royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 #1 Posted February 17, 2011 Folks I need some help here. Rode today 2 up for the first time on my RSV and it killed me. Not the handling so much. My problem is when she mounts and dis-mounts. I cant hold the bike up. We made one stop and come home. It took everything I had to not drop it twice and by then I was used up. Her getting on first makes it very hard to stand the bike up, but easier on me a little. However when needing to have her get off in order to get into a park spot or for whatever reason i simply cannot hold the bike up. Im not so sure I did not pull something in my wrist saving the bike. Her short legs dont allow much for her to anything any different, but someting has to change or I am going to be totally spent before we leave for a ride.
Ponch Posted February 17, 2011 #2 Posted February 17, 2011 You'll have to figure out what works best for you. I have LilBit mount the bike first. To me it's easier than trying to balance it while she gets on. Passengers have to learn how to ride too. When we first started, she learned pretty quick not to squirm around at low speeds and to be still at stop signs especially in windy conditions.
BoomerCPO Posted February 17, 2011 #3 Posted February 17, 2011 Leave the kickstand down whenever she gets on/off the scoot. Boomer....who sez you should NOT tell her to go onna diet unless you have alternate living quarters available...
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #4 Posted February 17, 2011 Here's what my wife and I do ... with the bike that is I stand up and plant both feet on the ground and hold the handlebars with the front brake engaged. I squeeze my inner thighs against the gas tank. Getting on... She puts her right hand on the backrest on the trunk and her left hand on my shoulder. She then puts her left foot on the footboard and leans intowards the bike. As she raises herself up, she moves her body into her seating area to transfer her weight to a more central point on the bike. She then lifts her right leg up and thru her seating area ad sits down. Getting off... (should I talk about that?) ... It's the opposite of getting on. This works very well for us and as long as she doesn't try to get on or off before I am "ready" ... I have no problem holding the bike steady. BTW, I am a very slight build guy of appx 155 lbs and 5' 11" and she is almost as tall as me and around 160 lbs Never ever have I had a rider get on the bike before me ... not on any bike I have ever owned.
Owen Posted February 17, 2011 #5 Posted February 17, 2011 I always allow her to mount and dismount the bike with me off and standing on the kickstand side to assist her. When she is settled, I then get on. My bike has been lowered and the kick stand is a little long which means it does not lean as far as stock when parked. That makes it a little easier to lift. If I need to back into a parking spot, I put it on the kick stand, get off and help her dismount. Nothing is worth getting my passenger hurt.
1joeranger Posted February 17, 2011 #6 Posted February 17, 2011 Funny how perspective is! Never entered my mind that someone loading or unloading off a bike would be an issue!! My girlfriend is 5' 2" maybe and, I'm guessing, 110?! No issue there!! My daughter is 5' 11 1/2" (always wanted to be taller then her dad - we call her midget!!) and I'm guessing she is 135?! Still no issue! I did give a fellow employee a ride once and I'll say he was about 210?! No issue there either. Please don't get me wrong just because its a no issue to me in no way discounts another who does have issues. It just never occurred to me that this could be a problem. Till I got the hang of it I could not raise my bike onto a center stand without using a 2x4. Now I can bike still has that monster weight, I am just better at applying leverage now. Or maybe the center stand finally found its grove!!!
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #7 Posted February 17, 2011 Funny how perspective is! Never entered my mind that someone loading or unloading off a bike would be an issue!! My girlfriend is 5' 2" maybe and, I'm guessing, 110?! No issue there!! My daughter is 5' 11 1/2" (always wanted to be taller then her dad - we call her midget!!) and I'm guessing she is 135?! Still no issue! I did give a fellow employee a ride once and I'll say he was about 210?! No issue there either. Please don't get me wrong just because its a no issue to me in no way discounts another who does have issues. It just never occurred to me that this could be a problem. Till I got the hang of it I could not raise my bike onto a center stand without using a 2x4. Now I can bike still has that monster weight, I am just better at applying leverage now. Or maybe the center stand finally found its grove!!! Using the method I described above, I have had times when a passenger has attempted to mount or dismount when I wasn't ready and almost caused me to drop the bike .... but for the most part, those were an extreme situation of not being "ready".
LilBeaver Posted February 17, 2011 #8 Posted February 17, 2011 Leave the kickstand down whenever she gets on/off the scoot. Boomer....who sez you should NOT tell her to go onna diet unless you have alternate living quarters available... :sign yeah that: :sign yeah that: Here's what my wife and I do ... with the bike that is I stand up and plant both feet on the ground and hold the handlebars with the front brake engaged. I squeeze my inner thighs against the gas tank. Getting on... She puts her right hand on the backrest on the trunk and her left hand on my shoulder. She then puts her left foot on the footboard and leans intowards the bike. As she raises herself up, she moves her body into her seating area to transfer her weight to a more central point on the bike. She then lifts her right leg up and thru her seating area ad sits down. ... It's the opposite of getting on. This works very well for us and as long as she doesn't try to get on or off before I am "ready" ... I have no problem holding the bike steady. BTW, I am a very slight build guy of appx 155 lbs and 5' 11" and she is almost as tall as me and around 160 lbs Never ever have I had a rider get on the bike before me ... not on any bike I have ever owned. I mostly agree with SilvrT on his description here. The key is having the person getting on the bike to try to keep as centered as possible on getting on/off, using the DRIVER for support and doing it in a SMOOTH motion. Think of it like getting in and out of a canoe (on water, of course) -- if you have any experience with that. I ALWAYS leave the side-stand DOWN for passenger mount and dismount even though I hold the bike upright. My reason is that just in case I cannot hold the bike up for whatever reason (ie my knee gives out, foot slips, etc etc) the side-stand is there to save my rump. There have been a few occasions where I have let a passenger mount first. I have given rides to a few youngsters that needed to be lifted and set in place on the back seat; no problem. The other times have been when I give my grandfather a ride. He had a stoke a few years back and has very limited mobility. It is a big effort to get him on, safe and situated but he has been riding since he was in his early teens (he is ~85 now) [he also gave me my first motorcycle ride and inspired my excitement about bikes]. SO, when he wants to go for a ride, I make it work. Typically for him getting on and off it takes at least 3 of us. One to stabilize the bike and hold the front brake then one person on each side of the bike to help him on and get him situated. I'm no beast either, ~200lbs and a whopping 5'8". Only times I have trouble when someone gets on or off is when they do so and I am not ready. OH YEAH, MAKE SURE THE BARS/FRONT TIRE ARE PERFECTLY STRAIGHT WHEN STOPPING OR MOUNTING A PASSENGER!!!! Hope that helps.
royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 Author #9 Posted February 17, 2011 Maybe it will come with time. Our 2 other bikes were never an issue. This one I have no control at all when she gets on or off of it. I am not a whimpy guy. Im 6'0 and med built at 155 lbs while she is short and thin (for obvious reasons I wont disclose the weight) but she is not big at all . I am very stout for a "thin" buy but this bike whipped me today. My left wrist is done. Hopefully it gets better. If we cannot figure this out Ill get rid of it. Not going to own something that I cant keep full 100% safe control of. I love the leaving the kickstand down idea. At least I can give up if it starts to go over next time insetad of hurting myself saving it.
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #10 Posted February 17, 2011 Think of it like getting in and out of a canoe (on water, of course) -- if you have any experience with that. Now there's a great analogy. I ALWAYS leave the side-stand DOWN for passenger mount and dismount even though I hold the bike upright. My reason is that just in case I cannot hold the bike up for whatever reason (ie my knee gives out, foot slips, etc etc) the side-stand is there to save my rump. Great idea Rick... I've never thought of that but it's a good habit to get into. There have been a few occasions where I have let a passenger mount first. I have given rides to a few youngsters that needed to be lifted and set in place on the back seat; no problem. The other times have been when I give my grandfather a ride. He had a stoke a few years back and has very limited mobility. It is a big effort to get him on, safe and situated but he has been riding since he was in his early teens (he is ~85 now) [he also gave me my first motorcycle ride and inspired my excitement about bikes]. SO, when he wants to go for a ride, I make it work. Typically for him getting on and off it takes at least 3 of us. One to stabilize the bike and hold the front brake then one person on each side of the bike to help him on and get him situated. I stand corrected from my earlier post as I have given rides to older folk and youngsters who needed help getting on the bike....first.
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #11 Posted February 17, 2011 Maybe it will come with time. Our 2 other bikes were never an issue. This one I have no control at all when she gets on or off of it. I am not a whimpy guy. Im 6'0 and med built at 155 lbs while she is short and thin (for obvious reasons I wont disclose the weight) but she is not big at all . I am very stout for a "thin" buy but this bike whipped me today. My left wrist is done. Hopefully it gets better. If we cannot figure this out Ill get rid of it. Not going to own something that I cant keep full 100% safe control of. I love the leaving the kickstand down idea. At least I can give up if it starts to go over next time insetad of hurting myself saving it. Practise, practise, practise .... don't get yourself down over this ONE time. Be thankful it's a 2nd gen you got and not a 1st gen .... you'd have already gotten rid of it with that attitude. Curious... what were your other 2 bikes??? This can make all the difference.
Flyinfool Posted February 17, 2011 #12 Posted February 17, 2011 OH YEAH, MAKE SURE THE BARS/FRONT TIRE ARE PERFECTLY STRAIGHT WHEN STOPPING OR MOUNTING A PASSENGER!!!! Hope that helps. Hmmmm... never worried about the bars while mounting my passenger........... Like anything else about riding it takes practice. It is worth the effort to just practice with her till it finally clicks and becomes a non issue. I lean the bike a little to the right so that there is very little weight on my left foot, the passenger then climbs on as SilvrT described, as the passenger is getting on I bring the bike to center balance. Once you learn how to do this you can load a 300lb passenger with no balance issues. (there will be other issues with a 300lb passenger:whistling:) I never realized that I even did this till someone behind us mentioned that I had the bike leaning way to the right and the passengers weight is what brought the bike to center.
Mel Posted February 17, 2011 #13 Posted February 17, 2011 Around 50 years of riding, LOTS OF 2-up time. I never thought of it as a problem or something to be planned. Side stand down, I get on, I'm in control of the bike. Passenger gets on, sometimes uses the rear footpeg/floorboard or not depending on height, athleticism, what bike, etc. Most of the time (I have to think about this) I guess I do put some of the weight of the bike on my left leg. My passenger grabs my left arm for an assist when getting on or off. I'm 73, my passenger is not far behind (age, that is) and we just take our time and use some caution. With the RSV it does take some grunt to hoist it upright, and you want to be sure that the sidestand is down when unloading. That being said, I am looking at some kind of trike conversion to help with the slow speed/stopped handling. Between the two of us we're probably putting 370 pounds on the seats, and the RSV is a little top heavy anyway. Here's what I'd like to get, but they say they do not make it to fit RSV. Darn,darn, darn!But I'm working on 'em. Maybe they would change their mind with a few more inquiries from Royal Star owners? http://www.trikealternative.com/retractatrike.shtml
flb_78 Posted February 17, 2011 #14 Posted February 17, 2011 I am not a whimpy guy. Im 6'0 and med built at 155 lbs I called that 7th grade.
MiCarl Posted February 17, 2011 #15 Posted February 17, 2011 My only thought is that she may be leaning back and hauling herself up with her arms. As others have said she needs to be in close to the bike.
royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 Author #16 Posted February 17, 2011 My only thought is that she may be leaning back and hauling herself up with her arms. As others have said she needs to be in close to the bike. We are going to practice in the garage. I too after reading replies seem to think its her, not me or the bike, but her "hanging" out off the left floorboard. I dont turn my head and standing puts my mirrors out of seeing whats going on while she is climbing on n off. Maybe we will sit up a video camera. I know it sounds crazzy but this one little thing of not properly knowing how to get on or off, or if its something I am doing, could have got us hurt.
royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 Author #17 Posted February 17, 2011 I called that 7th grade. Me to and 8th, 9th, and so on . I am the same size as I was when I graduated. Looking at some of my classmates 20 yrs later it makes me feel good too
royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 Author #18 Posted February 17, 2011 Practise, practise, practise .... don't get yourself down over this ONE time. Be thankful it's a 2nd gen you got and not a 1st gen .... you'd have already gotten rid of it with that attitude. Curious... what were your other 2 bikes??? This can make all the difference. 500 Kawasaki as a starter quite a few yrs back. Graduated to a M50 Boulevard from there. Now this bike. I knew it would be a big step up.
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #19 Posted February 17, 2011 500 Kawasaki as a starter quite a few yrs back. Graduated to a M50 Boulevard from there. Now this bike. I knew it would be a big step up. Yep... and several pounds heavier ... which makes ALL the difference I'd say. Take your time my friend... you'll get the hang of it... (or as you eluded to earlier... SHE will)
royalstar09 Posted February 17, 2011 Author #20 Posted February 17, 2011 Yep... and several pounds heavier ... which makes ALL the difference I'd say. Take your time my friend... you'll get the hang of it... (or as you eluded to earlier... SHE will) Thank you all so much. I love this bike so far, and was just in hopes it would be an operater or passenger thing and not a typical of the royal star thing. I may lighten my gas load for a while in an attempt tohelp me in my learning curve as well. 6 Gals up high like that is only adding to my learning issues. I have the Ride like a pro DVD on its way as well.
SilvrT Posted February 17, 2011 #21 Posted February 17, 2011 BTW, I am a very slight build guy of appx 155 lbs and 5' 11" and she is almost as tall as me and around 160 lbs Well, for a guy of my size (and you know what I'm talking about), she sure feels like 160 lbs when I lift her up and spin her around when we're dancin .... (but then again, so does a 100 lb sack of potatoes!) .... NO!! ... I DO NOT dance with a sack 'o spuds! ... LMAO!!! (I think I'd better stop coz for some reason, I feel my foot raising towards my mouth here...)
friesman Posted February 17, 2011 #22 Posted February 17, 2011 Ive had passengers that were around 200 lbs that couldnt get on while I was on the bike as they couldnt haul themselves up over the seat, so she just got on first with the bike on the side stand and swung one leg over where I would be sitting and then I got on after. that was putting my 85 wwayyy over capacity with the 2 of us, but the venture still handled everything great, but a wee bit top heavy. I found if I kinda sat down on on right side of the bike, I didnt need to wrestle it as much, let my body weight work for me,(there is an advantage to being about 300lbs), it felt like the bike would kinda settle,then after the bike is upright redistribute myself .....But I needed more air in the shocks.....lots mo air....lol. I have a "preflight" talk I have with every new passenger and have to remind some of my old passengers too, but it goes something like.. you dont get on until I say ok, you dont get off until I say ok (even if we are stopped), dont move at low speeds and stop signs, and dont be afraid to ask questions. I have told most passengers that havnt ridden before to think of themselves as a sack of potatos as the bike leans dont do anything drastic, just do what the sack of potatos would do in that circumstance...seems to help people visulaze and know what to expect. Brian
Guest scarylarry Posted February 17, 2011 #23 Posted February 17, 2011 My wife is 5' and can't get on with me on, the backrest has to be folded over due to her short legs.. This works for us and never had issue letting her on first.....
warriorhoneybee Posted February 17, 2011 #24 Posted February 17, 2011 i always make sure i'm on the bike first and in control,this is key in not dropping the bike. after i get on and have control(balance)i tell her ok and then she mounts me i mean the bike and than before i take off i always make sure she's ready to go. dis-mounting works the same way,i stop and make sure i have good footing and balance and than tell her ok and she dismounts.make sure on however you do it you do it the same way so you both get use to it and ALWAYS make sure you both know what you are fixing to do. good luck i personaly dont like the idea of her on the bike without me.
LilBeaver Posted February 17, 2011 #25 Posted February 17, 2011 We are going to practice in the garage. I too after reading replies seem to think its her, not me or the bike, but her "hanging" out off the left floorboard. I dont turn my head and standing puts my mirrors out of seeing whats going on while she is climbing on n off. Maybe we will sit up a video camera. I know it sounds crazzy but this one little thing of not properly knowing how to get on or off, or if its something I am doing, could have got us hurt. In my opinion, as anything with the potential for some SERIOUS injuries NOTHING is TOO LITTLE when it comes to safety precautions. I doubt that I need to mention it but knowing one's limits is just as important, if not more important than anything else in evaluating what is and is not okay. Setting up a video camera is an EXCELLENT idea! This will give both of you an opportunity to LOOK and see what happens while going through this process. ESPECIALLY what LITTLE things can make BIG differences in what goes on (small passenger movements where she may not even realize she is doing it). With the passenger stepping on the floor board and you balancing the bike with the bars and your feet, you essentially have yourself a 2nd or 3rd class lever (fulcrum = tires, passenger being loaded is the applied force and YOU holding the bike steady being the response to the applied force). Minimizing the distance between the applied force and the fulcrum (your passenger keeping her self as close to the wheels/pivot point as possible) will make a huge difference in the amount of applied force necessary to counter the torque applied by the passenger stepping on. Remember Torque=distance x force (technically speaking it is the cross-product of the displacement vector and the force vector - but not important here). The goal is to maintain rotational equilibrium, which means bike does not rotate. Anyhoot, I digress... Sorry, Physics excites me... 500 Kawasaki as a starter quite a few yrs back. Graduated to a M50 Boulevard from there. Now this bike. I knew it would be a big step up. Yep... and several pounds heavier ... which makes ALL the difference I'd say. Take your time my friend... you'll get the hang of it... (or as you eluded to earlier... SHE will) Several pounds heavier and a higher center of gravity! The RSV weighs in around 850lbs dry (say ~900 with a full tank) and your Boulevard maybe tipped the scales at what, 550 or so? The Higher center of gravity roughly translates to the fact that it will take more effort to hold it up (when you are a few degrees off center) -- again this comes back down to a rotational equilibrium/torque explanation where you, the bike and the tires [pivot point] constitute a 2nd class lever where the 'weight' is concentrated at the CG located between the point where you apply the force and the pivot point of the bike. I'll stop here, if anyone wants a true explanation of this I'll be happy to write it out but for now I'll call it quits here. Thank you all so much. I love this bike so far, and was just in hopes it would be an operater or passenger thing and not a typical of the royal star thing. I may lighten my gas load for a while in an attempt tohelp me in my learning curve as well. 6 Gals up high like that is only adding to my learning issues. I have the Ride like a pro DVD on its way as well. Folks MUCH MUCH smaller than you have been riding these bikes for a while without a problem so just some more practice and don't forget that it is a BIG bike and you'll be fine. Ensuring you are absolutely 100% comfortable on the bike by your self may be wise before giving to many rides to an excited passenger - but I'm sure I don't need to be the one to tell you that either. ... I have a "preflight" talk I have with every new passenger and have to remind some of my old passengers too, but it goes something like.. you dont get on until I say ok, you dont get off until I say ok (even if we are stopped), dont move at low speeds and stop signs, and dont be afraid to ask questions. I have told most passengers that havnt ridden before to think of themselves as a sack of potatos as the bike leans dont do anything drastic, just do what the sack of potatos would do in that circumstance...seems to help people visulaze and know what to expect. Brian Good advice here too. I do the same with ALL of my passengers - I don't care WHAT kind of experience they have (unless they regularly ride with me - then they get to pass on the lecture) but in actuality I have found that seasoned riders make WORSE passengers than folks that have never been on a bike before in their life. I also make a point to say if they are uncomfortable with ANY aspect of the ride or my driving to SPEAK UP immediately. Because if they are uncomfortable, timid, or tense about something - that may actually come back to but both driver and passenger as any twitching or whatever will be transfered to the bike and if done at the right (well... wrong) time, could be the difference of staying upright or going down. Well, for a guy of my size (and you know what I'm talking about), she sure feels like 160 lbs when I lift her up and spin her around when we're dancin .... (but then again, so does a 100 lb sack of potatoes!) .... NO!! ... I DO NOT dance with a sack 'o spuds! ... LMAO!!! (I think I'd better stop coz for some reason, I feel my foot raising towards my mouth here...) Maybe someone should hit the gym - (or eat healthier soup)! (and no I am not talking about HER) :stickpoke:. Although it may be hard to eat anything at all until you can pry that appendage out of your mouth... might be time to bust out the 'ol shoe horn again,eh? Good luck with that!
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