UPDATE: Thanks to you guys Troy Savoie is coming through!

[Godlover]

Well if it was a more difficult order, i would understand. It is not what we agreed on. Godlover is my father. I will file the chargeback, because this is not acceptable. I gave him a favor and we agreed on a new timeframe. He failed to meet this timeframe again. I am done dealing with him, and would say he is a thief. Just because a thief pays restitution, doesn't make him not one. Troy stole your money, and is just paying you restitution. He stole my money too. I think a reasonable time for a Troy Savoie order, is the time he agreed upon. I too gave him the benefit of the doubt, but know he is a con.

 

 

 

Well, at least you don't hold it against your dad for recommending Troy! I did wait a long time and was tired of waiting. Troy did come through with the product but it was not the quality I expected. I think he did it quickly. He made an agreement with you and didn't do as promised. You have every right to file a claim and should.

 

As a pastor I work with people who are down on their luck all the time. I have a heart for these people but when they continue to take advantage of others, lie, and keep making promises I hold them responsible for their actions. Folks, we are enabling this guy to continue poor business practices. How many times do we let him get away with his empty promises? I know many of you have waited far longer than I did for your product. I believe many don't want those who have waited less time to take action against him for fear of not getting their product. I understand it. But let's not enable him any longer.

 

With that said - I hope Troy gets his life together and he is in my prayers.

[YamaDuck]

Well, at least you don't hold it against your dad for recommending Troy! I did wait a long time and was tired of waiting. Troy did come through with the product but it was not the quality I expected. I think he did it quickly. He made an agreement with you and didn't do as promised. You have every right to file a claim and should.

 

As a pastor I work with people who are down on their luck all the time. I have a heart for these people but when they continue to take advantage of others, lie, and keep making promises I hold them responsible for their actions. Folks, we are enabling this guy to continue poor business practices. How many times do we let him get away with his empty promises? I know many of you have waited far longer than I did for your product. I believe many don't want those who have waited less time to take action against him for fear of not getting their product. I understand it. But let's not enable him any longer.

 

With that said - I hope Troy gets his life together and he is in my prayers.

The length of time waiting for your product should have nothing to do with filing a claim. As I mentioned before if I had used a credit card I would have made a charge back before my 60 days was up. I didn't so I had no 60 day grace period. Troy has made a lot of empty promises to me and a lot of other people. All I'm saying is you can only bend a branch so far before it breaks and the same goes for people. Yes I wanted to get Troy's attention, now I have it. Yes I could continue to hound him for the way he has treated me. I don't think that is in my best interest. Is it in your best interest, maybe.

 

Let me ask you a question. What if you file a claim with your credit card company because you have 60 days ( PayPal only gives you 45 days) and Troy doesn't have the money in his account. I would not be surprised to see he doesn't have it in his account. How will you get your money back then? I can tell you you will not get it back. It cost $175 to file a small claims case then you will have to go there for the pre trial and then go down for the hearing. If I were you I would file a charge back but if he doesn't have the money in his account then there is really nothing you can do. That is why I am working so hard to keep him working on my stuff. I could try to ruin him but then not only will I not get my stuff any other member who has an order with him will not get there stuff either. So it is not only me that would get the shaft but there may be other VentureRider members and other motorcycle club members who might not get there stuff.

 

Like I said before I will keep enough pressure on him to keep from breaking his will. Each person has to do what they think best. This is what I think best. You and others may have your own idea as to the best way to handle the situation. I know Alan said he could knock it out in an hour. He may be able to do that I don't know. I do know a member here contacted me and told me he use to do leatherwork and most people do not know or understand how slow a process it is. He got out of it because people though he could just knock out the work quickly. I have never met the member that shared that information with me but I believe him. I don't know anything about leather craft but I do beleive him and so based on what he tells me I doubt if Troy can pump it out in an hour. However I don't think it takes anywhere near two months to do either. It also doesn't explain why he keeps taking orders when he has not done the ones he already has.

 

Troy should not be advertising on Ebay. First it requires payment in full. Second when you bid on it you think he already has it ready to ship. But you are protected as long as you use a credit card. Any way do what you think best but if he has no money then he has no money. I don't know if he has themoney in his account or not. Good luck.

 

Harry

[ajlyoung1221]

Actually Credit Card Chargebacks work a lot differently than one might think. I am a manager at a retail store, and have insight into the process. Since my funds were transferred to Paypal, then my chargeback will be against Paypal. There are various reason codes, in which I would claim non-receipt. This non-receipt claim would then be sent over to Paypal to respond to. In which Paypal would have to provide the Credit Card Merchant with proof of delivery. In failure to do so, the credit card merchant would remove the funds from Paypal, and give it back to me. Then it is between Paypal and Troy to get it settled. Actually, filing the claim through the Paypal process would have got me nothing, if he had nothing in his Paypal Account.

 

When I say that my job should take only an hour, I think maybe you did not read what I wrote in the previous post. I ordered what Troy advertises on his Website.

SaddleBag Covers (which he lists on Ebay) and Baja Bra. You would think he has the patterns already made. Looking at the make and detail of them, they seem like a pretty simple cut and sew. Like sewing a pillow? He didn't need any parts of mine to make them. I have seen people sew, and I have seen people sew upholstery. This is not a tedious process. If indeed he is handsewing these in a straight stitch pattern, then I can see it taking maybe 3 hours.

 

Anyway, tomorrow is my day off, and I will go to the bank to file the paperwork at the bank.

 

Remember, most credit card companies extend this buyers protection. I use paypal, but I always make sure that it is via a Credit Card, and not a bank account. This is backup protection.

[Sylvester]

I just recieved my seat, passenger seat and backrest last week that was to be ready a month ago. The craftsman did a fine job but always had excuses for why it wasn't ready. The difference in our storys is that I gave him no money up front. I am very pleased with the work but I am leary of refering him to others. If they know he is slower than he says they will be OK as long as no money is paid up-front.

 

[YamaDuck]

 

Remember, most credit card companies extend this buyers protection. I use paypal, but I always make sure that it is via a Credit Card, and not a bank account. This is backup protection.

 

That is how I do it. I just had to use PayPal's buyer protection plan. What a joke. I purchased something from a dealer who had about 20 items for sell. As soon as all the auctions were over he closed his ebay account and stopped responding to emails. I called ebay and they told me that my purchase was covered by the PayPal Buyers Protection Plan if I use PayPal. I started a claim immediately. You would not believe all the hoops you had to jump through. Then after I jumped through all the hoops PayPal tells me they will try to take the money out of his account. What if he closes his PayPal account or what if his account doesn't have enough money to cover my cost. I thought PayPal would reimburse me sort of like an insurance policy. When I read that I filed a charge back with my credit card company and let PayPal fight for their own recovery at that point.

[YamaDuck]

I just recieved my seat, passenger seat and backrest last week that was to be ready a month ago. The craftsman did a fine job but always had excuses for why it wasn't ready. The difference in our storys is that I gave him no money up front. I am very pleased with the work but I am leary of refering him to others. If they know he is slower than he says they will be OK as long as no money is paid up-front.

 

Hey Sylvester who did your seats Troy or someone else? Just trying to figure out if this is only Troy taking so long or if other leather fabricators are slow also.

 

Harry

[ajlyoung1221]

Well, I guess, I am not sure if anyone here has had bad things with Wellsfargo. I did call the bank today and filed a dispute on the charge from Troy. It was simple, and they even gave me a provisional credit for the amount. Now the burden of proof lies with Paypal. I have my money back into my account already and very happy.

 

The fact of the matter is this.....

 

It is not that the leather making process is time consuming. It is that Troy, IMHO, is a thief. Harry, if I were to just leave it as it is, I am just authorizing Troy to use Paypal as a tool to steal money from others just to pay for my order? This is not right in my eyes.

 

If a thief is caught stealing, lets say at Lowe's (where I work). Is it then OK, to pay us back by stealing from Kmart to make his money? I don't think I can justify that.

 

I am sorry if this makes anyone else's situation rough, or he is unable to make your orders. That is not my intent. My intent is to stop all of this madness. He is a thief, no matter which way you look at it. And eventually it has to stop. It is just like the Ponzi schemes that people run. They have to continue to collect money to make good on past obligations.

 

I am sorry to Troy if this causes more difficulties in his quest to live a better life. I was not trying cause you more harm, and I know how it feels to be down on luck. I didn't steal to get where I am today. I didn't lie to get where I am today. In fact, I had to give up many of the material things that I would have like to have. If I had to sell some of my personal things to make some money, I did that. Now, thanks to hard work and a more sensible style of personal management, I am very well off.

 

Troy, if you read all this....

 

I am sorry about your situation. But after everything I read and have heard from you, you brought it on yourself. Believe it or not, but there are many people right now that are working at lower paying jobs to make things meet. They are not stealing from people.

[Guest Nevada Max]

I had to wait almost a year to get my saddle bag bras. Found out where his wife worked called her and within several days it was shipped. What a pain to install but once delivered they are well made and very nice. Artist temperament

 

Nevada Max

[YamaDuck]

Well, I guess, I am not sure if anyone here has had bad things with Wellsfargo. I did call the bank today and filed a dispute on the charge from Troy. It was simple, and they even gave me a provisional credit for the amount. Now the burden of proof lies with Paypal. I have my money back into my account already and very happy.

The fact of the matter is this.....

 

It is not that the leather making process is time consuming. It is that Troy, IMHO, is a thief. Harry, if I were to just leave it as it is, I am just authorizing Troy to use Paypal as a tool to steal money from others just to pay for my order? This is not right in my eyes.

 

If a thief is caught stealing, lets say at Lowe's (where I work). Is it then OK, to pay us back by stealing from Kmart to make his money? I don't think I can justify that.

 

I am sorry if this makes anyone else's situation rough, or he is unable to make your orders. That is not my intent. My intent is to stop all of this madness. He is a thief, no matter which way you look at it. And eventually it has to stop. It is just like the Ponzi schemes that people run. They have to continue to collect money to make good on past obligations.

 

I am sorry to Troy if this causes more difficulties in his quest to live a better life. I was not trying cause you more harm, and I know how it feels to be down on luck. I didn't steal to get where I am today. I didn't lie to get where I am today. In fact, I had to give up many of the material things that I would have like to have. If I had to sell some of my personal things to make some money, I did that. Now, thanks to hard work and a more sensible style of personal management, I am very well off.

 

Troy, if you read all this....

 

I am sorry about your situation. But after everything I read and have heard from you, you brought it on yourself. Believe it or not, but there are many people right now that are working at lower paying jobs to make things meet. They are not stealing from people.

 

Well, I guess, I am not sure if anyone here has had bad things with Wellsfargo. I did call the bank today and filed a dispute on the charge from Troy. It was simple, and they even gave me a provisional credit for the amount. Now the burden of proof lies with Paypal. I have my money back into my account already and very happy.

That's the best way to handle it in my opinion. Going through PayPal is very slow and no guarantees.

 

The fact of the matter is this.....

 

It is not that the leather making process is time consuming. It is that Troy, IMHO, is a thief. Harry, if I were to just leave it as it is, I am just authorizing Troy to use Paypal as a tool to steal money from others just to pay for my order? This is not right in my eyes.

 

I agree and I don't think Troy should be advertising on Ebay. That takes payment up front and as we all know Troy has not been responsible enough to handle other peoples money long enough to complete the order.

 

If a thief is caught stealing, lets say at Lowe's (where I work). Is it then OK, to pay us back by stealing from Kmart to make his money? I don't think I can justify that.

 

I agree. Stealing is stealing and should not be tolerated. However I don't know if Troy has stolen anything from anybody yet. No one has more of a right to be mad at Troy than I and I am mad but just because Troy does not do the job in the time frame as promised doesn't make him a thief, lier yes but thief no. I did not believe I was going to get my items just like you. Since then I have started getting a piece at a time so that makes him a lier in my book not a thief. I freely gave Troy my money and so did you. I did not intend for Troy to take so long and neither did you. Other members here have taken longer than my order. So I don't think Troy is a thief anymore, lier yes, slow as malasses yes but like I said before I don't know of anyone who Troy took their money and never delivered there item.

I am sorry if this makes anyone else's situation rough, or he is unable to make your orders. That is not my intent. My intent is to stop all of this madness. He is a thief, no matter which way you look at it. And eventually it has to stop. It is just like the Ponzi schemes that people run. They have to continue to collect money to make good on past obligations.

 

If you are tired of waiting I don't blame you for cancelling your order. Troy should be man enough to give you your money back instead of you having to file a charge back. I don't think anyone would blame you for doing what your doing after all you are the victim here not Troy.

 

I am sorry to Troy if this causes more difficulties in his quest to live a better life. I was not trying cause you more harm, and I know how it feels to be down on luck. I didn't steal to get where I am today. I didn't lie to get where I am today. In fact, I had to give up many of the material things that I would have like to have. If I had to sell some of my personal things to make some money, I did that. Now, thanks to hard work and a more sensible style of personal management, I am very well off.

 

Don't worry I know you are not trying to hurt anyone else's chances you are just looking after your investment as you should.

Troy, if you read all this....

 

I am sorry about your situation. But after everything I read and have heard from you, you brought it on yourself. Believe it or not, but there are many people right now that are working at lower paying jobs to make things meet. They are not stealing from people.

[eazyduzzit]

Troy does not do the job in the time frame as promised doesn't make him a thief, liar yes but thief no. I did not believe I was going to get my items just like you. Since then I have started getting a piece at a time so that makes him a liar in my book not a thief. I freely gave Troy my money and so did you.

 

People freely gave money to Bernie Madoff too, and he lied about what he was doing with it. According to the law, that made him a thief.

[Guest scarylarry]

People freely gave money to Bernie Madoff too, and he lied about what he was doing with it. According to the law, that made him a thief.

 

 

He also lived up to his name.....Madoff....

[Sylvester]

Hey Sylvester who did your seats Troy or someone else? Just trying to figure out if this is only Troy taking so long or if other leather fabricators are slow also.

 

Harry

 

No, Troy did not do my seats and I never had a fear of the job not being done. The man I used is very, very good at what he does. He just cannot schedule his work on a timely manner. I would use him again and he will do a great job. I just have to keep a leash on him. Like I said earlier, I do not pay up front for anything.

 

[straycatt]

However I don't know if Troy has stolen anything from anybody yet.

 

 

 

 

He has stolen the most precious thing that you have.....Time. Time spent worrying about your parts and your money. Time spent tracking Troy down. Even with this post, Troy steals more time.

 

You will never get back all of the time that Troy has cost you, all of you, and that alone is worth running him into the ground for.

[YamaDuck]

He has stolen the most precious thing that you have.....Time. Time spent worrying about your parts and your money. Time spent tracking Troy down. Even with this post, Troy steals more time.

 

You will never get back all of the time that Troy has cost you, all of you, and that alone is worth running him into the ground for.

I stand corrected. Very good perspective I haven't thought about. Thanks, I think???