos and wind protection more like a traditional Venture without major changes to the whole platform. Sort of performance of a sport tourer and ergos more remisicent of a purpose built tour bike. I know I'm going way off but a more toury version of the FJR would pacify. Sometimes I just like to bang it off the rev limiter in every gear and feeling the tear jerking acceleration, that ability to pull hard from 80mph while 2up and loaded. My inner child demands it!

 

Sorry about going way off, but an FJR (or my other bike crush, the Connie) with a variant pushed more into touring from sport touring would make me shut my mouth and open my checkbook. Ive had many bikes but this gen1 is easily the most comfy, and even in its obsolescence performs admirably well. I guess I'm just amusing myself (and maybe only myself) with speculation of how Yamaha can make it right with those of us that were disappointed in the 3rd gen spec sheet.

 

Maybe they are working on something as we speak, I hadn't thought of that...

 

I hear ya Case but,, an this is just the opinion of a beat up ol V-4 Yamaha guy,,, its not there for me... I was totally sold out on and in total line for (both emotionally and financially) the new Venture that was gonna turn the touring world upside down.. Its really hard to explain but,,, I sat there in the front row seat at Americade with over a million miles under my belt on the 1st Gens, our 6th 83 having carried us faithfully to the big unveiling, an echo in my mind of KNOWING first hand what those folks at Yamaha were capable of and - having waited many years for this moment just to be completely caught off guard.

Nahh,,, I think I am gonna just finish out my days aboard the ol has been,, enjoying CTFW at my wifes rev limited 100 mph out there in Gods country on those far off places where 135 degree tarmac is normal and where air cooled scoots fear to actually tour... When it comes time to really really need to go faster or pull harder than a beat up ol 74 inch 1st Gen V-4 can do it - gonna lay across the back of my teeny motored 60 inch R1 and watch the world disappear..

On the same token though,,, I still got a little bucketlisting going on,,, if the charm and of Maggie the R1 does slow up some,,, ya may see a 1700cc V-Max in my garage next to our 1st Gen

[cowpuc]

 

My rant aside I do want buyers of the new bike to feel welcome, this debate doesnt change the welcoming of new brothers and sisters, the debate is only about the machines and not the buyers.

 

+1

ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON!!!

 

and us folks with the faster 1st Gens PROMISE not to pick on ya'll like we have done and do with the slower 2nd Gen owners,,,, = NOT!!

[BlueSky]

When I owned an 83 750 Yamaha Virago, I decided that I didn't like vibrating underpowered V-twins. Make mine a smooth, powerful, high revving 4 or 6. I too like that rush of power when it is winding out. I was an avid hot rodder back in my day and still have the need for speed!

[vzuden]

I bought my new 2012 Venture in the fall of 2014. Not sure if this indicative of the second gen sales across the country but with a new bike sitting on the showroom floor for 2 years is it possible that it had some bearing in Yamaha thinking they had to make a radical change? I still would have preferred a water cooled V-4 in this new bike but maybe those who are not happy with the change could have spoken with their wallets before 2013 when Yamaha stopped building them?

[Brew]

I bought my new 2012 Venture in the fall of 2014. Not sure if this indicative of the second gen sales across the country but with a new bike sitting on the showroom floor for 2 years is it possible that it had some bearing in Yamaha thinking they had to make a radical change? I still would have preferred a water cooled V-4 in this new bike but maybe those who are not happy with the change could have spoken with their wallets before 2013 when Yamaha stopped building them?

 

Don't mean to hijack this thread and I will be test riding the new Venture when the dealer nearby sends me an e-mail of it's arrival but how does the Passenger feel on the back of your 2012? There is one nearby me with 6k on the clock going for $9500.00 and if my wife is happy, you know what they say. Right now I have my 15 FJR that I will keep that is fine for 2 to 300 mile days with her on the back but we want to take longer trips and have more storage available. Had an 08 Goldwing that we really liked but needed to make some changes to the suspension and windshield and she still was buffeted around on the back. She said she felt too far away as well.

Recently test drove a 16 HD RGU and the wind protection was very good, she felt closer to me which she liked but I didn't like my position on the bike. Test drove a 17 HD EGC had a nice power plant (a lot smoother than the 16), I liked my position much better but my head took a beating and she felt battered around a bit on the back.

[cowpuc]

Don't mean to hijack this thread and I will be test riding the new Venture when the dealer nearby sends me an e-mail of it's arrival but how does the Passenger feel on the back of your 2012? There is one nearby me with 6k on the clock going for $9500.00 and if my wife is happy, you know what they say. Right now I have my 15 FJR that I will keep that is fine for 2 to 300 mile days with her on the back but we want to take longer trips and have more storage available. Had an 08 Goldwing that we really liked but needed to make some changes to the suspension and windshield and she still was buffeted around on the back. She said she felt too far away as well.

Recently test drove a 16 HD RGU and the wind protection was very good, she felt closer to me which she liked but I didn't like my position on the bike. Test drove a 17 HD EGC had a nice power plant (a lot smoother than the 16), I liked my position much better but my head took a beating and she felt battered around a bit on the back.

 

I am positive that Zudey will have some important info on this too but I wonder if our member @videoarizona may also have some helpful info pertaining to your question.. He and I have spoke at considerable length about the 2nd Gens and available windshields and wind buffeting there of.. It will be interesting for my wife and I to hear what these experienced riders have to say concerning the question(s) you propose.. Hopefully several of our other experienced 2nd Gen riders will also chime in as "the more the merrier" usually applies quite nicely when considering gathering info about the purchase of a new scoot!! Hope this helps Brew and WELCOME to VR!!

y

[vzuden]

My previous ride was the Royal Star Tour Deluxe and although almost the same bike as the Venture there are a few differences. One of which is the seating. My wife didn't like the RSTD because she sat too low or I was too high. When I switched to the Venture she was thrilled after the first ride. Her position is higher now resulting in a better view of our surroundings. The seats are softer also.

Wind buffetting isn't an issue but I have changed the windshield and did so prior to her first ride. I have the Bagger Shield and use it in the upright position when riding two up.

[videoarizona]

I am positive that Zudey will have some important info on this too but I wonder if our member videoarizona may also have some helpful info pertaining to your question.. He and I have spoke at considerable length about the 2nd Gens and available windshields and wind buffeting there of.. It will be interesting for my wife and I to hear what these experienced riders have to say concerning the question(s) you propose.. Hopefully several of our other experienced 2nd Gen riders will also chime in as "the more the merrier" usually applies quite nicely when considering gathering info about the purchase of a new scoot!! Hope this helps Brew and WELCOME to VR!!

y

 

 

Yep...for sure the original windshield on the 2nd gen was not comfortable for my better half. She had a headache from buffeting after an hour in the saddle. We both wear full gear all the time (if that makes any difference).

 

The addition of the widest, tallest Clearview with vent solved most of her issues with the 2nd gen. She still misses the adjustable backrest of the 1st gen. Even with the 2nd Gen tour pack moved back, she isn't as comfortable on the 2nd gen as she is on the 1st gen. I carry a round pillow just in case she wants more support for her back.

Hope this helps...

[vzuden]

Oh, yea, Brew. I almost forgot, moving the trunk back was something I did before she rode the first time. It wasn't that she needed the extra room to fit but more of a case of sitting slightly back from original. It is easy to do and she will gain a couple of inches. A backrest for the rider with a pouch on the back is pretty valuable also so she has a place for her phone and sunglasses. We use UClear communicators (Full face/modular helmets) so we can converse easily and listen to music/navigation/phone calls independent of the other also.

[Du-Rron]

100 of the 3rd Gen Ventures have been allocated to Canada and the dealer has had one inquiry on ordering one now.

 

One Hundred!?!?!? have been allocated for Canada?!?!? Ohhhhh.... Harley must be really shaking in their boots over the new Venture. Harley makes this many bikes in a day...

[CaseyJ955]

One Hundred!?!?!? have been allocated for Canada?!?!? Ohhhhh.... Harley must be really shaking in their boots over the new Venture. Harley makes this many bikes in a day...

 

They did promise to turn the touring world upside down, and you doubted them! Betcha feel silly now, huh?

[BlueSky]

I bought my new 2012 Venture in the fall of 2014. Not sure if this indicative of the second gen sales across the country but with a new bike sitting on the showroom floor for 2 years is it possible that it had some bearing in Yamaha thinking they had to make a radical change? I still would have preferred a water cooled V-4 in this new bike but maybe those who are not happy with the change could have spoken with their wallets before 2013 when Yamaha stopped building them?

 

Most of us aren't really in the market for a new $25k motorcycle. BUT, if the new Venture had a 1700cc V4, I might get in the market. An air cooled V-twin makes that a 0% possibility. My wife has encouraged me to sell my two old bikes and get a newer more reliable bike, so the spouse has given me permission. Buying a new bike or a new car/truck is an emotional decision, not a necessity.

 

Yamaha makes business decisions based on their best information and I make personal decisions when it comes to buying vehicles. No meeting of the minds this time.

[CaseyJ955]

Most of us aren't really in the market for a new $25k motorcycle. BUT, if the new Venture had a 1700cc V4, I might get in the market. An air cooled V-twin makes that a 0% possibility. My wife has encouraged me to sell my two old bikes and get a newer more reliable bike, so the spouse has given me permission. Buying a new bike or a new car/truck is an emotional decision, not a necessity.

 

Yamaha makes business decisions based on their best information and I make personal decisions when it comes to buyi

 

I was not in the market for a new bike of any kind, I have my money tied up in other things right now, BUT I was moving some things around, checking to see if I could swing a new Venture if they did it right, had a test ride hooked me there was a fair chance I would have purchased. In this regard I was relieved that they stuck an aircooled twin in it because that put me right at 0% chance too. My wife is amazing but I do not accept spousal input regarding vehicle purchases or sales. The ONLY one to blame for me not buying a badass new Venture is Yamaha for not making one. Its fortunate because it would be tricky to justify on paper while im searching for a home further from the city. When it comes to bikes emotions usually prevail, which runs counter to how I have learned to make decisions.

[Bextreme]

I do like it. Shame on v4 but I'm ok with air cooled. No more plumbing issues.

Like the combined braking with abs, standard heated seats, low ride height, forward and reverse power assist for parking, traction control, riding modes, integrated audio system, voice, touch screen or handle bar controls for audio, controls, winds protection adjustable, advanced throttle, all electronic no more cruise cables or throttle cables, six speed, belt drive, same length as RSV but heavier. Also really like the huge alternator... Over 700 watts!

 

All in all I think they did a good job!!!

 

I demoed one and fell in love [emoji7] may get one in the spring

 

 

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[Bextreme]

Well Doc said take two bottles and call me in the morning. So I am out yo, I guess I would have to test drive this but Seriously Belt Drive..... the yamaha touring bike will never be the same, However the shaft has been the show stopper for Trike Conversions, But I would have to cut alot of weight to even attempt one of those. If they have Cat converters that would be the first thing to go, however if its computer monitored that may be more trouble then its worth.

 

Everyone talks about belt drive like it's a bad thing. Belts are quite less weight and deliver more power to the ground. I demoed one and loved it. Probably be my next bike.

 

 

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[Bextreme]

One of the first places i went to last night after the announcement was the Victory owners site theVOG.net. These are people who ride belt drive, air cooled v-twins all over the nation, and don't think twice about it. As stated on the post above, these folks are crazy excited on what they saw from Yamaha yesterday. They will buy it and not think twice about it not being a V4, or water cooled. This is the market Yamaha wants/needs to pull buyers from to stay in the full dresser market.

 

If they had went the other way (V4, shaft drive, water cooled), they would be trying to pull buyers from Goldwing, BMW K1600GTL, and other assorted sport tour bikes. They simply aren't going to pull very many of those folks. And, the market isn't very large with those bikes.

 

When I go on vacation, and I went on one again this past March to Key West, the ratio, and I'm not over estimating this at all, of v-twin, air cooled, belt drive full dresser touring bikes on the road is easily over 80% of the bikes I see. And, I think really the percentage is higher. And, the vast majority of those are Harleys. Then the remaining 20% is made up of Goldwings, and other non v-twin bikes. It appears Yamaha believes, and I think I agree with them, that they must tap into the huge V-Twin market to stay alive in the full dresser touring market.

 

So, what Yamaha has created is a beautiful bike that has a honkin, high quality, torque filled V-Twin to appeal to the vast V-Twin market, but they also designed the bike to look a tad more futuristic, which might just draw a few folks from the Wing, and the K1600GTL. We'll see.

 

Having said all of that, I too wish it was a V4, water cooled, shaft drive beast. But, I'm beginning to start to understand why they did it.

 

You hit the nail on the head [emoji41]

 

 

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[BlueSky]

I bought my new 2012 Venture in the fall of 2014. Not sure if this indicative of the second gen sales across the country but with a new bike sitting on the showroom floor for 2 years is it possible that it had some bearing in Yamaha thinking they had to make a radical change? I still would have preferred a water cooled V-4 in this new bike but maybe those who are not happy with the change could have spoken with their wallets before 2013 when Yamaha stopped building them?

 

Yeah, and Yamaha could have at least updated the bike with fuel injection and maybe updated the cassette player over the 14 years of production. They wouldn't spend a nickel on it updating it to get a larger market share. How many expensive bikes were on the market in 2013 that still had carburetors?

[cowpuc]

Everyone talks about belt drive like it's a bad thing. Belts are quite less weight and deliver more power to the ground. I demoed one and loved it. Probably be my next bike.

 

 

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Regardless of all the healthy and fun about what Mom Yam coulda, shoulda, oughta did or didnt do ( remembering our club is a motorcycle club where most of us LOVE yakkin bikes) = you pick up one of these gorgeous new ones and show up to a club event = ANY OF THEM, and I guarentee you and your new scoot will be the center of attention = hope your not the shy type:backinmyday:!!

Also,, PLEASE keep us all informed if you do so and please,, pretty please,,, dont forget the 's,, lots and lots of 's...