I think I've done it this time.......

[abusive throttle cranker]

I put a pencil into the plug holes. Sure as taxes I busted the tip off one in #3. Ahh np- I'll just leave the plug out of #3 and fire it up on the other three when the time comes! Blow that sucker right outa there- or into the exhaust system which will do too. Right? So I go on pulling shims and writing their sizes down- which of course involves rotating the crank back and forth. And then..........the inner exhaust valve on #3 is stuck open! Must be that piece of pencil lead! To make a long story shorter- now the clearance of both of the exhaust valves on #3 are over .19mm. Larger than they used to be! There must be fragments of pencil lead in both valve seats. So I ask you. Will firing it up on 3 cylinders cure this? Would placing the cam lobes in position to hold the exhaust valves wide open and then blowing 120 psi air pressure into the spark plug hole do the trick? Or (omg nooooooooooooooo!) do I have to pull the rear head and clean the valve seats manually? In that case can it be done with the motor in the frame?

 

I'm on disability and with this sequester business and the politicos talkin shyt about affecting social security I'm doing what I can but waiting for my next check (a week) b4 I spend any money. So I can work on it but no spending till then- and that includes the $12 to VentureRider.

[SilvrT]

That's a real "bummer"!! Hope ya get it cleaned out of there with minimal effort.

 

Might I suggest using a proper pencil sharpener next time ....

[MiCarl]

I seriously doubt if you got pencil lead into one valve seat, much less both of them. It's much more likely your valve clearances are 0.19 which is in spec.

 

I assume you have the plugs out. Ground all the plug leads or disconnect the ignition. Spin it a few times with the starter. Pencil lead will crumble into a powder and fall off the valve if you really have any there.

[Flyinfool]

If the exhaust valve is fully open the piston will be near mid stroke. If you are going to use air to try to blow it out, be very careful because the piston may move along with everything else attached to it. Make sure you will not get whacked by a wrench on the end of the crank or anything else you might have hooked up.

 

As to whether or not you can blow the lead out :confused24: :confused24: :confused24:

[Black Owl]

Was it just the lead, or did you get some of the wood from the pencil down into the cylinder?

It is never a good thing when you get Foreign debris down into a cylinder.

Back in the day in another life you could really screw up someone's motor by stuffing string down into the cylinder.

Now, being a straight arrow I would never do that myself, but that's what I have been told.....

[muffinman]

Try a shop vac with a little rubber hose that can get into the cyl

I would not start it or spin it over if the lead from the pencil gets crushed it could cause a hot spot in on the piston or cyl wall.

I personally use a straw to check TDC just to avoid problems like this.

Good Luck

Jeff

[Carbon_One]

I like Jeff's idea.

I also feel your pain as I had a similar experience once. I was using a thin screwdriver and ended up breaking the tip off. OMG. Now what I thought. First I tried using a thin pencil type magnet to retrieve it. Nope that didn't work so then I tried using a stiff wire with a very strong magnet above the cylinders hole. Nope again. I finally had to loosen the cylinder head, slowly turn the motor over until it reached top dead center, then at that point I could fish the bit out with the aforementioned pencil magnet. Never again will I use something hard in the cylinder to feel for top dead center.

So you're not the only one to be stuck in such an embarassing spot.

Larry

[abusive throttle cranker]

I agree the valve seats must be dry and bare metal. But still the lead could be compressed on to the surface. I'm worried about a hot spot as muffin says. Any wood and the mass of the stuff will almost instantly be gone/ash/vaporized. I think high pressure air and then spinning it with the starter. And follow that with running on 3 cylinders. Anything left after that will be miniscule. A couple explosions in that cylinder will certainly finish it off. I really really really don't want to tear the head off.

 

@Carl: My first readings of the exhaust valves on #3 yielded clearances of <.15mm. so now being over .19 means something is in there.>

[dacheedah]

i agree that a hose on a vacuum is your best bet to pull debris out of the cylinder. see if your auto supply place has a pinhole camera that you could use to take a peek.

[mbrood]

The cardboard from a paper towel roll is excellent... slit it down one side and fit one end over the vacuum cleaner hose and roll the other end tight to fit into the plug hole... With the crank turned to get the exhaust valves opened that vacuum will pull out your junk.

 

Unslit they also work great for under the fridge and stove... just flatten to other end and slide it in and suck the dust right out!

[abusive throttle cranker]

The cardboard from a paper towel roll is excellent... slit it down one side and fit one end over the vacuum cleaner hose and roll the other end tight to fit into the plug hole... With the crank turned to get the exhaust valves opened that vacuum will pull out your junk.

 

Unslit they also work great for under the fridge and stove... just flatten to other end and slide it in and suck the dust right out!

 

 

hmmmmm now thats an idea.........

This being #3 there is a problem with clearance. I wonder if we have an elbow for the vacuum.......

[abusive throttle cranker]

When it rains it pours....... I tried to take the TCI out so to put it on top of the air cleaner or into the fairing as has been suggested here. And of course I rounded off the screw on the right side- ya the one its next to impossible to reach! I used a western rim spec phillips to match the screw socket, wedged it in there strongly by leverage and used a wrench on the screwdriver shaft- and rounded out the #@@$%$@^%^%&%# anyway! So I removed the right side fairing to get at it and...........the high tension lead for #3 has been munched on! Probably by the dead mouse I had found. Not only that but some genius PO has cut the wires for the temp senser. Not being content with that he managed to also cut the tan wire to the horn on that side! Bork me!

[Venturous Randy]

Looks to me like having this problem was a blessing on finding the other problems.

IMO, I seriously doubt you will have any problems on the tip of the pencil as it will vaporise and go out the exhaust real quick.

On moving my TCI, I just sawed the ears off as you will need to saw one off anyway to have clearance on the airbox.

Another thing, when I checked valve clearance, I just made sure the lobe was off the shim and checked clearance. I did not worry about Top Dead Center.

RandyA

Edited March 15, 2013 by Venturous Randy