New-to-me '83 Venture Royale

[Flyinfool]

These bike run so well on 3 that pulling a plug wire makes almost no difference in idle speed.

 

Around 40 MPG is right in the ballpark of what you should expect. MPG will drop when you are on 3.

 

To check for a dead cylinder at idle, when the bike is cold, start it up and check the temp of the headers at the head, they should all heat up at about the same rate. Careful, they do get HOT quickly.

 

For a cylinder to fire it needs fuel, air in the correct ratio, compression, and a spark at the right time. Disrupting any one of these will make that cylinder not fire.

It is possible for all cylinders to be firing at idle with no load but then have one drop out under load. The most common cause of this is spark related.

How old are the plugs, these bikes are fussy about good fresh plugs.

[cowpuc]

That Fool is no fool, he is right on the money about the plugs. Our bikes use the smaller "d" plugs which have a very small end surface area and they don't take kindly to over choking - choke, start and off choke quickly - work it back and forth till it takes throttle and the plugs will last a long time. Leave it on to long and plugs will blacken and once they do they are shot.

Do exactly Like Jeff mentioned, start cold, spit check the headers one at a time, check em like your checking a hot iron - should get a hot "ssst" off each header - if you get one that dont sizzle like the others check that plug.

If they all are hot at idle I would go next to pulling the carb diaphrams and checking them. I bought Tweeks, our 83, from a guy who ran her over 6k miles on three cylinders. I told him when I test drove first time that she was wayyy under powered, he looked at me like I was nuts. Rode her home 100 miles, highway speeds no problem. Pulled diaphrams and one diaphram was completely separated from slide. Put slide back together and wow zzzzz wow wow wow - previous owner was :moped:and happy with it but never knew what a v=4 (just made a new icon here guys "V=4" - as in OUR Veeezzz = 4 ,,,, if I didnt own "cowpuc" for a name already I think I would register myself as "V=4" - I like that - SORRY - GOT SIDETRACKED:puzzled:) was REALLY all about!!

 

Small hills should disappear in the rear view like they werent even there IF your "on the pipe" (old two stroke lingo), running in the horsepower "r" curve (above 4 grand), even actual mountains actually should do the same - these things pull like freight train when hitting on all 4..

Edited December 10, 2015 by cowpuc

[videoarizona]

Maybe it's 3 cylinders... I have noWhere near that kind of pull at high speed. Mpg was just over 41-43 for my fill ups. Just pulling spark plug wire at idle best way to check the cylinders? Dead one won't make a change right?

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

 

No. Many times the bike will run fine at idle on three. Most common reasons for three are plugs and wires. On mine, I found one wire wasn't seated in coil and end was corroded. Cut off end and stuck wire in tight.

Your mpgs tell me you are not missing at speed. Next time out, downshift to 4th and crank it....make sure you are turning throttle all the way!!! Bet you will be surprised at acceleration.

[LukeMacPU]

I've had a weak battery issue that's led to me flooding it a few times recently at start. No issue since new battery went it. I'll check the plugs when I get home. Runs ok, but I'm sure I've over-choked it a couple times since I got it running and threw new plugs in it. I thought the plugs would recover from the flooding after I got it started and ran it a bit. Sounds like I might be wrong.

 

I'll be sure to check the pipes next start-up. Should quickly tell me what I'm working with. I had a diaphragm messed up when I first got it. Should be able to pull air filter and watch the slides move to check that right? The messed up diaphragm had separated and you could easily see it didn't move like the others.

 

Thanks for the info guys.

[Flyinfool]

Since the choke on these bikes does not actually restrict air like a normal choke, it adds more fuel without changing the airflow. When you start it cold get it off choke as quick as possible or the fuel enrichment could mask a plugged jet.

 

It is even hard to visually check the plugs, I have seen plugs that looked just fine that would not run well.

[LukeMacPU]

So what does it mean if I only have one slide moving via diaphragm the other three are sitting still?

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[LukeMacPU]

Here's my problem...

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/11/5f279131a99337b136d1e606b4663330.jpg

Slides keep slipping off the metal tube that diaphragm fits on. How do I get them to stick?

 

I guess three nonworking diaphragms would explain my poor engine performance!

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

Edited December 11, 2015 by LukeMacPU

[BlueSky]

And explain the good fuel mileage. The engine was running lean especially when it was trying to accelerate.

[LukeMacPU]

What's the secret to keeping them in place?

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[videoarizona]

People have used a type of glue... Don't remember what. Search old posts..diaphram repair....or diaphram sticking... I'm on road so my search is a pain...

[LukeMacPU]

I'll give it a shot thanks.

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[cowpuc]

I have successfully used both "Seal All" (comes in a Yellow Tube with red print) and epoxy 2 part to reconnect them. My very favorite now though is the "Red Kote" tank sealer that I use to coat tanks with.. That stuff is AMAZING as an adhesive!! I will say that if you use epoxy - be careful not to over do the application and add to much weight to the whole mechanism. Also, no matter what you use - make sure everything is clean and dry before applying adhesive and let them set up real well before putting them to use.

Another note worthy product is YamaBond number 5. I played with finding a decent product for patching holes and tears in the diaphrams themselves years ago .. Discovered Number 5 - works AMAZINGLY well for patching diaphrams and intake manifolds!!!

Good eye on the diaphram and glad you figured it out Luke!!

[LukeMacPU]

Thanks I'll go glue shopping!

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[LukeMacPU]

Got my slides epoxied together and reinstalled. Just rode back to the office from lunch for the first time and all I can say is holy cow!!! I must have never had more than two or three slides working properly after I synced the carbs and actually tried riding it. Hadn't checked them since I first put the carbs on after cleaning them. Bike is a freakin' rocket for a big ol' thing! Night and day difference. First I've experienced the top end I'm assuming these are supposed to have and I couldn't stop smiling.

 

Love it!

[Flyinfool]

See, we knew you could not have been running on all cylinders. Just be careful, for a big ol' thing it will still lift the front wheel off the ground when you get on it hard. Kind of sneaks up on ya the first time it happens.

[LukeMacPU]

I guess my bike doesn't want me to get bored by having nothing to work on so...

 

Now that I've got my engine pulling good and hard in the upper revs like it should, I figured I should roll on it in 5th and see if my clutch is weak. Sure enough, it starts slipping and breaks loose just as the engine starts to pick up the punch. My tach seems to be sluggish, but at an indicated 4000-4500 is where the clutch starts slipping if I pin the throttle in high gear. I've ordered new (stiffer) clutch springs to see if I can get away with just that.

Edited December 16, 2015 by LukeMacPU

[Flyinfool]

That will most likely do it. Did you remember a new gasket?

[cowpuc]

I guess my bike doesn't want me to get bored by having nothing to work on so...

 

Now that I've got my engine pulling good and hard in the upper revs like it should, I figured I should roll on it in 5th and see if my clutch is weak. Sure enough, it starts slipping and breaks loose just as the engine starts to pick up the punch. My tach seems to be sluggish, but at an indicated 4000-4500 is where the clutch starts slipping if I pin the throttle in high gear. I've ordered new (stiffer) clutch springs to see if I can get away with just that.

 

Luke,,,, it is your destiny!! May the V-FORce be with you (:scared:I may have just hit on another good one liner) !!

 

At least more than it has been with me! Out of 5 MK1 1st Gen's I have yet to have a clutch that didnt do that - especially while loaded with gear and riding 2 up. I have tried new springs and even new clutch plates and always ended up with a slipper right in the spot where your talking Luke. I have not tried heavy duty springs though,,, I know that someone on here sells them, I think it is @skydoc_17 that are suppose to be the cats meow. Hindsight being 20/20 If I were gonna go for it I would order a set of his and deal with him on figuring it out - he has had LOTS of good reviews:thumbsup:

[LukeMacPU]

I see what you did there with the Darth Vader lines. Well played, especially with the new movie coming out.

 

So are you saying it isn't a problem I should worry about or just that it might still slip a bit even with new springs? The bike was not loaded at all, just my 200 LBS.

 

I did order a gasket. Seem to have terrible luck getting those off intact.

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

Edited December 17, 2015 by LukeMacPU

[cowpuc]

I have just lived with it and covered quite a few miles in doing so (current 83 has over 300k on her and NEVER had a good clutch), I have always just avoided hitting the retro rockets up in those higher gears and, if I did, tried to avoid the slip so not to burn up my plates.. Gotta keep in mind also that I dont mind riding beater scoots, to the point of also riding em with no second gear out till they are junk too (just to give you some insight into what meets our needs). Just depends on what your after I guess.

I will say this, I have a V-Max now and that thing is SO nice - I can nail it in high gears and actually get to feel the mighty v-4 pull through those upper gears - WAYYYYY nice!!

Something that I have found REALLY helps with mine has been the type of oil I run, stay away from "car" oils of the High Mileage types, I use Truck Oils like Rotella 15-40 or and Walmart 20-50 a LOT.. Seems to work better as far as preventing clutch slippage.

I know from experience that our scoots (MK1's - 83/84's) have a "half plate" in the clutch basket. Its the first plate to go into the basket when your putting it back together. I always theorized that this fiber plate missing half its surface was probably a big part of the reason I could never get a good solid clutch. I did try replacing that with an extra full plate I had (that is whats in Tweeks - my bike - right now). It was a used part though and it came out still slipping in the range you are talking. Been in there a LOT of miles!

The newer scoots (MK2's = 86 to 93's) I think all have the updated Diaphram clutch spring and they seem to be a lot better of system than we have.. I have a running "parts" 87 that I have ridden and indeed, having a solid clutch all the way thru the gears is pretty cool!!

Luke, if I jump on my 83, by myself, not loaded for touring,, run up to 4 grand in 4th or 5th gear and NAIL IT - I garantee you that my clutch will slip and I will have to tease it a little with the throttle to keep it from doing so,, been like that for many miles!!

I also assure you that this malady is fixable and, if I or you want a good clutch, someone like Skydoc has the knowledge and parts to accomplish the task!

Just I never took the time and spent the cash to accomplish it..

[LukeMacPU]

Puc,

 

I appreciate the additional insight and clarification. That is a pile of miles you're putting on! I hope to put on a fraction of that. Doesn't sound like a super critical fix from what you're describing. As long as I don't race my touring bike, I should be fine. With my personality, I'm going to have a tough time letting a slipping clutch go unresolved. I've got no problem riding a bike with cosmetic issues, but a correctable mechanical problem will drive me nuts eventually. It's an illness really. I'll see how long I can hold out if the new springs don't help much. Might eventually have to get in touch with Skydoc and see if his full plate is the cure.

 

Thanks again guys/gals for all the help getting this bike up and running. I'm pretty darn happy with it! Never dreamed it'd haul the mail like it does (now that all the slides work) and my first long road trip was uber comfortable. 1200 miles down, hopefully many many more to go!

[LukeMacPU]

New clutch springs in. Super easy swap. Spent 10 times as long scraping old gasket off the cover as I did with everything else! [emoji35]

 

Test ride tomorrow hopefully. Not exactly a good time of year to have quality bike time. The Mrs would certainly frown upon me taking off by myself on Christmas Eve leaving her with the wee ones! Weather is crazy warm for December though so I'm enjoying it and will get out there sooner rather than later.

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[LukeMacPU]

It took a while to get that test ride in. Clutch engagement seems more gradual with new springs, but it still slips if I whack it wide open in 5th. May have to look into that full plate after all... someday.

 

Got some new Bluetooth stuff for bike and helmet too. All good and ready to roll! Apparently I can talk on the phone while riding 65-70 and people can still hear me fine. Who knew?!?!

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,

[Doug royal86]

Idont know if anyone has told you, but 2nd gear might go away after awhile. The 83 did have a history of a bad 2nd gear. Mine went out around 50 t0 55, 000 miles. I drove it up to 70,000 before I sold it. (just skip 2nd gear) When I got my 84 I skipped 2nd by habit. Enjoy and good luck

[LukeMacPU]

I've heard 2nd can be a problem. Not looking forward to that, but I also hear the repair is prohibitively expensive.

 

 

My thumbs did this on a tiny keyboard so cut me some slack!,