Brake mod and de-linking a bust

[capymotiv]

Well, where to begin.

 

Got my 01 blue dots in yesterday and could not wait to get to it today. Hope was completely dashed when I found that NOTHING about the blue dots would work on my first gen. I would need to grind the mounting pads down about a 1/4 inch on the calipers, the rotor are too thick for them and I would need to fabricate an extension link for the top of the caliper to get it at the right angle.

 

I have a 01 rear caliper and mounting spacer coming. Should be here tomorrow. I am assuming that I am going to run into the same problems? Brakes are already de-linked but left front is not hooked to anything. Front brakes are really spongy and will not stop the bike effectively. This bothers me to no end since my girl rides with me constantly. Only option I can see is to install a portioning block and tie it to the right front.

 

Are there any mods other than the stainless line that I can do to get this heffer to stop. I am finding myself pulling the lever and pushing the pedal to there extreme limits while saying a prayer in traffic.

[bongobobny]

Yes you will!! The R1/R6 stuff does not bolt directly on to a MK1. The bolt spacing is different from a MK1 and MK2. You need to change your fork lowers, and the rotors to a MK2 in front, and in the rear you need to change the caliper mounting bracket from a MK1 to a MK2 AND change the caliper mounting bracket pivot bolt on the swing arm as well, and the rear rotor, all different...

 

You can still tie the front brake lines together so you have both front brakes, but if you want BETTER braking I strongly suggest converting your front brakes to a MK2 setup which also gets rid of those pesky power robbing hydraulic anti dives! The MK2 uses electric anti dive solenoids, triggered by the brake lights via a relay. The bolt spacing is also correct for the R1/R6 calipers and is a direct plug and play with the MK2 rotors. Someone once said that the 2nd gen rotors are also a direct bolt on but I can not confirm that, and the member that said it is no longer on this forum. The MK1 is only a 2 piston setup whereas the MK2 is a 4 piston setup! There is a reason the MK2 upgraded the brakes, the MK1 brakes were anemic at best! Also you should use the front brake master cylinder from the MK2, the piston is bigger delivering a slightly larger volume of hydraulic fluid to the calipers which is needed with the larger total piston area of the MK1 vs the MK2.

 

Also Stainless Steel brake lines do help, less line swelling with them which results in more power going to the actual brakes...

Edited July 3, 2016 by bongobobny

[cowpuc]

Capy,, hopefully I am reading your post here correctly - if not and my response is way out in left field - just throw it out..

By Blue dots, I am taking it that you ordered two piston calipers thinking you could do the caliper upgrade that everyone talks about? If so, that upgrade is only doable on a M2 1st Gen - your 84 is a MK1, totally different critter.. To do the caliper upgrade on the 1's you have to swap out the fork sliders so you have the right mounting brackets.. By what you are describing, sounds to me like you were not aware of that?

If I am correct on my assumption here and that were my bike, this is what I would do.. I would go back to linked brakes and regain the usage of the front left disc (could go ahead and link up the front pair to work together but this is the simplest way to get cha back to ok brakes). I would run the pistons out on all the calipers at least a full pads worth and clean the pistons really well so they have no stickyness in there movement, you can completely remove the pistons but I have found it not usually necessary.. I would flush the systems and get fresh fluid in em.. Your front brake is spongy because it's got air in it - I would bleed until I had a solid lever/peddle - there are some tricks to it - ask if your having trouble bleeding.. I would clean up the rotors with brake cleaner and put new pads on all the way around. If you have or have had leaky fork seals = ANY fork fluid dripping onto the calipers = the pads are shot and not saveable. My current MK1 came with braided hoses - my first time experiencing them - WOW what a nice feel,, I have a good stopping - one finger front brake now. You might consider consider going that route BUT I personally wouldnt go there until I KNEW I had completely chased out all the bugs on the original system and seen how I liked it at its best. It is possible to come close to that "feel" by plugging off the anti-dives and shedding the hoses that feed em, IMHO..

 

Sorry I got so long winded, hope something in there helps some how..

[Condor]

If you would have done a search for threads covering the R1 mod, the subject has been discussed Ad Nauseum on what is needed to do the conversion on a 1stGen MKI. But again... basically you'll need MKII forks, and MKII rotors to get the R1's to adapt. They aren't a plug'n'play with the MKI like they are on the MKII and 2ndGen's.....

[Flyinfool]

As far as getting better braking from what you already have.

 

1. Make sure the the seals on your front forks are not leaking. There is nothing that will overcome fork oil getting on the pads.

 

2. Put in EBC HH pads all around. The HH have a lot more grip than the stock pads.

 

3. As mentioned above, since you already did half of a delink, get that left front brake hooked up to the front master, you do not need a proportioning valve.

 

4. Get rid of the proportioning valve from the rear. You do not need it reducing pressure to the rear to keep balance with the front that is not there.

 

5. Do a good flushing of the brake and clutch fluid. The fluid should be changed every 2 years anyhow.

 

This will all take minimal funds to accomplish and get you better braking until you are ready to do all of the work needed to do the R1s.

 

If your fork seals are leaking, then this is the perfect time to change out to the MKII lower forks while it is all apart anyhow.

[gaj1917]

You've gotten lots of good info capy. I especially concur with cowpuc - I installed stainless steel braided lines on my '84, and it made a HUGE difference. Lots of these lines available on eBay and elsewhere. A bit of a pain to install, though.

[Marcarl]

I had rotten brakes on my 85, changed to SS lines and was really quite happy and comfortable, even with a trailer and my wife on the back, so a total load of about 600 lbs

[greg_in_london]

I agree with Flyinfool - do the basic maintenance and upgrade including stainless steel hoses.

 

A larger diameter master cylinder will help with setting up the front brake - any one designed for two disks and that sits at the right angle (ie custom, not flat bars) will be 5/8" / 14mm and will do.

 

The restrictor and the proportioning valve are what stop the brakes working properly, but don't connect the other front disk to the back brake cylinder without the restrictor as you might find yourself unable to brake without locking the front up !

 

I'd remove the proportioning valve and connect the rear hose directly if you haven't already done that though.

[Guest Jamsie]

Greg , only thing i can add is DO NOT BUY HEl brake lines. the lines i bought for my 2nd gen didnt fit and it had correct model on the packaging, goodridge can do lines to order if you give then dimentions etc .

1 more thing . jeffs idea of tapping on the master cylinder banjo to get rid of airlock at the top works , another option is a banjo with a bleed nipple at the master

[zagger]

My '83 has stock calipers which I delinked. Handlebar brake drives both front calipers. The two calipers are linked with a short brake line arcing up over the front wheel. Foot pedal drives the rear. Brakes are good. No idea about more complicated solutions - mine is simple and works fine.

zag

[garyS-NJ]

On my '84, I delinked by running a second front line off the front master to the front left caliper and got the next bigger master. Plugged the rear master port that went to the front left and ditched the proportioning valve. Fronts are still a little soft and the rears got very "wooden" (hard). Gonna rebleed the fronts and my rear master is now leaking (ugh $70 rebuild kit).

 

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