Creaking Rear Wheel SYNDROME

[rumboogy]

For those that read every post, you'll remember that I got STUCK up in Custer, SD last weekend because I was having issues with my 2009 Venture. The rear wheel was "creaking" or "clicking" when the bike was in motion. I got several great responses here and some from friends regarding the possibilities of what could be going on back there.

 

In the end (no pun intended), I decided NOT to chance it and called my brother in Arkansas to come after me with the trailer (only 2nd time this bike was ever trailered)...so 20 hours later...he shows up in Custer, SD. He got there at 2am on Saturday morning and we set the alarm for 530am to leave back for Arkansas for another 18 hour drive back home.

 

Once I got home I took my bike (not to the stealer), but to my regular bike mechanic who is also the one that put on a new set of tires the month prior to my trip to South Dakota.

 

Here's what I found out (remember I am not the most mechanically inclined person)...but evidently Yamaha sets their rear ends up differently than other bike manufacturers and their "alignment" process of the rear wheel appears to be "sloppier" than it should be. My mechanic kept saying he didn't know why they didn't use "dowels" to help in aligning the rear wheel (by the way, that's all greek to me).

 

Anyway, he stated there is even a technical bulletin (see link or attachment below) that explains the problem and gives a solution. My mechanic also told me that his contact at one of the larger Yamaha Dealers in Arkansas told him they have even seen (heard) of this "creaking" on brand new bikes and also bikes that have never had a rear tire change.

 

I am posting this so that others that may or may not have this problem can find it easily.

 

I hope this helps someone else.

 

Here is the link to the bulletin.

http://www.arkansasbiker.net/Service_Info.pdf

 

Wally

[Marcarl]

Thanks for that info,,,, I'm sure if not done right it might cause more issues than creaking.

[Freebird]

Wally, you need to explore a bit. That has been posted here since 2006. It is good to bring it back up though. Glad you got it all resolved.

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1705

[V7Goose]

Wally, I don't know why I missed your original post, and I am very sorry you had to go to the trouble and expense of trailering your bike.

 

But like Don said, this is very old information that is often discussed here, and the tech bulletin is available in the tech library. As you have seen, there are two different subjects discussed in that bulletin, the alignment and greasing/seating the clutch drive pins. Lack of regular grease on the drive pins is the cause of this noise virtually 100% of the time. Alignment of the final drive is generally only needed one time, and then only iff the axle does not slide in without friction.

 

For anyone else that runs into this problem - there is no known risk of riding your bike with the clicking noise until you can get it looked at. Usually the problem is not bad enough to hear when the bike is running - most of us first find it when pushing the bike backwards in the driveway.

 

Bottom line for all 2nd gen owners is that they REALLY need to make sure those drive pins are properly greased with EVERY rear tire change. Seems like very few Yamahaha dealers ever do this, and virtually no independent shop or dealer for a different brand would even know about it unless someone specifically educated them. Thanx for bringing this back to our attention!

Goose

[rumboogy]

Don...I know, I shoulda done more research. But 1200 miles away on a netbook aren't the most ideal conditions to a search...and not only that, I wanted ANSWERS from a voice...in other words, PANIC had set in...

 

And then the other factor is PROPERLY describing a noise. We kid (at least some people do), about how to describe a noise.

 

I heard this as a "clicking" or suttle "grinding" sound. But CREAKING is the exact sound it was making, so some people were offering suggestions based on the wrong sound (my fault).

 

After seeing the rear wheel off and seeing all the parts in person, it made much more sense to me. Absolutely NO DAMAGE just a noise. I am hoping the alignment process will eliminate it for me. I'll know in about 2 hours.

 

So Don, have you ever had this issue on your Venture's. Apparently it occurs on other models of Yamaha's.

 

Thanks.

 

Wally

[etcswjoe]

There was a post a couple weeks ago that talked about bent axle that covered this too, makes for some interesting reading.

[Freebird]

No, I can't say that I've ever had that issue but I learned many years ago about greasing the pins in the hub. As for the alignment, like Kent said, if the axle doesn't slide in easily then you need the alignment. I've never had any problem sliding my axle in or out. I did check that alignment one time just to do it but wasn't actually having an issue. Once it is done, there will likely be no reason to ever do it again unless you pull the drive shaft and then need to re-align it.

[Panjandrum]

I had the creaking problem on my 2008 RSV with 20,000 Km on the clock. So, I took it to the Stealer who had relpaced the back tire earlier this year. I provided the bulletin from Yamaha found in this thread.

 

Well, they did the work and fixed the creak. I was told that they did find some minor wear. The service desk guy said they spent 1 1/2 hours working on it. He spoke to the Service Manager about having this covered either by them Dealership or Yamaha. The response was that they would split the time... which had now increased to 3 hours!

 

I spoke to the manager the next day, as I had to take the bike back as the rear brake was now working at about 50% to previously. I expressed my disgust that the problem was not covered either by them or by Yamaha. He said that he was still negotiating with Yamaha, and may be able to provide me with a credit. He also said that he had told Yamaha he was a upset that they, a Canadian Yamaha dealer, had never received the bulletin. It was only sent to the US dealers.

 

He also said that, if this procedure is required every time a back wheel has to come off, it will increase the time by an hour, which he would need to add to the cost of a tire change.

 

I am currently our about $200, and hoping for a credit. And I am still being a nice guy. That could change.

 

Yamaha is also refusing to cover the cost of fixing the radio connections, so I will have to take that job on myself... and I am not particularly adept as a mechanic. My mistake was probably telling them how to fix it, rather than just saying, "The Radio is not working.":bang head:

 

I am not thrilled with Yamaha right now, though I love the bike, and I love this forum for the wealth of information available.

[V7Goose]

I would not go back to that dealer; he is an absolute liar and thief. All of those issues are regularly covered under warranty by any honest dealer.

Goose

[SilvrT]

I would not go back to that dealer; he is an absolute liar and thief. All of those issues are regularly covered under warranty by any honest dealer.

Goose

 

I agree with Goose and I'm curious to know who the dealer is ... could it start with "GA" by chance?

 

Sometimes ya really have to PUSH HARD on these dealers to get them to do anything. I only had one dealer visit so far since I bought mine and that was for the " I " basket swap.... and I had to push hard for that and then a second time when they put the wrong basket in.

[slickster]

We were 2 days in an 8 day trip and the rear wheel started creaking....ignored it and rode on....sometimes it was quiet, sometimes not...finished the trip without incident...that was 2 weeks ago...today go out and the fuel pump quit...

[Dano]

Wife heard that on our way out to Cody, but knowing what it was after reading about it on here, I knew it wasn't an issue till I could get back home. If, however, I'd a known what to do when I had the tire off for the new tire, I should have done it then.

 

Question posed here is:

 

I'm taking it in next week to get the headlight dimmer switch replaced under warranty, should I take the print-out in and have them do this for me? Possibly even re-align it if it needs it?

[Patrolman46]

I have a 2006 RSTD purchased new this May as a factory hold over. 0 miles when I recieved it & it had the creaking noise the 1st day I rode it, so I mentioned it to the local Yamaha dealer & he talked about the alignment situation & said he would take care of it when we put a new tire on @ 10,000 to 15,000 miles. Now this guy has been in business for 30+ years here & is highly respected so I tend to believe him.

 

Has anybody found that the problem is more serious than my dealer is saying? It still has the "creaking noise", especially in the morning when the bike is cold. It seems to quiet down with more miles during the day. I already have 2,700 miles on the bike & LOVE it more every day I ride it to work. (Mini Vacation every morning & afternoon)

 

C Ya, Patrolman46

[Rick Butler]

Don,

 

This axle alignment procedure has been around since before 1988 and they just recycled it in 2006. In fact I was told how to do it from a early Venture mechanic and I have been using it since then where when I'm finished the wheel spins quietly every time. I guess I could provide pictures, but the process starts when you remove the wheel as follows:

 

1. Before loosening and removing the axle, etc, loosen the 4 acorn nuts where the drive shaft attaches to the final drive. This also allows the wheel to come out easier because the final drive will move as you slide the wheel out.

 

2. These final drive acorn nuts should remain loose until you put the wheel back on the final drive before inserting the axle.

 

3. Once you insert the axle and push it all the way into the right side of the swing arm, insert a 10mm allen socket into the axle. I like to use a 3/8" breaker bar instead of a ratchet so I can rotate it in either direction. Rotate the axle 360 degrees until you find the soft spot where you feel the least resistence. When I find this spot, I score the edge with the corner of a file at the pinch bolt slit. This allows me to set the axle each time because this sweet spot will remain in the same location.

 

4. Now put the axle nut and washer on and snug it up until the axle pulls all the way through. Then tighten the pinch bolt and torque the 27mm axle nut to 110 ft lbs.

 

5. Now finish the process by tightening the acorn nuts to spec.

 

This 3 step process allows the axle and final drive to be completely aligned where there will be no binding in any of the splin connections.

 

On first gens, this process can be done on the road on the center stand where you will loosen the nuts up and then tighten everything back up in the above sequence. Second gens will require a jack stand to do this.

 

And it also helps to grease the clutch hub fingers.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Rick

 

 

 

No, I can't say that I've ever had that issue but I learned many years ago about greasing the pins in the hub. As for the alignment, like Kent said, if the axle doesn't slide in easily then you need the alignment. I've never had any problem sliding my axle in or out. I did check that alignment one time just to do it but wasn't actually having an issue. Once it is done, there will likely be no reason to ever do it again unless you pull the drive shaft and then need to re-align it.

[rumboogy]

I mentioned it to the local Yamaha dealer & he talked about the alignment situation & said he would take care of it when we put a new tire on @ 10,000 to 15,000 miles.

 

My mechanic says it would not have harmed my Venture had I driven home from South Dakota (about 1200 miles), but to be honest, if I had bought a new bike and everything wasn't right, I would NOT WAIT for a tire change. FIX IT NOW, so that is one less thing to worry about...plus it's under warranty. They are the ones that assembled it and did not do the alignment in the first place. COST THEM NO MONEY in parts, really NO MONEY in labor since (exorbitant) labor costs would be covered anyway.

 

I would make him do it NOW. (again, out of principle, not out of necessity).

 

Wally

[Panjandrum]

I agree with Goose and I'm curious to know who the dealer is ... could it start with "GA" by chance?

 

The dealer is a BMW and Yamaha shop. Perhaps there is some BMW influence here?

[Panjandrum]

Question posed here is:

 

I'm taking it in next week to get the headlight dimmer switch replaced under warranty, should I take the print-out in and have them do this for me? Possibly even re-align it if it needs it?

 

Dano, I would be MOST interested to know what happens in your neck of the woods if you take the print-out in. If Yamaha covers the work for you, I have my case made, and my much-needed $200 back!!!!!

[sadicarnot]

Don,

 

4. Now put the axle nut and washer on and snug it up until the axle pulls all the way through. Then tighten the pinch bolt and torque the 27mm axle nut to 110 ft lbs.

 

Rick

 

Rick; You tighten up the pinch bolt first then the axle nut? do you have to worry about the axle being fully seated in the pinch bolt socket?

 

I have the groaning I did the alignment the way the tech bulletin says to do it with the rear wheel removed. Maybe I would get better results by following your procedure?

 

I have an '09 RSTD BTW

[Stache]

The below is flat nonsense on the part of the dealer. I'm out here at the far end of the continent and:

 

my dealer had the bulletin - the mechanic showed it to me when I reported the problem

 

they fixed it under warranty without any issues about 'splitting labour'

 

told me they'd put it on the file for my bike to (a) check specifically for the sound every service, and (b) grease the pins every tire change. No mention of additional cost for tire changes.

 

Time to consider a new location for services...

 

I had the creaking problem on my 2008 RSV with 20,000 Km on the clock. So, I took it to the Stealer who had relpaced the back tire earlier this year. I provided the bulletin from Yamaha found in this thread.

 

Well, they did the work and fixed the creak. I was told that they did find some minor wear. The service desk guy said they spent 1 1/2 hours working on it. He spoke to the Service Manager about having this covered either by them Dealership or Yamaha. The response was that they would split the time... which had now increased to 3 hours!

 

I spoke to the manager the next day, as I had to take the bike back as the rear brake was now working at about 50% to previously. I expressed my disgust that the problem was not covered either by them or by Yamaha. He said that he was still negotiating with Yamaha, and may be able to provide me with a credit. He also said that he had told Yamaha he was a upset that they, a Canadian Yamaha dealer, had never received the bulletin. It was only sent to the US dealers.

 

He also said that, if this procedure is required every time a back wheel has to come off, it will increase the time by an hour, which he would need to add to the cost of a tire change.

 

I am currently our about $200, and hoping for a credit. And I am still being a nice guy. That could change.

 

Yamaha is also refusing to cover the cost of fixing the radio connections, so I will have to take that job on myself... and I am not particularly adept as a mechanic. My mistake was probably telling them how to fix it, rather than just saying, "The Radio is not working.":bang head:

 

I am not thrilled with Yamaha right now, though I love the bike, and I love this forum for the wealth of information available.