Thinking about the clutch.

[hig4s]

So from reading other clutch threads it seems you can just double up the clutch spring and get a better feel. I've been thinking about the PWC clutch kit, but concerned that several people have complained about the change in friction point on the clutch lever.

 

Does doubling up the stock spring do that also?

And if not, does anyone that upgraded to the PWC have a stock spring they want to get ride of.

 

Also instead of the PWC kit, can one just get the PWC heavier spring, I read someone here didn't like the feel of the kit and just used the spring, but I can't see paying for the whole kit if I just need the spring.

[BOO]

I am not saying anything bad about any of the so called upgrades to the clutches but I can tell you what mine has done.

I did buy the PWC clutch kit and after installing it I didn't like the way it felt so I put the half disc back in but used the stronger spring. This was probably at about 60 thousand miles. Now at about 75 thousand the clutch is slipping again so again I put all the parts of the PWC kit back in and the friction point is at almost the full release point of the clutch lever. Same as the first time. I have since repaired the slave cylinder but that seems to have no effect on the clutch.

I'm not a 100 percent sure but at this point I'm about ready to order all new clutch parts from Yamaha and replace all the discs and spring.

Like I said I'm not saying anything bad about any of the kits but it just has not worked out for me as it has some on this forum.

BOO

[1BigDog]

At 25k my clutch started slipping. This was back in 2004 and I had never heard of PCW. While it was a bit pricey I used the Barnett set-up along with their carbon fiber discs. The whole set-up set me back about 200 bucks then but 6 years and 40k later I have had no issues. Clutch release isnt a problem. Just a slightly harder pull, barely noticable. IM quite happy with my set-up. But thats just me.....

[MAINEAC]

I got the Barnett same as Ruffy but I got 70K on mine... Barnett is the closest thing to bulletproof when it comes to clutches... I've been using Barnetts since the 70s...

[hig4s]

At 25k my clutch started slipping. This was back in 2004 and I had never heard of PCW. While it was a bit pricey I used the Barnett set-up along with their carbon fiber discs. The whole set-up set me back about 200 bucks then but 6 years and 40k later I have had no issues. Clutch release isnt a problem. Just a slightly harder pull, barely noticable. IM quite happy with my set-up. But thats just me.....

 

Jeff, do you have your old spring?

 

I only have 15k on my bike, and it really doesn't slip, but it has never felt as positive and solid as other bikes I've had.. Once down shifting and accellerating to get away from a dangerous situation, it felt like it might have slipped some. So now I'm just leary of it and thinking I'll just double up the stock spring seeing as some have said that works rather than spend a lot of money on something that might just be my imagination.

[Sleeperhawk]

Jeff, do you have your old spring?

 

I only have 15k on my bike, and it really doesn't slip, but it has never felt as positive and solid as other bikes I've had.. Once down shifting and accellerating to get away from a dangerous situation, it felt like it might have slipped some. So now I'm just leary of it and thinking I'll just double up the stock spring seeing as some have said that works rather than spend a lot of money on something that might just be my imagination.

 

I had the Barnett in my 05, no issues with the Barnett, like Jeff said a little stiffer when squezing the lever. I put the PCW in my 08 because of what was being said here and cost, so what the heck. So far nothing major but if I have to do it over again, back to Barnett. I am with Boo, something just not right about the PCW.

[1BigDog]

Al, ill look around my garage for it sometime today. Im pretty sure I still have it.

 

The Barnett pressure plate is also a pretty purple too....too bad the cover isnt clear..LOL

[1BigDog]

Sorry Al, but I must have tossed the spring away. I had the Barnett box but it wasnt in there anymore.

[hig4s]

Sorry Al, but I must have tossed the spring away. I had the Barnett box but it wasnt in there anymore.

 

 

Thanks for looking. I guess I am now debating between ignoring it until it really needs to be done, of getting the Barnett conversion.. I found it for $149,, anyone know of a better price?

[1BigDog]

149.00 is a good price if it includes the carbon fiber discs as well. My cost was about 200.00 6 years ago, with the discs. If you plan on keeping the bike a while then the Barnett set-up is the way to go. I also made my own gasket from a sheet of rubber impregnated gasket material from Pep boys for 4 bucks vs 13 bucks for the factory gasket. Call me if you need any more info.

[craigatcsi]

Okay, it looks like I can't put this off any longer.

I haven't read that any of you approached the dealer about this being covered by warranty, so I'm guessing that it isn't covered.

 

I have decided to go with the Branett, but should I get just the spring kit or the plates kit also?

 

Craigr

[BOO]

Since this thread came back to the top I will update what I did to my clutch.

I ended up ordering new fiber disc and steel disc (probably not needed) and replaced the whole thing. I put the half disc back in along with the wire but I put a Vmax spring in instead of the standard spring. Probably have 3 or 4,000 miles on the bike since the install. Very happy with the results, friction point back where it should be and the clutch feel nice and solid. So far so good.

BOO

[1BigDog]

Okay, it looks like I can't put this off any longer.

I haven't read that any of you approached the dealer about this being covered by warranty, so I'm guessing that it isn't covered.

 

I have decided to go with the Branett, but should I get just the spring kit or the plates kit also?

 

Craigr

 

I would get the carbon fiber discs to go along with the new pressure plate. If your stock steel plates look good with no burn marks and are all level I would go ahead and re-use them. If you opt for the Barnett it should come with new bolts. If not make sure you buy NEW BOLTS. The old ones will break on you. I used allen head bolts on mine.

[phertwo]

I just put in the PCW clutch kit a month ago. I decided to go for it over the Barnett purely based on price (PCW = 84 bucks, Barnett = 150+). However, I'm not really happy with my results. Yes the PCW will fix any slipping clutch and it will give you an incredible off the line pull with the ability to change gears quickly, but it has those drawbacks. Off the line and shifting up is great! Downshifting is scary, especially when you need to slow it down in a hurry. The travel of the clutch is so short that its basically engaged or not, not much slippage play-room. Slow speed maneuvering is also more difficult because you have to have a steady grip or your going to lurch forward.

 

Overall I think the PCW kit is great for racing and booting it around town, but for the average rider its not very friendly. I will probably throw the half disc back sooner than later and move to a Barnett kit down the road.

 

Oh, and you can buy just the spring and gasket from PCW - it would be around 50-70 bucks I think. That would probably fix a slipping clutch, but i'm not sure how long it will work for as the PCW spring looks identical to the stock spring.

[BOO]

I just put in the PCW clutch kit a month ago. I decided to go for it over the Barnett purely based on price (PCW = 84 bucks, Barnett = 150+). However, I'm not really happy with my results. Yes the PCW will fix any slipping clutch and it will give you an incredible off the line pull with the ability to change gears quickly, but it has those drawbacks. Off the line and shifting up is great! Downshifting is scary, especially when you need to slow it down in a hurry. The travel of the clutch is so short that its basically engaged or not, not much slippage play-room. Slow speed maneuvering is also more difficult because you have to have a steady grip or your going to lurch forward.

 

Overall I think the PCW kit is great for racing and booting it around town, but for the average rider its not very friendly. I will probably throw the half disc back sooner than later and move to a Barnett kit down the road.

 

Oh, and you can buy just the spring and gasket from PCW - it would be around 50-70 bucks I think. That would probably fix a slipping clutch, but i'm not sure how long it will work for as the PCW spring looks identical to the stock spring.

 

Sounds like you have a different issue with the PCW clutch kit then I did. If I am reading and understanding correctly, your engage point is very near the handlebar grip? Mine on the other hand was engaging at the very end of the travel. Sounds like we may not be getting this thing installed correctly.

As far as the spring is concerned, it sure looks the same but it's much stronger than the original one. I have felt of several clutches on newer bikes and they are very soft compared to the one PCW furnishes. I would say the PCW is more like the Vmax clutch spring.

BOO

[phertwo]

My clutch engagement/friction zone is right at the final travel of the clutch handle ie. furthest from the handlebar grip. I find this to be a nuisance because I have to have a wide open hand grip most of the time to maneuver slowly (meaning I dont have a good grip on the handlebar) and it takes an extra second or so for me to release the clutch handle to the end of its travel to downshift (being very cautious not to release too quickly or the clutch will grab too quickly - scary when wanting to do an emergency stop!)

 

I can pull apart the handlebar and file down the pin that engages and disengages the clutch (to bring the clutch friction zone closer to the handlebar) but it wont change the tiny friction zone.

[craigatcsi]

Well, I just ordered the FULL Barnett kit for $300ish.

I had it shipped 3days, so it looks like I will be replacing it this coming w/e.

I will post how it goes and my opinion of the setup.

Thanks for all of the replies,

craigr

[craigatcsi]

Well, I've been putting this off, riding instead. But my wife wants to go out of town this w/e, so I was going to make the change tomorrow after work.

 

I just gave a look in the service manual and it mentions having to drain the clutch fluid, etc.. Do I really need to follow it's procedure?

 

Do I need to buy the clutch tool?

 

When I did this YEARS ago, it was pretty idiot proof. Is it more difficult on a hydraulic clutch?

 

I am beginning to become intimidated.

 

Craigr

[Guest]

If your clutch fluid is anything other then a clear, light amber color its time to change the fluid too. With the bike on the side stand you shouldnt need to drain the oil either but I would recommend an oil change at this point too. The discs should soak for a while in the same motor oil you are going to use. Did you get new bolts in the kit? If not, go and buy some now. I used S/S allen head bolts. DO NOT REUSE THE OLD BOLTS. I found that with an allen head socket mounted to a speed handle, I was able to compress the spring with the bolt passing through the top by leaning into the motor with the speed handle propped against my chest and turning the bolt until it seated. Watch your torque as the setting are really low, 6-7 ft lbs I believe and put a dab of blue loctite on the threads. Not a lot, just a touch to keep them seated. I also used a cut down allen wrench to reach the underside bolts on the clutch cover rather then dropping the exhaust pipe. Just cut the head down about 1/2 way and it should clear the pipes. Good luck!! its really not that hard. Just have some patience and if you get in a jamb and lose patience, walk away for a while......trust me, it works.....

 

I believe there is a tech article at the Venturers site for this procedure.

[craigatcsi]

I DID look in the tech section and didn't see it in there. I saw something about the bearing, but don't need to replace that.

My kit did come with bolts so no worry there.

 

I take it tat I don't need the clutch tool then?

[Rick Butler]

Hey guys,

 

You do realize that Skydoc sells the exact same kit that PCW sells for far less than a Barnett?

 

http://www.venturerider.org/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=2905&title=second-genheavy-duty-clutch-spring26amp-3b-full-disc-upgrade-kit-21&cat=22

 

I just installed one in my friends RSV and it felt really good. I've had my PCW kit for several years and over 70k now and it's still doing fine. I'll probably replace the fiber plates this winter just because I've gone too long, since I have 130K on my 02 RSV.

 

In fact that it's been my experience that in these first clutch slippage situations with new bikes, you really don't need to replace the fiber plates if you choose to replace the pressure plate with a PCW kit or a Barnett.

 

And if you need the instructions for changing out the pressure plate, etc in the tech section, you can find it here:

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10518

 

Hope this helps,

 

Rick

[Guest]

Nothing against Skydoc, hes a great person to deal with and PCW also sells a good kit but, Barnett has been around a heck of a long time and makes very high quality parts. Yes, they do cost more but theyre worth it. I had my set-up in my 99 for over 6 years now and never had any more problems with the clutch. Not knocking anyone here but when something works as well as the Barnett set-up does you stick with it. If the PCW works as well, then by all means, go with it. Just a personal preference on my part here.

[Freebird]

Here's the article in the Tech Library on replacing the clutch.

 

http://www.venturerider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10518

[Seaking]

Being ONE of those poor beggars who has gone through the gamete of stock, PCW and Barnette, I can tell you of my impressions with all these setups..

 

My OEM clutch system FAILED me at the very worse time 2 years ago and almost got me killed.. I dropped the hammer and nothing happened.. ouch.. never experienced that before in my so many years of riding.. But it kept getting worse..

 

After much research, the PCW system seemed like a great idea.. And it is.. don't get me wrong. It was smooth and strong and didn't slip.. I do the full disc mod change as well, getting rid of the silly set up of the half discs.. BUT this made my friction zone move to the almost fully released clutch lever position, instead of closer to the bar as it is with the stock set up.. But it's something you just have to get used to.. no worries.

 

Early this spring, n advanced course killed the clutch, burnt out the friction plates and discoloured the steel plates. OK, I had used syn oil and it may perhaps maybe contributed to the premature clutch failure. A new set of discs resolved the problem but later past summer this year on another advanced course, I killed the clutch once again.. not fun, not good. Never doing that course again on this bike.. something *I* am doing or something about the bike doesn't like the clutch etc..

 

A rebuilt the stackup but this time using the OEM stack instead of the PCW stackup.. and yes, now the friction zone is back to where it was before. In the long run I put the Barnette spring plate in and it's been a lot better since then..

 

With the PCW I found I had an odd and very subtle chatter vibration when a load was put on the bike at various speeds and rpm / gears.. but with the Barnette I don't experience it at all.

 

My clutch fluid darkens sooner than my ride buddy's clutch fluid does, so I'm wondering if I have other issues concerning my clutch, or if I just ride my clutch more in slow maneuvers where he doesn't do a lot of slow riding etc..

 

For now, I have to give my vote to the Barnette clutch spring.. Nothing wrong with the PCW, its less expensive and does work.. (don't do the full disc mod though).. The only thing about the Barnette is the caution a lot of people tell you about not re-using the old bolts but to get new ones..

 

I haven't yet had to remove mine 'yet' so not sure what I should replace those bolts with.. what kind etc..

 

Anyway.. clutches are fun.. I need to learn how to bleed my clutch fluid out myself to save some coins..

 

Cheers