Amplifiers vs Audio Quality vs COST

[rumboogy]

Just curious for those that have installed an AMPLIFIER on their RSV's...are you happy with it?

 

Was the cost of that upgrade WORTH the enhanced sound quality, or was the sound quality only slightly improved?

 

Did you install in the trunk or under the fairing?

 

Have you had ANY issues with the electrical system since installing this upgrade?

 

I know there are several threads about what kinds, and how to mount, but hopefully this is a "different" thread.

 

Thanks for all your replies.

 

Wally

[Freebird]

Well, I tried it. Mine was just a cheapo 200 Watt amp that I actually mounted where the cassette player was. It boosted the volume in that I didn't have to turn the volume as high as before installing it but that was about it. Though I may have had the knob turned lower, it did nothing for the overall performance of the system. If I tried to play it any louder than I did before, the speakers wouldn't handle it so I ended up with the same volume and quality even though the know was lower. I removed it when I installed the Ponch Gauges.

[rumboogy]

Don...when you had the amplifier...did you also have the stock clarions...or had you put the Polks in there? Thanks.

 

Wally

[Freebird]

I had the Pioneers and then tried the Polks. Same results.

[GaryZ]

Well, I tried it. Mine was just a cheapo 200 Watt amp that I actually mounted where the cassette player was. It boosted the volume in that I didn't have to turn the volume as high as before installing it but that was about it. Though I may have had the knob turned lower, it did nothing for the overall performance of the system. If I tried to play it any louder than I did before, the speakers wouldn't handle it so I ended up with the same volume and quality even though the know was lower. I removed it when I installed the Ponch Gauges.

 

There are a couple of possibilities as to why you did not get more sound;

 

The Speakers

Aftermarket speakers are capable of handling more power vs the stock speakers. However, 80% of speaker failure is from too small of a power amplifier that is driven into horrible distortion. In other words . . . a 10W power amplifier can easily destroy a 200W speaker. Also, those expensive aftermarket speakers usually have lower sensitivity in order to produce more bass. Lower sensitivity equals less sound given the same power.

 

The Amp

A "200W" car amplifier is often only capable of 200W into a 2 ohm load when bridged (both channels driving one load). If the amp is configured in stereo, you can only deliver 25W into 4 ohms per channel (about 12.5W into 8 ohms).This is barely more than the original system.

Edited June 26, 2011 by GaryZ

[rumboogy]

So what you are saying is that a 400 watt amp would be much better than a 200 watt amp? Both the volume and quality of the sound is better with the larger amp? Also...what would a 400 watt amp do to the electrical system? Is that too much draw?

[Marcarl]

So what you are saying is that a 400 watt amp would be much better than a 200 watt amp? Both the volume and quality of the sound is better with the larger amp? Also...what would a 400 watt amp do to the electrical system? Is that too much draw?

In order to clarify your question with a useable answer, we will need to talk both amps produced and ohms load. So maybe GaryZ could lay that out a bit better so we can all understand it and work with it. Could you Gary?

[frankd]

Any speaker can only convert so much electrical energy into sound. Putting a larger amplifier on it won't make it any louder. The speaker cone can only move so far. 100 watts per channel is a lot of audio power. Also, audio amplifiers are only about 50% efficient. If you are running the amplifier at 100 watts per channel (200 watts total), that means that you'd have about 400 watts of input power (14 Volts dc times 28.5 amps) or just about everything the bikes alternator can produce. Turn off the lights, I want my music loud.

 

How much power is the 2nd Gen. radio rated for?? The 1st. Gen is rated @ 12 watts/channel.

 

Now, I did have a 45 watts/channel amplifier on my XS750. However, that had 5" speakers and the radio only put out about 4 watts/channel by itself. The amplifier made that bike sound a lot better---but I still couldn't hear it well at highway speeds.

 

 

Frank D.

[GaryZ]

Power . . .

Power rating seems to be a big hang-up with most folks. Speakers are extremely poor air pumps. Most of the power applied to a speaker is wasted as heat. The power rating is simply how much heat the speaker can dissipate without failing. The power rating of a small speaker has almost nothing to do with how it sounds.

 

Power rating on speakers is obtained by putting a complex test signal into a huge power amplifier and connecting the test speaker. The test starts with the level very low (low power) and the voice-coil temperature is monitored. When the temperature is stable, the speaker sits and cooks for a while. If no failures occur, the level (power) is increased, wait for stable temperature, sit and cook. This is repeated until the speaker fails. They assign a power rating from the last stable test. Most speakers are rated at higher power ratings than the power amplifiers they are used on. There is no problem driving a small 400W speaker with a 20W amplifier. The speaker simply will not get as loud. A large cone speaker (12", 15", 18") is different. These monsters have a bunch of mass and need a certain amount of power just to get moving.

 

Sensitivity . . .

This can also be called efficiency rating. A 1W test signal starts at 20Hz and is swept to 20kHz while a measuring system records the speaker output. The speaker sensitivity is the average level (dB) in the mid-band. Please note that this test is at 1W. Power rating has little to do with efficiency. Generally, a speaker designed to produce extended lows will be less efficient.

 

Put It Together . . .

Let's assume there are two different sets of speakers we want to evaluate:

 

Speaker A

4 ohms

rated @ 20W continuous power

sensitivity is 91dB 1W/1m

2W/1m = 94dB

4W/1m = 97dB

8W/1m = 100dB

16W/1m = 103dB

 

Speaker B

4 ohms

rated @200W continuous power

sensitivity is 86dB 1W/1m

2W/1m = 89dB

4W/1m = 93dB

8W/1m = 96dB

16W/1m = 99dB

32W/1m = 102dB

64W/1m = 105dB

128W/1m = 108dB

200W/1m = 109dB

 

As you can see, the sensitivity rating dictates how loud these speakers will get if the same power is applied. 8W will produce 100dB on speaker A and a only 96dB on speaker B. Speaker B can be connected to a bigger power amp to produce more loud.

 

Power Amplifiers and Speakers . . .

An audio power amplifier delivers power to a load (speaker). When a power amp is turned up to a point where it is exceeding its rating, it hits the poor speaker with a DC voltage that quickly destroys tweeters and will burn up woofers after a bit. Speakers are designed and tested using an audio signal (sorta AC), not DC.

 

A speaker's power rating has little to do with sensitivity.

And, power rating has little to do with a speaker's quality of sound.

Edited June 27, 2011 by GaryZ

[rumboogy]

I think I almost understood that...

 

So Gary...what would be YOUR optimal set up with Venture and 4" speakers?

 

Or am I missing the point here.

 

Wally

[GaryZ]

I think I almost understood that...

 

So Gary...what would be YOUR optimal set up with Venture and 4" speakers?

 

Or am I missing the point here.

 

Wally

 

I plan on installing a bigger power amplifier to drive my 4" coaxial loudspeakers. Then I want to try and install another power amp (bridged) and a small subwoofer. The 4" speakers will be operated from 150 - 200Hz and up while the subwoofer pumps out the lows. You see, simply removing the lows from the 4" speakers will clean them up and they will be louder.

[rumboogy]

This is fun...

 

So where would you install the sub? And how would you get the sound "outside"?

[GaryZ]

OK, the other confusing issue seems to be concern with the VR electrical system. A stereo power amplifier should be connected directly to the battery through a fuse or circuit breaker. The battery delivers the big current hits when needed, not the charging system. The VR system simply re-charges the battery.

[GaryZ]

This is fun...

 

So where would you install the sub? And how would you get the sound "outside"?

 

I have been looking closely at the cassette player and the space under it. The subwoofer will likely exit next the this area, into the space around the steering head.