not motorcycle related but need advice

[oldgoat]

ok i have a 2005 pontiac grandprix

i had new tires installed about 3 weeks ago. now my front end shakes while braking?

are the darn rotors warped? it goes shaky shaky and the whole steerring shakes.? while brakeing?

im not sure if these new type rotors can be turned down like i use to back in the 70,s and 80,s. also could the shop have done this by useing a impact wrench? seems like you should just snug them and tork them like the old days and do it in a pattern? i know im old school shade tree mecahnic from the old days when a cresent wrench screwdriver ductape and a few choice #### words could keep it running but these new cars are way beyond my old school knowledge.

[Hummingbird]

When disc brakes first came out the wheels had to be torqued or you could possibly warp the rotors. That's what I was told back then and I'm sticking to it.

Don't know about the newer cars as I haven't seen a torque wrench on a wheel for years. It sounds like the rotor is warped and yes they can be turned , usually ONCE as there isn't too much material in them anymore.

However, new rotors have become VERY inexpensive so it might be as easy to replace as to turn them down.

 

 

jmho

[stroker ace]

Sounds like the warped rotor syndrome to me also. If it didn't do it before and now it does sounds like tighten 'em with the impact tight to me. Have you tried to loosen one of them ? If you need the four foot cheater to get one loose you know what happened. my

[TNrider]

The shop that installed the new rotors did not tighten the lug nuts sequentially and at the proper torque. Yes they are now warped. Usually not worth turning even if new.

[wannarsv]

X2 What Hummingbird Said.... I always torq mine even though I hear comments Like I AIN'T NEVER TORQUED A LUG NUT from folks that know WAAAAAAAAY more than me. ( ifn ya knows what I means) But this I know, I don't have warped rotors.

 

Later, Melvin

[BigBoyinMS]

Most shops don't use a torque wrench anymore but the better shops at least have a set of "Wheel Torque Extension Sockets". http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/s_e8vOcFCDIW6EOA3tLzHKbKcx_GHSsYbS_Vy7L2PjsSiU3OE3uwW5Go8RfARei77FHyEkRo6IvVrHV2IRZlG1tyQ5Dpkt_Iry_gkJqtY_cUK9n2bBpiGT_-4EBl70IohF2gaWJ7wmjN5pHEBA=s90 The tech will use them with an impact wrench and they flex radially to get the torque close. The "not so good" shops will just use an impact and a regular socket and hope nothing breaks.

[bongobobny]

Pontiacs arwe known for eatring rotors!!! Heed the advice offered above...

[SilvrT]

ok i have a 2005 pontiac grandprix

i had new tires installed about 3 weeks ago. now my front end shakes while braking?

are the darn rotors warped? it goes shaky shaky and the whole steerring shakes.? while brakeing?

im not sure if these new type rotors can be turned down like i use to back in the 70,s and 80,s. also could the shop have done this by useing a impact wrench? seems like you should just snug them and tork them like the old days and do it in a pattern? i know im old school shade tree mecahnic from the old days when a cresent wrench screwdriver ductape and a few choice #### words could keep it running but these new cars are way beyond my old school knowledge.

 

First thing I would do is go back to the shop that installed the tires and say something about it.

 

When exactly did the shaking start? 3 weeks ago? yesterday? If it started 3 weeks ago then I'd suggest the shop messed up somehow. Did they pull any of the brake components off to inspect them?

 

Shaky, shaky (the way you describe it) sounds like something more than just warped rotors. Does your brake pedal pulsate? Does the steering wheel "pulsate"? How really bad is this shaky,shaky...

 

I'd have this checked out asap.

[oldgoat]

yep pedal pulsates steering wheel shakes only when i start useing the brakes then it shakes the steering and pedal pulsates. and i here a clack clack noise inside? this started yesterday so cant say for sure the tire shop did this? but im willing to place money on it. these are aloy wheels and i hope they didnt due something to the rims as well. i did call them they said it test drove out fine. what the ehll they talking about. how do you test drive tires? as thats all they do. 4 brand new goodyear tires and they dont look at things when the wheels are off?? hmm not going back there again. i was given a price of just over $200 for rotors possible need brake pads and labor that sounds fair to me.

[SilvrT]

. and i here a clack clack noise inside?

 

Is it a front wheel drive? If so, maybe it's the CV joint ??

[Hulign]

I would advise you to learn to do your own brakes. It's really easy to do and those rotors prob cost less than 30 each at the parts store. pads and rotors could be less than 100.00 and have a warranty. Torq sticks are the standard and damn reliable. one thing that can also happen is when the wheel is removed rust can fall loose behind the rotor and when retightened can cause a vibration. Newer "top hat" rotor equipped cars have fewer problems with wheel tightening throwing the rotors out of whack. The rotors aren't worth turning cause it costs 12-15 to machine and less than 30.00 for new.

 

The rear brakes get a little more complicated (esp depending on the year, GM had a class action lawsuit for one of their rear brake setups [the parking brake says pump to set on the bad ones])

 

Then front brakes may need a special socket but still with buying it you can save a TON.

 

I was an undercar specialist for 15 years....would be glad to help in any way short of driving there and doing it for ya

 

Frank

 

PS the average markup on parts when I left the business was our cost X 2.5 = OUCH... make some calls you might be surprised

[Hulign]

CV joints tend to make noise at tight turns not during braking more under load....clack..clack..clack. They usually only cause a vibration under power that goes away as you ease up on the gas (the coasting shaft will recenter but under load goes off center and vibrates).

 

Good Luck either way you go!

 

Frank

[MikeWa]

Obviously the shop did not perform a decent test drive after replacing the tires or this would have come up. Yes they could easily have warped the rotors or it could be a defective or improperly mounted tire. Have the car checked and repaired before it tears up something else.

Mike

[SilvrT]

CV joints tend to make noise at tight turns not during braking more under load....clack..clack..clack. They usually only cause a vibration under power that goes away as you ease up on the gas (the coasting shaft will recenter but under load goes off center and vibrates).

 

 

Actually, I know that... was just "throwing it out there" as a remote possibility to the "clack clack".

[Hulign]

SilvrT, I figured as much... just threw it in there. never hurts to have more ideas.

 

Even if it was a CV joint I would recommend learning those for yourself. Most auto parts places have the common 1/2 shafts for around 60.00, I have heard of shops getting upwards of 400.00 a side. Most just aren't that bad to do.

 

Loved doing them when I was paid by the flag hour though.

 

The business has just gotten too greedy. I know costs are up and traffic was down but the rough dollar has helped. Yet still they gouge.

 

Sad really

[flb_78]

If you own a torque wrench, you may just want to try to retorque the lugs yourself first.

 

Loosen the nuts 1/2 turn with the car on the ground, raise the wheel in the air, have someone step on the the brake and retorque the nuts to 75lb/ft for alloy wheels, 100lb/ft for steel wheels.

 

If that doesn't improve it, you'll probably need new rotors and I agree with Hulign, new rotors are the way to go usually for a GM front wheel drive car. I can do a front brake job on the wife's Chevy Corsica in under an hour with hand tools.

 

Autozone has your rotors for $43 each.

 

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/Duralast-Brake-Rotor-Front/2005-Pontiac-Grand-Prix/_/N-jmqqyZ8knrq?counter=0&itemIdentifier=443809_172993_2708_

 

Oreilly's has rotors for $43 each with 1 year warranty and $82 each for lifetime.

[Hulign]

I'm actually surprised they are that much. I still think if I were you I would have a go at doing them myself. It's like 4 bolts per side once the wheel is off. 2 on the caliper itself and 2 to hold on the caliper mount(most gms). Be sure to wash the rotors wish good old dish soap and water before installing (works better than brake clean for me). A box of nitril/latex gloves are worth their weight in hand cleaner!

 

Most of all have fun and take pictures, so you can gloat later about how much you saved.

 

Frank

[short-haul]

could also just be loss lug nut when you sine the paper work at most tire stores it tell you to recheck the lug torque after so many miles

 

I hope they were not left loss it will ruining a rim in a short time cause pulsation and a clicking noise.

 

improper torque sequence will also cause a pulsation so will a bad tire

[SilvrT]

 

Loved doing them when I was paid by the flag hour though.

 

 

Not sure what you mean by "flag hour" ....

 

Years ago, when I pulled wrenches, we worked by the Chilton's "flat rate" guide. It was not uncommon to get 12 paid hours of work done in a 7 hour work day.

[Hulign]

Same thing as book time. Just the term we used.

[BradT]

Alloy wheels should always be torqued.

 

If it has disc brakes on the rear it could be the rear rotors or all four of them.

 

If you ride the brake any it will heat them up and then their toast. Just replace them as it does not really cost that much new and very easy to change. Normally only two additional bolts after the tire is removed.

 

BRad

[elag]

First of all YES. When putting wheels on a car, the lug nuts have to be torqued to spec. Otherwise it could warp the rotors. Even newer cars. The company that installed the new tires may not have torqued them properly and caused the warp.

 

Second. It may not be the rotors at all. You said it started after the new tires were installed. It is possible that one of the new tires could have a broken belt. This could have been caused by over inflation or it could have just been a faulty tire. Feel around the sidewalls (inside and outside) to see if you feel anything that feels like a bump or dent. These are signs of a broken belt.

 

Third and I'll bet this is the answer you'll get from the shop. Sheer coincidence! You're rotors just happened to warp just after you had the tires installed. Not much you can do to prove otherwise. If they try to tell you this. There is no point in arguing, just have them replaced (elsewhere!)

[oldgoat]

just had all 4 rotors and of course all new pads done and had a heart attack at the cost to do this was$485.00 but i went with the best pads and rotors out there. 2 year warrenty on the rotors and suppose to be limited life time pads? lets just say when it comes to my safety i think this was not a bad price. im to crippeld up to do this myself.

also got a free wash and wax and carpet vaccum and top the fluids windshield ect. and one free tire rotation and oil change at 3000 miles that in it,s self impressed me with this shop and no it,s not the tire shop that did this.. just that i had 10,000 miles on these old rotors and pads so i guess i cant blame the tire shop. but gee dont ya think they would have noticed this when they did my tires? but all is well and im back on the road with good brakes and knowing im safe out there for myself as well as others...