ground location & blinker speed changing

[meach]

Here's the story if anyone cares to offer assistance:

 

I'm in the process of wiring my bike & trailer as I've added a tag-along trailer. I've also added some LED brake/turn lights, previous owner installed LED tail light & custom turn signals on lic. plate holder but I think all other lights are stock. All the basic functions on bike and trailer are working but with some flakyness. Bike lighting was working fine before I started messing with it but now a couple odd things have come up. I had an older 5 - 4 converter I wired in that had never been used but since I was having issues I have since switched to a powered 5 - 4 converter.

 

Also PO installed what appears to be a load equalizer from Street Magic, not sure of its rating. Possibly it has gone bad.

 

I thought perhaps poor grounding on bike might be problem but not sure where any wiring grounds are, I know where battery grounds (PO also added a stebel horn, mounting bolt has the battery ground)

 

Flaky things it does:

Flasher speed rate varies, seems to randomly speed up and slow down. When applying brakes the flasher speeds up which seems odd since brighter brake lights would mean more amp draw, I thought flashers sped up when bulb burned out thus lower amp draw.

This happened when trailer attached but also now when trailer not attached.

 

A side note when applying brakes I hear a relay near radiator clicking but can't find it. Where is it and whats its purpose?

 

Another odd thing is when trailer attached and brakes applied the bike and trailer lights blink opposite each other, when no brakes applied the lights blink in unison.

 

suggestions/comments?

 

I might try and disconnect the load equalizer and see how that affects things.

[dacheedah]

You need an isolator with a seperate power supply, grab the wires under the back seat and go from there.

[meach]

You need an isolator with a seperate power supply, grab the wires under the back seat and go from there.

 

Yea I've already done that, was just still having the other issues, thought perhaps others might have suggestions, at least where the grounds were located, guess not.

[dacheedah]

Grab your ground from the battery, fused positive from battery going to your isolator other connections should be solid ( I hate those blue clip together deals ) either soldered and heat shrink or a plug in kit with solder and heat shrink, by the way did I mention I HATE those little clip deals that are the source of a lot of wiring issues.

 

Next check your bulbs and make sure they have a good clean solid connection, some dielectric grease will help keep things from corroding. If you are using LED's on the bike side that may also cause an issue for you. Should not be a problem on the isolated circuit.

 

http://www.dealnay.com/877230/universal-trailer-taillight-power-converter-and-electronic-circuit-isolator-circuit-saver.html

Edited May 8, 2013 by dacheedah

[bkuhr]

When applying brakes the flasher speeds up which seems odd since brighter brake lights would mean more amp draw, I thought flashers sped up when bulb burned out thus lower amp draw.

 

 

The thermo flasher uses a bi-metallic strip, that is designed to use a specified current flow (specified # of bulbs) to achieve a normal flash rate. It works by heating up, due to current out to the lights, until it flexes, and breaks/opens the circuit, turning the lights off, then the strip cools, and flexes back, remaking, closing the circuit, turning the lights back on.

At a lesser current flow, equivalent to failure of 1 light, the strip heated up enough to break, but was NOT hot enough to require a normal cooling cycle. After a shorter than normal cooling cycle, the strip closes, starting the cycle over and causing a fast flash rate. If you pay special attention, you will notice that the light on time is about the same, but the light off time is faster, when there is a bulb out.

At very low current flow (such as 100% LEDs), the strip may not get hot enough to open, and the lights may remain on constant without flashing.

At a higher than normal current flow, (more bulbs or add trailer), the strip will be hotter than normal, and require a longer cooling cycle, resulting in a slower flash rate.

Thermo flasher typically rated for 4-6 incandescent bulbs (6 on auto and 2 on trailer). Don’t forget the dash indicator is also incandescent (unless replaced) and a normal turn involves 3 bulbs on vehicle or 4 if trailer attached.

Changing the vehicle bulbs to LED will have effect, unless load equalizers (bypass resistors) are used (although this defeats any power savings gained from LEDs). Better to replace thermo flasher with solid state flasher, but then loose bulb out warning of fast flashing.

 

 

Another odd thing is when trailer attached and brakes applied the bike and trailer lights blink opposite each other, when no brakes applied the lights blink in unison.

 

likely due to function of converter

[dacheedah]

Back to you want them isolated from the bike's main lights. If properly isolated and the bike lights function properly without trailer, connected won't matter. The isolator takes the signal and gives it the power from your battery.

 

If the lights don't function properly without the trailer you need to check light connections, wiring, relays. . . on the bike.

 

On the trailer side if the bike is fine but trailer is erratic, I go back to solder and heat shrink, run check of wire for chafing and push thru wire loom , run a ground wire to your lights and you will be much happier with the reliability. After many years with boat, jet ski, farm and utility trailers I can tell you grounds are the source of many trailer woes.

 

If they put all led's in the back and stuck a load equalizer in and you are grabbing behind that it could be your issue, you want the wires to come from under your back seat.

Edited May 8, 2013 by dacheedah

[Flyinfool]

Also make sure that your 5 - 4 converter is rated for LED. Not all of them are, and can do weird things when used with LED.

[meach]

thanks for suggestions, did some trouble shooting, for the most part everything is working fine with a couple quirks, issues appear to be on bike side with the LEDs & what I'm assuming to be a load equalizer (small black box with "Street Magic" on it but no other markings, 4 wires tapped into wiring) PO put on bike. I'm using the trailer harness that plugs in under seat from member here on VR which just plugged in and I soldered/shrink wrapped pigtails going to converter/trailer. Didn't occur to me to see if the equalizer is upstream or down stream from what I did, will check that later.

 

So now it only flashes fast when powered by battery only (ign on but not running thus lower voltage) when bike running all is mostly well, flash rate normal and syncronized between bike & trailer, HOWEVER when brake is applied bike & trailer turn signal flash opposite each other at but at normal rate which I can live with.

 

Yea I also hate those clips that come in wiring kits all the time, never use them as they are usually just a problem waiting to happen.

[Guest tx2sturgis]

Meach!

 

 

Before you do anything, do this:

 

Temporarily, put a regular 1157 incandesent bulb in the brake light socket. (unless you no longer have the OEM brake light on the bike)

 

Test all functions.

 

If its good, then you just have to add an equalizer to the brake light LED.

 

If you want to see my solution from 5 years ago, see this post:

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showpost.php?p=206400&postcount=5

Let us know.

Edited May 8, 2013 by tx2sturgis

[meach]

Meach!

 

 

Before you do anything, do this:

 

Temporarily, put a regular 1157 incandesent bulb in the brake light socket. (unless you no longer have the OEM brake light on the bike)

 

Test all functions.

 

If its good, then you just have to add an equalizer to the brake light LED.

 

If you want to see my solution from 5 years ago, see this post:

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showpost.php?p=206400&postcount=5

Let us know.

so I put an 1157 back in the bike tail light (there are still some other LED bars around the lic. plate that function as brake/turn/tail, there was no easy way to disconnect them) and there was no change to how anything performed.

 

The trailer tail still has the original bulbs, I just added LED brake/turn/tail and mounted up higher on back of trailer. Later I may unhook the LED on trailer and see if that has any effect. Only real unexplained thing at this point is the bike & trailer flash at same time (both turn & 4 way) EXCEPT when brakes are applied and then bike & trailer flash opposite each other (both turn & 4 way), I'm assuming this must be a function of the converter. But I love how bright the LEDs are and the fact they sit up higher more in line of sight of someone behind you.

[Guest tx2sturgis]

there was no change to how anything performed.

 

 

 

This tells us that you most likely have everything wired correctly.

 

 

when brakes are applied and then bike & trailer flash opposite each other (both turn & 4 way), I'm assuming this must be a function of the converter. .

 

This is normal, many converters work this way.

 

 

Sounds like your ready to hit the road!