snyper316 Posted January 7, 2017 #1 Posted January 7, 2017 Ok so this week I have been doing alot of Tinkering thought I would put some Led Bulbs in Signals and Brake Lights. However when I did a search on why the Blinkers would not blink at all. I did searches on this and have gotten very confused, Ha like that takes much but all the same. I was impressed by how ugly the turn signals looked with white LED's Needless to say I found my mistake there. So before I go tackle this Endeavor I wondered if someone has post somewhere that I did not find about installing the LED's with maybe some Pictures of how it was done or maybe even point me in the right direction. I want to do it right that way there is no question. I noticed something else which I am not sure if it was coming from the speaker or the brake handle but when I would press the break handle I heard a faint Humm kind of like a slight squeal. I also noticed with the lights all on with just the key I had no voltage drop what so ever. I had also seen where you guys have replaced dash lights with Led's. I just want my turn signals to work. Also has anyone put a Led Headlight in the First Gen's. I remember seeing a picture of a First Gen with Projector lights in the front but around here those Projector bulbs are a big no no. I need to see the sides of the roads!!!
Flyinfool Posted January 7, 2017 #2 Posted January 7, 2017 Using the correct LEDs is a big part of getting it to work. 1. The LED color needs to be the color of the lens and/or the needed color output. In other words a yellow LED for the turn signals. a red LED for the brake / tail lights. 2. There are some cheap LEDs that claim to be 1157 replacements but will not work in our application. I received a set for testing from another member that could not get them to work. After a bit of testing I determined that our turn signals ground the hot lead when the turn signal is in the off part of the flash. The LEDs were wired internally so that it would end up shorting the running lights to ground during the signal off cycle. I also noticed that the cheap LEDs were less than half the brightness of the good ones. I replaced all of the lights except headlights and fog lights (those are all HID) with LEDs all from http://www.SuperBrightLEDs.com. I could not be happier with the end result. I did do a write up on what I did, I will find that thread for you.
Flyinfool Posted January 7, 2017 #3 Posted January 7, 2017 Found it http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?77042-MORE-lights.
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #4 Posted January 8, 2017 Yep Mr led snowpercharger lmao I did find post about you being the guru on this. I found these load resistors but it said for fast flash... Hopefully when I get ready to do this I won't have a migraine because I can't think all my brain is mushy Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
bongobobny Posted January 8, 2017 #5 Posted January 8, 2017 For the turn signals, you have to use load resistors on the bulbs so that the circuit draws enough current to make the flasher relay work. The load resistors are applied from the hot wire of the turn signal bulb to ground... You can install a different flasher that will work with LEDs, but you will lose your automatic canceling feature.
CaseyJ955 Posted January 8, 2017 #6 Posted January 8, 2017 Im not familiar with the Venture blinker circuit but is there a solid state flasher option to replace the deliciously vintage bimetallic strip style flasher? I went through this on a couple other vehicles not wanting to use the resistors.
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #7 Posted January 8, 2017 You can install a different flasher that will work with LEDs, but you will lose your automatic canceling feature. That feature works when it wants to, the last 2 weeks is the first time in 1 yr or better since it last worked June of 2015. I ended up taken the springs out of my switch to allow me to slide it over when I need to turn. I was thinking I had read somewhere that there was no need to splice into the wires. So I guess a known good LED flasher would be preferred. I am guessing any flasher will work on our bikes? I had also read somewhere else that I would have to run LED's all the time or burn the flasher or LED bulb up. I read quite a few threads but most appeared to be on 2nd Gens, Also the other thing I was finding was the LED's were flashing too fast. Mine I would turn them on and they would go to bright and stay. So I either splice into lines or pull the front off to get to the flashers and just replace it. I ordered the cables from yamagrl so I will have to do that anyways so I will be trying again next weekend while the rain/sleet/ice/snow is a flying. Hopefully @Flyinfool can get his adjusting done on his machine, So I can test yamagrls handy work and I can find out just how much brighter the lights will be. Might even check into getting the headlight upgraded. Just not sure if there will be enough room behind the headlight for the heat sink.
Flyinfool Posted January 8, 2017 #8 Posted January 8, 2017 That feature works when it wants to, the last 2 weeks is the first time in 1 yr or better since it last worked June of 2015. I ended up taken the springs out of my switch to allow me to slide it over when I need to turn. I was thinking I had read somewhere that there was no need to splice into the wires. So I guess a known good LED flasher would be preferred. I am guessing any flasher will work on our bikes? I had also read somewhere else that I would have to run LED's all the time or burn the flasher or LED bulb up. I read quite a few threads but most appeared to be on 2nd Gens, Also the other thing I was finding was the LED's were flashing too fast. Mine I would turn them on and they would go to bright and stay. So I either splice into lines or pull the front off to get to the flashers and just replace it. I ordered the cables from yamagrl so I will have to do that anyways so I will be trying again next weekend while the rain/sleet/ice/snow is a flying. Hopefully Flyinfool can get his adjusting done on his machine, So I can test yamagrls handy work and I can find out just how much brighter the lights will be. Might even check into getting the headlight upgraded. Just not sure if there will be enough room behind the headlight for the heat sink. There are some flashers that are made specifically for LED, those are the ones that may burn up if used with the higher current draw of incandescent. There is noting you can do in the flasher that will burn up the LEDs. All they know is that they are getting 12-14 volts and can not tell nore care where the power comes from. You can mix and match incandescent and LED. Once upon a time I was working on a LED friendly flasher that would retain the stock features of the bike like the self canceling, I never finished that project because I got my bike working without it. The fast flashing does not look like them going on solid and bright If yours are going full bright with no flashing then you may have some other issue.
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #9 Posted January 8, 2017 (edited) The fast flashing does not look like them going on solid and bright If yours are going full bright with no flashing then you may have some other issue. Alright when my incandescents are in they work fine but when I unplug just the front bulb they no longer flash. My Jimmy would do the same when one bulb would blow out. Where is my flasher for the turn signals? In the diagrams it appears like it would be by the starter solenoid but when my lights are flashing it sounds like it is behind the headlight. It almost seems like it may be a weak grounding issue to me. Because if you don't ground your trailer lights they will do the same thing. I ended up grounded my lights on my trailer straight to the frame and they worked fine afterwords. They were grounded before but weren't always getting that connection. Edited January 8, 2017 by snyper316
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #10 Posted January 8, 2017 I bet @yamagrl cables will fix most of this issue or at least take away that equation. I will try grounding straight to frame and see if that will make them blink. I am sure the flasher is a few years old or decades old. I will replace and try that again as well.
yamagrl Posted January 8, 2017 #11 Posted January 8, 2017 I bet yamagrl cables will fix most of this issue or at least take away that equation. I will try grounding straight to frame and see if that will make them blink. I am sure the flasher is a few years old or decades old. I will replace and try that again as well. I believe your problem lies within the flasher. The LEDs don't draw enough load to make proper flashing. But you may have gotten lucky... After reviewing the 83 Wiring schematic it appears the the 83 has a stand alone flasher relay. cowpuc or Venturous Randy or one of the of the other notorious 83 riders might know if the the 83 flasher relay is a stand alone. The subsequent model years have an integrated Flasher-relay/Canceling relay/Starting Circuit cutoff relay. There may be other issues as well, but I think the LED flasher might be a good place to start. I'd be interested to see if the LED Flasher helps. You might be able to just swap out the relay to one designed for LEDs http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-Pin-CF13-EP34-Car-Flasher-Relay-to-Fix-LED-Light-Hyper-Blink-Flash-or-No-Flash-/161193691684?hash=item2587e48a24:g:SkcAAOxyXDhSi-t4&vxp=mtr
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #12 Posted January 8, 2017 The subsequent model years have an integrated Flasher-relay/Canceling relay/Starting Circuit cutoff relay. There may be other issues as well, but I think the LED flasher might be a good place to start. I'd be interested to see if the LED Flasher helps. You might be able to just swap out the relay to one designed for LEDs 2 Yes you are correct Heather. Which is what I was thinking to when Fool pointed out about the canceling unit. There is a round 2 plug one for flashers, square 3 plug one for the turn signals, it is all behind the left fairing. I got them dug out as of now and going to try and replace them both. The cancel unit sits behind the the plastic that holds the fairing on I believe.
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #13 Posted January 8, 2017 Well I have tried resistors and the flashers neither helped it could be the Walmart bulbs. At this time I will take those back. However the fourways worked fine. Just not the turn signal bulbs. The flasher four the fourways was fine just signaled a little slow. When I put a different flasher in the 4ways increased in speed to pretty much normal. The only lights that really drag power is the brake light. I just wanted to ad led lightbars without having to worry about power draw. Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
yamagrl Posted January 8, 2017 #14 Posted January 8, 2017 Well I have tried resistors and the flashers neither helped it could be the Walmart bulbs. At this time I will take those back. However the fourways worked fine. Just not the turn signal bulbs. The flasher four the fourways was fine just signaled a little slow. When I put a different flasher in the 4ways increased in speed to pretty much normal. The only lights that really drag power is the brake light. I just wanted to ad led lightbars without having to worry about power draw. Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside. Did you try a flasher designed for LEDs?
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #15 Posted January 8, 2017 Yes I did... It was flasher for a mix of leds and incandescent Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
snyper316 Posted January 8, 2017 Author #16 Posted January 8, 2017 Or straight leds 2-4 bulb Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
snyper316 Posted January 9, 2017 Author #17 Posted January 9, 2017 Next set I get will be from @Flyinfool source. The led bulbs were from Wal-mart that could have been the issue. Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
snyper316 Posted January 9, 2017 Author #18 Posted January 9, 2017 Found something interesting while checking a link Heather posted here. http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-3-Pin-LED-Adjustable-Car-Flasher-Flash-Relay-For-Turn-Signal-Light-Indicator-/201652823207?hash=item2ef371e4a7:g:znAAAOSwHoFXvRIB&vxp=mtr I have had a car with these and never really knew what they were but mine was a more rescest screw... that it had -/+ on it. Has anyone else seen or used these?
GaryZ Posted January 9, 2017 #19 Posted January 9, 2017 It seems to me the LEDs could be paralleled to the original bulb and you could enjoy the brighter lights. This will not reduce the load on the alternator, so, maybe you parallel only the circuits that need the load resistance and install LEDs in the running lights, dash lights, and fog lights.
snyper316 Posted January 9, 2017 Author #20 Posted January 9, 2017 Ok I am sitting here looking at this wiring diagram for the 83 venture... it seems as with two different flashers neither worked for this application. I am closely looking at the circuit for the canceling unit to the flasher it appears the flasher would get its power from the canceling unit. I am thinking maybe the canceling unit is not reading the other flasher at all therefore not powering it on. Does this sound plausible?
Flyinfool Posted January 9, 2017 #21 Posted January 9, 2017 There is always the sanity check to be sure you did not mess something up. Try the original flasher and bulbs to be sure all is still good. Then try changing just one turn signal to LED at a time and test.
snyper316 Posted January 10, 2017 Author #22 Posted January 10, 2017 https://vimeo.com/198769232 Well got one side working. Seems like they flash a little slow. Living life one curve after the other. Vroom scooting, thru the countryside.
Flyinfool Posted January 10, 2017 #23 Posted January 10, 2017 Did you try it with just one resistor? Disconnecting one of the resistors may speed up the flash. What value resistors do you have?
snyper316 Posted January 10, 2017 Author #24 Posted January 10, 2017 Did you try it with just one resistor? Disconnecting one of the resistors may speed up the flash. What value resistors do you have? Yes Sir I sure did before I put in the back left resistor. The resistors I used seemed quite large to be honest. I will do more experimenting, I just can't figure out why the other flashers didn't seem to work. The resistors I got just say 12v 6ohms. So anymore suggestions would be welcomed at this point. I am just happy I got them to work. I was determined to get them to work. One of my downfalls is if I can't get something to work I will keep trying till I do.
Flyinfool Posted January 10, 2017 #25 Posted January 10, 2017 The resistors are physically pretty big. they have to be to get enough surface area to dissipate the heat that they will generate. Yes they can get quite warm in use, bear that in mind when you mount them. Your two 6 ohm resistors hooked up one front and one back are equal to the one 3 ohm resistor that I used on mine. It actually does not matter where in the circuit you connect them. you could put them both right next to each other if that is easier. The reason all of the LED makers use one per bulb is so that if you are only replacing 1 bulb it will be the correct resistor. They are just doing it the easiest way for a non electrical person to understand. That is just not the easiest way to accomplish the job. Either way is electrically correct. Now I prolly just made it confusing..........................
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now