86' 1300 tear down. Help and advice please!

[Rusery]

So i am now an owner of a VR 86' 1300 and i am planning on stripping it down and transforming it into my own creation. I am going for a Vmax VR hybrid look and i am seeking some help with a few aspects of getting to the end goal.

 

I have run into some trouble both weird and normal:

 

Taillight, head light, blinkers: These run through the CMU (dash unit) to work correctly, and i have little experience dealing with electronics to come up with a solution in order to bypass this. I guess i can do some splicing but i am wondering if anyone's done anything like this or has other possible solutions in mind.

 

Idles fine but slowly dies (SOLVED)

 

ALSO - i cannot tell if my radiator is working correctly without the CMU connected. The fan doesn't seem to want to work either and i am not sure how i can work around this.. Maybe rig the fan to run 100% of the time? Still have no idea how to figure that out.

 

Currently what she looks like (beautiful):

 

The end result would be chopping that tail end off, shrinking it down, replacing the seat to something more smooth, replacing the headlamp with something meatier and finally obviously replacing the old handlebars with something else that i have not fully decided on.

Edited July 9, 2015 by Rusery

[Flyinfool]

Oh my, Bike porn, she is nearly nekid........

 

Headlight and tail lights and brake lights do run thru CMU but only for a sensor to turn on the warning light if one of them burns out. easily bypassed. The Turn signals do not run thru the CMU but only have a wire into the dash for the dash turn indicators.

 

Get a flashlight and take a look in the tank for rust.

If you ae belo2w a half tank you can pull the sender (under the seat) to look at that half of the tank.

How long has it sat before you got it, it may just be gummed up carbs and some SeaFoam may help.

 

The switch for the fan is located just behind the radiator high on the right side. it is easy to accidentally knock the wire off of the switch. Short the switch wires to see if the fan comes on.

[Rusery]

Oh my, Bike porn, she is nearly nekid........

 

Headlight and tail lights and brake lights do run thru CMU but only for a sensor to turn on the warning light if one of them burns out. easily bypassed. The Turn signals do not run thru the CMU but only have a wire into the dash for the dash turn indicators.

 

Get a flashlight and take a look in the tank for rust.

If you ae belo2w a half tank you can pull the sender (under the seat) to look at that half of the tank.

How long has it sat before you got it, it may just be gummed up carbs and some SeaFoam may help.

 

The switch for the fan is located just behind the radiator high on the right side. it is easy to accidentally knock the wire off of the switch. Short the switch wires to see if the fan comes on.

 

Excellent news for the head/taillights. Thought this was going to be a huge issue for me. I need to somehow also hide all the extra wiring and i believe splicing every single wire to shorten them is out of the question.. I hope i can pull them all back and tuck them under the seat somehow, but thats gonna be a lot of work.

 

I believe its rust for sure now and that i've dislodged something in the gas tank. I believe it was sitting for over a year in Canadian weather. I took a look in the top of the tank and i found some smooth rust spots as well. I stuck a plastic rope down into the tank to see if i could rub on the sides and there was certainly some rust colouration on the rope.

 

Possible to line the tank or treat it?

 

I took a video (below link) of the bike running right now and it sounds like its backfiring, while producing WAY too much white exhaust. Afterwards the exhaust slowly comes out of the tailpipe like a cigarette plume. The backfiring happens around 40 seconds mark. Let me know if the link is broken, and ill try loading it elsewhere.

 

https://vid.me/WIWm

[Flyinfool]

Yes it is possible to line the tank. There are several good writeups on this site of how to do it, and discussions of the different materials available.

 

White smoke out of a cold engine is normal especially if you have high humidity, On a cool damp morning mine looks like a fog generator until it gets warmed up, some backfiring of a cold engine is also normal. Did you have the choke on? Check for exhaust leaks?

[skydoc_17]

With the bike warmed up, Adjust the IDLE SCREW on the left side of the engine, (as you are sitting on the bike) the adjustment screw is the ONLY screw that has a head on it that you can turn with your hand. (Thumb Screw) If you need to use a screwdriver, you are turning the WRONG screw. Get the bike to idle at 1000RPM's (warmed up) The tank can be coated, but I would drain the tank, put in a fresh set of plugs and add NEW gas. You are seeing moisture that has collect in the Ethanol fuel in the tank. I would also drain the Carb. bowles. Here is a write up I did a few years ago about cleaning the Carbs. on the bike:

 

Cleaning First Gen. Carbs. On The Bike

 

I use this cleaning method to unstick a float needle that is causing the gas tank to drain when the bike is parked, or for a Carb. That is passing raw gas out of the overflow tube when the bike is running. This on bike cleaning DOES NOT address the issue of a Carb. Set needing a complete rebuild, (off the bike) and does not address the issue of AIR PASSAGES being blocked, and causing poor performance. These two issues require the Carbs. be removed from the bike.

 

With the bike on the center stand, and the engine off, I select the first Carb. I want to clean. You will be looking for the Black Plastic Carb. Drain Tube, and the screw that opens that drain. (Phillips Head Screw) You will need a small coffee can, or a coke can with the top cut off, (NO plastic containers) to catch the gas that will come out when you open the drain screw. Allow all of the gas to drain from the Carb. and have a look in the can for “floaters”. (Solid particles) With a new can of Carb. Cleaner, insert the red straw in the end of the drain tube. I wrap the junction of the red straw, and the drain tube with a small piece of shop towel to slow the blow by. Press the button on the top of the can of Carb. Cleaner, and count to 3. Remove the red straw and let the cleaner fluid run into the coffee can. Move to the next Carb. and repeat. When you do Carb. #4, start over again, and do them again. I use up one can of Carb. Cleaner on the four Carbs. When the can of Carb. Cleaner is gone, retighten all four drain tube screws,

(CAUTION DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN THE DRAIN SCREWS) Turn on the ignition switch, (do not start bike) listen for the fuel pump to fill the Carb. Bowles and stop pumping, check the drain tubes and the overflow tubes (down in front of rear tire) for fuel leakage, move the can with the Carb. Cleaner/Gas mixture away from the bike, (or better yet, roll the bike out of the garage) and start the bike. (It may take a few short bursts on the starter motor, and you may need to choke it as well) Go for a ride and “blow the cobwebs out” (my personal FAV part) if this doesn’t solve your problem, then a “Carbs. Off Rebuild” may be in order. On a side note, I run 3 ounces of Seafoam in every tank of gas I put in my 87’and 89’VR because of the negative effects of the Ethanol in the fuel these days. Because of my shop here in South Central PA. I buy OEM parts direct from Yamaha, and share my discount with the VR.ORG members. It would be my pleasure to help you with any project you have in mind for your First Gen. VR.

 

Another Suggestion is to look at the Front Brake and Clutch Master Cylinder Reservoirs on the handlebars. You will see a plastic plug located on each side. If you remove the plastic plugs, you can install a set on "conventional" motorcycle mirrors in these two locations. (like a set of VMAX mirrors, or aftermarket) Keep in mind that the left side, (clutch side) mirror threaded hole is threaded left handed, so you will need a set of mirrors with one side right hand thread, and one side left hand thread.

The last suggestion would be to extend the sides of the "false tank cover" either with sheet metal, or if you still have the original side covers, you can cut them down to your liking.

Good luck with your projects Rusery, if you have questions, or need parts, feel free to contact me.

Earl

[Rusery]

@ Flyinfool - Thanks for the reply on this, i couldn't find the resource but its probably because i am a trial member. Just seeing the amount of help here and topics makes that 12$ 100% worth it and i would like to contribute to the community here as well if i can. Especially people modding their VRs.

 

 

With the bike warmed up, Adjust the IDLE SCREW on the left side of the engine, (as you are sitting on the bike) the adjustment screw is the ONLY screw that has a head on it that you can turn with your hand. (Thumb Screw) If you need to use a screwdriver, you are turning the WRONG screw. Get the bike to idle at 1000RPM's (warmed up) The tank can be coated, but I would drain the tank, put in a fresh set of plugs and add NEW gas. You are seeing moisture that has collect in the Ethanol fuel in the tank. I would also drain the Carb. bowles. Here is a write up I did a few years ago about cleaning the Carbs. on the bike:

 

Cleaning First Gen. Carbs. On The Bike

 

I use this cleaning method to unstick a float needle that is causing the gas tank to drain when the bike is parked, or for a Carb. That is passing raw gas out of the overflow tube when the bike is running. This on bike cleaning DOES NOT address the issue of a Carb. Set needing a complete rebuild, (off the bike) and does not address the issue of AIR PASSAGES being blocked, and causing poor performance. These two issues require the Carbs. be removed from the bike.

 

With the bike on the center stand, and the engine off, I select the first Carb. I want to clean. You will be looking for the Black Plastic Carb. Drain Tube, and the screw that opens that drain. (Phillips Head Screw) You will need a small coffee can, or a coke can with the top cut off, (NO plastic containers) to catch the gas that will come out when you open the drain screw. Allow all of the gas to drain from the Carb. and have a look in the can for “floaters”. (Solid particles) With a new can of Carb. Cleaner, insert the red straw in the end of the drain tube. I wrap the junction of the red straw, and the drain tube with a small piece of shop towel to slow the blow by. Press the button on the top of the can of Carb. Cleaner, and count to 3. Remove the red straw and let the cleaner fluid run into the coffee can. Move to the next Carb. and repeat. When you do Carb. #4, start over again, and do them again. I use up one can of Carb. Cleaner on the four Carbs. When the can of Carb. Cleaner is gone, retighten all four drain tube screws,

(CAUTION DO NOT OVERTIGHTEN THE DRAIN SCREWS) Turn on the ignition switch, (do not start bike) listen for the fuel pump to fill the Carb. Bowles and stop pumping, check the drain tubes and the overflow tubes (down in front of rear tire) for fuel leakage, move the can with the Carb. Cleaner/Gas mixture away from the bike, (or better yet, roll the bike out of the garage) and start the bike. (It may take a few short bursts on the starter motor, and you may need to choke it as well) Go for a ride and “blow the cobwebs out” (my personal FAV part) if this doesn’t solve your problem, then a “Carbs. Off Rebuild” may be in order. On a side note, I run 3 ounces of Seafoam in every tank of gas I put in my 87’and 89’VR because of the negative effects of the Ethanol in the fuel these days. Because of my shop here in South Central PA. I buy OEM parts direct from Yamaha, and share my discount with the VR.ORG members. It would be my pleasure to help you with any project you have in mind for your First Gen. VR.

 

Another Suggestion is to look at the Front Brake and Clutch Master Cylinder Reservoirs on the handlebars. You will see a plastic plug located on each side. If you remove the plastic plugs, you can install a set on "conventional" motorcycle mirrors in these two locations. (like a set of VMAX mirrors, or aftermarket) Keep in mind that the left side, (clutch side) mirror threaded hole is threaded left handed, so you will need a set of mirrors with one side right hand thread, and one side left hand thread.

The last suggestion would be to extend the sides of the "false tank cover" either with sheet metal, or if you still have the original side covers, you can cut them down to your liking.

Good luck with your projects Rusery, if you have questions, or need parts, feel free to contact me.

Earl

 

 

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! Now that is some amazing advice. The amount of searching i have done for a GOOD solution for servicing carbs probably ranks around the 20 hour mark.

 

I forgot to mention in my first post that the first few times i ran the bike when i got her home, it was spitting gas out of the carb drain hoses (unsure which carb), probably due to sticky floats. I let the bike sit for about a week after that as i was away and too busy to spend good time on her. When i came back to work on it, the bike wouldn't idle at all, which is where i am today kind of. I went out and bought Deep Creep seafoam, an oil sealing agent and some rustremoval for the tank. I plan on pulling it off and doing the tank first to get the rust out of it. THEN hit the carbs using your method. I am going to start off with a few ounces of seafoam in the fuel tank on the VR to get it working in the system, then start the process. Any additional advice on using seafoam for long term operational use or carb cleaning?

[zagger]

IMO, the smoke coming out of the exhaust looks like burnt oil, not steam from a water leak. If the engine hasn't been run for months or longer, it is entirely possible that a little engine oil got past the valve seals, coated the piston and inside of the head, and was blown into the exhaust system when the engine started. This oil will start smoking pretty good when the engine and exhaust system warms up, but eventually the oil will be consumed and the smoke will stop. Yesterday I started up an old bike that sat idle for a couple of years. Once the exhaust was hot, it started pumping out lots of white smoke (like yours). I switched it off, let it cool (with smoke drifting out the exhaust pipe), and started it again. More smoke, but volume was decreasing. Let it cool again. Ran it today and smoke was nearly gone. Since it doesn't have a serious oil leak past the valves, I'm guessing that I won't see more smoke during normal use. The abnormal smoke simply comes from oil that slowly leaked past the valves during the extended storage time.

 

Gas tank rust: I had to loosen and clean out lots of rust in the gas tank of my '83. The inside surfaces of the welded seams in the tank are particularly prone to getting rusty. After cleaning out as much rust as possible (just get creative with wires, chains, etc.), I sealed the inside of the tank with a coating called Red Kote (http://www.amazon.com/Red-Kote-Quart-Sealer-Diesel/dp/B009X0JOSM). Works well but is very smelly and should be used outdoors! As I vaguely remember, I diluted the Red Kote with a little extra MEK (methyl ethyl ketone) to make it a bit less syrupy.

 

Good luck,

zag

[Rusery]

IMO, the smoke coming out of the exhaust looks like burnt oil, not steam from a water leak. If the engine hasn't been run for months or longer, it is entirely possible that a little engine oil got past the valve seals, coated the piston and inside of the head, and was blown into the exhaust system when the engine started. This oil will start smoking pretty good when the engine and exhaust system warms up, but eventually the oil will be consumed and the smoke will stop. Yesterday I started up an old bike that sat idle for a couple of years. Once the exhaust was hot, it started pumping out lots of white smoke (like yours). I switched it off, let it cool (with smoke drifting out the exhaust pipe), and started it again. More smoke, but volume was decreasing. Let it cool again. Ran it today and smoke was nearly gone. Since it doesn't have a serious oil leak past the valves, I'm guessing that I won't see more smoke during normal use. The abnormal smoke simply comes from oil that slowly leaked past the valves during the extended storage time.

 

Gas tank rust: I had to loosen and clean out lots of rust in the gas tank of my '83. The inside surfaces of the welded seams in the tank are particularly prone to getting rusty. After cleaning out as much rust as possible (just get creative with wires, chains, etc.), I sealed the inside of the tank with a coating called Red Kote (http://www.amazon.com/Red-Kote-Quart-Sealer-Diesel/dp/B009X0JOSM). Works well but is very smelly and should be used outdoors! As I vaguely remember, I diluted the Red Kote with a little extra MEK (methyl ethyl ketone) to make it a bit less syrupy.

 

Good luck,

zag

 

 

Excellent advice! I will be checking into the tank liner, good to know about a specific product since there are so many. Also yeah, after i ran it around more there is no more backfiring, no more smoke and no more issues other than my low idle. Ill be doing that foam treatment before i get into the thick of it with a full clean. Has anyone here done a sea foam treatment into the air intake? Im thinking taking the filter out, and spraying some sea foam right into the carbs from above to really get them at the heart.

[VanRiver]

Hi @Rusery, welcome to the forum...nice scoot, I look forward to seeing all your future mods to it!

 

Please listen to the other guys like @Flyinfool and @skydoc_17 more then me as I can only dream about having 1/10th of their knowledge and experience on these bikes (they are my hero's), but I had a similar "white/gray" smoke issue with one of my Ventures too when I first bought it.......I was worried it was burning oil (bad rings) or steam from a coolant leak (head gasket)....but after all the troubleshooting my bike stopped smoking as soon as I put new properly gapped plugs in AND Synchronized my carbs. The Syncing of the carbs was really the thing that did it as my bike was so out of whack with one cylinder sucking so much fuel that it was off the charts on my meter. Could have sucked a tennis ball through a garden house!. Plus the original plugs were complete not gapped properly and not putting out the right spark to make that gas go boom.

 

Long story short, my smoke was due to inefficient combustion of fuel and not all those other scary issues usually associated to smoke out of the exhaust. The key is the color of your smoke and the bullet proof nature of these engines, they are not known to have head gasket issues or ring failures even at high mileage.

 

You have a lot of work a head of you including carb cleaning, making sure you carb slides are jumping properly and no pin holes in your carb diaphragms.....but my advise is to get yourself a nice carb sync tool and make sure she is burning the fresh gas efficiently. But that is fun work...not work work!

[Rusery]

Hi @Rusery, welcome to the forum...nice scoot, I look forward to seeing all your future mods to it!

 

Please listen to the other guys like @Flyinfool and @skydoc_17 more then me as I can only dream about having 1/10th of their knowledge and experience on these bikes (they are my hero's), but I had a similar "white/gray" smoke issue with one of my Ventures too when I first bought it.......I was worried it was burning oil (bad rings) or steam from a coolant leak (head gasket)....but after all the troubleshooting my bike stopped smoking as soon as I put new properly gapped plugs in AND Synchronized my carbs. The Syncing of the carbs was really the thing that did it as my bike was so out of whack with one cylinder sucking so much fuel that it was off the charts on my meter. Could have sucked a tennis ball through a garden house!. Plus the original plugs were complete not gapped properly and not putting out the right spark to make that gas go boom.

 

Long story short, my smoke was due to inefficient combustion of fuel and not all those other scary issues usually associated to smoke out of the exhaust. The key is the color of your smoke and the bullet proof nature of these engines, they are not known to have head gasket issues or ring failures even at high mileage.

 

You have a lot of work a head of you including carb cleaning, making sure you carb slides are jumping properly and no pin holes in your carb diaphragms.....but my advise is to get yourself a nice carb sync tool and make sure she is burning the fresh gas efficiently. But that is fun work...not work work!

 

Nice to meet you Van and yeah i can already tell from skulking around the forums that thems two guys know what theyre saying! After buying a bike like this, i didn't know there was such a large community and im very happy to see that there is one. Honestly, i thought this bike was much lesser known than it is. I didn't do a lot of research before i bought it because the guy was selling it for 800$ with 50k on it and had people lined up down the proverbial "block" to buy it off him. I immediately went to the bank and got him his petty 800 clams in exchange for this sex machine!! Anyhow, i did learn that 1st gen 82

 

So far a lot of planned work and i am looking for the correct plug type but i am getting two types.

 

Can anyone confirm that the 86' takes DPR8EA-9 NGK plugs? Im going to stick Iridiums in her for that extra kick and insurance.

 

I am also looking at universal handlebar mounts that will sit in the tripple tree. I am unsure which size to get and am reluctant to buy the wrong size for this bike, because i know nothing is truly universal haha.

[VanRiver]

Yup the DPR8EA-9 is the right plug....I personally only use the traditional standard plugs in my Venture that Mother Yamaha intended. I find with these bikes they like fresh plugs so I treat them like underwear (I change them often).

The standard plugs are nice and cheap plus easy to find compared to Iridiums so I don't feel obligated to keep them in longer to get my "moneys worth".

 

But that is just my personal opinion and how I maintain my bikes. Don't really know if Iridiums make the gas go BOOM any better.

 

Nice to meet you Van and yeah i can already tell from skulking around the forums that thems two guys know what theyre saying! After buying a bike like this, i didn't know there was such a large community and im very happy to see that there is one. Honestly, i thought this bike was much lesser known than it is. I didn't do a lot of research before i bought it because the guy was selling it for 800$ with 50k on it and had people lined up down the proverbial "block" to buy it off him. I immediately went to the bank and got him his petty 800 clams in exchange for this sex machine!! Anyhow, i did learn that 1st gen 82

 

So far a lot of planned work and i am looking for the correct plug type but i am getting two types.

 

Can anyone confirm that the 86' takes DPR8EA-9 NGK plugs? Im going to stick Iridiums in her for that extra kick and insurance.

 

I am also looking at universal handlebar mounts that will sit in the tripple tree. I am unsure which size to get and am reluctant to buy the wrong size for this bike, because i know nothing is truly universal haha.

[Rusery]

I have the same philosophy with my bikes and the only reason i like the Iridium is because of the enhanced spark i get out of them as well as the resistance they have to fouling. As you're from Alberta you can attest to the winters in this country as being horrible for bike starting. I drive my bikes until snowfall, and additionally when the roads are clear on an unusually mild day ill even ride then! Where i do try to get my moneys worth is usually my oil as i use synthetic but even then i change every 7k.. Haha.