tires - what to get

[garyS-NJ]

I need some skins for my '84 xvz12D and was thinking of going with the shinko 230 tourmasters. V rated tire and very reasonable.. I have them on my little '83 xj550 and happy as they seem good on dry and wet.. I don't know about the mileage but they might not be a high mileage tire (even though it's a touring tire?), but I'm OK with that as low milage usually means sticky..

 

so any suggestions for a reasonably priced set of tires?

 

oem spec: Front 120/90-18 65H and Rear 140/90-16 71H, but does anyone go up a size?

 

and what about going from biased ply to radials?

[Great White]

Well, you're not going to find radials to fit the rims you have.

 

Bias ply rims are too narrow for radials. You're kind of stuck looking for bias ply options or maybe a cross ply (another type of bias ply) if you can find them. Cross plys are generally tougher due to the carcass construction and a higher belt count. Less ballooning at speed too. That's tougher in the carcass, not the tread surface. Cross plys are what I consider kind of a step between older tech bias plys and modern steel belted radials.

 

I'd have radials on the Venture tomorrow if I could find a 120/70R 17 with a decent load rating. The V pushes them within about 90 odd lbs of thier rating on the front tire. Its just such a heavy pig of a bike. The 160-170 radial rears have plenty of capacity, but the fronts are a PITA. I may just bite the bullet and run some 120/70r17's on a 17x3.5 rim up front and see what I get.

 

Cant help you with the bias ply options, not really my cup o' tea. If I have to run bias tires, I usually just get what fits at a decent "middle of the road" price and just run 'em 'till they wear out.....

Edited October 14, 2015 by Great White

[garyS-NJ]

come on venture riders? you guys ride fast, hard, and long.. what kind of tires get the job done at a reasonable price?? this site here lists a collection of tires for the Goldwing: http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/best-honda-goldwing-gl1800-tires.

 

shinko sport tour tires: (load capability?): http://www.shinkotireusa.com/tires/sport-bike/sport-touring

 

shinko touring tires: (speed rating?): http://www.shinkotireusa.com/tires/cruiser/touring..

 

I can look through the specs but figured I could get a quick comeback tires that do it all for a reasonable price...

[videoarizona]

I have Shinko 230's on my 89. I'm impressed.

 

They ride very well.

Grip like glue.

Don't crab all over the place on ridges and ruts.

Were not expensive.

 

I really don't care if they don't last 10K miles. When the rear tire wears out, then it must be the time to clean and lube the rear end! That's my way of looking at it.

 

I keep air pressure up to within a few pounds of maximum on tire sidewall. Good tires.

david

[GaryZ]

I have Dunlop Elite 2 tires (E2) on my '92 VR and I hate them. They squirm!

My '85 has Elite 3 (E3) tires and I really like them.

The Elites are not particularly cheap, but, they last a long time.

I have Shinko tires on one of my Ninjas and I'm liking them.

The Shinkos need slightly more warm-up and I will likely try them on the '92 soon.

[phonetrouble]

how about Michelin Commander II tires?

They don't make the 120/90x18 for the front, how about going to a 130/90x18 that they do make?

They do make the rear tire and have had one on for over 8k and have enjoyed the wear and rideability.

It is almost time to replace the front and rear again before riding season starts (well, in Oklahoma, we ride almost all year) in the Spring, I want to have a matched pair.

Would the 130 be too wide for my 84?

[garyS-NJ]

I read a lot about tires in the past few years skinning my '83 xj550 and '78 cb750F. Everything said that the OEM size tires with OEM rims give the best handling performance. You can go up for looks but at the price of performance.. I went up very modestly looking at actual tire width for the sporty bikes but thinking my venture is not for looks..

[garyS-NJ]

Whoops, I actually put the brigestone batlaxx BT45's on my cb750 but they don't make tire sizes for the venture.. Got to look more today and down to the following:

 

1. shinko tourmaster 230's best performance for price (might not get the miles but this time I'd watch).. V rated 4 ply about $150 delivered

2. shinko 777's: H rated (and I already like the V rated 230's on my little bike)

3. Avon AV71/72's: $260 delivered but with a 15K miles "warranty" H rated but front is heavier load rating of 71 vs 65 on the shinko230

4. Kenda Kruz 673: H rated and a little more $$ than the shinko 230's and I don't know them

5. IRC WF-920's: H rated and about $220 delivered but this company just doesn't have a large product line/experience to compete with Avon

6. Michelin Commander 2: no front tire at 120/90-18

7. Dunlop Elite 3: Expensive bias ply tire or the D404 upgrade (never heard anything good about a 404).

 

so seems it is the shinko 230's or the avon AV71/72's

[garyS-NJ]

I'm pretty sure the Avon will last longer and the price is proportional to the mileage. But Changing tires is no biggie and I figure what's most important is a good rain tire. So which might be a better rain tire? The cobra or the 230?

[Du-Rron]

See Here:

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?107652-Shinko-777-Tires

[garyS-NJ]

I like the 230s better than the 777

[phonetrouble]

I forgot to mention that we always ride 2 up and sometimes pull a trailer, so need a tire that will handle a heavy load. Wife and I add 400 pounds to the total weight... of course, I am only guessing at her weight...

Also, I have seen some posts that radials don't work well on the 1st gens...

[Great White]

how about Michelin Commander II tires?

They don't make the 120/90x18 for the front, how about going to a 130/90x18 that they do make?

They do make the rear tire and have had one on for over 8k and have enjoyed the wear and rideability.

It is almost time to replace the front and rear again before riding season starts (well, in Oklahoma, we ride almost all year) in the Spring, I want to have a matched pair.

Would the 130 be too wide for my 84?

 

I would say it's too wide. Not because of the added 10mm of section width, but because of the rim width recommendations.

 

If you go to the Michelin 2015 tire fitment guide they list the 130/90 18 and it's a bias ply, so that seems to work (maybe need a little fender massaging at most). But Michelin "conveniently" left out the rim width data in the 2015 guide. Probably for liability issues as much as anything else. Legally, they only want people putting OEM recommended tires on OEM rims.

 

If you go to the last guide where they still gave the rim widths, they didn't offer the commander II in 130/90 18. But if you look at the chart, they do/did offer a 130/90 17 in bias ply. The important numbers here are the section width and aspect ratios, since they they determine rim width needs. If it was an 18 instead of a 17, they rim width needs would be the same. The rim width for that 130/90 17 is listed 3.00. Almost into radial tire rim width territory (most front radials start at 3.5 rim widths)

 

The Venture uses a 2.15 front rim.

 

The 2.15 is pretty narrow for the Michelin commander II front tire with the above info taken into consideration. What it means to you is you could have some odd handling behaviors. Typically, a tire mounted on too narrow a rim ends up with a very rounded cross section due to the sidewalls being pulled in farther than the OEM intended. Some things you can get are a "squirming" feeling under load, slow handling or a bike that seems to "tip in" when leaning (ie: hard to get into a lean and then a quick roll in once it starts).

 

You can even end up width excessive heat in the carcass (due to the sidewalls not running in the plane they were intended for) which can cause tire failure. The heat is caused by the cord plys/carcass in the tire deflecting while in use. We're not talking about bumps, highway running is the worst for heat build up as the flexing happens as the tire rotates down to the road surface and sort of "squishes out" (or flattens if you prefer) at the contact point. All tires do it, the contact surface is flatter than the rest of the tire, but OEM's design for that. But too wide a tire on too narrow a rim deflects the carcass more than the OEM designed for and it builds more heat. It's also a cumulative thing that breaks down the tires strength. Anything from nothing happening at all to to reduced service life to blow outs or tread separation from the carcass could happen. There's just no way to know until it happens since it outside the OEM intended use.

 

The bottom line of all that "blah blah blah" is that I wouldn't put the 130/90 18 MC II on my 2.15 rim. There's just too much difference in the rim width requirements.

 

The problem with the MC II tires is they were intended for the modern "heavy cruiser" market (ie: where the money is) and those typically wear wider rims than the bikes from the 80's.

 

 

Now, if they offered the MC II in the 83-92 Venture rim sizes, I'd have them on my bike tomorrow and probably wouldn't be looking at a custom 17" rim swap for my 83.

 

 

 

I forgot to mention that we always ride 2 up and sometimes pull a trailer, so need a tire that will handle a heavy load. Wife and I add 400 pounds to the total weight... of course, I am only guessing at her weight...

Also, I have seen some posts that radials don't work well on the 1st gens...

 

 

Radials, due to their construction, require wider rims than bias ply tires. Even if you were to find a set of radials to fit the Venture's rim diameters, the rims were designed to wear bias ply tires. As such, the rims width are waaaaay undersize to fit any radial on the market. I wouldn't even try them, you're getting into dangerous territory trying to spoon radial tires on rim widths that are too narrow.

 

A properly balanced trailer (any trailer) should only have about 10-15% of it's total weight on the tongue. So assuming you've got 50 lbs in the trailer (and properly distributed), you're only adding 5-7.5 lbs to the bike weight. The Venture is a heavy bike to start with and comes OEM with a 74H rear tire weight rating. When you're talking 400 lbs in riders, 5-10 lbs is pretty much not even worth considering. More important is stopping the total weight of the bike and trailer, but that's a convo about brakes and not what we're discussing here.

 

 

Of greater concern than the trailer, the Venture is an arse heavy bike. Exactly where you plop all your luggage and yer butts. A 74 tire weight rating charts out at 827 lbs: https://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/docs/Street-Tire-Load-Ratings.pdf .

 

I know my 83 puts 327 lbs on the front tire with a full load of fuel on board (I actually scaled the front tire, rear was too heavy for the scale). That means 473 lbs is on the rear (assuming 800 lb bike) tire of the bike. With a 74 WR rear tire, that means my rear tire can support (within tire OEM ratings) 354 lbs of passenger and cargo. Going over that rating and you get into more heat in the carcass and maybe a failure, maybe not. Maybe just accelerated tire wear. No way to know.

 

Now, keep in mind, people overload these bikes on a regular basis and you don't have them blowing tires, throwing tread or flying off they road everywhere.

 

But if you are buying new tires and you know you're going to be overloaded, it's best to at least try and get a WR in a tire that fits your intended use.

 

Good hunting.

 

Edited October 18, 2015 by Great White

[garyS-NJ]

Haha. Great inputs great white. But I'm only 160 lbs and don't haul any fat chicks. I was thinking more about the tires and concluded I don't give a shot how long it lasts (and load isn't really an issue else the Avon would get it) but rather rain. I want a tire that gets me home in the rain. Everything else is icing on the cake.

[Great White]

Haha. Great inputs great white. But I'm only 160 lbs and don't haul any fat chicks. I was thinking more about the tires and concluded I don't give a shot how long it lasts (and load isn't really an issue else the Avon would get it) but rather rain. I want a tire that gets me home in the rain. Everything else is icing on the cake.

 

I was answering "phonetrouble", but it's all still good info.

 

[garyS-NJ]

Yes of course I know. So who can compare the 230's to the cobras for rain?

[cabreco]

Gary

When I bought my 1984 Venture it had Dunlop E2, I thought the bike ran fine. They were a bit worn so I replaced them with Kenda Kruz (yes I cheaped out) I HATED THE WAY THE BIKE RODE. I sucked it up for a few months & was SO HAPPY when I got a nail in the rear tire. I had it patched & started researching. The top 2 that came up were Metzeler & Dunlop E3. After more research I opted for the Dunlop E3 & couldn't be happier. The Venture rides quiet, smooth & nimble.

Get the E3's you'll be happy you didn't cheap out...ESPECIALLY if you ride a long trips

 

I forgot to mention, the first long haul I took was 2 up with the wife to Tail of the Dragon. in the rain, all weekend & the bike NEVER felt slippery on the road!

Edited October 18, 2015 by cabreco

[camos]

Gary

When I bought my 1984 Venture it had Dunlop E2, I thought the bike ran fine. They were a bit worn so I replaced them with Kenda Kruz (yes I cheaped out) I HATED THE WAY THE BIKE RODE. I sucked it up for a few months & was SO HAPPY when I got a nail in the rear tire. I had it patched & started researching. The top 2 that came up were Metzeler & Dunlop E3. After more research I opted for the Dunlop E3 & couldn't be happier. The Venture rides quiet, smooth & nimble.

Get the E3's you'll be happy you didn't cheap out...ESPECIALLY if you ride a long trips

 

I forgot to mention, the first long haul I took was 2 up with the wife to Tail of the Dragon. in the rain, all weekend & the bike NEVER felt slippery on the road!

Every time I read one of these threads on someone agonizing over tire brands I think how pointless.

Sure there are cheaper tires that do a reasonable job of holding the road but they don't get good mileage. If you do the math, getting E3's is more cost effective than any of the cheaper brands can offer. While it would appear that most of the equally expensive brands have issues that amount to playing Russian Roulette or they only make a tire for one end of the bike so, again, how pointless.

 

[garyS-NJ]

Wow. I didn't see the dunlop e3 front tire available because I was looking for a 120/90-18 but they list it as MR9018.

[cabreco]

Wow. I didn't see the dunlop e3 front tire available because I was looking for a 120/90-18 but they list it as MR9018.

In case you need a conversion chart

 

 

Save yourself the aggravation

 

 

YOU WON'T REGRET E3's!

[garyS-NJ]

Not aggrivation.

[mralex714]

7. Dunlop Elite 3: Expensive bias ply tire or the D404 upgrade (never heard anything good about a 404).

 

so seems it is the shinko 230's or the avon AV71/72's

 

I'm running 404's and were a step up from the Metzlers I had. BTW Elite 2 and 404 have the same tread pattern. Running parts bike I have has Elite 2.

[garyS-NJ]

I'm thinking with three bikes to ride, and not a touring guy, mileage is less and less important so just want a good rain tire and the sink 230s should do..

[cowpuc]

I ran a Full Bore home from the west coast a while back, ended up getting considerable more miles out of it than the 404's under the same conditions (lots of HOT tarmac) and later had a chance to run some mountains down south in LOTS of rain - that cheap Full Bore did an amazing job cutting thru water on the the roads, did a really fine job.. Another one that I would have no problem spooning on Tweeks thats for sure..

[garyS-NJ]

wow, I looked up rain tires and their tread patterns which made me look harder at the shinko 777 over the 230 and feel the 777 might be a better rain tire.. Then I read it should last longer than the 230. and while the 230 is dry, it's slippery wet... and then I saw the 777 has a HD version and a deep tread pattern (rain) and cost a little more than the 230's (so it's a little more tire?). I think only Revzilla had the HD 777 listed.. sold. funny how all the online sellers are so close in pricing// (except cycle gear - which I love for apparel).