Clutch will not disengage

[Formerfuzz]

It may be an optical illusion. Here it is on my level. It's straight. My Slave Cylinder will deliver tomorrow.

 

[

QUOTE=

V7Goose;988337]Yes, it would take a LOT of pressure to push that rod to move the pressure plate - no way to do it by hand. I cannot really tell from your pictures, but something doesn't look quite right on the bottom left one - almost like the end of that rod is bent down? Be sure to carefully check the parts breakdown for all the specific parts and the order before you re-assemble.

Goose

[Formerfuzz]

Replaced the Slave, bled the line and pumped it up. The same conditions exist that I had before I replaced it. I'm back to square 1 where the Clutch lever will not pull in and disengage the clutch. As Goose suggested I pulled the clutch cover off along with the pressure plate. The pics show what I see. The large nut was loose, about half way out. Please look at these and tell me what you see.

 

Edited October 14, 2016 by Formerfuzz

[Formerfuzz]

***UPDATE***

I pulled out the push rod from the clutch side and can see the ball bearing at the end of the push rod from the slave cylinder. This morning 10/14 I have the clutch lever operating properly and have the Slave Cylinder operating the push rods through to the pressure plate. The push rod is only extending out about 1/8" when I pull the lever and that isn't enough to disengage the clutch. What is the normal travel distance to separate the pressure plate from the clutch plates.

 

I also noticed the pressure plate spring will sometimes not depress the push rod back into place. Probably will order a new one.

 

I believe Im making progress, just cant quite get there. Any help will be appreciated.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Formerfuzz

[Formerfuzz]

Progress update above

[Formerfuzz]

We have gone through the entire hydraulic clutch and I appears to be working, so we have eliminated that. New symptoms are when running in neutral, and try to put in gear with the clutch pulled in, it kills the engine as though the clutch was out. Also, unable to start while in gear with clutch pulled in. I get both oil and temp lights, but will not turn over. Will only start in neutral.

 

Could it it be a transmission problem? It shifts from neutral to 1st okay just kills the engine.

 

Thanks,

Tim

[Du-Rron]

We have gone through the entire hydraulic clutch and I appears to be working, so we have eliminated that. New symptoms are when running in neutral, and try to put in gear with the clutch pulled in, it kills the engine as though the clutch was out. Also, unable to start while in gear with clutch pulled in. I get both oil and temp lights, but will not turn over. Will only start in neutral.

 

Could it it be a transmission problem? It shifts from neutral to 1st okay just kills the engine.

 

Thanks,

Tim

 

Clutch switch on left handgrip disconnected???

[Formerfuzz]

Clutch switch on left handgrip disconnected???

 

I doubled checked just now it is plugged in. I had a thought on the clutch basket. As mentioned earlier the large nut that holds it in place was loose. Is it possible the basket slipped out then back, but not properly seated? I would think that would create problems with the drive and clutch.

[Kirby]

Is the kickstand down?

[Formerfuzz]

Is the kickstand down?

 

Holy Crap!!! Man do I feel like an idiot. The kickstand was down while I had it on the jack to work on it. Cranked it and went through all of the gears. Clutch works fine.

 

***Summary***

 

• Clutch lever would not pull in and disengage. We determined that the clutch basket main nut was loose due to the locking tabs not being in place by previous owner or mechanic, allowing basket to move.
  
• tightened main nut, and folded locking tabs down.
  
• Discovered the Slave Cylinder piston had pushed out too far extending the push rods to the limit preventing the clutch lever from pulling in
  
• Replaced the Slave Cyclinder.
  
• Made sure push rods were depressed in fully when filling and bleeding the line.
  
• Dry tested the clutch operation so a visual confirmation it was working property (engine off)
  
• Replace covers with new gaskets, fill with oil
  
• MAKE SURE THE KICKSTAND IS UP!
  
• Crank it up let run a few minutes to allow oil to circulate completely
  
• Test the clutch and shifting
  
• Go riding
  

Thanks to all who contributed to helping me solve my problem.

Edited October 23, 2016 by Formerfuzz

[V7Goose]

You say the clutch issue is resolved - not sure I follow how you came to that conclusion. The large nut holding in the clutch basket should NEVER come loose - that is why there are lock tabs on the base washer! Finding it loose is a huge problem, and I strongly suspect it was the original cause of your issues. My only assumption is that some incompetent goober was in there changing the clutch basket, and the boob never bothered to properly torque and lock the nut?? Hopefully nothing is damaged. At this point I would remove the basket and carefully and slowly inspect EVERYTHING for any scratches or other wear marks as a clue to what damage MIGHT have been done. If the clutch lever hit a hard stop, SOMETHING was hitting that should not have been.

 

The clutch rod does NOT need to move far to release the clutch pack - if you measure any movement at all, I'd bet all is fine there.

 

There is a rather complicated interplay between the side stand switch, the clutch switch and the neutral switch (there is also a diode involved in that circuit if I remember correctly). It always takes me a while to trace out the schematic wires to each of those switches and and logically put together the multiple states that all have to be tested to determine the exact problem (in gear, neutral, stand up, stand down, clutch in, clutch out - make a matrix and you see how complicated this gets).

 

Start by using an ohmmeter (with key OFF, of course) to check the function of all three switches. The best thing to do is locate and pull the plugs to each switch and measure there - that totally isolates the circuitry to anything else on the bike and gives you the only really positive test of switch operation. Note that the neutral switch is also the OD switch, so you need to make sure you are measuring the correct wires there.

 

With any luck you will find that the problem is simply a mis-adjusted side stand switch! Good luck,

Goose

[Formerfuzz]

You say the clutch issue is resolved - not sure I follow how you came to that conclusion. The large nut holding in the clutch basket should NEVER come loose - that is why there are lock tabs on the base washer! Finding it loose is a huge problem, and I strongly suspect it was the original cause of your issues. My only assumption is that some incompetent goober was in there changing the clutch basket, and the boob never bothered to properly torque and lock the nut?? Hopefully nothing is damaged. At this point I would remove the basket and carefully and slowly inspect EVERYTHING for any scratches or other wear marks as a clue to what damage MIGHT have been done. If the clutch lever hit a hard stop, SOMETHING was hitting that should not have been.

 

The clutch rod does NOT need to move far to release the clutch pack - if you measure any movement at all, I'd bet all is fine there.

 

There is a rather complicated interplay between the side stand switch, the clutch switch and the neutral switch (there is also a diode involved in that circuit if I remember correctly). It always takes me a while to trace out the schematic wires to each of those switches and and logically put together the multiple states that all have to be tested to determine the exact problem (in gear, neutral, stand up, stand down, clutch in, clutch out - make a matrix and you see how complicated this gets).

 

Start by using an ohmmeter (with key OFF, of course) to check the function of all three switches. The best thing to do is locate and pull the plugs to each switch and measure there - that totally isolates the circuitry to anything else on the bike and gives you the only really positive test of switch operation. Note that the neutral switch is also the OD switch, so you need to make sure you are measuring the correct wires there.

 

With any luck you will find that the problem is simply a mis-adjusted side stand switch! Good luck,

Goose

 

Thanks Goose. I believe you are correct on the main nut and locking tabs. As mentioned the nut was loose and the locking tabs were not folded over. This was most likely the root cause. Now that I know what I'm doing I will go back in and double check everything.

 

As as far as the safety switches, this was just me be so absorbed in solving my clutch problem that it just slipped my mind.

 

Again, thanks for everyone's help.

[paysaw]

I had that same problem.My slave unit was jammed.You could bleed it out but when bleed screw tightened, the same problem as you.When I pulled it out it was full of gunk.

[maddog2498]

Had similar thing happen to me. Call yamaha dealer, jim martin in fitzgerald ga. and he told me that I probably had moisture in my lines. Mine would pull in but would not dis in gauage the clutch. Changed fluid 2 or 3 times to flush all old out and put in new fluid and had no more trouble. Got moisture in mine coming out of

Tosa nm down into Albuquerque nm. I NEED HELP WITH MY REAR SHOCK, it is leaking and I have a lowering kit on it. what schock do I need, where to find, can it be rebuilt, and how much? I do not seem to be able to find anything trying to search on this site.

[videoarizona]

Had similar thing happen to me. Call yamaha dealer, jim martin in fitzgerald ga. and he told me that I probably had moisture in my lines. Mine would pull in but would not dis in gauage the clutch. Changed fluid 2 or 3 times to flush all old out and put in new fluid and had no more trouble. Got moisture in mine coming out of

Tosa nm down into Albuquerque nm. I NEED HELP WITH MY REAR SHOCK, it is leaking and I have a lowering kit on it. what schock do I need, where to find, can it be rebuilt, and how much? I do not seem to be able to find anything trying to search on this site.

 

What bike?

[maddog2498]

What bike?

 

I have a 2002 midnight rsv with 85k. Have lowering kit on rear but handles bad at low speeds. I see where you can lower front by sliding tubes. Does this easy fix work? Love my bike but having coolant leak also for 1st time and shock leaking.

Edited March 16, 2017 by maddog2498

[videoarizona]

I have a 2002 midnight rsv with 85k. Have lowering kit on rear but handles bad at low speeds. I see where you can lower front by sliding tubes. Does this easy fix work? Love my bike but having coolant leak also for 1st time and shock leaking.

 

 

OK thanks for bike info.

 

The RSV's rear shocks are a known trouble spot after around 50K miles.... and the original units are not rebuildable. It's not that they are bad, its what it is. However, there are two companies (or 3?) that make direct after market replacements, and the original Yamaha shock is also available. In addition, you might be able to find one at pinwall cycles on ebay...a used one that may or may not last long enough to make you happy. It's a crap shoot as it is with almost any used part. The good thing about putting another shock in is, you get to grease up the rear end and check the drive splines and such for wear. Peace of mind kind of stuff. Brake pads and tire check on rear as well.

 

Here is a link for an old discussion on rear RSV shocks. Doing a search in the forum should produce hundreds of hits for you to read through.

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?75298-What-is-the-best-rear-shock-replacement-Jan-2013

 

 

The problem with low speed handling is one of how the bike is set up. Its made for high speed cruising down the road at speed....

 

I did NOT do the lowering/raising kits for the rear as I felt that is not what I needed. I did do the lowering of the front end to help with handling. There are a number of pics and discussions about how to do it, but it is really simple...just involved. Handlebars off of the triple tree, Take the outer fairing off, release the 2 nuts holding the inner fairing to frame and the two holding the triple tree, then pull the fairing and bars toward the front and up to gain a few inches access to the triple tree. Remove the main stem nut, remove the front fork covers, lower covers, and loosen the nuts and adjust, etc..... I raised mine up one inch. Make sure you angle the air valves on top of each shock to the outside so you can get to them later if needed.

 

I also moved my whole fairing forward a tad to give more clearance between the bars and the inner fairing. I did that by putting a washer on top of the bolts that hold the inner fairing to the frame.

 

Yes, it works. I don't know how the lowering/raising kits will help or hinder the lowering of the forks. Someone else more familiar with the kit can help here.

 

The idea behind the lowering of the front end is to change the way the bike sits (front end geometry) so she still tracks well but is easier to steer at slow speed. Not quite as much "pushing" or "plowing" into the corners.

 

Here is a link or two for you to get some idea of what has been done....even a link on when I took off my forks due to a leak.

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?122351-Front-Fork-Oil-Leak&highlight=lowering+front

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?939-Lowering-the-Front-End

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?107623-Damper-replacement&highlight=lowering+front

 

 

And last...the clutch issue you had is familiar to me as well. Except mine was on my 89 VR. Air in line and old fluid (3 years) stopped my clutch from disengaging. Bleeding it got it working again enough to get me home. I just finished putting in a rebuild kit for the master cylinder this morning. Took a few hours to bleed again...but think I got it done. Will know in a few hundred miles. If the bike starts to creep with clutch in, I'll know I didn't get all the air out!

 

hope this helps.