V7Goose Posted April 5, 2011 #26 Posted April 5, 2011 (edited) The Barnett pressure plate is pretty - up until you put the engine cover back on. Are you saying it lose it's appearance after that?:rotf: Yes, that is EXACTLY what I am saying! By definition, something that cannot be seen has no appearance. But if you are buying it because of its beauty, you could always take a picture of it and tape that to the engine case. Goose Edited April 5, 2011 by V7Goose
Guest scarylarry Posted April 5, 2011 #27 Posted April 5, 2011 Yes, that is EXACTLY what I am saying! By definition, something that cannot be seen has no appearance. But if you are buying it because of its beauty, you could always take a picture of it and tape that to the engine case. Goose :rotf::rotf:
CaptainJoe Posted April 5, 2011 #28 Posted April 5, 2011 You probably also believe, if a tree falls in a forest and no ones around, that it doesn't make a sound.
Rick Haywood Posted April 5, 2011 Author #29 Posted April 5, 2011 Well I wish this thread would have ended at about thre first ten posts/replies. It's really to bad that most anytime you ask about something it turns into a this is better or you shouldn't spend more money or what ever. As for the Barnett why would someone assume a person is buying it because it looks good. Most people I know realize you can't see the thing after an install anyway and for someone to suggest that the Barnett spring and the PCW spring are the same thing is foolish because they are different in everyway. In the future I guess the best thing to do is just not ask so as to not offend someone and have the thread turn into a this is better and you are stupid to spend more money for looks. Sorry to rant but it gets annoying that this happens almost every time.
Rick Haywood Posted April 5, 2011 Author #30 Posted April 5, 2011 As far as the PCW name, there is no argument here. What is interesting is that some have recommended using the PCW supplied spring kit only. They want $69.95 for the kit plus shipping. Skydoc17 will sell you the same PCW spring and the rest in genuine Yamaha parts for $80.00. And he will include full step by step instructions. Saving a couple of bucks or helping one of the people who contribute a lot to this site. I know which one I would choose. I am fairly sure Earl will be there to help you on the phone when things don't go as planned. Look at the customer reviews on Harbor Freight's site regarding these wrenches, more so the 3/8", but also the 1/4" There have been more than a few say the wrench didn't click off when used and they snapped the first fastener off. Gary Which Kit did you buy?
V7Goose Posted April 5, 2011 #31 Posted April 5, 2011 Well I wish this thread would have ended at about thre first ten posts/replies. It's really to bad that most anytime you ask about something it turns into a this is better or you shouldn't spend more money or what ever. As for the Barnett why would someone assume a person is buying it because it looks good. Most people I know realize you can't see the thing after an install anyway and for someone to suggest that the Barnett spring and the PCW spring are the same thing is foolish because they are different in everyway. In the future I guess the best thing to do is just not ask so as to not offend someone and have the thread turn into a this is better and you are stupid to spend more money for looks. Sorry to rant but it gets annoying that this happens almost every time.Rick, buddy, it seems to be time to clear the air here - you have taken exception to things that were not even said in this thread. I didn't see anybody say you shouldn't spend more money for something you wanted. In addition, nobody ever said or tried to imply that the Barnett pressure plate and PCW spring were the same thing. I DID say that the Barnett functioned as good as the PCW spring - if that upsets anyone, I cannot understand it. As for the comments about its looks, they were jokes between several of us, and none of them were even posted in response to someone saying they preferred the Barnett pressure plate. I did take exception to several posts that tried to state good things about one spring kit in such a way to imply that those specific things were in some way different or better than you would get with the competition. That is uniformed at best, and dishonest at worst, and I wanted to make sure that other members would have the information to evaluate the options. I do have my opinions on the Barnett kit, but I did not mention them in any way except to say it performed as well as the PCW spring. Stating that it costs nearly twice as much is a fact (assuming my memory is correct on the price). I do not know why someone would take exception to sharing that fact. Goose
dingy Posted April 5, 2011 #32 Posted April 5, 2011 Which Kit did you buy? I have neither of the kits being discussed. I went with a third option which is referred to as the 'Double D' mod. It uses two stock pressure diaphragms stacked from an MKII style clutch. The half plate is replaced with a full plate and the diaphragm spring seat is omitted. It is, in my opinion this is the one with the least slippage potential, but this does come at a price. It takes a LOT of lever force to pull. I would not recommend it for the 'normal' rider, if there is such a thing, due to the lever pull. I find myself shifting into neutral if I know I am going to be stopped at a light for a while sometimes. I also replaced lines with S.S. braided hoses. I just had the motor back out, for some more upgrades this winter & the friction plates had not worn even a .001" from last year, with about 6,000 miles on them. Gary
Rick Haywood Posted April 6, 2011 Author #33 Posted April 6, 2011 I have neither of the kits being discussed. I went with a third option which is referred to as the 'Double D' mod. It uses two stock pressure diaphragms stacked from an MKII style clutch. The half plate is replaced with a full plate and the diaphragm spring seat is omitted. It is, in my opinion this is the one with the least slippage potential, but this does come at a price. It takes a LOT of lever force to pull. I would not recommend it for the 'normal' rider, if there is such a thing, due to the lever pull. I find myself shifting into neutral if I know I am going to be stopped at a light for a while sometimes. I also replaced lines with S.S. braided hoses. I just had the motor back out, for some more upgrades this winter & the friction plates had not worn even a .001" from last year, with about 6,000 miles on them. Gary Thanks for the info, I also have thought about going with the double spring thing.
Rick Haywood Posted April 6, 2011 Author #34 Posted April 6, 2011 OK I stand Corrected, I took a few of the posts as to say It was really foolish for me to spend $140 or so on something that isn't any better or different than one that costs $80 other than it looks nicer in the box.
skydoc_17 Posted April 6, 2011 #35 Posted April 6, 2011 I always thought that the object of asking a question in an open forum was to Solicit the opinions of the other members of the forum. In the hope that the other members will divulge information that you were not aware of. As with every post I personally make, you are welcome to "take what you need" and leave the rest. I can honestly say that there have been very, very, few threads that I have ever read that didn't shed some new light on these wonderful machines that we all own and love. Is it true that sometimes you need to "wade thru" some of the posts to get to the "meat " of a particular thread, with out a doubt! Are there a bunch of "humorists" in this forum, yes in deed! Are there members of this forum that are extremely passionate about the subjects that appear in the threads, You bet! The Yamaha V4 is an exceptional motorcycle, in all of it's forms. Worthy of the exceptional people that own them, and are members of VR.ORG. I dare say that you would be hard pressed to find a more jovial, well informed group of owners at one of the other sites weather it would be for a car, a truck OR a motorcycle. It is indeed a "family". Can any member honestly say that they have not tolerated a family member while they "vented", or got "overly excited" about a subject, or was learning how to exercise their "social skills", OR just wanted some "attention"? We tolerate these family members out of love and respect, because this is what family members do. I try to keep this "family" attitude when I read the posts and threads on the VR.ORG site. And by doing so, I am guaranteed that I will come away with a better understanding of the machine I own, and the people that have posted. Earl
V7Goose Posted April 6, 2011 #36 Posted April 6, 2011 OK I stand Corrected, I took a few of the posts as to say It was really foolish for me to spend $140 or so on something that isn't any better or different than one that costs $80 other than it looks nicer in the box. I understand where you are coming from. But as I said above, I don't think anyone said or implied that at all. And as I specifically said in my post, if there is something about that kit that you find of value over the competition, then you made the right choice to buy it. I know it will function well for you. Goose
Zane Posted April 6, 2011 #37 Posted April 6, 2011 I think Sky_doc sells that too. Support your fellow Venturer!
marinakorp Posted April 6, 2011 #38 Posted April 6, 2011 I just put the Barnett in my 96 Royal... it Sure does look pretty behind the cover... and it works quite well. It is a little stiffer (at first) and I assume that Ijust got used to it... or it broke in a bit...put about 500 miles on it. It really hooks up well. Where I had a feeling of slippage in higher gears when on the highway and applying the throttle... I do not have that feeling any more. I initially had issues with the low speed feathering of the clutch (when first installed) and it was difficult...it is much easier now.
Rick Haywood Posted April 6, 2011 Author #39 Posted April 6, 2011 I just put the Barnett in my 96 Royal... it Sure does look pretty behind the cover... and it works quite well. It is a little stiffer (at first) and I assume that Ijust got used to it... or it broke in a bit...put about 500 miles on it. It really hooks up well. Where I had a feeling of slippage in higher gears when on the highway and applying the throttle... I do not have that feeling any more. I initially had issues with the low speed feathering of the clutch (when first installed) and it was difficult...it is much easier now. Thanks for the info
Guest Posted April 6, 2011 #40 Posted April 6, 2011 I just put the Barnett in my 96 Royal... it Sure does look pretty behind the cover... and it works quite well.. Wait..you dont have the Barnett clear clutch housing cover yet????? :witch_brew::rotfl::hurts:
dingy Posted April 6, 2011 #41 Posted April 6, 2011 Try this. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260755316759&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT Gary
CaptainJoe Posted April 6, 2011 #42 Posted April 6, 2011 Just don't do what i fdid and not order a side case gasket. I ordered the 5 springs and 7 friction plates OEM and forgot the gasket... for my 650 Vstar. Hopefully i can get the side cover off without tearing the old gasket. Otherwise it will be laying in pieces for a couple more weeks... Like other members said... whatever you feel good about is what counts. Wish i could have put stiffer springs on the 650 but alas its a manual clutch and was worried about the pull in pressure .
flb_78 Posted April 6, 2011 #43 Posted April 6, 2011 I don't have a clutch cover gasket. When I replaced my clutch, I used an anaerobic gasket maker from LocTite.
MizzouMike73 Posted April 6, 2011 #44 Posted April 6, 2011 I have the barnett, and yes it looked pretty in the box, and on the bike http://thumb8.webshots.net/t/76/176/9/50/85/2393950850096516608NCNwNu_th.jpg I put it on, followed the instructions, replaced the gasket with an OEM, I have ridden about 200 miles on it so far with no issues. Going to do about 1,000 this weekend, so wish me luck. I did not notice any real difference in the clutch pull, but I did notice that the clutch did stop slipping. I replaced the friction plates, but not the clutch plates (should have bought the whole kit), but the plates still had the dimples and looked good. 48k miles on the OEM. Good luck, as long as it fixes your issue and you are happy with the result, I consider it a success!!
MAINEAC Posted April 7, 2011 #45 Posted April 7, 2011 I'm just gonna throw my take on this thing... I spent the extra money on the Barnett Pressure Plate upgrade because i see it as a "true upgrade" while I look at the PCW upgrade as more of a fix... let me try to explain .. PCW from everything I've heard from people on this forum is a fine product and their customer service seems to be excellent.. from what I've heard and I am not knocking their product in any way.. And their diaphragm spring replacement seems to fix the OEM Yamaha weak clutch spring problem and is probably the spring Yamaha should have made in the first place and we would probably not be having this discussion now because our original clutches would not be slipping for 10s of thousands of miles instead of 10 to 40K like most of us... I detected slipping when i bought my RSV with 10K on it... Maybe it was due to rider abuse by the original owner... who knows.. Now the Barnett replaces the whole pressure plate and diaphragm type spring with an automotive type plate with 6 coil springs.. no need to add a 1/2 plate or remove a plate or whatever else is required with the other upgrade... Just bolt it in and you have a positive clucth that locks up without any slippage and probably (I really don't know this as a fact) wears more evenly because of the design... AGAIN this is my thought process not actually fact... Time will tell which way to go was better when our upgraded clutch's start failing.. I got close to 80K on mine without a hint of slipping and yes I pull a trailer and probably have 35K on that.. So yes i spent the extra money for a Barnett and yes Goose I know you think it's a waste of money... I got the memo a few years ago with your comments back then when i was looking to upgrade... I've removed perfectly good factory clutches before to "Upgrade" with Barnett clutches back in the day because i wanted better than factory performance,,, So when my RSV clutch was slipping and I found out Barnett made a replacement pressure plate that would cure the slipping it was a no-brainer for me...
LilBeaver Posted April 7, 2011 #46 Posted April 7, 2011 ... I got close to 80K on mine without a hint of slipping and yes I pull a trailer and probably have 35K on that.. ... Good info. Thanks!
Yammer Dan Posted April 7, 2011 #47 Posted April 7, 2011 I got a Barnett waiting in my spare parts but I fixed mine for less than a buck and if its working I ain't messing with it. Picks the front wheel up just fine. About 90 per cent of the time you don't need to replace gasket when pulling clutch cover. This is just my experience. May pull the next dozen and ruin gasket every time.
dingy Posted April 7, 2011 #48 Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) What difference is there between an MKI clutch and the Barnett? Just stronger springs? These MKI clutches are always on ebay, if the stronger springs are available & cost effective this might be another option. I have one laying around I took out of the 1200 motor. Pictures of MKI style clutch attached. Gary Edited April 8, 2011 by dingy added another picture
LilBeaver Posted April 8, 2011 #49 Posted April 8, 2011 Excellent question! Hopefully someone can answer this... What difference is there between an MKI clutch and the Barnett? ...
Prairiehammer Posted April 8, 2011 #50 Posted April 8, 2011 According to Dingy in this thread http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?p=529445#post529445 there is no difference between a Barnett and a stock MK1. Hmmm.
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