Electrical Gremlins have come to visit

[ragtop69gs]

My passing lights have quit working. I split the fairing to check it out and found that the switch , fuse and wiring are all ok. I pulled the the 2 + leads from the double bullet connector going to the lamps and checked voltage, I have 11.7v at that point. When I plug the 2 + leads back into the double bullet connector my voltage goes to 0.0v It is not blowing fuses. I have played with the wires going into the light bar and it still won'n light. Why would my voltage drop to 0 when I plug in those two + leads but not blow a fuse?

[T.J.]

Just thinking:confused07: What about ground from your lights? If you try a ground wire while checking. just thinking.

[Marcarl]

Check the bullet connectors going to the lights for continuity going from the connector to ground. Or maybe you have a disconnecting connector, loose wire in the connector.

[Dano]

Check your grounding point, sounds like you're reading the voltage THRU the light but not back to a ground point (ya gotta know how electricity works!), so the juice is flowing but not getting back to the battery. You may need to go thru all the wiring to the lights, by checking continuity back to ground with a self-powered "check light" or meter. The ground MAY be good enuff to "see" voltage in the connector but not good enuff to pass "amperage" of the light bulb back to the battery. You can check it both ways (ground to the bulb, hot power to the bulb, then check the two wires together at the connector) like this by having one point on the battery (+ or -) the other lead to the opposite polarity. A self-powered "check lite" or a "resistance" reading meter will be the only way to do this.

 

Good luck and let us know what you find.

 

Dano

 

PS Good directions for the work required REALLY helps!!

Edited March 12, 2012 by Dano
U know!!!!!!

[ragtop69gs]

Just thinking:confused07: What about ground from your lights? If you try a ground wire while checking. just thinking.

 

I tried grounding the light bar, didn't help.

 

Check the bullet connectors going to the lights for continuity going from the connector to ground. Or maybe you have a disconnecting connector, loose wire in the connector.

 

I pulled each bullet connector (at both ends) and all were clean.

 

Check your grounding point, sounds like you're reading the voltage THRU the light but not back to a ground point (ya gotta know how electricity works!), so the juice is flowing but not getting back to the battery. You may need to go thru all the wiring to the lights, by checking continuity back to ground with a self-powered "check light" or meter. The ground MAY be good enuff to "see" voltage in the connector but not good enuff to pass "amperage" of the light bulb back to the battery. You can check it both ways (ground to the bulb, hot power to the bulb, then check the two wires together at the connector) like this by having one point on the battery (+ or -) the other lead to the opposite polarity. A self-powered "check lite" or a "resistance" reading meter will be the only way to do this.

 

Good luck and let us know what you find.

 

Dano

 

PS Good directions for the work required REALLY helps!!

 

I have voltage thru the switch up to the light lead connector when the positive leads to the lamps are disconnected, but not when they are plugged back in. When I plug either + lead in voltage drops to 0.

I checked the ground continuity by placing one lead of the meter on the light buckets (thats where each bulb grounds) and the other on a motor mount bolt, that showed that I had ground. I even tried a jumper from the light bar to the battery ground.

[Marcarl]

Try running a light right off the connector, so touch the center of the bulb to the connector, and run a wire from the bulb base to ground.

[Guest]

Do you have a relay installed? They do go bad. I usually end up replacing the switch and relay and that does the trick for me.

[Carbon_One]

Boy Jay you sure been having some electrial fun lately. Still have any hair left?

Seriously just take a deep breath and start back at step one tracing the lights circut being sure each step is good from power source to ground. AND make sure the bulbs are good too.

Larry

[djh3]

I think I would make sure the bulb is good first. Ya I know but hey its one less thing to come back and bite ya. Then a ground from say the battery to your bulb and power from your lightbar supply. Then reverse and see if the ground is good and power off the battery. It kind of sounds like a broken wire issue or a non-continous power/ground. Like someone said broken wires, you get the voltage but trying to power something not enough wires to supply the demand. Be sure and let us know what you find. On the relay deal, I should think if its sending power the relay is working. Any of them I had crap out are hung in the closed position and lights dont work because it wont close the circuit.

[ragtop69gs]

Boy Jay you sure been having some electrial fun lately. Still have any hair left?

Seriously just take a deep breath and start back at step one tracing the lights circut being sure each step is good from power source to ground. AND make sure the bulbs are good too.

Larry

Done that 3 times and still the same outcome If I try it again expecting a different result, does that mean I'm insane?

 

I think I would make sure the bulb is good first. Ya I know but hey its one less thing to come back and bite ya. Then a ground from say the battery to your bulb and power from your lightbar supply. Then reverse and see if the ground is good and power off the battery. It kind of sounds like a broken wire issue or a non-continous power/ground. Like someone said broken wires, you get the voltage but trying to power something not enough wires to supply the demand. Be sure and let us know what you find. On the relay deal, I should think if its sending power the relay is working. Any of them I had crap out are hung in the closed position and lights dont work because it wont close the circuit.

 

Seems kinda far fetched that both bulbs would burn out at the same time. I'll power each with jumpers from the battery just to be sure. Checking with a meter, all the wires and switch seem to be good There is no relay in the circuit yet, It's on the list.

[djh3]

Way out in left field but anybody think maybe the switch is weak? Will not support the amps required?

[Dano]

does that mean I'm insane?

I'll power each with jumpers from the battery just to be sure.

 

Nope, electrical issues can drive you there tho!

Great idea to check the bulbs straight back to the battery.

 

 

Way out in left field but anybody think maybe the switch is weak? Will not support the amps required?

 

A good possibility, if it has "flashed" the contacts, there could just be a touch of metal left or they have burnt corrosion on them. Usually want to use a relay to run high-powered "fog" lites, too much amperage (110-130 watts / 12v= 9.1666- 10.83333 amps), most switches are only good for a few amps, read the side of the switch.....

[Nemo]

Please excuse me if I'm wrong, but I believe your ground is okay. I believe you're getting a feed back somehow showing voltage at the switch and the light. I don't believe you're getting a true 12V power supply. You'll have to run a temp power wire to either the light or the switch. I say either, because some switches, switch the ground with the hot wire directly to the light. Use a continuity meter to determine where the ground wire actually goes, and then run the temp power wire. If you show continuity at the light (with the switch off), then run the temp power to the switch. If you find continuity at the switch (with the switch off), then run temp power to the light. I think you have a broken power wire.

[ragtop69gs]

Way out in left field but anybody think maybe the switch is weak? Will not support the amps required?

 

I installed a new switch yesterday when I started on this.

 

Please excuse me if I'm wrong, but I believe your ground is okay. I believe you're getting a feed back somehow showing voltage at the switch and the light. I don't believe you're getting a true 12V power supply. You'll have to run a temp power wire to either the light or the switch. I say either, because some switches, switch the ground with the hot wire directly to the light. Use a continuity meter to determine where the ground wire actually goes, and then run the temp power wire. If you show continuity at the light (with the switch off), then run the temp power to the switch. If you find continuity at the switch (with the switch off), then run temp power to the light. I think you have a broken power wire.

 

As I said the switch is new and inline with the hot side. The ground goes from the bulb to the light housing and that grounds thru the lightbar bolted to the fork. The lamps are sealed beam bulbs.

[MikeWa]

You have high resistance in the circuit. Since you seem ok with a volt meter try this. With the circuit live, lights on and all connectors plugged in trace the circuit voltage with the volt meter. You will need a pin or needle to use as a back probe so raid the wife's sewing kit. Connect the negative lead of the meter to a good ground. Use the pin to back probe the connector supplying power to the passing light circuit. If it has battery power work your way to the passing lights connector by connector. When the power suddenly drops you have found your problem... If there was no power at the first connector then work your way back to the battery connector by connector until you get power. Again you have just located your problem... If you had good power all the way to the passing lights continue the test through the ground circuit connections. Again a big change in the voltage at any connection isolates the problem.

 

Good Luck

Mike

[RSTDdog]

You have high resistance in the circuit.

 

Agreed. Had a similar problem with the headlight circuit on a suzuki. 12volts up to the headlight connector, plug in the connector- O volts and no headlight. Turned out to be a bad connection in the headlight circuit through one of the multi plugs. By passed the connector and voila, headlights. Connector would pass voltage but not current. 55 watt driving light is almost 5 amps (~4.6) at 12V

 

Can you put a an auxiliary 12volt power source directly to the wires leading to the light bar and if so do the lights work? Basically by pass the switch and other wiring from the battery.

 

I have never owned or installed a light bar but i assume there are several connectors in the light bar itself? High resistance, (corrosion, dirty) where the bulb plugs in will do this.

 

Starting from the light bar bulbs and working back wards, disconnect apply twelve volts to bulb, do they work? If yes. Connect the bulb, trace back to the very next connection, disconnect apply twelve volts. DO they work? If yes, keep going. at the point you apply 12 volts and the lamp(s) no longer lights, the bad connection is between there and the last time the bulbs lit up. Make sense?

 

RSTDdog

[djh3]

MikeWA, hmm sounds like you might have been an aircraft electrician at one time. Simular to the way we use to troubleshoot them multi wire bundles on the aircraft.

[ragtop69gs]

You have high resistance in the circuit. Since you seem ok with a volt meter try this. With the circuit live, lights on and all connectors plugged in trace the circuit voltage with the volt meter. You will need a pin or needle to use as a back probe so raid the wife's sewing kit. Connect the negative lead of the meter to a good ground. Use the pin to back probe the connector supplying power to the passing light circuit. If it has battery power work your way to the passing lights connector by connector. When the power suddenly drops you have found your problem... If there was no power at the first connector then work your way back to the battery connector by connector until you get power. Again you have just located your problem... If you had good power all the way to the passing lights continue the test through the ground circuit connections. Again a big change in the voltage at any connection isolates the problem.

 

Good Luck

Mike

 

Mike,

 

I have to have power to do your checks.

 

Please re-read my original post # 1 especially where I plug the 2 lamp + leads back in. Why do I lose power as soon as I touch either lamp connector into the hot female side ? The fuse does not blow, but voltage drops to zero

[ragtop69gs]

Agreed. Had a similar problem with the headlight circuit on a suzuki. 12volts up to the headlight connector, plug in the connector- O volts and no headlight. Turned out to be a bad connection in the headlight circuit through one of the multi plugs. By passed the connector and voila, headlights. Connector would pass voltage but not current. 55 watt driving light is almost 5 amps (~4.6) at 12V

 

Can you put a an auxiliary 12volt power source directly to the wires leading to the light bar and if so do the lights work? Basically by pass the switch and other wiring from the battery.

 

I have never owned or installed a light bar but i assume there are several connectors in the light bar itself? High resistance, (corrosion, dirty) where the bulb plugs in will do this.

 

Starting from the light bar bulbs and working back wards, disconnect apply twelve volts to bulb, do they work? If yes. Connect the bulb, trace back to the very next connection, disconnect apply twelve volts. DO they work? If yes, keep going. at the point you apply 12 volts and the lamp(s) no longer lights, the bad connection is between there and the last time the bulbs lit up. Make sense?

 

RSTDdog

 

I'll give it a shot

[ragtop69gs]

Turns out it was the scotch lock connector that was bad, it would pass voltage but with a load it failed. I am in the process of installing a relay, taking power from the battery for the lights.

[Flyinfool]

Turns out it was the scotch lock connector that was bad, it would pass voltage but with a load it failed. I am in the process of installing a relay, taking power from the battery for the lights.

 

Scotch lock, acky, poohey, yucky doo.......

[Carbon_One]

Scotch lock, acky, poohey, yucky doo.......

 

For a fact. Hate them myself & will never use one except as an nemergency fix till a proper connection can be done later.

Larry

[djh3]

I use them but everytime I do I cringe. I like the

Scotch lock, acky, poohey, yucky doo.......

I use to work for U-haul years ago as a mobile repair mechanic. I wish I could tell you how many times I fixed lights, went on service calls on the side of the road or wherever for inoperative lights. And the biggest culprit?? Yup Seems the main shops were in love with these things to fix lights or repair clearence lights etc. But if you are adding something and have to join in-line you dont have alot of choice unless you want to cut your supply line and either crimp connector (next worse thing) or solder. And sometimes you cant get in there to solder decent.

Glad you got it figured out.

[RSTDdog]

Turns out it was the scotch lock connector that was bad, it would pass voltage but with a load it failed. I am in the process of installing a relay, taking power from the battery for the lights.

 

Good deal. You'll probably find going direct to the battery and using a relay that they should be a tad brighter as well. I like to use the Marine grade wire that is stranded and tin (I think ??) coated copper. Anyway when you strip it, it looks silver and not copper. Less prone to corrosion at the connection points.

[ragtop69gs]

Good deal. You'll probably find going direct to the battery and using a relay that they should be a tad brighter as well. I like to use the Marine grade wire that is stranded and tin (I think ??) coated copper. Anyway when you strip it, it looks silver and not copper. Less prone to corrosion at the connection points.

 

I did find them to be brighter drawing from the battery. I'll keep that marine grade wire in mind for the next time. And i'm sure there will be a next time, probably sooner than later because I'm going to do the same to my wifes RSV sometime this week.