Replacing starter w/ second gen, brands vs price

[OutKast]

Ok. It seems like I have three options.

 

1. Used Second Gen starter off Ebay will cost about $120 delivered.

 

2. The Rick's Motorsports Premium Starter is about $220, 1 year warranty

 

3. What looks like the way to go - Several different brand labels on what appears to actually be the same starter, a Mitsuba, from $160 to $170, all with a 1 year warranty.

 

An extra $40 for new with warranty seems a no-brainer. Ricks appears to have a shinier case, but nothing stating what technically makes thier's better.

 

Has anybody used this "mitsuba"?????

 

 

Edit - more searching, Mitsuba is Japanese, not Chinese. Maybe they are the original supplier anyway?

Edited January 2, 2016 by OutKast
More Info found

[BlueSky]

Here is one for $75

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/97-01-YAMAHA-ROYAL-STAR-XVZ1300LT-TOUR-DELUXE-Engine-Starter-Motor-/201396301604?hash=item2ee427af24:g:jm4AAOSwMmBVt819&vxp=mtr

[LukeMacPU]

I put a Vmax starter on mine. Appears to be the 4 brush upgrade over my '83 two brush and it was only $80 new. Has been working well for the last couple months, but too early to comment on longevity.

 

NEW YAMAHA STARTER V-MAX VMAX VMAX VMX1200 1985-2000 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00TH4BOMS/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awd_eK1HwbSZ6XFMX

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!

[OutKast]

I put a Vmax starter on mine. Appears to be the 4 brush upgrade over my '83 two brush and it was only $80 new. Has been working well for the last couple months, but too early to comment on longevity.

 

NEW YAMAHA STARTER V-MAX VMAX VMAX VMX1200 1985-2000 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00TH4BOMS/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awd_eK1HwbSZ6XFMX

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!

 

Appears to be 4 brush, as no screw on outside of case. Guess you really don't know without opening it, as the add does not say. Also being a Mitsuba, how can they sell it for half of the second gen? This has really got me thinking.

 

No more slow crank?

[LukeMacPU]

PO had starter issues and he parked the bike because of it. He never got to the bottom of it and threw some other electrical parts/battery at it. I got the bike after 80 miles of riding since 2009. That was this past October, 2015. I've been tinkering and fixing since then (carbs, brakes, clutch springs, fork springs, fork seals, etc...). I'm new to owning a Venture and there are certainly more informed folks on here.

 

I was in your spot a couple months ago. Couldn't make myself spring for the $220 super nice starter when the old one (2-brush) had been working for 30+ years and almost 40K miles. I checked out some used ones on Ebay. Went with the new one I posted above. From what I read, the lack of screws on the outside of the case meant it was the 4 brush design and should be better than what I had. I also ordered and installed a rebuild kit for my old one so I've got a spare. Spins fine now when not installed, but haven't tested the rebuilt one on bike.

 

I needed a new battery also. New battery PO installed had been sitting for over 2 years and was completely dead with some dry cells. I could charge and bike would crank fine, but battery would drain quickly. Put in a new AGM sealed battery and now the bike cranks over and starts no problem. No issues when the bike is warm from riding either, it restarts just fine. Again, I've not had much experience here. My old starter was definitely sick, would barely crank (only one or two slow turns) even with fully charged battery and/or the boost function of my charger (50 amp). I could jump power directly to post on starter and it still wouldn't spin. New starter and the problem is gone.

 

No idea why these are only $80. Some experts may be able to shed some light on this? Maybe I'll regret it a year from now, but I'm happy for now.

Edited January 2, 2016 by LukeMacPU

[Flyinfool]

The screws / no screws in the case only applies to Yamaha starters. There some other brands that are interchangeable, will fit and function but are still a 2 brush with no screws in the case. I do not know which brands are the 2 brush with no screws.

 

FWIW, I still have the 2 brush in my 88. I did do the @Dingy cable upgrade and the Dingy brush ground upgrade and have no issues starting a hot engine.

[Venturous Randy]

A couple years ago I picked up a used 2nd gen starter from Pinwall for about $49. It has worked great and on several occasions it started the bike when it was hot where I know the old one would have had a problem. Personally, I would rather have a used 2nd gen Venture starter than some off brand.

I do realize that Pinwall has gone up significantly on their prices lately.

Randy

Edited January 5, 2016 by Venturous Randy

[wizard]

When ever I can, I avoid anything made in China.

[NewbeeMC9]

The screws / no screws in the case only applies to Yamaha starters. There some other brands that are interchangeable, will fit and function but are still a 2 brush with no screws in the case. I do not know which brands are the 2 brush with no screws.

 

FWIW, I still have the 2 brush in my 88. I did do the @Dingy cable upgrade and the Dingy brush ground upgrade and have no issues starting a hot engine.

 

Not finding the Dingy Upgrades; is there a link? I may go that route when time comes. Interesting, and Thanks

[Flyinfool]

Here is the ground upgrade.

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?46890-First-Gen-Starter-Ground-Upgrade

 

You will have to PM or email @Dingy about the Starter cables, he was making and selling them.

[Prairiehammer]

For General Information:

A list of Yamaha Models (with years) in which their four brush starters will bolt up to a First Gen Venture with out modification.

Four Brush Starters.pdf

[OutKast]

Just to close this thread, the factory second Gen starters are MITSUBA.

[LukeMacPU]

So what'd you end up doing? Or was this thread just an academic exercise and your current starter is good?

 

FWIW, my new starter ($80) has been working well even in the colder weather we've had in IN lately.

[mother]

i bought a second gen which is a 4 brush, from pinwall for 50 bucks

[Condor]

Just wondering... Years ago I had a starter problem with my 5.7 Vortec Suburban in that I couldn't keep starters from dieing because of the heat generated from the header. It was suggested that I replace the OEM with a Hi-torque starter, and it would have if I hadn't bought a dealer installed new one. (Life time Mr. Goodwrench) I'm sure we all heard them, and I think Chrysler used them on some of their motors?? They gave off a sort of high pitched 'wheeze'... And they're a lot smaller than OEM...making it easier to R&R. Anyway I wonder if something like that would be available or adaptable to our Ventures? Just a thought??

[Freebird]

I don't know the answer to your question but wonder if it's really in issue. I mean, yes, on the first gen bikes with the 2 brush starters there is an issue but I haven't heard of any issues with the RSV or the 4 brush starters added to the first gens.

[Flyinfool]

I haven't even heard of a lot of 1st gen starters actually dying, just the slow cranking when hot and people replacing them just to feel like they were not on the verge of being stranded. But I have never had it not start.

 

I had one of the aftermarket high torque GM starters when I had the race car. The engine had so much compression that it would shatter the nose casting of the stock starter. The high torque starter had what looked like a motorcycle starter and that ran thru an additional gear reduction in a billet nose piece before it got to the flywheel. Our bikes already have a 2 (or 3?) stage gear reduction between the motor and the flywheel.

[mralex714]

Ok. It seems like I have three options.

 

1. Used Second Gen starter off Ebay will cost about $120 delivered.

 

2. The Rick's Motorsports Premium Starter is about $220, 1 year warranty

 

3. What looks like the way to go - Several different brand labels on what appears to actually be the same starter, a Mitsuba, from $160 to $170, all with a 1 year warranty.

 

An extra $40 for new with warranty seems a no-brainer. Ricks appears to have a shinier case, but nothing stating what technically makes thier's better.

 

Has anybody used this "mitsuba"?????

 

 

Edit - more searching, Mitsuba is Japanese, not Chinese. Maybe they are the original supplier anyway?

The places I talked to about the new starters for The Ventures and V-Max and they said they were only 2 brush or the didn't know. So I bought a used 2nd gen.

Edited January 19, 2016 by mralex714

[Ozlander]

Not finding the Dingy Upgrades; is there a link? I may go that route when time comes. Interesting, and Thanks

I did the Dingy brush ground upgrade about 10 years ago. Starter has been fine since.

Probably all you need to do.

[Trader]

OK....this is not really a highjack seeing as we are talking about starters.

I've replaced 2 out of the 3 cables with 4 gu. wire. The red wire, that connects to the left side of the starter (looking from the front) is thinner than the 2 others I have replaced already. Does this red wire need to be replaced also? If so, what guage does it need to be?

Edited February 1, 2016 by Trader

[OutKast]

So what'd you end up doing? Or was this thread just an academic exercise and your current starter is good?

 

FWIW, my new starter ($80) has been working well even in the colder weather we've had in IN lately.

 

 

I bought a used second Gen starter. It has MITSUBA SM13 cast into it. It has 4 brushes. It was about $60. Another member alerted me to it as it was listed under Tour Deluxe, not Venture. Shop not heated so it is not on yet.