Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 #1 Posted October 29, 2007 I changed by brake pads yesterday (front & rear) Man what a pain getting the front ones back in. They kept falling out of the caliper while trying to get them back on the rotors. But I got it after awhile. Now on to my question: Out of the gate I did 15 mph and applied both brakes with little force until stopped. I did this 3 time then increased my speed to 20, 25, 30 then 40 applying the brakes with little force 3 times. I didn't do any practice panic stops with the new pads yet. I noticed that the front brakes grab and then seams to skip then grabs again then skips. This makes the front of the bike jerk so you end up getting a jerky stop. I checked the brake fluid level after changing the pads and both the front and rear reservoirs were full. I didn't have this problem before changing the pads. The old front pads were not that bad in the first place (about half gone) but I changed them because I was changing the rear anyway and figured why not. The back inner pad was down to nothing. Everyone knows that pad wears much faster then any other. So why are the front pads acting strange? Thanks for the help on this one.
SilvrT Posted October 29, 2007 #3 Posted October 29, 2007 any chance the rotor is bent? how's the rotor surface look?... any gouging or raised edge? Did you "scuff" the pad surfaces and the rotor surfaces with emery paper first? are the rotors/pads completely clean of any oil or grease?
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #4 Posted October 29, 2007 Zachtcb said: How old is the rotor? 5 years old.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #5 Posted October 29, 2007 SilvrT said: any chance the rotor is bent? how's the rotor surface look?... any gouging or raised edge? Did you "scuff" the pad surfaces and the rotor surfaces with emery paper first? are the rotors/pads completely clean of any oil or grease? I put a square edge along poth front rotors and they look straight to me. I don't see any gouges or raised edges and I didn't scuff the pads of rotors with emery cloth first, should I have? I don't think thers any oil or grease on the pads, at least I tried not to get them oily.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #6 Posted October 29, 2007 Whats got me stumped here is that I didn't have the problem (or didn't notice it) before yesterday AFTER changing the pads. The warrenty on the bike ran out on 10/11/07, go figure a final drive oil leak and now this. Time for a new bike.
SilvrT Posted October 29, 2007 #7 Posted October 29, 2007 I generally scuff up the surfaces with emery paper. It may take a short while for the pads to "wear in". When I changed my rear pads and rotor last year, it took a while before they started braking as they should...they seemed like "faded" brakes would...in other words, took more pressure on the brake pedal. Wasn't long tho...can't really recall. Dumb question... any chance you got the pads in backwards (is that even possible?)
SilvrT Posted October 29, 2007 #8 Posted October 29, 2007 BTW, did you bleed the lines after changing the pads?
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #9 Posted October 29, 2007 SilvrT said: I generally scuff up the surfaces with emery paper. It may take a short while for the pads to "wear in". When I changed my rear pads and rotor last year, it took a while before they started braking as they should...they seemed like "faded" brakes would...in other words, took more pressure on the brake pedal. Wasn't long tho...can't really recall. Dumb question... any chance you got the pads in backwards (is that even possible?) I don't think you can install the pads backwards, can you? I know the first time I did have them backwards and the caliper would not close so I had to turn them around. I may wait awhile and put some more miles on them before I try doing anything else. I may even try bleeding the lines tomorrow, it's about time for new brake fluid anyway.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #10 Posted October 29, 2007 SilvrT said: BTW, did you bleed the lines after changing the pads? No, but I have that in mind to do anyway.
Marcarl Posted October 29, 2007 #11 Posted October 29, 2007 I would think you got a bit of grease or oil on the rotor, if you haven't had this before. Get some brake cleaner in a spray can and clean it up good before you start to pull things apart too far.
StarRider07 Posted October 29, 2007 #12 Posted October 29, 2007 Pilot said: I changed by brake pads yesterday (front & rear) Man what a pain getting the front ones back in. They kept falling out of the caliper while trying to get them back on the rotors. But I got it after awhile. Now on to my question: Out of the gate I did 15 mph and applied both brakes with little force until stopped. I did this 3 time then increased my speed to 20, 25, 30 then 40 applying the brakes with little force 3 times. I didn't do any practice panic stops with the new pads yet. I noticed that the front brakes grab and then seams to skip then grabs again then skips. This makes the front of the bike jerk so you end up getting a jerky stop. I checked the brake fluid level after changing the pads and both the front and rear reservoirs were full. I didn't have this problem before changing the pads. The old front pads were not that bad in the first place (about half gone) but I changed them because I was changing the rear anyway and figured why not. The back inner pad was down to nothing. Everyone knows that pad wears much faster then any other. So why are the front pads acting strange? Thanks for the help on this one. Funny you mention that. I just bought an 07 RSV on Sep 9. About 2 weeks ago, my front brakes are doing the same thing. At least from your description. I also get a sound that I can't really explain. Not a squeel, not a grind. More like a rubbing. Can't describe the sound. No it is not the sound coming from the holes in the rotor. I know that is normal. Greg
Stoutman Posted October 29, 2007 #13 Posted October 29, 2007 Use that brake cleaner in a well ventilated area unless you want to visit the local poison control center. (Long story, took about two months to get my sense of balance back.) As for the pulse in the brake the only thing I can think of is a warped rotor or grease on the rotor. My rear rotor warped and that was what it felt like. If you can stop safely you may want to just let the pads wear in a bit to see if it improves. I had to measure the rear rotor with a dial gauge to see if it was warped. It was only out of spec by .006 inches. My front brakes had a rubbing sound when they were new for about the first 1,000 miles. After that they were pretty quiet. I have yet to change the stock pads on the front after 19,000 miles. The rear is on its third set of pads. The first set was replaced by the dealer under warranty when I had the warped rotor replaced. The second set gave me about 10,000 miles before they started squealing. Inner pad was down to metal. Put the EBC sintered pads on the third time. Seem to work very well.
Eck Posted October 29, 2007 #14 Posted October 29, 2007 I have to throw in a nickles worth here in place of just 2cents worth.... If you didnt notice the pulse "before" you changed your brake pads then this eliminates any worry what so ever about a bent rotor. You said the inner rear pad was wore down to nothing, which means the old front pads still had a little life in them. This means you would have noticed the pulsating even with the OLD pads.. If the pulsating is NEW to you since you installed NEW pads, then you had to have gotten oil or grease (something) on the rotor abd new pad surface. I would leave them alone (as they are) and just go for a ride..now dont see how fast you can go, but get on a side road and in 3rd or 4th gear, you can hold the throttle at 25 MPH and slowly pull in on the front brake lever while holding your throttle and make the pads rub "kind of hard" (DRAG) on the rotor for ONLY 10 to 15 seconds. The heat that is built up will more than likely burn off any oil or grease, and you should be fine.. If it seems to be better AFTER doing this, but still not like you think they "used to be" you can do it again one or two more times to ensure you burned off anything on the two surfaces...DONT hold the brake on for long periods of time because "excessive" heat WILL warp the rotor.. I dont feel there is anything wrong with the brake job you did other than getting the rotor and pads a little dirty with something that will wear off in a short time. You should not have to bleed your brakes just because you changed the pads. Howeve, it wouldnt do any harm, but you should not have to. As for sanding the pads and rotor with emmery cloth or something, I have never done this. It will not hurt to do it to remove any grease or oil on the pad surface, but you really dont need to do it for the brakes to work right. Like I said, I would just go for a ride, hold the brake on for a couple times and then let it go.. You will be fine.
SilvrT Posted October 29, 2007 #15 Posted October 29, 2007 Eck said: As for sanding the pads and rotor with emmery cloth or something, I have never done this. It will not hurt to do it to remove any grease or oil on the pad surface, but you really dont need to do it for the brakes to work right. Like I said, I would just go for a ride, hold the brake on for a couple times and then let it go.. You will be fine. Eck... this was a "standard" thing I always did when I used to pull wrenches (years ago) and I continue doing that. It tends to take any glazing off the surface and provide a bit more "bite" for those new pads. I even do this on old pads/rotors or shoe/drum brakes if they're not worn out. Just "cleans em up" a bit. It may not have much of an effect but it's just something I do coz that's what the old geezer who taught me said I should do. LOL I should mention that I scuff them at 90 degrees to the rotation.
Eck Posted October 29, 2007 #16 Posted October 29, 2007 Silvert, Please dont take offense, cause I'm not doggin what you said. What you said here: It may not have much of an effect but it's just something I do coz that's what the old geezer who taught me said I should do. AND I should mention that I scuff them at 90 degrees to the rotation. You are absolutely correct in what you were taught and how you scuff at 90 degrees. This same subject (scuffing new pads) was a major discussion in my NIASE class (National Institute of Automotive Excellencey) when I became state certified in brakes. You Can scuff the new pads and it does remove the grease /oils from handleing. Glazeing occurrs from heat / wear. New pads dont have glaze (yet) Brake pads can squeel from glazeing, and you can remove your old pads and lightly scuff (sand) at a 90 degree to rotor rotation to remove the glaze. But like I said, it wont hurt either way, but you really dont have ot sand them. I think that old gezzer was our class teacher.. I remember, a guy threw a pair of ladies crotchless underware under the seat of his car cuz he was so darn strick with us in his class......
SilvrT Posted October 29, 2007 #17 Posted October 29, 2007 Eck said: Silvert, Please dont take offense, Eck... none taken
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #18 Posted October 29, 2007 Marcarl said: I would think you got a bit of grease or oil on the rotor, if you haven't had this before. Get some brake cleaner in a spray can and clean it up good before you start to pull things apart too far. I used about two cans of breake cleaner on the calipers, they were dirty, I have about half a can left and I will give them a good cleaning in the morning, thanks for the suggestion.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #19 Posted October 29, 2007 StarRider07 said: Funny you mention that. I just bought an 07 RSV on Sep 9. About 2 weeks ago, my front brakes are doing the same thing. At least from your description. I also get a sound that I can't really explain. Not a squeel, not a grind. More like a rubbing. Can't describe the sound. No it is not the sound coming from the holes in the rotor. I know that is normal. Greg Greg your still under warranty, bring it back to the dealer and see what there mech thinks it is.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #20 Posted October 29, 2007 Stoutman said: Use that brake cleaner in a well ventilated area unless you want to visit the local poison control center. (Long story, took about two months to get my sense of balance back.) As for the pulse in the brake the only thing I can think of is a warped rotor or grease on the rotor. My rear rotor warped and that was what it felt like. If you can stop safely you may want to just let the pads wear in a bit to see if it improves. I had to measure the rear rotor with a dial gauge to see if it was warped. It was only out of spec by .006 inches. My front brakes had a rubbing sound when they were new for about the first 1,000 miles. After that they were pretty quiet. I have yet to change the stock pads on the front after 19,000 miles. The rear is on its third set of pads. The first set was replaced by the dealer under warranty when I had the warped rotor replaced. The second set gave me about 10,000 miles before they started squealing. Inner pad was down to metal. Put the EBC sintered pads on the third time. Seem to work very well. Going to clean the rotors in the morning, also going to change the brake fluid though I don't think that has anything to do with the problem I have now but it needs to be done anyway. I may let it go for a few 100 miles around town (lots of stopping at the lights) and see if they wear in some. Thanks for your input its appreciated.
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #21 Posted October 29, 2007 Eck your thinking a bit like me now and that's scary... Your method is something I didn't think of doing but it's worth a try. After giving the rotors a good cleaning in the morning instead of riding around town for a few hours I will try your suggestion on one of the back roads and see what comes of it. Thanks for the input.
Squeeze Posted October 29, 2007 #22 Posted October 29, 2007 I remember having a Discussion about break in of Pads ... it's here http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?p=138134#post138134 and Monsta's reply here ... http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showpost.php?p=138249&postcount=7 Maybe you have some Cementite build up on on of the Rotors ??
Pilot Posted October 29, 2007 Author #23 Posted October 29, 2007 Just to relieve my mind because I don’t know. Do pads have a forward? In other words are they directional? Hope you understand my meaning here….
BuddyRich Posted October 29, 2007 #24 Posted October 29, 2007 Not on the Venture Jim. Did you remove the wheel? Did you get all the clips back in? The reason I ask is I don't remember ever having to fight to keep the pads on the caliper after pushing the plungers all the way back in
Squeeze Posted October 29, 2007 #25 Posted October 29, 2007 Pilot said: Just to relieve my mind because I don’t know. Do pads have a forward? In other words are they directional? Hope you understand my meaning here…. Nope, no Directions on our Pads ...
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