Rear Tire Overload?

[BOO]

I agree with the statement about the gages. I have checked mine by averaging the tested pressure. Off the top of my head I wouldn't know what to use as a standard.

A couple of people have mentioned using a trailer for the excess load but I don't want to pull a trailer for several reasons. Knocks the gas mileage down a lot, 8 to 10 MPG. If the trailer doesn't have brakes then the stopping distance increases by quite a lot and there was a long thread about stopping the RSV recently so adding to that problem is not good.

As you can notice the tires have a spot close to my heart. I am quite concerned about them not to the point I worry a lot about them but it is something that need attention.

Jerry

[Condor]

I'm just wondering. I recollect reading an article on braking somewhere that a 3000# car traveling 60-70mph only weighs about 5-10lbs on each tire due to lift created by air pressure under the chassis. I have no way of substantiating this, but some lift sounds reasonable, and one of the reasons for ground effects flashing and wings to reduce air pressure and increase traction on race vehicles. Now, I wonder if this holds true with a motorcycle. On my 1stGen I can see areas in the fairing that might? produce a downward force at high speed. And maybe the fairings are designed to do more than offer protection from the elements. When it comes to static weight on my bike I can go over the 400# factory specs just sitting on the bike with a sack lunch.... well not quite but close... That's why I can't ride two up. Even loaded up with enough stuff for a 3-4 day trip and I'm way overloaded....without moving. But.... I wonder just how much an 800# bike with 450-500#s of gear and rider weighs at 60-70mph?? Does it still weigh 1250#'s, or is it considerably less. Curious...

[Leadwolf56]

 

A couple of people have mentioned using a trailer for the excess load but I don't want to pull a trailer for several reasons. Knocks the gas mileage down a lot, 8 to 10 MPG. If the trailer doesn't have brakes then the stopping distance increases by quite a lot and there was a long thread about stopping the RSV recently so adding to that problem is not good.

 

Jerry

 

Jerry,

I pull a trailer with my 90 VR and I only lose about 2 mpg even when it's fully loaded. We pulled it to Colorado last summer 2up with the bike and trailer fully loaded. Ran about 40mpg there and back. Moose was pulling his Aspen camper which I know is heavier and he got quite a bit worse mileage than us. It does increase the stopping distance quite a bit. I also keep my tires (Dunlop Elite 2) at max prressure and check them every time before we ride. Also visually inspect them for cracks, punctures, etc. I also have Ride-On in this set. Thought I'd try it since we were doing the Colorado trip and figured it wouldn't hurt any.

[wizard]

"Buy a good gauge and check it every year. And if it is an electronic one replace the batteries every year. Then when you check your tire pressure always check it two or three times and take the average."

 

I've used a pencil gauge for years now. I have one on both bikes and cars and they all measure the same when I compare them at the maintained pressure on my vehicles. I have compared the readings they give me with the air shock hand pump, which reads up to 60 lbs, and they read the same at 49 lbs which is what I keep my rear Metzler at.

Leonard

[Tartan Terror]

I was searching to find the load numbers on the Michelin Commander and came across this MC tire recall. I know its not the same tire but it may indicate a wider problem as companies usually dont recall until they get caught in the cover up. Just food for thought.

 

http://www.michelinmedia.com/pressSingle/value=MCH2007061546507

[Squidley]

I've been doing a bit of searching myself online and came up with a bit of surprising info. I couldn't find a specified load rating on the Michelin Commanders, but I did for the Avon venom.

Now get this, there are 2 Venom rear tires size 150/90B15 the load index on 1 of them is 80H which it's load is 992 lbs. The other is a 74V which is 827 lbs. thats 165 lbs difference...which is huge on these bikes.

I will check more into the Michelins load rating and post back with what I find out. Make sure when you order whatever tire you decide to get, that you make sure of the load rating and get the most tire you can get.

[BOO]

I've been doing a bit of searching myself online and came up with a bit of surprising info. I couldn't find a specified load rating on the Michelin Commanders, but I did for the Avon venom.

 

Now get this, there are 2 Venom rear tires size 150/90B15 the load index on 1 of them is 80H which it's load is 992 lbs. The other is a 74V which is 827 lbs. thats 165 lbs difference...which is huge on these bikes.

 

I will check more into the Michelins load rating and post back with what I find out. Make sure when you order whatever tire you decide to get, that you make sure of the load rating and get the most tire you can get.

 

Brad,

 

It appears the cheaper tires even in the Dunlop line have a lighter load rating then say the more expensive models. Dunlops are almost the same as what you are saying about the Michelin's. The D404 are 74 load rating also and the E3's are 77H which is about 920lbs. So we have to make sure what we are buying that's for sure. Not sure what the V speed rating is but the H is 130 MPH.

 

I'd be interested in finding out what you have on your bike. I would also like to take a look at the tire sometime.

 

Jerry

V is 149 MPH, appears the better Michelin is slightly better than the Dunlop E3.

[FROG MAN]

Some interesting data. The front tire load rating is only 1/3 to 1/2 of the rear. This has to mean that most of the load is transfered to the rear in forward motion.

[BOO]

Some interesting data. The front tire load rating is only 1/3 to 1/2 of the rear. This has to mean that most of the load is transfered to the rear in forward motion.

The E3 Dunlop front tire is about 760 lbs at 130.

Jerry

[FROG MAN]

760 is a good one. I seen some in the 400 to 500 range.

[Midrsv]

I will check more into the Michelins load rating and post back with what I find out. Make sure when you order whatever tire you decide to get, that you make sure of the load rating and get the most tire you can get.

 

Brad, I have a new set of Michelins in my basement that I had planned to use on my next tire change. I checked the load rating on them and the front is 760 lbs and the rear is 827 lbs.

 

DT

[SaltyDawg]

Ok first let me say that I am glad that everybody is safe and relatively well considering the circumstances.

 

Not to knock anyone but this is actually the first time I have heard of a rear tire blow-out on the RSV. I'm sure there have been more, but it really doesn't sound like an epidemic. We still don't know whether or not there was something in the tire.

 

Yes we should check the tire pressures, that's a given. These are BIG motorcycles and we put our lives on the line every time you throw your leg over it. Accidents do happen, parts do fail. We can't control what happens, we can only try to prevent it. Proper maintenance and care of the motorcycle can give you peace of mind, but it can't prevent all accidents.

 

I mean no disrespect to anyone and believe me I feel for you guys, it's great that you guys are safe and sound.

 

It just sounds like some people are getting scared instead of informed. We can't let "The Sky is Falling" syndrome to get into our heads or we might as well park these beasts.

 

Guess I will step down off my soapbox now.

Sorry, I just felt it needed to be said.

[Condor]

Ok first let me say that I am glad that everybody is safe and relatively well considering the circumstances.

 

Yes we should check the tire pressures, that's a given. These are BIG motorcycles and we put our lives on the line every time you throw your leg over it. Accidents do happen, parts do fail. We can't control what happens, we can only try to prevent it. Proper maintenance and care of the motorcycle can give you peace of mind, but it can't prevent all accidents.

 

I mean no disrespect to anyone and believe me I feel for you guys, it's great that you guys are safe and sound.

 

It just sounds like some people are getting scared instead of informed. We can't let "The Sky is Falling" syndrome to get into our heads or we might as well park these beasts.

 

Guess I will step down off my soapbox now.

Sorry, I just felt it needed to be said.

 

[FROG MAN]

Rear tire blowout with the rsv or venture is not uncommon. Several members of this forum have had failure. We need to do daily inspection and tire pressure checks especially when traveling fully loaded. This is a question that has been in my mind for a few years now.My growing concern is unexpected road debris however so small creating a scenario of I don't know what happened but the rear blew.Not panic just concern. It has happened to me I don't want to read of it happening to you.

[dynodon]

You can probably figure half the bike weight and half the passengers on each tire. plus all the load in the bags on back.

 

A trailer is a great help in this regard. take everything out of the bags that is heavy and put in the trailer. If you have say 350 pound trailer/load, you should have about 30-35# on the ball. (close to 10% of total weight of the trailer/load in it on the ball, you do NOT need more than that unless your trailer is very poorly designed). That equates to a few pounds less that might be carried in the trunk (since the ball is out farthur, it magnifies the weight a little bit over that in the trunk and a bit more over that in the side bags).

 

Sure means we are running close on the load weight of the tire. That spec should have quite a bit of safety margin, but keeping tire pressure (cold) near the top is essential, and checking for excess heat (check the sidewall too!) is important. don't forget the front tire and trailer tires.

[wizard]

I have read on this forum of folks running tire pressures recommended in the book that came with the bike. Those recommendations are for the OEM tires. Do not run those pressures on Metzler tires. This is wrong and dangerous.

This is quoted from the Metzler website:

 

RECOMMENDED MINIMUM TIRE PRESSURES (P.S.I.)

Touring/Cruiser

ME880 Marathon Solo 2 Up Light 2 Up Heavy

Front 38-40 40-42 40-42

Rear 44-46 46-48 48-50

 

 

The rear tire is rated at 992 lbs, which is better than the stock tires that come with the bike.

[FROG MAN]

Thanks wizard. If Metzler recommends varying the pressure with load makes one wonder about the other mfg. The tire I blew on the rsv rear was a new metzler.

[SaltyDawg]

Haven't the Metzler's had a reputation for chunks of tread separating from the tire?

[Guest KitCarson]

Okay on a serious note: Motorcycle tires........and blow out or fast decompression...this is a serious situation. I had this happen to me on a Harley Electro Glide......I was young.....had a lot of flat track experience at the time.........I went six directions before I got it stopped, no did not have to change my pants...I was too damm scared to sh++++. (still feel it was only luck that kept it up) Besides Squidley and Frogman on this site.....I myself know of two others not on Ventures but on touring bikes whom have had blown out rear tires......one almost killed the folks on the bike. Easily could have. The common denominator in all these, that I know of...have never met those on this site......but those I know and my own situation was from pushing the tires too long........just one more ride.....just one more month....heck it will be okay......

Since that day when it changed my religion......I totally ignore any bike or manual specifications about any tire.......I read the sidewall, buy the heaviest load tire I can get and always inflate the tire to the maximum inflation pressure always.....for all situations....I also never, never run that tire to the wear marks.......I will let an oil leak leak........let a small hole in a radiator leak.......for a bit........Tires , axle nuts.....brakes......I keep a close eye on all that stuff. I run a tire I suppose for about two thirds of it life.......not only for safety , but with tread on the tire it is very much unlikely it will pick up a nail or peice of glass or something to cut the tire.

Crickett came with Dunlop tires......404 the front tire is load rated at 767 pounds.....the back at 8 something......I forget......bottom line is both say very clearly on the sidewall maximum load and inflation is 41 PSI. The manual calls for less..........when I went to Rockhill and picked her up...both tires had 32 PSI in in them from the dealer.....that was my first stop when I left the dealer........first gas station with a air pump.

I do not think one needs to worry........or fret.....but just make it a habit to weekly check your tires......check the pressure.......lay down on the ground and look at the sidewalls with a flashlight......only takes a bit of time.......or do it when you polish the chrome.....in the summer I usually spend an hour or so friday night just cleaning the bike......TV is worthless.....so I work on the Bike.........just make it a part of general maintenance and do not push those tires to the wear bars......that is too late........if you ever have this happen to you.......you will not have to have anyone tell you to check those tires.......you will find it is only by luck if you keep the thing upright. Respectfully Kit

[Midrsv]

While I don't ride in fear, I do believe in stacking the deck in my favor as much as possible. That's why I have passing lamps, extra tail and brake light and always wear a helmet. That being said, it seems to me that going for the maximum load capacity on tires would be another step in my favor. Given that together, thanks to me, my wife and I max out the 400 lb load capacity of the bike and then add saddle bag and trunk contents along with the tounge weight of the trailer we are probably pushing the capacity of the rear tire. So, when it comes time to replace the OEM Bridgestones on my '07 in the spring I probably won't use the Michelins I have stored in the basement and will instead go back to Avons with the highest capacity. Anybody want a good deal on some Michelins?

 

DT

[Condor]

Here's another thought. Just how much weight is on the back tire. In the name of science, somebody needs to put the back end of the bike on a scale and actually see what the rear end weights without anyone on it. On a trailer with a 10,000 GVW the weight is shared by all 4 tires. In other words each tire needs to be 2500# rated. Same thing with our bikes. I'd be very interested in finding out just how much weight we are putting on the rear tire. The factory specs state a max load of about 400#'s, but the weight of the bike at 750-800#s, and the 400 pound load, doesn't come close to the 1500# total rating of both tires. Granted there are other factors that need to be taken into consideration such as axels, and bearings, but I don't think we come close to overloading a rear tire with an 800#+/- rating.

[Tartan Terror]

Condor that is a great idea! Load the bike up and get a passenger and just weigh it. That wil give us a reference of what to base our thinking on. Like I said before they always allow a buffer zone in the weight it will handle. Meaning if it says say 800 lb it will be more like 1000 as an absolute.

[Guest KitCarson]

Here's another thought. Just how much weight is on the back tire. In the name of science, somebody needs to put the back end of the bike on a scale and actually see what the rear end weights without anyone on it. On a trailer with a 10,000 GVW the weight is shared by all 4 tires. In other words each tire needs to be 2500# rated. Same thing with our bikes. I'd be very interested in finding out just how much weight we are putting on the rear tire. The factory specs state a max load of about 400#'s, but the weight of the bike at 750-800#s, and the 400 pound load, doesn't come close to the 1500# total rating of both tires. Granted there are other factors that need to be taken into consideration such as axels, and bearings, but I don't think we come close to overloading a rear tire with an 800#+/- rating.

You are 100 percent right about the total load and load on each tire......I am not scientist....I never even finished high school.....but common sense tells me with the bike supported at the exact balance point (2nd gen) which is just about 5 inches behind the kickstand.......half the weight is on each tire......off the ground....is the same on the ground.........tire problems quite simply come from three things.......under inflation.......running them too long.....or a peice of road trash that no one can prevent. Now having said that ......I do see lots of bikes overloaded......weight of bike...riders and junk!! So if you put 600 pounds on the rear with bike and riders......I betcha some folks have more than 200 pounds in those bags.........border line...50 pounds on the trailer hitch?.....but do not think that is causing it all....(the factory load rating is for more than just tires, over loading effects lots of things......handling...brakeing.........I do not worry about tires.......simply do not overload the bike.........and throw the tires away at two thirds down on tread. To me a bike is supposed to be fun....enjoyable.....and I sure enjoy them. I have enough to worry about watching the traffic......so I just keep good tires.........on everything......bikes.....cars....trucks.......... Another thing....since that day when my Harley just about tried to kill me.....I have always changed tires early.....and since that day I have never even had a flat on a motorcycle........on my work trucks........if keep good tires on them, they do not pick up nails all the time around construction sites......and withstand stuff like jumping curbs.......let them get down just close to the wear bars.it is a constant hassle fixing flats. Simply by keeping good tires.....for the past 12 years or so.......cannot even remember a flat on the work truck.....did one day throw the wheel off the side of a metal culvert.....that sure tore that one up!!! PVC glue and plastic bags would not fix that one!!! So let me shut up.....all I wish to get across to everyone is if you keep good tires on the bikes.......unless it is an act of god....with road debris......some cut glass.......chunk of metal fallen off a truck........you do not have to worry about tires.....keep them inflated....change them before they wear out.......and relax. I have seen photos of tires posted on this site.......showing bragging rights on how many miles they got before doing the burn out!! I would never even ride to the corner store at 45 mph on those tires...let alone head for a M and E at 85 down the interstate. With good tires.....and a pressure check....I do not even worry about it. Open that throttle up!!!

[flb_78]

I have seen photos of tires posted on this site.......showing bragging rights on how many miles they got before doing the burn out!! I would never even ride to the corner store at 45 mph on those tires...let alone head for a M and E at 85 down the interstate.

 

 

You mean like this? I just took the picture 10 minutes ago, just for this thread.

 

This is my current front tire, I have no idea how many miles are on it. It was on the bike when I bought it and I've put 10,000 on the bike since June.

 

Hoping to get another 3 or 4 thousand out of it.

[93 venture]

Here's another thought. Just how much weight is on the back tire. In the name of science, somebody needs to put the back end of the bike on a scale and actually see what the rear end weights without anyone on it. On a trailer with a 10,000 GVW the weight is shared by all 4 tires. In other words each tire needs to be 2500# rated. Same thing with our bikes. I'd be very interested in finding out just how much weight we are putting on the rear tire. The factory specs state a max load of about 400#'s, but the weight of the bike at 750-800#s, and the 400 pound load, doesn't come close to the 1500# total rating of both tires. Granted there are other factors that need to be taken into consideration such as axels, and bearings, but I don't think we come close to overloading a rear tire with an 800#+/- rating.

 

WELL, I SAY WE NEED TO RUN OVER TO A TRUCK STOP AND GET THE BIKE ON A CAT SCALE,AND SEE WHAT THE WEIGHT IS, SHOULD BEABLE TO PUT THE FRONT WHEEL IN ONE PAD OF THE SCALE AND THE REAR ON THE OTHER PAD AND SEE WHAT THE WEIGHT IS PER AXLE.