midnightrider1300 Posted April 9, 2015 Share #1 Posted April 9, 2015 as many of you know I work in sales at a motorcycle dealership. The Yamaha factory rep came in yesterday and I just point blank asked him IF there was a Venture in the future. His response was YES. So asked more what he told me was a little shocking... Stratoliner, roadliners V-max and a couple more lines were history.... he said look for a touring bike in a V-twin 1900 with push rods it will be a touring /cruiser much like the venture/tour deluxe...He said that it IS in the works, Yamaha is still being secretive ... BS from a rep? time will tell ....he said it Venture would be out in OCTOBER .... (not holding my breath) price range was $20,000.00+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbjman Posted April 9, 2015 Share #2 Posted April 9, 2015 Like you said, time will tell if this is true. Kind of a non-issue for me because I won't be in the market for any $20,000 bike no matter whose nameplate they bear; although I don't want it to be called a Venture if it's not a Venture at heart! This report makes me wonder..... What was the reaction when the '99 Royal Star Venture was revealed? Other than the V4, it was completely different from the Venture Royale; so what did you think at the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted April 9, 2015 Share #3 Posted April 9, 2015 When the '99 came out, I was thrilled. I had owned the '88 and it just didn't fit me very well. When I saw the "cruiser" styled '99, I loved it at first sight. I was riding a Harley FXRD at the time and immediately bought the Venture and a few weeks later sold the FXRD. Now that being said, this is not the first time that I've heard of some rep claiming this and that about a new Venture coming out. There is always one that seems to know things that nobody else in the dealer chain knows about. If this one is true, it will be the first time I've ever heard of one getting it right. Only time will tell but I don't believe this rep's story. I do agree though. If it has a Twin, it should be called a Venture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyinfool Posted April 9, 2015 Share #4 Posted April 9, 2015 Only time will tell but I don't believe this rep's story. I do agree though. If it has a Twin, it should be called a Venture. I disagree. IF it has a V-twin it should NOT be called a Venture, especially if it is push rods and/or air cooled and/or something other than shaft drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbjman Posted April 9, 2015 Share #5 Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) I'll have to admit, I didn't know what a Venture was until less than a year ago.... But when my wife and I rode to St. Ignance late last summer/early fall on my 650 maxim, I was really looking at other bikes due to my growing desire to upgrade to something bigger after 3 years. I was always thinking a used Goldwing would be nice, had no real interest in Harley for some reason and didn't even know what big bikes Yamaha had offered. So I was at a gas station near Cross Village, and another couple was fueling up next to me on an AWESOME looking bike which was an Ultra Classic. I was in love the style and warmed up to HD a little more. When we got home I began regularly browsing CL and came across a listing for BEAUTIFUL AWESOME WONDERFUL blue touring bike with a matching trailer, and the writer of the ad claimed it to be a Yamaha "Royal Star Venture". DING DING DING DING! It was L.A.F.S. for me, too! I was already a Yamaha fan, and the more I read and researched about RSV, the more I wanted one. After a month of watching/waiting, my 99 came up on CL, at an asking price I could handle, and so here I am! Edited April 9, 2015 by pbjman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freebird Posted April 9, 2015 Share #6 Posted April 9, 2015 I disagree. IF it has a V-twin it should NOT be called a Venture, especially if it is push rods and/or air cooled and/or something other than shaft drive. Sorry, that is what I MEANT to say. If it is a Twin, it should NOT be called a Venture. We are on the same page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steamer Posted April 9, 2015 Share #7 Posted April 9, 2015 So it looks like the sneak peak pic's in the other post just might be the new venture, stratotour or what ever they call it. I said a couple years ago that the replacement for the venture would be a big V-twin. Reason for saying this.... all the other guys are v-twins, except Honda. They build what makes them $$$. Don't matter what a hand full of people like us would like to see them do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midnightrider1300 Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share #8 Posted April 9, 2015 ... all the other guys are v-twins, except Honda. They build what makes them $$$. Don't matter what a hand full of people like us would like to see them do. this pretty much WHAT the rep said....he also said that 90% of market is made up of USED bikes and that touring is only a very small portion of the 10% that is left and that Yamaha had to do what made sense.... ALSO foreign market was much bigger on motorcycle and they are what is driving the market... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
videoarizona Posted April 9, 2015 Share #9 Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) I understand the economics of business. But going to an air cooled V-Twin is a step backwards in my opinion. Going to run hot, going to vibrate to much...etc., etc..Plus a huge investment in total redesign. When you have a motor that is as well designed as our V4, Yamaha should be testing the market with a fuel injected version of the 2013 2nd Gen first. Far less investment to add FI, CD, MP3, and bluetooth to an already proven design. Simply modernizing the 2nd Gen would have kept them in the marketplace...and if they advertised it (of course) it would give them time to find out if the market will bear a modern V4 touring machine. Plus, if they made it adaptable from Touring to Cruiser with quick-disconnect windshields, Tour Packs, saddlebags....it would be a "convertible to boot. One model, small investment, some advertising...and see how the market responds. Then make the economic decision whether to continue with a V4 or change to a V Twin and change the model completely. Well...in my business experience...large corps do not necessarily think clearly...management by committee wins again. BTW, I worked with Hitachi many moons ago. They sent one of their engineers to my business for a year. He was consistently amazed at the ideas we came up with that Hitachi never had thought of. We made some cool changes to their products based on simple conversations about how products were used. This was with respect to the Broadcast industry. Hitachi was a huge player in that industry...still is worldwide. I think Yamaha made the mistake 4 years ago by not modernizing their Touring product line. If they had done that...they may have found out the v4 concept could have kept them going(and be a unique motor for marketing) for years to come. My .02 cents worth... david P.S. On the plus side...no hard valve adjustments. Grins. Edited April 9, 2015 by videoarizona clarification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSky Posted April 9, 2015 Share #10 Posted April 9, 2015 A V-twin is much cheaper to manufacture and that is what seems to be the preferred design. I've read that a V4 is very expensive to manufacture, more than a straight four. To me this will just make the Goldwing more attractive or maybe even a BMW. Obviously my opinion doesn't count though. I still buy rear drive cars too and the choices are slim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickardracing Posted April 9, 2015 Share #11 Posted April 9, 2015 What difference does it make what it is called. I won't be a buyer if it looks anything like the "spy" photo from last week that was posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black wing Posted April 9, 2015 Share #12 Posted April 9, 2015 i think Yamaha has forgotten what a "Touring" bike is supposed to do, and really a twin with push rods? are we going to be able to see where the ground the Harley logos off the sides? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigLenny Posted April 9, 2015 Share #13 Posted April 9, 2015 I'm not gonna buy any touring motorcycle that isn't water cooled. When I consistently hear air-cooled V twin owners talk about heat issues, it turns me off. Plus, I just can't be convinced that air-cooled motor would last as long as a water cooled one. Just a hangup I have I guess. The undisputed king of air-cooled touring bikes decided last year to add watercooling to there motor and they literally can't keep an inventory of them because they're selling so many. And, I just read an article a couple weeks ago in Rider Magazine stating that Victory is on the verge of putting water-cooling on their bikes. Polaris already does that with the Indian Scout, so they have tested the technology and will be moving forward with it. Now, having said that, I will understand if Yamaha decides to go with a big twin. It's by far the most popular configuration trending today. I won't like it, because I think the V4 is one of the best motorcycle motors ever invented, and quite frankly I don't understand why Yammy doesn't continue to exploit that uniqueness by upgrading it. But, if they are going to go with what is the most up to date popular trend, it is water cooled V twin, not air cooled V twin. And, I agree with Freebird and some others; if they come out with a V twin touring bike, they shouldn't call it a Venture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BratmanXj Posted April 9, 2015 Share #14 Posted April 9, 2015 i think Yamaha has forgotten what a "Touring" bike is supposed to do, and really a twin with push rods? are we going to be able to see where the ground the Harley logos off the sides? The 1600/1700 Road Star/Warrior engines are push rod and MUCH better than the comparable HD motors. They run on Reg. Unleaded fuels without the heat management issues that HD has with their 96ci & 103ci running premium, get comparable fuel mileage and great torque. It is a completely different riding style than the 1300cc Royal Star Engine, neither good nor bad. I go back and forth between an Ultra Classic, Warrior, and the Venture. If I hadn't have come from a Sport Tourer and understand mid-range rpm riding the Venture would feel like a dog. The Tourer market has been trained on low-end torque and that is better suited from a big inch push rod motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
videoarizona Posted April 9, 2015 Share #15 Posted April 9, 2015 The 1600/1700 Road Star/Warrior engines are push rod and MUCH better than the comparable HD motors. They run on Reg. Unleaded fuels without the heat management issues that HD has with their 96ci & 103ci running premium, get comparable fuel mileage and great torque. It is a completely different riding style than the 1300cc Royal Star Engine, neither good nor bad. Well at least that is good to hear! The heat issue would really bother me...here in Arizona! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowpuc Posted April 9, 2015 Share #16 Posted April 9, 2015 I dont know,, I still got a strange feeling that the only reason that Harley drifted into watercooling that exhaust valve had more to do with meeting regulations having to do with emissions than it did on rider comfort.. I may be wrong and probably am but Tip and I spent some time on a wet head HD and I honestly can't say we felt much difference in temp comfort.. It did seem to have more umpphh though.. WOW Midnight, no more V-Max? I am sure they were not a good seller (economy) but, this saddens my heart cause I was hoping that big block 4 would be around long enough that for us folks who live off the table scraps of folks willing to spend the big bucks would be able to find an affordable one to go out and play on - bummer!! I still think that big block would have been a GREAT resource for a new breed of Venture!! And the end of the Strat/Roadliner,, guess I can see that too as they have been around a while and you dont see alot of em out on the tour... I happen to love that great big torque makin push-rod clankin V-Twin coffee can pistoned 1900cc hunk of pure Yamaha motor but I would prefer mine in a Raider (old habits are hard to break, the feel of a chopper gets in your blood I guess) - not in a touring bike per say.. However,, if Yamaha would come out with a "Raider" turned "touring" - that could be interesting.. Sort of a new breed of V-Twin tourer that nobody else had.. Laid back in an easyrider fashion all stretched out with my back in Tips lap, the feel of the stability that only comes from a long bike flowing down the highway and a great big torque monster 1900cc pushrod V-Twin idling along at 2 grand and 70 mph, feeling the bike flex under me as we cross expansion joints on the highway while going around the City of Sacramento.. I could do that.. If its gonna be a new pushrod V-enture,, probably rather pick up a year old Harley Ultra Limited for the same price, maybe,,, maybe not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvester Posted April 9, 2015 Share #17 Posted April 9, 2015 Yep, heard the same thing from a "factory rep" in 2008. So how is that going? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagleeye Posted April 9, 2015 Share #18 Posted April 9, 2015 Yep, heard the same thing from a "factory rep" in 2008. So how is that going? That pretty much says it all. :rotf: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edbo Posted April 9, 2015 Share #19 Posted April 9, 2015 Man I was hoping the value :mo money:of my bike was going to go up, because everyone would want the V4 engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ventureless Posted April 9, 2015 Share #20 Posted April 9, 2015 I dont know,, I still got a strange feeling that the only reason that Harley drifted into watercooling that exhaust valve had more to do with meeting regulations having to do with emissions than it did on rider comfort.. I may be wrong and probably am but Tip and I spent some time on a wet head HD and I honestly can't say we felt much difference in temp comfort.. It did seem to have more umpphh though.. Puc I think Harley did it because they were having a lot of mechanical issues from customers due to the heat. Nothing to do with rider comfort at all. I know one of our local large police departments turned all their 103s back in and got new ones because none of the 103s they first bought were making it past 10K or so miles because the motors were running so hot. When you take the same cylinders and keep putting bigger and bigger pistons in, the whole thing heats up quicker and gets hotter without being able to dissapate the heat as well. So I think it was Harley covering their own a^^es and not for emissions at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSky Posted April 10, 2015 Share #21 Posted April 10, 2015 Water cooled or air cooled, the same amount of heat is coming off the engine and if it isn't diverted away from the rider, heat will be a comfort issue. The engine will run cooler but not the passenger. Police depts. buying air cooled Harleys to tool around the cities is ridiculous. Gotta keep-em moving to cool them. Then there is that story in the news in Miami when I was there of a city motorcycle cop trying to catch a couple of sport bikes on his Harley and of course crashed the Harley and hurt himself. Idiocy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRider Posted April 10, 2015 Share #22 Posted April 10, 2015 I'm not buying what the rep said with the demise of the VMax. Too soon since they redesigned it. Now, putting the VMax engine in a new Venture? Now your talkin'. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leo3wheel Posted April 10, 2015 Share #23 Posted April 10, 2015 I'm not buying what the rep said with the demise of the VMax. Too soon since they redesigned it. Now, putting the VMax engine in a new Venture? Now your talkin'. RR Yes, latest V-Max only in production since 2009. Yamaha would have to have a strong reason for stopping production. V-Max has 1,679 cc (102 cu in) liquid-cooled DOHC V-4 engine producing 174.3 hp (130.0 kW) @ 9,000 rpm. In comparison, Honda GL 1800 SE Gold Wing ABS 2004 has 1832 cc, water cooled, 6 - cylinders boxer, 4-stroke engine producing 118 hp (88 kW) @ 5500 rpm. V-Max engine would make powerful touring machine, but gas mileage would be poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted April 10, 2015 Share #24 Posted April 10, 2015 The 1600/1700 Road Star/Warrior engines are push rod and MUCH better than the comparable HD motors. They run on Reg. Unleaded fuels without the heat management issues that HD has with their 96ci & 103ci running premium, get comparable fuel mileage and great torque. It is a completely different riding style than the 1300cc Royal Star Engine, neither good nor bad. I go back and forth between an Ultra Classic, Warrior, and the Venture. If I hadn't have come from a Sport Tourer and understand mid-range rpm riding the Venture would feel like a dog. The Tourer market has been trained on low-end torque and that is better suited from a big inch push rod motor. The 1900 Stratoliner and Roadliner is a push rod air/oil cooled engine as well. I had a HD Ultra Classic with a 103 and I can say my 1900 Strat is WAY better engineered than the HD. Way more torque, very smooth and absolutely no heating issues and will run just fine on 87 octane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowpuc Posted April 10, 2015 Share #25 Posted April 10, 2015 I dont know,, I still got a strange feeling that the only reason that Harley drifted into watercooling that exhaust valve had more to do with meeting regulations having to do with emissions than it did on rider comfort.. I may be wrong and probably am but Tip and I spent some time on a wet head HD and I honestly can't say we felt much difference in temp comfort.. It did seem to have more umpphh though.. Puc I think Harley did it because they were having a lot of mechanical issues from customers due to the heat. Nothing to do with rider comfort at all. I know one of our local large police departments turned all their 103s back in and got new ones because none of the 103s they first bought were making it past 10K or so miles because the motors were running so hot. When you take the same cylinders and keep putting bigger and bigger pistons in, the whole thing heats up quicker and gets hotter without being able to dissapate the heat as well. So I think it was Harley covering their own a^^es and not for emissions at all. Point well taken Ventureless!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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