Serious cornering questions tips for an experienced Rider

[muaymendez1]

Ok so i have been dealing with this for a while and it takes a lot to get this off my chest but i feel very wimpy when going into a turn since I lost my buddy riding 14 months ago.

i thought i was over it but I constantly get scared before a turn and slowdown and then reallize how fun the turn would have been a bit faster.

I thought it was the new bike but now I have 5000 miles on this bike and I still feel uneasy.

 

I have to say that there are times when I scrape and I have narrowed that down to open visible turns. New jersey with all its foliage has lots of blind curves which I cant see around.

I have also notice that if the turn is a large radius I go into it slower but can eventually gain the speed to scrape the floorboards. SO i am thinking my problem is not adjusting my speed to enter the turn correctly.

is this just an experience thing.

Should i just go out there and ride a twisty road over and over again to practice?

I should also mention that my breaks were not up to par and Now that I have good breaks I dont have to panic to stop. My last panic I came up on a turn quick and I wasnt slowing down fast enough hence a grab and stomp on the brakes and a rear lockup through the turn onto the opposite lane. luckily no traffic was there to greet me.

[painterman67]

I feel your pain and nervousness. For me this same thing happened after watching the ride like a pro video. All my life I have ridden instinctively. After the video I was catching myself second guessing everything I did. I almost sold my bike because when I went out I couldnt wait to get back off the thing. For me it took a friend and brother to say lets go ride. And when I got anxious he was behind me a read my lines in the curves and talked to me on the cb. Weird how the voice of someone you know would give their on life for you will calm you down. And when he couldnt calm me down we stopped to take a break. Eventually it went away. The mind is a powerfull thing to overcome. Its probably not your expierience but your confidence in yourself. Give it some time and find a riding buddy . Someone patient enough to not push you and itll happen.

 

Just an opinion from someone whos been there. I took twenty years off a bike after a bad wreck , watched a video and started doubting myself. Stay within your own limits, ride your ride and the rest wil follow

 

Hope this helps

 

David

[twigg]

Enroll on an Advanced Rider Course.

 

These are enormous fun, and you will be taught by experts to corner and ride quickly and safely.

 

They will help you unravel any bad habits, and teach you some new good ones.

 

It is the best money you will ever spend.

[dingy]

Some thing that may help if you are not doing it now is to O-I-O corners. Outside-Inside-Outside.

 

When setting up for a curve go into it as far to the outside edge of curve as practical at a comfortable, but pushing speed. When into curve in center, go as far to the inside of the curve as is safe. About 1/3 to 1/2 way into curve, start accelerating fairly hard. As curve is exited, aim for the outside edge of curve. As bike is accelerated it will naturally pull you through curve and to outside.

 

You do not want to brake or downshift in a curve you are pushing bike through, either one will tend to make the bike dive into the curve. Go into the curve in a gear where you are at the low end of the power band, maybe 4500 -5500 rpm's for a first gen. This will allow enough acceleration range to come out of curve and not have to shift. Upshifting is not as bad as downshifting though if RPM's are topped out.

 

When going into a curve hard, look ahead quite a ways, don't look down right in area near front of bike.

 

Gary

[Yammer Dan]

I got shook after my accident in 06 and still haven't got back to where I was. Mine had nothing to do with a curve but I was doing nothing wrong and can think of no way I could have missed it. Just keep trying.

[XV1100SE]

Stay within your own limits, ride your ride and the rest will follow

 

Have to agree with this. If you don't feel confident on a curve better to take it slower and not force it. As you've experienced, better to start into a curve slower than have to brake hard mid way thru it.

 

You aren't alone in your unease. I tend to slow down going into a curve where I can't see far enough to be in my comfort factor. Mileage may not help in all cases. Sometimes taking a course at a track can make the difference.

[muaymendez1]

Thanks for all the positive responses. I am so glad I posted this. I was actually ashamed to post this but I am being welcomed with open arms.

Wow . What a feeling.

I completely forgot about the advanced rider course. I am goona search now and see if any are open.

thanks guys

[twigg]

Thanks for all the positive responses. I am so glad I posted this. I was actually ashamed to post this but I am being welcomed with open arms.

Wow . What a feeling.

I completely forgot about the advanced rider course. I am goona search now and see if any are open.

thanks guys

 

There are no dumb questions ... Not asking is a bit dumb

 

I get that feeling of "shame", I know where it comes from. The macho image that used to typify motorcyling should be long gone. The idea that to be a "proper" biker you had to be able to scrape the pegs, or get your knee down on every bend ... and woe bedtide any rider who couldn't do that.

 

It is hogwash now, and it was hogwash then.There are many reasons to ride, and few of them are to do with trying to behave like Rudolph Valentino on public roads.

 

Indeed, those that try often end up dead.

 

Riding is a mixture of confidence and skill. The confidence comes from knowing your own limits, and sticking to them. The skill comes from teaching, and practise.

 

There is a great deal of fun to be had riding between 40 and 70mph, with not a Z-rated tyre in sight.

[Flyinfool]

I have found that my "fear" in the corners is the not knowing if there is gravel or some other hazard in the curve. I had a close call with gravel once and it was very scary to have over 1000 pounds sliding sideways in a curve.

I never went thru the dirt bike phase growing up to have that instinct built in on how to handle loose conditions.

I have found that IF I just rode that curve VERY recently to have some assurance that there is no hazard I will take that curve a lot faster.

 

I will have to get a clutch ordered to go and take the advanced riding course. I have read about to many that wore out a clutch during a course.

[muaymendez1]

I dropped it on a curve 5 years ago.There was plenty of gravel. Then last year 4 of us in a group.I took the merging ramp scraping pegs on an unfamiliar bike (a loaner). My buddy behind me didn't negotiate it well and lost his life.I dont think its eating at me but not knowing whats around that bend scares me.

 

Ladt summer with all thr high winds and hurricanes wer were hit with, you never knew which bend had a tree sticking out into the roadway or falling rocks from thr hill s. Another thing is sun glare.Im happy eith all shade or all sun, Those turns where sun shines in your eyes every 10 feet blind me.wgich again causes anxiety

[SilvrT]

Stay within your own limits, ride your ride and the rest wil follow

 

I have to agree with this. "ride your own ride" ... even when you are with others. And don't let anyone put you down because of it.

 

As you continue this way ... push yourself slightly beyond your comfort zone... not too much, just a little. Pay attention to what it feels like, what works, and what doesn't seem to work. You will eventually increase that comfort zone.

 

And yes, take an advanced rider course. This will help immensly.

[dacheedah]

Look where you want to go, avoid watching someplace you don't want to go. I agree in taking an advanced course, we all pick up bad habits, they creep into our riding and riding safely is about developing and practicing good habits. If you question your confidence, you should practice to improve your skills and your confidence will return. . .

[CaptainJoe]

Riding a motorcycle is EXACTLY like skiing or snowbarding...

 

An Expert willing to take "chances" eventually winds up DEAD..

 

An Expert constantly seeking to improve his skills and making decisions on what he sees... normally lives to see another day.

 

in racing you deaccellerate right before the turn then accelerate into the turn(when you can see where your going) there are reasons for doing this, but, "your on a touring Bike"... ??

 

 

Blast around a blind corner just because it"s the cool thing to do?.... I've never seen a Ride like a pro video that shows that ... Your suppose to be in control of yourself at all times??? I personally think it's an irresponsible thing to do... no matter how many times you've ridden the road.

 

Dude ... if you want to race ... go to a race track... and while your at it get a faster bike cause the Venture isn't going to get you far. That goes for 1st gens too...Yeah, thats right ...Bring it! LOL

 

Dont worry about what others think...

[twigg]

In racing, you don't need to see where you are going

 

Generally you know exactly where you are going and could pretty much ride the track blindfold ... with allowances for other riders, of course.

 

In racing you need the fastest way round the corner that maximises the next part of the track ... which is usually the absolute fastest way around, but not always because exits speeds can be varied depending on what comes next.

 

So on a section of track that is a series of fast sweep you go fast all the way through ... but a tight turn followed by a long straight demands a fast exit, which compromises the entry. If you come off such a corner too slow, you carry the disadvantage all the way along the straight. Races are lost this way.

 

None of that applies on the road because you do not know what is around the corner ... a child, a broken down vehicle, whatever. Also, until you can see your exit you don't know if the corner tightens up (nasty) or opens out (wonderful).

 

So you almost always go in slow, hit your chosen apex, and power out. Going in slow gives the widest safety margin without putting new creases in your seat, and powering out increases the fun.

 

The other thing to remember is that coming off the bike, at warp speed, on a track is vastly less dangerous than even a low speed spill on a road. There are no high curbs, no walls in dangerous places, no street furniture (poles, lamps, signs) and nothing coming the other way.

 

Track days are enormous fun, and the whole style and approach is almost alien to road riders.

[spear]

I've never had an off in 42 years of riding.

I turned 60 last year and to maintain that record (never having an off) I decided to get myself a Voyager outrider - as per my avatar.

The bike is upright 24 hours a day, 7 days a week - at any speed from zero to whatever, on the straight or in the twisties.

[octoberboy]

I only got into riding last year. Taking the class was really helpful. But after that I was still a bit scared.

 

Here are a couple of things I did to build some confidence:

1) On non-business hours I used the rather large parking lot at a nearby medical complex. Practiced all kinds of turns. Created little courses based on every 5th, then 4th, all the way down to every other parking space marker. Even found some sand/gravel and would go, stop, start and turn over it. Also practiced emergency stopping at faster and faster speed as well as while I was in a turn (standing up the bike first).

 

2) I mapped out a road course that included windy roads, rail road tracks, roads under construction (uneven, surface grinded, and raised manhole covers), dirt roads, etc. Went out during slow traffic hours then worked my way up to busier times of the day.

 

Net/net I forced myself to practice at a pace I was confortable with in environments that were a bit more controlled than just going out and riding. I found it very helpful.

 

Was talking with Steamer the other day. He had a good idea I hadn't thought of. When practicing in a parking lot, wrap your crashbars with pipe insulating foam.

 

Just a thought and, I agreed, also try the intermediate or advanced course. I know guys that take them every other year and find they always learn something new to help them.

 

Cheers...

[MiCarl]

I'm pretty cautious in curves too. You get hard into one, pegs dragging, and something unanticipated comes up you're going to be in trouble. You have little braking ability, you're already turning as tight as you can and if you straighten up you go off the outside of the curve or into oncoming traffic.

 

Unanticipated can mean gravel, sand, animal (dead or alive), wet spot, oncoming traffic across the center line, etc. No amount of practice will prevent these things from occasionally happening.

 

Of course the likelihood of a surprise is much higher in a blind curve, which it seems most of the fun ones are.

 

In the rare case I can see well through a curve I almost always ride it hard.

 

Sounds to me like what you're describing is prudence.

[Stache]

Sounds to me like what you're describing is prudence.

 

Agreed - and, when riding with a group, don't be shy about describing your riding style.

 

A friend asked to come along on one of my group's rides. - he was fairly new and when he saw all the 'experienced' bikers lining up he got nervous about being able to ride with us.

 

We went and talked to the road captain. He put my friend in second position and me in third. Told my friend that we'd be taking it easy and that my friend should 'ride comfortable'. Told me to keep an eye and if I thought my friend was getting nervous or pushing himself to double tap my horn. 200 Km later my friend was grinning from ear to ear and complaining of the pain from all the backslaps and "good job's" from the members.

 

My friend hasn't missed a ride since, and his confidence is improving nicely.

 

The moral to this long story is: Ride comfortable. Your friends will ride with you, where you're comfortable, or they're not your friends. Confidence comes from success. Enjoy the ride.

[twigg]

Your Ride Captain sounds like a guy worth listening to.

 

Cardinal rule .... Leader at the front ... all the less experienced riders right behind, and the more experienced bringing up the rear.

 

There are good reasons for that, and he knew what he was doing.

[muaymendez1]

Ok so I sought the help of an experienced buddy and the conversation was quite thr confidence builder.

I told him thay I wanted to ride today and thst I was gonna push myself but if he didnt see me behind I would be lagging.

His response was that he only rode 1k miles in the past 4 months and that he was accepting the ride so he could refresh as well since last tuesday made him feel a bit inexperienced.lol

So we will be meeting today and helping each other out. A few hours in a parking lot and a few on the twisties.

He commended me and said he was honna try to be more like me and communicate his worries when ruding in a group.He wanted to tag along and not tell me that he was uneasy.

It sure is great to be around friends.Going oit in a few we are looking forward to an unheard of 60 degrees in february in NewJersey

[muaymendez1]

Your Ride Captain sounds like a guy worth listening to.

 

Cardinal rule .... Leader at the front ... all the less experienced riders right behind, and the more experienced bringing up the rear.

 

There are good reasons for that, and he knew what he was doing.

 

When I ride with ther local Hog chapter they like keeping exp guys up front followed by less exo and then 2exp riding sweep.

Is there a rule of thumb.I think they do it this way cause no one wants to ride into a fallen rider,which I have witnessed.

[Stache]

When I ride with ther local Hog chapter they like keeping exp guys up front followed by less exo and then 2exp riding sweep.

Is there a rule of thumb.I think they do it this way cause no one wants to ride into a fallen rider,which I have witnessed.

 

When I have led rides, I put the less experienced riders, and riders I don't know, right behind me because they are most likely to have difficulty maintaining the pace. The ride captain is responsible for keeping the group together, and safe. If the less experienced riders are at the back all I can see in the mirror is the guys I already know will keep up with me.

 

Also, I want more experienced riders at the back so that if the 'accordion' starts playing and the line stretches and collapses, or if we get seperated by traffic, they'll be more able to catch up, or responsible enough not to out-drive their ability and/or luck in the attempt.

 

My opinion only... I'm sure there'll be others

 

Lastly, while the unexplained does sometimes happen, I like to think I don't lead at such a pace as to leave fallen riders in my wake.

[Phoneman1981]

Very good info here. Losing a riding partner would shake up anybody. You are not alone. After a straigt away crash on damp pavement 25 years ago I finally got back on. I have discovered the more I ride the better I get. Always room for improvement. I am still learning after being back on for several years. Thanks to my riding buddies, we learn from one another.

[twigg]

When I ride with ther local Hog chapter they like keeping exp guys up front followed by less exo and then 2exp riding sweep.

Is there a rule of thumb.I think they do it this way cause no one wants to ride into a fallen rider,which I have witnessed.

 

They should put the less experienced up front:

 

1. They are not pushed into trying to keep up

 

2. They follow behind one of the most experienced

 

3. They do not get left behind at lights, etc.

 

4. They "feel" good not trailing

 

5. More experienced riders behind can watch over them

 

1 & 3 are probably the most important here. If there is a large group, some will be frustrated by the slower pace and the group should maybe be split into two.

[Brake Pad]

I've been down on black Ice, Ran into a Deer, and have slid on ice into the garage doors

I've been riding since 1980, But with all the riding skills, it still comes down to age with me. and the fact that I travel a lot with my wife on the back

 

I ride as safe as I can, I don't play while riding, and I plan every trip, I anticipate all my turns.

and I ride to my comfort level.

(Florida gets very windy this time of year) I'll take secondary roads instead of the highways

I'll take the turnpike or 95, if there is no other way to the location.

when were pulling the trailer, we only ride at 65 MPH, Don't care what anyone else is doing.

Like this coming International Rally 2012, I'm riding straight up secondary roads, I think I hit one state highway, but only for 28 miles.

For a lot of us we pay a lot of money for the pleasure of riding this bike.

before I go out on a ride, i check the bikes tires, and i go practice my circles & figure 8's in the street before taking off, especially when the wife is on the back

 

I did a lot of club riding for years, and with the latest of club was the Lead shepherd for 3 1/2 years (Star Chapter 297 Ft. Lauderdale).at one point and time, our formations were so tight, that traveling down the highway at 70 with 15 riders, we'd be just a little longer the then a tandem tracker trailer 150 to 160 feet.

Years back I did parade formations with 7 to 9 bikes, diamond formations ( floor board to floor board) riding. Now a days, Its more the pleasure of being with my wife. taking a ride out for breakfast. or riding with a small group for a lunch ride.

I'm over cautious on wet pavement, and crossing white lines and rail road tracks in the rain, & I slow down when coming to intersections. And it is with the grace of God, that I haven't broken anything yet. That's my story and I'm sticking to it......

Edited February 23, 2012 by Brake Pad
add more