Indian Roadmaster Thoughts

[Freebird]

Some of you who were at Maintenance Day may have heard me talk about taking a look at the Indian Roadmaster. There are many things I like about it but a few things that I don't. I know that the front fender is an iconic Indian feature but I'm still not sure if I like it. At any rate, the one thing I mentioned was that I needed to do some research in regards to engine heat. The only complaint I have with the Road Glide so far is the excessive heat from the engine. It gets quite uncomfortable on even a warm day.

 

Well I haven't gone to test ride one yet and now I probably won't. I spend a good bit of time doing some online research and have seen about all that I need to. There are a LOT of complaints about excessive engine heat. A short test ride on a hot day has led many to commenting that they would not be buying one. Some say it can actually be painful, as I admit that it can be on the Road Glide.

 

A few other things that I have read.

 

At least one person has developed oil leaks at around 3,000 miles. No specifics except that the engine is being pulled to repair it and it is taking a long time to get the parts.

 

Complaints about the brown leather seat. There are reports that it looks great when new but looks very bad after only a few months. Eileen didn't like the brown seat anyway. When I showed her pictures of the bike, her comment was that she hated the "orange" seat. Not a problem because they offer a black heated seat as an option but of course, it is big bucks.

 

This one is HUGE to me though. No integrated intercom or cb. I know that many people will just use bluetooth headsets for intercom but that doesn't solve the cb issue. It's not something that we use all the time but I feel is almost a MUST when riding with a group. I know there will be aftermarket solutions and the J&M is probably already available but again, MORE money. This is something that I feel a touring bike that cost 30 grand should have.

 

Several complaints from tall and also larger riders about feeling cramped, especially when riding two up. Highway pegs and possibly moving the trunk back would probably help and if there is not already a trunk relocation kit on the market, there probably will be very soon.

 

So, I guess I'm over my desire to even go ride one. I'll just keep what I have for now. The Roadmaster has potential but I think a wait and see attitude until they have been on the road for awhile is in order.

[Motiv]

Just get the new V-Max powered Venture when it comes out in October.

[Freebird]

If they keep the "cruiser" styling, it is a possibility.

 

I tell you though. Anybody thinking about a Roadmaster should spend some time reading posts on the Indian forum. Many reports of engine whine, pealing chrome, seats breaking down, oil leaks, excessive heat, electronic issues, etc.

[BigLenny]

Don,

 

Great read on your research of the Roadmaster! My wife and I test rode that bike back in September at Bikes Blues and BBQ, and I was highly impressed with the power, smoothness, and overall feel of the bike. However, I did notice the heat from the motor. And it wasn't a hot day. Something about the looks and mystic of that machine really appeals to me, but after reading about the issues you brought up in your post, I'm not about to put up with all that kind of mess from a bike that cost $30K.

[SilvrT]

Seems many of the V-twin air cooled bikes have a "heat" issue. Harley, Victory, Indian, .... what about some of the others like Kawasaki, Honda and Yamaha V-twins (even though some of them aren't air cooled).... anyone know?

 

Temps were in the low to mid 30's over the weekend (that's appx 90f) and I was noticing a fair amount of heat when stopped in traffic but it wasn't so bad that I couldn't live with it. Would have been a lot worse though had I not gutted the CATs out of the head pipes.

 

During a ride on Saturday though I noticed my butt was getting quite hot ... even while moving along at 80km/h (50 mph) ... that was really odd and I was beginning to think there was something wrong .... and in fact, as I soon discovered, there was!!!

 

Turns out my son who was on the ride with me flipped my seat heater switch on to HIGH at our last stop !!! :Laugh: He should know me better by now ... I don't get mad, I just get EVEN!

[cowpuc]

Billmac and I were talking about the new Roadmaster at a recent Puc's Friends Greet - Meet and Eat Hot Dogs (get a plug in here - next time you see one posted make sure you take the day off work and come on out - so what if it cost you your job and you have total financial collapse - Hot Dogs are worth it!!!).

Willy (Billmac) shared with me something really interesting that he discovered about the Roadmaster. I was telling him about the heat I had felt while testing the Indian and he was telling me that the heated seats on those puppys are "on" automatically when you start the bike up and that there is a switch on the right side of the saddle that you have to turn "off" after starting the bike. Just sharing this so if one of our VR Family does do a demo they give the bike a fair shake..

Now, in other fairness about the Indian, I too think it is very wise to do the research like Don did (THANK YOU BOSS) and maybe even watch for a posted gathering of Indian riders that you could sneak up on. Attend the gathering and listen to the chatter about how things are going.. I have found, that especially with a "new" breed of bike - folks arent always totally open to sharing vital info about there experiences with outsiders.. Places like the Sturgis Rally (planning on being there this fall) are ALWAYS good for this kind of stuff..

Following up on what Don was saying, I would like to add that Polaris had some real issues with the beginning of their Victory line and basically turned their backs on the first two years of warranty work drastically needed by those early purchasers.. Now I am not saying they are even remotely the same company as they were back then BUT - it might be prudent to also ask around about how they (Polaris) are treating the new Indian purchasers at this time.. Dont misread this, I LOVE the new Indians BUT - if I were gonna spend 30k on a scoot (or anything for that matter - THAT is a LOT of cash in my book) I would want to know what I was getting as a "package" before I dropped the coin:detective:

[BigLenny]

SiverT,

 

I absolutely LOVE the look of the CCT! That bike has turned me on ever since it hit the market. I have test rode it a few times and really dig the way it rides and it certainly is a conversation piece when at gas stations and such. Red is my personal favorite. My RSTD is Red/Black, my F150 is red, my wife Altima is red, etc. However, the one thing that has held me up from pulling the trigger is the fact that it is air cooled, and there is a consistent discussion on the forums about engine heat. I have not ever had a heat experience with my RSTD, and I'm not really wanting to put me and my wife in a situation where it's a blazing hot day out, and we're also having to deal with heat coming off the bike. Harley has helped themselves a considerable amount by semi wet heading there Ultra's. I know two different people who traded there old HD's for the new water cooled ones, and they both say the heat reduction is substantial and they love it. A few times I have test ridden the Vision, which I think is an interesting looking machine, but man, the heat was immmediately on my right inner thigh. I think the big fixed fairing attributes to that.

 

As far as the Jap brands having heat issues on their air cooled bikes, I'm not really verse on that, but I do know that the water cooled Kawasaki Voyager has been plagued with some serious heat issues. So much so that they installed some sort of blower system under the seat on the newer models.

 

Sounds like you have yourself a mischievous son on your hands. LOL.

[SilvrT]

SiverT,

 

I absolutely LOVE the look of the CCT! That bike has turned me on ever since it hit the market. I have test rode it a few times and really dig the way it rides and it certainly is a conversation piece when at gas stations and such. Red is my personal favorite. My RSTD is Red/Black, my F150 is red, my wife Altima is red, etc. However, the one thing that has held me up from pulling the trigger is the fact that it is air cooled, and there is a consistent discussion on the forums about engine heat. I have not ever had a heat experience with my RSTD, and I'm not really wanting to put me and my wife in a situation where it's a blazing hot day out, and we're also having to deal with heat coming off the bike. Harley has helped themselves a considerable amount by semi wet heading there Ultra's. I know two different people who traded there old HD's for the new water cooled ones, and they both say the heat reduction is substantial and they love it. A few times I have test ridden the Vision, which I think is an interesting looking machine, but man, the heat was immmediately on my right inner thigh. I think the big fixed fairing attributes to that.

 

As far as the Jap brands having heat issues on their air cooled bikes, I'm not really verse on that, but I do know that the water cooled Kawasaki Voyager has been plagued with some serious heat issues. So much so that they installed some sort of blower system under the seat on the newer models.

 

Sounds like you have yourself a mischievous son on your hands. LOL.

 

Ya, you'd think at 45 he'd of grown out of that by now LOL

 

Well I'll be totally up front and candid regarding the heat issue on my Vic.

 

When we first got it, the heat was very noticeable, specifically on the right side and directly under the passenger floorboard. I could feel it and so could my wife... a LOT. After a bit of research I found 2 things that, for the most part, reduce that heat significantly.

 

1. Removal of the Catalytic converters. Those things are in the head pipes and directly underneath the right passenger floorboard. So I did that ... a bit of a PITA job but the effort was well worth it. While there is still some heat, it was no where near what it was.

 

2. Dyno tune. Install a power commander and have the bike dyno tuned. This sets the optimum air/fuel/timing mapping at various rpms and throttle positions and does make the engine run cooler, not to mention add power. You have to understand that all bikes are set at the manufacturer to meet and or exceed EPA guidelines and because of that, they're really not running at their optimum levels.

 

One of the nice things about the Victory line is that they are both Air and Oil cooled and they have a fairly large oil cooler. You will never have to worry about them overheating (according to those who ride in the deep south).

 

So, in summary, I won't try and tell you that there is no heat from the engine but what I will say is you will notice it in stop and go traffic on a hot day but (and this depends on each individual) ... it is bearable and it won't burn the inside of your leg, IF you do at least number one above. I should add, it's not so much that it's ENGINE heat alone but rather, heat from the header pipes and crossover collector.

 

Every bike will have it's downside(s). For me, there are so many positives about this bike that I can put up with a little bit of extra heat on hot days in stop and go traffic. When you've moving along, it's not an issue.

 

If there's anything else you want to know about them, feel free to ask.

[BigLenny]

SilerT,

 

It's good to know there are things that can be done to reduce the heat. Thanks for being candid.

 

Let me ask you; how is your bike's fit and finish holding up? Are there rattles where there shouldn't be rattles? Or, have you had issues with nit pick things that shouldn't happen? Hows the paint quality?

[SilvrT]

SilerT,

 

It's good to know there are things that can be done to reduce the heat. Thanks for being candid.

 

Let me ask you; how is your bike's fit and finish holding up? Are there rattles where there shouldn't be rattles? Or, have you had issues with nit pick things that shouldn't happen? Hows the paint quality?

 

Created a new thread soas to not hijack Freebird's thread .... after all, he's the boss and we could get into a big heap of kaka if'n we wuz to do that .....

[WildBill1]

Freebird if you are riding an air cooled Harley, stick with much better motor than Polaris Indian. Indian engine oil is also the transmission and primary too which is bad for an Air cooled engine. Oil is contaminated 50 miles after its changed. Whereas Harley has separate oil cases. I think transmissions need gear oil anyway.

[Freebird]

and I think that is good advice. I'll just keep my Road Glide. I'm actually very happy with it.

[Ride2much]

Also tested a RM, but,until the seat issue is fixed and the paint issue and the heat issue are fixed,I am not forking out 30K

[SilvrT]

Freebird if you are riding an air cooled Harley, stick with much better motor than Polaris Indian. Indian engine oil is also the transmission and primary too which is bad for an Air cooled engine. Oil is contaminated 50 miles after its changed. Whereas Harley has separate oil cases. I think transmissions need gear oil anyway.

 

WHAT??? YOU JEST ... YES??

 

NO? ... then maybe you should advise all the manufacturers of motorcycles about this as apparently none of them know about it LOL

[billmac]

My star chapter rode the Indians on a demo day and I rode the RM, before we took off the guide walked around each rider to help with the location of the controls and how they worked and I said what about the heat some are talking about and he pointed out the seat heater switch on the right side of the seat and said they come on when you start the bike and most don't know that and it gets really hot and turned it off. The RM was a great ride and the trans only made a clunk once in awhile but my rstd and Harley does that sometimes. handled great and had plenty of power to get up and go. I did not use the radio because I wanted to hear the engine and listen for noises and rattled I found none. Don't remember how many mile were on the bike but if I an extra 30 grand would get one.

[WildBill1]

WHAT??? YOU JEST ... YES??

 

NO? ... then maybe you should advise all the manufacturers of motorcycles about this as apparently none of them know about it LOL

 

They already know why, its a cheap simple design that doesn't necessarily make it the best design for an air cooled motor. I had no problems with one oil I my Venture, but I see problems in the long run with the Polaris Indian.

[Zzyzx]

Don,

I got the chance to ride the Roadmaster and the other two bagger versions during the local demo days and found the Roadmaster to be a real nice ride with a nice center of gravity and easy to handle.

I got the chance to ride it 3 times that day and found the controls were placed nicely and except for the crappy radio, no intercom or CB, was options nicely.

 

We road down and back near the American River on a nice road with a few twists and turns and I was impressed with the power and how easily it took the curves.

The transmission was a bit loud and had some shifting noise but did not feel any real excessive heat coming off the engine during the ride but, it was only around 75 degrees that day so cannot attest to how it would be during hot summer rides.

 

I don't know why but the Roadmaster seemed to handle better in the turns than the baggers, maybe just my perception.

 

The tan seat color looks nice from the beginning but have seen a couple of them that are beginning to turn a bit darker in some areas. Maybe a good dye job would do the trick???

 

With the warranty being changed to only 2 years and still a fairly new offering for Polaris I think I would spend $30K on something a bit more true and tested.

[BigLenny]

Don,

 

I know you say you are very happy with your Glide, but let me tell you a story. My cousin and his wife were long time Wing owners. They went through 3 Goldwings over 15 years and rode them from one end of the U.S. to the other. In 2013, during a trip out west, they stopped at a Harley dealer in Colorado because they were riding with some Harley folks. While they were there, they shocked all of us who know them and traded in their Goldwing for a brand new 2013 Road Glide Ultra (exact color as yours). Blew our minds because they were die hard Wing people. Anyway, they wound up loving everything about the Glide except the heat from the motor. They weren't used to that from the Wing, but they toughed it out and reluctantly made themselves get used to it. They loved loved loved everything about the Glide and Harley in general, except for the heat issue. Anyway, they had the Glide for a year or so, and then Harley came out with the Rushmore edition water cooled Ultra's. They were on a ride in Tulsa and stopped at a Harley dealer to take a break. They test rode the new Electra Glide Ultra and couldn't believe how much better the bike rode with all of the improvements. Plus they loved the upgraded latches, touchscreen infotainment center, LED lights, etc.... The dealer made them a heck of a deal on trading in there Glide(I couldn't believe how much they got for the Glide) and they bought the EG Ultra water cooled. My cousin immediately said after he bought the bike, and continues to say, he can't believe how much cooler the bike runs with the water cooling. He said it's night and day difference. They are crazy about it! As you know, Harley did a ton of upgrades to the Rushmore bikes, and it has vaulted them forward quite a bit.

 

So, I gave you that too long story to say this; If your ever get to where you want to make a change to get away from the heat that your Glide puts off, you might just want to stay with Harley and give the new water cooled bike a shot. With all the new improvements they have made to the bike, it actually feels like a completely different machine.

 

BTW, my cousin at first kinda baulked at the idea of getting a handlebar mounted fairing bike because he had been so used to the Wing and the Road Glide, but he reports that with the new aerodynamics of the new fairing on the EG Ultra, he doesn't even notice any difference with wind than he did with a fixed faring.

[SilvrT]

Since aerodynamics and wind has been mentioned above, .... a few weeks back we had Harley demo days ... Saturday at one location, Sunday at another, and I went both times and rode 3 times. Each was on an Ultra Limited, one being the "low" version.

 

Compared to my Vic, or my Wing and RSMV, I found the Ultra to not be as good. I was getting more head buffeting and body buffeting on the Ultra. I could really feel it under my arms and on my knees. Never felt any of that on the Vic, Wing, or RSMV.

 

As for the water cooled Harley, has your cousin come across any issues with that as I've heard there's been some problems with it.

[SilvrT]

They already know why, its a cheap simple design that doesn't necessarily make it the best design for an air cooled motor. I had no problems with one oil I my Venture, but I see problems in the long run with the Polaris Indian.

 

You see it with the Indian but not with other, similar bikes (like the Victory for example) ??

[Freebird]

I appreciate the reports on the Rushmore but I have to tell you, it goes contrary to everything I have heard. I know a couple of riders who have them and they say that they run just as hot. I also talked to my dealer about it and he told me that their tests have proved that it runs absolutely no cooler. I haven't ridden one so can't say one way or the other. The dealer told met that it allowed them to make some performance improvements without heating them up even further but that they don't run cooler. Of the two riders that I personally know that own them, both have had multiple problems with overheating and the small radiator burping out the coolant. One is a Tri Glide that a friend traded for. He traded his 2012 Tri Glide for a new 2015 Tri Glide and tells me that it was a HUGE mistake. He has had it on the shop 7 times for overheating and they still haven't solved the problem.

 

I'm really glad to hear a good report about it but I'll take a watch and wait approach to it just as I will the Roadmaster. I'm actually not in the market for a bike. My Road Glide only has about 9,000 miles on it and I pretty much have it all setup as I like. I just thought that, for the most part, the new Roadmaster looked pretty good and if the reviews had been better in regards to the heat, I would have gone and tried one out.

 

I'm over it now.

[BigLenny]

Since aerodynamics and wind has been mentioned above, .... a few weeks back we had Harley demo days ... Saturday at one location, Sunday at another, and I went both times and rode 3 times. Each was on an Ultra Limited, one being the "low" version.

 

Compared to my Vic, or my Wing and RSMV, I found the Ultra to not be as good. I was getting more head buffeting and body buffeting on the Ultra. I could really feel it under my arms and on my knees. Never felt any of that on the Vic, Wing, or RSMV.

 

As for the water cooled Harley, has your cousin come across any issues with that as I've heard there's been some problems with it.

 

No, My cousin has had no problems whatsoever with his bike. I talked to him about 15 minutes ago. He said Harley has had some recalls that he had to take it in for, but everything has been awesome!

When I test rode the EG Ultra I really liked it. I was very impressed. But there is one unfixable issue with the bike that kicks it out of my radar. The bike isn't near long enough for me. I'm 6'6" and I feel like i"M scrunched up on the bike when I'm on it. That's why I like the CCT. It's a long feeling bike with huge floorboards. My RSTD is a long feeling bike that fits me real well. The Harley folks have told me there is a tall boy seat that you cane buy to help with that issue, but it only sets back about an inch. That wouldn't be enough for me on that bike.

[cowpuc]

Yep, I have actually seen the overheat you are referring to Don.. This may sound really far fetched but I have a hunch that the water cavity on the Rushmore heads just arent big enough to handle the coolant needed for even just cooling the exhaust valves.

Another interesting thing - Larry, a really good friend of mine, bought a brand new Ultra Limited in 2010. That puppy was one HOT son of Harley - especially for his wife. After the bike got about 500 miles on it we ripped into it - mainly to make it pull like it should. Tuner, head work, after market pipes (rid of catalytics), cams, more effecient breather ect ect.. Dynoed out a 103 horse and 106 torque - torque curve straight as an arrow.. Suprisingly, after getting his bike to run like all Harleys should (IMHO) we were shocked to find how much cooler it ran - A LOT COOLER!! I think even just getting rid of the catyletic and sticking on a race tuner so a dyno guy can fatten it up top to bottom (they are really lean from Harley - regs and all that) would be a really good start!!

[SilvrT]

The bike isn't near long enough for me. I'm 6'6" and I feel like i"M scrunched up on the bike when I'm on it.

 

I'm 5' 11" and I felt fairly comfy but sure didn't like the lack of room on the floorboards. Nor did I like how high I had to lift my foot to apply the brake or shift gears. I felt "scrunched" when I rode the "low" version as it seemed the seat design pushed my butt further forward in comparison to the standard configuration ... it wasn't long before my back started bothering me due to that.

 

That's why I like the CCT. It's a long feeling bike with huge floorboards.

 

Absolutely LOVE my floorboards and leg room / seating position ... I've been tossing around the idea of getting some highway pegs but I really don't need them as I can stretch out my legs just fine with what's there. I have a 32" inseam. About the only thing the pegs would do for me is provide a place to rest the toe of my boot on.

[billmac]

Hey Don, you can go ride one and not buy it.