83 MK1 no spark on #1 SORTA

[The Cheese]

Hello All. Thanks for taking a look.

 

Little history first, 83 VR. Less thank 6k miles. New to me. Has spent the better part of its life sitting in a yard. So far, I have:

Pressure washed

Full carb overhaul

Bleed the clutch

Re soldered the CLASS thingy

Changed spark plugs

Checked gas tank for rust

Some other odds and ends not related

 

After getting my carbs finally done. Put em back on and it ran. Much improved than before. I have not synced yet. The tach is non responsive. I rev it up. It goes down. Let off it goes back up. Thought it was strange. Bike will not rev up past *k RPM.

I do know that #1 is getting a spark when I push the starter button. Then as soon as it starts, the spark goes away. Of coarse I am letting off the button when it does start. However, if I tap the button while it is running I can see it get a spark. I know I should not do that. But it was a thought. If I hit the kill switch, I can see a weak spark. If I turn the IGN. switch off, I swear I see a weak spark again. I have checked the plug cap. It was clean. The place it mates with the wire was slightly corroded and loose. I have since cut off till I got good wire and reinstalled with no effect.

 

As I type this its 26*. Its a bit cold to go dealing with it much. I have not checked out anything else. I plan to take the right hand controls apart and clean it. I also plan to check out the fuse holder on the bat. What else should I look at? And how should I do it? I was under the impression that coils either work, or dont. Is it safe to assume that?

 

If she needs a new TCI, I will have to move on. I do not want to give up that easy, but buying a used on on eBay looks out of the picture.

 

Michael

[MiCarl]

If I understand you correctly the tach works, but when you rev it the tach drops to 0?

 

My 89 does the same thing if I get lots of water above the engine. It straightens out when dry, 5 minutes on the road does it. Clearly water getting somewhere it shouldn't

 

The tachometer is electronic and basically works by counting the firing pulses to a coil (I thought it was #2, but only have a 25% chance of being right:confused24:). Of course when my tach dies the cylinder it watches cuts out too.

 

The tach dying tells me it's probably not a coil but the pulse to the coil. I'm probably either getting some water into the TCI or somewhere am shorting out a pick up coil.

 

I could find the problem and fix it, but so far have found it's easier just not to spray water up there.

 

Of course when this is going on it doesn't rev so well either. You may be loosing more than one.

 

The coils fire when the TCI cuts power to them (essentially the TCI charges the coils then they discharge when the TCI switches off). Hitting the kill switch will have the same effect. I'm at a loss to explain why the start button would do it.

 

It might be worth pulling the TCI and checking to see if it's got a bunch of water in it.

 

**

Oh by the way: The reason it fires at idle and then cuts out at higher RPMs is everything happens faster at higher rpms. That moisture is pulling something out of spec and it falls on its face when it has to work fast.

Edited December 8, 2010 by MiCarl

[The Cheese]

I did give it a good hosing at the car wash. But that was a month ago. It has been raining alot here as well. Its been dry for a couple of days now. I am so close to bringing it in the house!

 

The tach will read when its idling. As long as engine speed does not change to quickly, it will keep it. Up to a certain point. When I slowly feed it some throttle, it will go slowly down. I will have to take a vid to describe it well.

 

I think you are right about getting tach signal from number two. The right side jugs fire well. I mean the exhaust is really hot. But the left side not so much. Maybe It runs on three when idling, then when I try to rev it, num 2 cuts out. That would explain both. Now to find the y?

 

Michael

[SC89Venture]

Michael,

 

Hang in there with it, these are awesome machines. I don't have much to offer excpet this. Read all you can about these bikes in the tech sections and all the forums. The search engine works great when you figure out how to use it. I started wrenching on my 89 model doing tires and brakes, and well still working on the brakes.

 

There are great people on here that will chime in.

 

Keep us posted.

 

Don

[Yammer Dan]

Wet TCI.

[bongobobny]

Or the connector from the pickup coils to the TCI. Pressure washing may very well have gotten into the connector and it has since corroded. Unseating and a coat of dielectric grease should fix that issue. You will find the connector halfway up the frame behind the motor on the stator side...

[Condor]

If I understand you correctly the tach works, but when you rev it the tach drops to 0?

 

My 89 does the same thing if I get lots of water above the engine. It straightens out when dry, 5 minutes on the road does it. Clearly water getting somewhere it shouldn't

 

The tachometer is electronic and basically works by counting the firing pulses to a coil (I thought it was #2, but only have a 25% chance of being right:confused24:). Of course when my tach dies the cylinder it watches cuts out too.

 

The tach dying tells me it's probably not a coil but the pulse to the coil. I'm probably either getting some water into the TCI or somewhere am shorting out a pick up coil.

 

I could find the problem and fix it, but so far have found it's easier just not to spray water up there.

 

Of course when this is going on it doesn't rev so well either. You may be loosing more than one.

 

The coils fire when the TCI cuts power to them (essentially the TCI charges the coils then they discharge when the TCI switches off). Hitting the kill switch will have the same effect. I'm at a loss to explain why the start button would do it.

 

It might be worth pulling the TCI and checking to see if it's got a bunch of water in it.

 

**

Oh by the way: The reason it fires at idle and then cuts out at higher RPMs is everything happens faster at higher rpms. That moisture is pulling something out of spec and it falls on its face when it has to work fast.

 

I agree. I power washed the '93 when I first bought it. Would even run afterwards. Let it sit for 3 weeks in 100+ deg temp, and it fired right up. Water anywhere around the TCI is not good. Not into power washing any longer....

[MiCarl]

I agree. I power washed the '93 when I first bought it. Would even run afterwards. Let it sit for 3 weeks in 100+ deg temp, and it fired right up. Water anywhere around the TCI is not good. Not into power washing any longer....

 

Starting in '90 the ignition went from a TCI (which is essentially four functional units, four pick up coils) to computerized (one functional unit, one pick up coil). You newer guys don't have the option of wiping your ignition out one cylinder at a time.

[The Cheese]

Thank you all for the suggestions. I will start with the pick up coil plugs, clean up the right switch housing, then dig the TCI out. That 32* is not too inviting. But, I gotta get it ready by spring.

 

P.S. Pressure washing is not on the not to do list!

 

Michael

[The Cheese]

I wanted to update this thread. I still have the bike. It still is in the same condition. I hav'nt worked on it since my last post. I have started it every now and again. I have also found out it really is a 1984, title is wrong. Sorry. I need to get this bike going or sell it. Either way I'm getting off my butt now that it is warming up here.

 

Michael

[Dano]

Just remember- #1 is left rear, #2 is left front (this is where the tach gets it's signal, also the vacuum sensor comes off the #2 carb), #3 is right rear and #4 is right front.

[bongobobny]

Yah! Pressure washing was not a good idea! I'll almost bet when you remove your TCI and take the cover off for baking you will find a fair amount of water in the TCI. For the most part the board has been waterproofed but not completely. I once heard a person describe the coating as "looked like somebody threw up on the board" which is actually what it does sort of look like.

 

There are some diodes on the board that can go bad. Contact Gary, member "Dingy" for more info on this. BTW if it really is a '84 then any TCI from '84 to '89 will work.

[The Cheese]

I played around with it yesterday. I have no spark at all to #1. I have spark to #2 until I give it gas. It then cuts out at 2.5k. The tach cuts out at the same time. I found some wires chewed for the radio. So I took the fairing apart hopeful to find some important ignition wires cut. So far, I find none. So I switched the coils around to see if the problem switched. No. It remained the same. I have put it up for sale. If I can figure out whats wrong before it sells, I would like to keep it. I really do want to ride this bike.

 

Thanks

Michael

[The Cheese]

Bike has been sold. Maybe the new guy can get it going.

Shalom