starter idler gear

[jwox]

I'm thinking of buying a '89 Venture Royale. I posted that I'm looking for a venture and he told me he had one but the idler gear for the starter needs replacing. He told me it's already apart and that's how he found the problem. Are the idlers a huge problem to replace? I'm pretty capable mechanically but I'd like to know more from knowledgable people who are owners. Thanks in advance for any info!!!!

[Prairiehammer]

If it is already apart, the "idler gear" for the starter is easy to replace.

But I've never heard of a First Gen starter idler gear failing. It IS somewhat more common to have the starter CLUTCH fail on the First Gen.

[MiCarl]

I can't imagine any way the idler gear could fail without taking out its neighbors.

 

Unless somebody just plain lost it.....

[GeorgeS]

It probably has the Loud Noise, from the -----" Starter engage Clutch " ---- Most likley.

 

-- See Service Manuel, on this web site, for the details on the Starter engage Clutch --

 

Yes, this is a Nasty Job. About 150 bucks worth of parts, and you have to pull the

Stator Rotor.

 

Check the maintenance section on this web site, there is a complete breakdown of the job with photo's.

 

If your a fair mechanic, with tools, its not to bad,

 

If you don't know what a screwdriver is, I would strongly advise against trying this job youself. You will be paying a dealer to do it .

[jwox]

I'm going tomorrow to pick it up. The idler gear broke in three places. Odd. As long as I can get the motor to turn over by pushing it so I know it isn't seized, I'll buy it and repair it. I hope to have it going before winter gets here. The leaves are changing pretty quick so I need to get right on it.

The bike is the pretty two tone blue with a little over 18k miles and every piece of chrome add on imaginable. It has a new front tire but the rear will need replacing before next seasons touring.

I'm very excited to get the new Venture Royale! I have a radiant heated garage I built and have all the tools needed to repair this awesome motorcycle.

[Venturous Randy]

John, welcome to our site and we hope you join. It will by far be the best $12 you will ever spend on the bike. We also want to see pictures.

RandyA

[Snaggletooth]

IM curious about that broken idler. Very odd. I'd be pulling that rotor off and inspecting the engage clutch also.

 

One of the three small idlers or the large 72 tooth ring gear that seats in the engage clutch?

 

If it's one of three small ones carefully inspect both case and case cover for damage.

 

From my Droid wherever I may happen to be at any given moment.

[jwox]

I'm sure I'll be joining! There's some great information here!

It's one of the three small idlers. He said the gear costs about $31 so maybe that will tell which one it is. I'll check out the case out for damage too.

Thanks for the input!

P.S. I'll post photos when I get some taken after I buy it.

[GeorgeS]

be sure to find the job write up in the maintnance section , scroll down left side

of home page, and get to that section.

 

This is a VERY Common problem on these bikes. Lots of us have done this job, so there will be plenty of help.

[jwox]

Can I put the venture in fifth gear to turn the motor over? The only thing I'm worried about is if it's seized and that's the reason the gear broke. There shouldn't be any timing issues, I would think.

[MiCarl]

You can turn it over in 5th gear, but it's a heavy bike to be pushing around.

 

Better to turn it with a socket. Remove the 3 Phillips screws in the name plate on the left side of the engine. The cover will pull off giving you access to the rotor bolt. 17mm, I think........

 

Of course if he's got it hanging open because of the idler gear it's already accessible.

[Marcarl]

My biggest concern would be: What broke the gear!, that may be more involved than what you might realize, but then if the price is right, the chrome may be the winner.

[Prairiehammer]

This is a VERY Common problem on these bikes. Lots of us have done this job, so there will be plenty of help.

 

George, the broken idle gear is a very common problem?

This is first I've heard of such.

 

Or did you mean the broken starter CLUTCH is a common problem?

[GeorgeS]

George, the broken idle gear is a very common problem?

This is first I've heard of such.

 

Or did you mean the broken starter CLUTCH is a common problem?

 

Yes, starter Engage Clutch, is common problem. But if this bike has the Loud clanking noise on " Start Attempt " then I'm pretty sure it needs the Engage clutch repaired.

 

I have never heard of one of the " Idler Gears " going bad. ( small ones that is )

 

The large 72 tooth gear, YES, but thats usually a result of the Engage Clutch

assembly failing, and causing the 72 tooth gear to be damaged.

 

Dimes to Dougnuts, this bike need the " Engage Clutch " Rebuilt !! Stay Tuned !!

[jwox]

Here's some photo's of the cycle without sidecovers. You can see how far the previous owner took it apart. The motor turned over fine with the bike in gear. I'm really happy and look forward to driving it. Hopefully yet this fall.

[jwox]

Forgot to show you the gear that broke. Do you think it's due to the starter clutch plate being bad? And, does the rebuild kits I see on ebay work or is it better to buy the whole works? Thanks!

[lsutley]

The intermediate gear may have been defective and there are no further ailments :fingers crossed:but I believe that it would be worthwhile to pull the rotor before going any further. Check the sprages, springs for wear or breakage and the rotor for cracks. Check the 72 tooth gear bushing, the hub and teeth for wear or damage.

 

If the overrunning clutch and gear are OK, it would be safe to replace the damaged gear, (IMHO) but there might still be a problem, that could produce the same results. A misfire in the motor, to produce a kickback against the starter, could break the gear. A problem with the starter that produces an intermittent engagement might cause such a failure.

 

If the rotor or 72 tooth gear is damaged, I have a good set that is available.

[Snaggletooth]

If you get to the point of needing to get into the engage clutch PM or email our Guy "Dano". He takes you rotor and reworks it to install a new engage system that is years beyond the OEM system. Even gets a new 72 tooth ring gear with it that is different from the original

 

Costs a lil bit more but not out of line on cost. Never have to worry about it again. I was one of the first to have this done in the states and not a miss since.

 

Do a search on engage clutch mod or check out my profile album for a pic of the new setup.

 

You won't regret the change.

 

Outstanding stuff.

 

Mike

 

 

From my Droid wherever I may happen to be at any given moment.

[lsutley]

Ditto, to what Snaggletooth has to say about Dano's rotor modification. The reason I have a spare is that I installed the modified rotor as preventative maintenance. The one that I removed was OK. After seeing the difference between the stock and Dano's, the improvement is obvious.

[Flyinfool]

I think I have the second starter clutch that Dano did.

Money well spent.

[Squidley]

You scored very well on that bike, I see quite a few Very Hard to find chrome pieces in the pics

[dingy]

Forgot to show you the gear that broke. Do you think it's due to the starter clutch plate being bad? And, does the rebuild kits I see on ebay work or is it better to buy the whole works? Thanks!

 

PM me an address, I can send you one of those gears.

 

Free, if you register as a paying member. Already will have saved you $20.

 

Gary

[jwox]

I am glad I have lots of good chrome pieces and lights on it. Someone spent a lot of money on accessories.

I'll have to get the "dano" modification done ASAP. I hope to ride it yet this fall but then I will get it done. Excellent mod it sounds like. I want reliability when doing iron butt rides!

[Snaggletooth]

I've already said my .02 cents about the Dano mod but I'll throw in some words on reliability.

 

I ride that bike daily. I used it on a service route for work. Lots of starts and stops during the day. 5 days a week it got started maybe 20 or more times a day. On the weekends about 10 to 15. Not normal usage for most people.

 

I had the the original engage fail then rebuilt it with new dogs and springs. That lasted a season or two. The big issue with rebuilding is getting the alignment of the engage assembly in the rotor spot on with the crank shaft. If it ain't perfect its going to fail again.

 

Dano does that for you when he installs the engage system. All you have to do is tighten the nut on the crank.

 

I think its been 3 years or more now of service without a single skipped or missed beat off his mod.

 

What more can ya ask for?

 

From my Droid wherever I may happen to be at any given moment.

[Flyinfool]

Forgot to show you the gear that broke. Do you think it's due to the starter clutch plate being bad? And, does the rebuild kits I see on ebay work or is it better to buy the whole works? Thanks!

 

It looks like a shiny spot on the sides of 2 of the teeth on the broken section, Like someone was prying on it or whacked it with a hammer. I have no clue as to why you would have to do either.

 

I do not know which rebuild kits on ebay you are referring to.

 

You will need 3 gaskets to put this back together. You can NOT just use a liquid gasket, you need the gasket thickness for proper internal clearances.

Side cover gasket

Middle gear cover gasket

Crush washer.

 

As long as that cover is off take a good look at the stator, if any of the coils look burnt, now is the time to replace it.