Price of things - Canada vs USA - Rant

[cowpuc]

WOWZY WOW WOW WOW - what an absolutely ironic thing to come home to after spending a couple weeks completely out of it,, medically - just amazing,,, almost like we're connected as a real family here or something....... First post after all the drama - feeling pretty good so I think I'll make er a good long one seems how we're on a subject that Tip n I are learning LOTS about..

 

So,, it all started years ago when we got married.. She was a school teacher, decided we didnt wanna stick our youngens into the travesty that was happening in our public schools in the area (not a pretty picture). Her being a teacher (and, HOKEY SPAMOKEY what a good one) we decided she would stay home and teach our children.. She never returned to "work" - taught em all the way thru high school - leaving me as sole provider.. Now,, think about that,, out of those $$'s of sole provision came not only costs associated with raising 4 kids but - also the costs of paying for a local school system that my kids never attended - a time when home schooling was majorly taboo (things have changed HUGELY in Home Schooling acceptance).

Sound like I am whining? I am NOT.. I am actually still thanking God that I was able to raise my kids during a day and age when wages for skilled trades people were SMOKIN and jobs were so plentiful that a decently skilled skilled trades person could walk off a job in the morning and be working the new one that after noon.. Money was plentiful so the pangs of raising our kids our way was majorly lessened.. Done got blessed..

When I finished my non-traditional College Education at 39 years old I walked into Mid Management like I owned the world. 5 years later walked into upper Management in a large manufacturing setting - AMAZING sign on, very nice salary and 100% health/dental for family paid by company along with complete college reimbursement for all of us.. GREAT job!! Done got blessed...

Kids got older, I got restless with time of life running out on dream of turning my lifelong deep passion for bikes and Business ownership of bike shop - played with my own business, grew to self sustaining and stepped out.. Did really well UNTIL the dreadful day I broke my back and landed in a wheel chair paralysed from waist down. 5 major surgerys piecing it back together - HUGE expenses even though we carried great insurance (just the titanium in there was 52 grand) set us back BUT it taught us something = how necessary Health Insurance was.. Got blessed again - little over year in a body cast, lots of therapy and look at me gooo!!

All this rambling on is for a reason,, stick with me,, its comin.. Kids grew up, got minds of their own,, flew da coup and all that,, xtra cash starts to grow even though = yep,, our Health Care costs grew like everyones.. Those numbers Freebird shared are good figures for self employed people who want to carry decent insurance - just about spot on.. Yep,, ya can get cheaper BUT - keep in mind - those deductibles really add up fast if something happens,, like it has for us these last couple years..

Brain surgery, Heart Surgery and this most recent Cancer business was,,, WOWZY WOW WOW WOW expensive!! Even at 5 grand deductible - toss in a few xtras like a spouse having a Gall Bladder removed and maybe a few Crowns on teeth (opps,, dont forget,, NONE of these policies cover dental - WOW were we spoiled back in those Skilled Trades/Management days) and a yearly outpay of 17,800 BESIDES those monthly premiums of 2160.00 is not unrealistic..

Sound like I'm whining - I'm not,, matter of fact,,, I consider myself one EXTREMELY blessed person cause guess what - if your dead and dont get to play with the new Grand Kid or ride the scoot cross country with you best friend no more - that money dont do ya no good... Dont tell those Insurance Companies but I would of cashed in my retirement plans - sold da house and even our new MK1 to have them remove that 80 Centimeter tumor that was doubling in size every 90 days and all those other parts n pieces to add these days onto my life if thats what it would have taken - I like living.. Do the same for Tip - even quicker..

I know it's hijackin but starting to feel a little more like myself tonight - gonna go ahead and step off into normal hijack land .. Wanna hear something really interesting I just found out about? It's dealing with old people stuff so you youngens may wanna go back to your working on your scoots .. Like Don,, I am 62 also.. These last couple years of medical nonsense have really knocked the wind out of my sails,, a little - can still dance and eat Hot Dogs and .. Been thinking of taking the early S.S. and been doing a LOT of diggin and figuring.. May sound nuts to some who arent there yet but the way that works is ya get a little more than half of what you get at 65 if ya opt for 62 - may not be smart but I tell ya,, ya start having multiple close calls and it sure makes ya think that even a half a retirement would be better than none if ya died... Problem is,,, ya cant get onto the "free Health Insurance" that we paid for all our lifes until 65 around here... BUT - for me,, I would end up with somewhere around 1100 bucks and that would be nice to hand to the Health Insurance people. Kids were here from Cali a while back (thankfully they came BEFORE this last bug Tip n I got caught by - WOW were we sick) - had the big family pow wow about it all - getting papers drawn up and all that stuff,, just in case - something to think about folks.. Suggestion came up to yak with my Cancer doctor and Family Doctor about it for family estate planning purposes.. Here is where it REALLY gets interesting..

Cancer Doc tells me to hold on a bit - apparently if my "numbers" show certain things - he can sign a paper and BINGO - instant FULL RETIREMENT $$$'s with FULL MEDICAL (Medicare?).. So I got thinkin,, see how things can work,, one minute I not only gotta suffer thru income losses because I flat out dont feel good and it aint "Business as usual" NO HOW NO WAY, plus I gotta pay out over 2 grand a month to avoid REAL financial catastrophie and BINGO,, all of a sudden - it appears we may end up with 2 grand extra a month coming in plus no longer having to pay out the 2160 for Heath Insurance cause I get to have the Insurance Company (Medicare) paying me back some of those premiums I been paying all my life = thats 4160 a month retirement income :big-grin-emoticon: Of course,, gotta deduct Tips Health Insurance still but,,,,, WOWZY - its amazing how much things can change from one moment to the next = that's important - if ya dont remember anything else from all these ramblins - remember that

Okay,, back to Silv's thread - Silv,, I leave you with this profound thought - it comes from Kevin Costner in the movie - Water World = "nothins free in Water World".. And then here is one I just made up - "even it Kevins point were not true, it wouldnt be worth anything cause life, material items, freedom and liberty are only valuable if ya earn em anyway"..

The End

 

Been missing you lop eared varmints

Puc

[Air Ready Auto]

I leave you with this profound thought - it comes from Kevin Costner in the movie - Water World = "nothins free in Water World".. And then here is one I just made up - "even it Kevins point were not true, it wouldnt be worth anything cause life, material items, freedom and liberty are only valuable if ya earn em anyway"..

The End

 

Been missing you lop eared varmints

Puc

 

 

:clap2:

[slowrollwv]

Yes the 1217 that I quoted was for the insurance from where I work but that would end when I turn 65 in July this year. I will go on Medicare with a part B supplement it will cost me $156 a month. That is not too bad from what the quotes that I was given from other company's but still leaves the wife with out any insurance. The only thing we can do at this time is get Obamacare for her as where she works does not have insurance for there employees. Since the only thing she gets from that company is a pay check she is going to retire in November of this year and tell them to stick it up there cazoo.

[Sailor]

I have some experience with medical costs here in Canada. Being retired ( the boss pronounces it "retard") we pay our own medical which comes to about $1800.00 (CDN) per year for the both of us. For prescriptions we pay the first $ 600.00 for the year then we pay 1/3 and the plan pays the rest. We are not covered for glasses, hearing aids or dental. Although I got silicone lens replacements in both eyes and 2/3 of that was covered. Anything the plan does not pay for I take off our income tax. A few years ago I developed cancer and was not expected to make it. A year of treatments-drugs,injections ( at $1400,00 a pop) and daily radiation for 7 weeks cost me nothing. I broke my ankle a couple years ago- ambulance, surgery, three days in hospital cost me nothing. I just had a full knee replacement which cost me nothing. I think the taxes we pay on both sides of the border are reasonably close, the difference is in where the money goes.

There is an investigative tv show we have here which is called " Marketplace". They investigate ripoffs etc. They investigated why there is such a difference in prices between the US and Canada. For example, pocketbooks are $3.00 to $4.00 more in Canada than the US. They went to various manufacturers and shipping companies in the US and found the reason for cost differential was that the attitude of the manufacturers was that " They are Canadian, they are used to paying a higher price so we charge them more." Transportation and taxes had little to do with it.

Dairy prices here are far higher and that is due to the quota system imposed by the government which is intended to keep prices higher so farmers make more.

When I worked at Vancouver airport we would get truckloads of shirts from California and ship them by air ( the most expensive way to ship) across Canada. A week later there would be a sale on those shirts. Vancouver $ 30.00, Toronto $ 25.00 Montreal $ 20.00. This was just the stores ripping people out west off. It was the same with radios etc from Japan.

The government set tariffs which make it more expensive to ship from west to east than from east to west. This gives the eastern manufacturers a bigger profit.

[snyper316]

1998 I paids $38 a month for insurance, Blue Cross Blue Shield, see a Dr $10.00 prescrips 5.00. Dental copay depended what you had done never had to pay for cleanings. Eye Dr 100% paid. Good ol Days. It was probably more because TTI it was some deal we only paid a fraction of the cost, Too long ago to remember. Hard to believe that was 20 yrs ago almost. After reading @cowpuc post I kind of chuckled because step dad did take early Retirment. I am thinking if he had known he probably gotten full retirement, his biggest issue tho he didn't have insurance and seen these sliding scale doctors. Not nearly what you have going on but, I am thinking he could have due to several factors in his health altho he will never admit it.

[SilvrT]

. Been thinking of taking the early S.S. and been doing a LOT of diggin and figuring.. May sound nuts to some who arent there yet but the way that works is ya get a little more than half of what you get at 65 if ya opt for 62 - may not be smart but I tell ya,, ya start having multiple close calls and it sure makes ya think that even a half a retirement would be better than none if ya died... Problem is,,, ya cant get onto the "free Health Insurance" that we paid for all our lifes until 65 around here... BUT - for me,, I would end up with somewhere around 1100 bucks and that would be nice to hand to the Health Insurance people.

 

In Canada we have CPP (Canada Pension Plan) & OAS (Old Age Security). A person can start getting CPP at age 60 but I believe it's 30% less than what you get at age 65. OAS automatically kicks in (assuming you apply for it beforehand) at age 65.

 

Both Nina & I started receiving CPP around age 62 or 3 (the % drop is less than at age 60) and at age 65 we started receiving OAS.

 

Having this extra income has allowed us to put extra money away for retirement, buy our 2013 Victory new and pay for it within 2 years, pay off my ex in a divorce settlement, maintain zero balances on our credit cards, and purchase our mobile home which, as of today, is paid for. Granted, we had to kick in some money from our incomes but a lot of these things would not have been possible without that extra money.

 

Life is short. One never knows when their time is gonna be up. Like puc says .... better to have some than none. Enjoy life while your living has always been my motto !!

 

I think about my ex's parents who lived a very simple life, never buying more than what was absolutely necessary, living in the same house they more or less grew up in, saving every penny they could. When they retired nothing much changed except they went to Reno a few times. By the age of 72 they had both passed on. They spent their whole life basically "without living it" only to leave everything they scrimped and saved to their 2 kids. It's ok to do that but IMO it's not ok to deprive one's self of a fulfilling life in the process.

[Kretz]

Ha! I applied for OAS in March 2016, I still don't have my OAS!

I was told in August last year when I called that "it can take up to 35 weeks for a decision to be made!" That took me to January this year. Now when I call I get the usual "we are experiencing higher than normal call volumes" I have managed to get through 3 times now (hanging on for up to an hour!) & each I time get the similar response.

"Your file has been flagged with your query, call again in 10 working days & we should be able to tell you more!" My last call I got told "there probably won't be any change & I'll then refer your case to a supervisor".

I was told the first time I contacted them that there is a HUGE backlog in BC, so "you have to keep phoning... It's the squeaky wheel that gets oiled!"

[SilvrT]

Ha! I applied for OAS in March 2016, I still don't have my OAS!

I was told in August last year when I called that "it can take up to 35 weeks for a decision to be made!" That took me to January this year. Now when I call I get the usual "we are experiencing higher than normal call volumes" I have managed to get through 3 times now (hanging on for up to an hour!) & each I time get the similar response.

"Your file has been flagged with your query, call again in 10 working days & we should be able to tell you more!" My last call I got told "there probably won't be any change & I'll then refer your case to a supervisor".

I was told the first time I contacted them that there is a HUGE backlog in BC, so "you have to keep phoning... It's the squeaky wheel that gets oiled!"

 

That SUX! Typical guvmint B/S

 

Did you go through Service Canada or direct to whoever deals with OAS?

[camos]

Ha! I applied for OAS in March 2016, I still don't have my OAS!

I was told in August last year when I called that "it can take up to 35 weeks for a decision to be made!" That took me to January this year. Now when I call I get the usual "we are experiencing higher than normal call volumes" I have managed to get through 3 times now (hanging on for up to an hour!) & each I time get the similar response.

"Your file has been flagged with your query, call again in 10 working days & we should be able to tell you more!" My last call I got told "there probably won't be any change & I'll then refer your case to a supervisor".

I was told the first time I contacted them that there is a HUGE backlog in BC, so "you have to keep phoning... It's the squeaky wheel that gets oiled!"

What's the reason for calling about an application for CPP? I applied when I was 60 and all it took was filling out an application, no phone call necessary. Here are the application details, nowhere does it say anything about calling.

 

Can't remember the details exactly but I opted for 60 because I would have to live longer than 80 (about) for there to be any financial benefit to waiting. I did not at the time and still do not expect to make it to 80. In any case, the amount received is so low that it will only pay for the taxes on my house and the insurance for my vehicle. That is not close enough to actually "live" on so I get to work until I die. That at least allows me live a decent life and not just at a subsistence level so it ended up being good choice. Of course the fly in the ointment is that I live to 100 in which case I'll be buggered.

[SilvrT]

What's the reason for calling about an application for CPP?

 

he's talking about OAS, not CPP and he hasn't received it yet when he should have.

[Condor]

SlowRollWV said 1217 per month for his wife and him. I recently checked on insurance for my wife and I. We are not high income and the fact is, unless your income is low enough that you qualify for some type of subsidy, your income really isn't a factor. The quote that I got for my wife and I, $5,000 deductible, came to just over $2,000.00 per month. That is a primary reason that I'm still working. I am 62 now and will have to wait until I'm 65 before I am eligible for Medicare. Along with that I will need some type of Medicare Supplement insurance to cover what needs to be covered but it will be much less than $2000.00 per month but still more than you pay.

 

You're right where my wife and I were 13 years ago, only I was self employed.. I had to file early retirement just to pay the.. at the time... $975 per month premium to my HMO. It was great when we hit 65 and medicare kicked in. A $1500 swing in our cash flow. See you have something to look forward too.... :-)

[videoarizona]

[quote=cowpuc;Like Don,, I am 62 also.. These last couple years of medical nonsense have really knocked the wind out of my sails,, a little - can still dance and eat Hot Dogs and .. Been thinking of taking the early S.S. and been doing a LOT of diggin and figuring.. May sound nuts to some who arent there yet but the way that works is ya get a little more than half of what you get at 65 if ya opt for 62 - may not be smart but I tell ya,, ya start having multiple close calls and it sure makes ya think that even a half a retirement would be better than none if ya died...

Puc

 

 

Puc, I took early retirement at 62. To supplement my self-employment income. I wanted more play money! My accountant suggested I "do the Math". IE... Look at my realistic life expectancy, figure out how much I would get total if I lived to that age...taking retirement at 65 and at 62. It made more economic sense for me to start early as my family history suggests I won't make it out to 86...which is where my 2 figures (65 vs 62) meet each other. If I make it to 82...I will get more of my money back taking it early, even though I get less per month than if I waited to 65.

 

So suggest you do the math. Chart out the "what ifs" of when you may leave this earth and see what works best for you. Yes, it's a guess...but no more so than the insurance companies "guess" that they call their actuary tables. At least my guess takes in my family history!!

 

FWIW,

david

[Sailor]

I took my company pension at 59. It cost me a 2% reduction in pay but it is indexed to the cost of living so I have gained far more. I took the CPP at 60 which reduced my monthly payments but they increased once I made 70. I have the OAP which I got at 65. All I had to do was go online and apply a couple months in advance.

[Midrsv]

Puc, I took early retirement at 62. To supplement my self-employment income. I wanted more play money! My accountant suggested I "do the Math". IE... Look at my realistic life expectancy, figure out how much I would get total if I lived to that age...taking retirement at 65 and at 62. It made more economic sense for me to start early as my family history suggests I won't make it out to 86...which is where my 2 figures (65 vs 62) meet each other. If I make it to 82...I will get more of my money back taking it early, even though I get less per month than if I waited to 65.

 

So suggest you do the math. Chart out the "what ifs" of when you may leave this earth and see what works best for you. Yes, it's a guess...but no more so than the insurance companies "guess" that they call their actuary tables. At least my guess takes in my family history!!

 

FWIW,

david

 

I agree with you David. I took SS at 62 also. For me, the break even point was 79 1/2 based on total dollars collected from SS. The kicker for me was that if I delayed until 65 or 66 I would likely have to pull from savings so that money couldn't continue to grow.

[videoarizona]

cowpuc said: >

 

 

Something else to consider in the long run. Check with your estate person, but I do believe that after you leave this world to go FTFW in the skyways above, Tip can collect a portion of your SS for the rest of her life. I think she has to reach either 62 or 65 to qualify but maybe not. You've been married long enough for that provision to kick in. Of course, if her SS income is higher than part of yours.,...then no. But if her share of yours is higher than hers...it would be a good thing to have!!

Just another positive thing to think about!

 

Yea...sorry...guess this discussion is a hijacking of the thread. Good discussion, though!

Edited April 20, 2017 by videoarizona
dang

[SilvrT]

 

Yea...sorry...guess this discussion is a hijacking of the thread. Good discussion, though!

 

heh ... we've been on this topic so much I forgot what the original topic was about!

[camos]

he's talking about OAS, not CPP and he hasn't received it yet when he should have.

Oops, missed that. It is still just an application form to be filled out.

 

If the application has already been filed I would be inclined to go to a Services Canada office and get it sorted out in person. No one should rely on the pathetic civil service to get anything accomplished without the pressure of face to face interaction.

[Kretz]

Oops, missed that. It is still just an application form to be filled out.

 

If the application has already been filed I would be inclined to go to a Services Canada office and get it sorted out in person. No one should rely on the pathetic civil service to get anything accomplished without the pressure of face to face interaction.

 

Believe me Camos I'm not dumb & have chased this as much as I can..... I filled in the forms & sent them off a YEAR AGO, I have also been to a local Service Canada office & they can give me no more information than the Service Canada people I am talking to already! I'm told there is a terrific backlog in BC! Ya think?

I got through today to be told there is no further "update" on my file since my last call, (last week) & that my case will now be referred to a supervisor who should respond within 24 hours BUT at the same time I am told these calls are also way behind & that a supervisor probably will NOT call me so I can phone again on Monday for an update! It's absolutely ludicrous, tomorrow I am going to see my MP's local office about the whole stupid business!

[camos]

Believe me Camos I'm not dumb & have chased this as much as I can..... I filled in the forms & sent them off a YEAR AGO, I have also been to a local Service Canada office & they can give me no more information than the Service Canada people I am talking to already! I'm told there is a terrific backlog in BC! Ya think? It's absolutely ludicrous, tomorrow I am going to see my MP's local office about the whole stupid business!

Didn't mean to imply you were deficient in any way. Sorry if it came across that way.

 

Good idea about contacting your MP, a year backlog is ridiculous. Situations like this shouldn't happen, ever. Too many lazy fat assed sniveling servants that can't be fired because of the power of the guvmint unions.

 

It's not as if the guvmint didn't have access to a person's age and know when they should be applying for OAS. Almost everyone should be hooked into Services Canada through the CRA (taxman for our southern neighbours) so the form could be autofilled and validated with no real input required. Course there is so much deadwood in their IT department that they can't hardly imagine how a computer can automate data, never mind know how to accomplish it.

 

OK, that was a rant just to keep this on topic.

[SilvrT]

@Kretz ... fill out and submit another application today, then do another one tomorrow, then again the day after that, and on and on .... that should get you some action! LOL

[Kretz]

Didn't mean to imply you were deficient in any way. Sorry if it came across that way.

 

Good idea about contacting your MP, a year backlog is ridiculous. Situations like this shouldn't happen, ever. Too many lazy fat assed sniveling servants that can't be fired because of the power of the guvmint unions.

 

It's not as if the guvmint didn't have access to a person's age and know when they should be applying for OAS. Almost everyone should be hooked into Services Canada through the CRA (taxman for our southern neighbours) so the form could be autofilled and validated with no real input required. Course there is so much deadwood in their IT department that they can't hardly imagine how a computer can automate data, never mind know how to accomplish it.

 

OK, that was a rant just to keep this on topic.

 

Kretz ... fill out and submit another application today, then do another one tomorrow, then again the day after that, and on and on .... that should get you some action! LOL

 

Not at all Camos! No need to apologise! I was just trying to say that I really feel I have done all I can, next move is my MP can't think of what else to do... Each time I contact them, they raise a query BUT the people who are supposed to respond to the "front line" just don't! The front line phone people will tell me each time I call what they are doing but at the same time tell me that their request will probably NOT result in a response! I have also been told that if I keep "pestering" things will eventually move forward!

& you are correct they have ALL this information in umpteen places, but we are required to provide it all again & again ad nauseum.

 

Good one SilvrT... Maybe I'll do that! But it's bad enough chasing one application... don't want to confuse these beggars do we?

BTW the original post was your complaint about the cost of your mirrors... How do we get so off topic? Sorry probably my fault! LOL

[SilvrT]

 

Good one SilvrT... Maybe I'll do that! But it's bad enough chasing one application... don't want to confuse these beggars do we?

 

Confuse them? How can you confuse someone who is already confused?

 

BTW the original post was your complaint about the cost of your mirrors... How do we get so off topic? Sorry probably my fault! LOL

 

Ya, it's all your fault!

[Kretz]

Confuse them? How can you confuse someone who is already confused?

 

 

 

Ya, it's all your fault!

 

 

Ya! I got broad shoulders, I can take the blame! lol

Well I went & spoke with my MP's staff, they were astounded that it's taken so long. So it's now in their hands... bet they don't have to wait in a telephone Q! MP's office inquiries are (I'm informed) directed straight to a named individual who has to respond within a given time or provide a damn good reason why they haven't. So I may get some response soon!

[SilvrT]

ya! I got broad shoulders, i can take the blame! Lol

Well i went & spoke with my mp's staff, they were astounded that it's taken so long. So it's now in their hands... Bet they don't have to wait in a telephone q! Mp's office inquiries are (i'm informed) directed straight to a named individual who has to respond within a given time or provide a damn good reason why they haven't. So i may get some response soon!

 

awesome!

[cowpuc]

Puc, I took early retirement at 62. To supplement my self-employment income. I wanted more play money! My accountant suggested I "do the Math". IE... Look at my realistic life expectancy, figure out how much I would get total if I lived to that age...taking retirement at 65 and at 62. It made more economic sense for me to start early as my family history suggests I won't make it out to 86...which is where my 2 figures (65 vs 62) meet each other. If I make it to 82...I will get more of my money back taking it early, even though I get less per month than if I waited to 65.

 

So suggest you do the math. Chart out the "what ifs" of when you may leave this earth and see what works best for you. Yes, it's a guess...but no more so than the insurance companies "guess" that they call their actuary tables. At least my guess takes in my family history!!

 

FWIW,

david

 

Tracking with ya brother!! What you are describing is basically what got me started on the whole thought of taking the early out.. Lots of figuring and things to take into account for sure.. We were in the process of getting it all sorted out, we are also real close to our children and included them in a lot of the and over it all in dealing with that of which you speak.. Was looking like we had it all hammered out until the Cancer Doc (discussing with him the whole thing of answering that timeless question of when am i gonna hit the endless touring on streets of gold) came back with - "dont do nothing till ya hear from me about approving you for full bennies... Yet another hair pin turn in the adventure of sorting it all out..

 

cowpuc said: >

 

 

Something else to consider in the long run. Check with your estate person, but I do believe that after you leave this world to go FTFW in the skyways above, Tip can collect a portion of your SS for the rest of her life. I think she has to reach either 62 or 65 to qualify but maybe not. You've been married long enough for that provision to kick in. Of course, if her SS income is higher than part of yours.,...then no. But if her share of yours is higher than hers...it would be a good thing to have!!

Just another positive thing to think about!

 

Yea...sorry...guess this discussion is a hijacking of the thread. Good discussion, though!

 

My understanding is you are right on target brother!!!! Apparently, because Tip does have a "work" history (anybody reading this, PLEASE understand that I am talking about "income producing" work here - as far as actual WORK goes - Tip as a stay at home mom, raising 4 kids and educating them as their k-12 school teacher worked 100x harder then I ever did in ANY of my WORK settings - she's a keeper that lady!!,,, plus - when I came home from work I got to PLAY with those kids - I became known as the "party parent" and she had to suck it up as the "party pooper parent" ) that does make her eligible for a small SS income - the SS people will pay her that (full amount at 65 or lesser at 62 just like anyone else) BUT - now get this,, because we are married - she somehow gets a boost in her net SS draw to bring her up to what sounds like 1/2 of my amount. This is outside of the death benefit thing you are talking about if I understand it all correctly David..

All that said,,, if this deal that the Cancer Doc is working on comes thru (truthfully, I hope it doesnt cause I somehow get the impression that if it does it somehow indicates they - those Cancer people - see stuff happening that's not real nice) - I will automatically go to full SS,, then we will almost for sure wait for Tip to draw at 65...

Soooo,, David,,, let me ask ya another quick question since Silv is being so gracious about all of hijackin this thread anyway... When you went thru this decision making stuff - did it seem,, weird,, like,, hey - wait a minute here - I just turned 20 yesterday,, didnt I:confused24: