Guitar Fingers

[Nighthawk II]

Hey SilvrT, How are those Geetar fingers comming along? I've got some hard slick finger tips now and was just wondering how yours were doing.

[SilvrT]

Hey SilvrT, How are those Geetar fingers comming along? I've got some hard slick finger tips now and was just wondering how yours were doing.

 

yo brotha! ... I gots me muh own rock 'n roll band now and we're dooin gigs down at the local blues club...

 

 

LOL... yeahsureright!

 

Well, let's see.... 3 weeks ago Saturday I took the guitar into a shop to have it re-stringed and to see if the action could be made a bit easier (we bought a used one) ... they told me it would be ready Wednesday. I neglected to ask "Which Wednesday" ... a week later Saturday, I goes over there and it hadn't even been looked at yet ... guy says "I'll have it ready in an hour" ... it was too much hassle for me to go all the way back there an hour later so I said I'll get it next Saturday. So, "next Friday" rolls around (this is now 2 weeks later) and I phone them..."is my guitar gonna be ready tomorrow?" I ask ... guy says "well, we've been pretty busy... we might have it done" So I respond with my favourite response to these kinda statements... "maybe is not acceptable... either you will or you won't, which is it?" ... Guy says it will so Saturday I go there and voila` ... it's done. I pay the man and leave thinking "I'll nver do business there again". Get home and start practising... "hmmmmmmm..." I'm thinkin... "this doesn't sound right" so I find out it's way out of tune...get that fixed and I'm dooin good. So all in all ... I got about 2.5 weeks of practising in since I got it. Bummer! By the time I got it back from the shop, my finger callouses had all but disappeared (what little I did have). Anyhoo, to make a "long story short" (LOL) .... fingers are toughening up pretty good and I'm up to 7 of the basic chords ... Majors...A, C, D, E ... Minor...A, D, E and I'm workin on G Major. Can't do the change from one to the other very fast but it's coming along and was able to change from D-A-E Major once or twice without looking LOL.

 

All in all, I'm having a blast. I'm also working on a song... it's called "Some Day" ... and it goes like this... "Some day... I'm gonna be... a guitar playah.."

[Celt]

sheeet i'm feelin bad about steerin ya to that guitar shop Rick .i really did hear good things about them .glad your back at it tho.keep on strummin:080402gudl_prv:

[TDunc]

You guys are making me feel bad now. Been playin since I was 13 and have not had it out in about a year.... Bluegrass, Praise, light rock all have been part of my history and now I feel the need to Play, ... no ride... no play... NO RIDE..... I am so confused... think I will go outside slide down the hill on the ice......... Yes on MY ICE......

 

 

[SilvrT]

You guys are making me feel bad now. Been playin since I was 13 and have not had it out in about a year.... Bluegrass, Praise, light rock all have been part of my history and now I feel the need to Play, ... no ride... no play... NO RIDE..... I am so confused... think I will go outside slide down the hill on the ice......... Yes on MY ICE......

 

 

 

:rotf:

[SilvrT]

sheeet i'm feelin bad about steerin ya to that guitar shop Rick .i really did hear good things about them .glad your back at it tho.keep on strummin:080402gudl_prv:

 

No worries mate ..,. but get this... right from the "get-go" that I walked in there I got a bad taste in my mouth. I walk in ... guy who appears to be the "boss" is chatting with, what I thought, was a customer. Nuther "kid" behind the counter just sittin there listenin. So I sand there...looking around a bit... these 2 guys keep on chatting and it wasn't long before I realized they were more like "visiting" ... talkin about stuff like "and what did you do for Christmas" and so on.... this goes on for about what seemed like 10 or 15 minutes. Now as you know, this shop is pretty small so it wasn't likely they didn't see me standing there .... finally this guy that looks like the "boss" looks at me and asks if he can help me. So I tell him what I'm looking for and then go bring the guitar in from the truck. He looks it over and tells me it's in bad need of strings... ok, no problem... so I ask him "how does it sound" ... well, the look he gave me! ... "not bad for a cheap plywood guitar" he says. Well that P/O'd me even more. I say... "I thought Yamaha was a good brand" and he says "sure.... back in the 70's maybe" By this time I'd told him that I bought it used so he asks how much I paid... $95 I say and he just shakes his head and says "you paid way too much"... well now I'm really feeling good... yep warm and fuzzy feeling I have coming to this place.

[Snaggletooth]

Years back I rolled into a shop that I used to do a lot of business with ( like 5 guitars worth) just have have a look around. All new faces and nobody paying attention to anything but their own little world. I spent about 20 minutes wandering the shop and found an old Hot Rod amp. I got a thing for the old valve amps. In good condition and priced pretty low so I started trying to get someones attention. Another 10 minutes. Finally got some young kid to pay a little attention to the guy waving money.

 

Grabbed a guitar off the wall and plugged it in. Sounded sweet and I was ready to pack it out. The kid goes into a 10 minute lecture and why I should buy a new electronic amp that could be adjusted to sound like a valve amp. I asked him if that amp was that bad how about knocking off another $50.00 to get rid of it. I was stunned as he didn't even bat an eye and said "What ever man, but your'e going to regret buying old crap like that."

 

Kept that amp for 7 years and never regretted it. The only thing I did regret was not offering him a couple of hundred bucks for the '72 Strat that was in the case. I mean...........it was just an old guitar......geesh.

 

Never went back.

[Renne]

As former owner of H.I.S. Music,(over 10 years) Princeton Mn. I understand customer woe's. It never failed to amaze me when a customer came in with a less than acceptable/ playable guitar and ask if all guitars were this hard to play? I felt so bad when they had been taken advantage of, guitars with bowed soundboards and bad bad necks, actions that you could drive a car under and plead with me to "fix it". My best "fix" was to take a decent guitar off the wall, have them play it, take their useless piece of junk in on a trade, mark down the new one what they paid for the junker if I could and gain a loyal customer. I'd then scrap the junker for parts, use em for Mr. Fix it and burn the wood.

 

I still deal in good price point guitars and at present rolling my distributor accounts over to my son. Suggestion, purchase the BEST guitar you can afford, if it doesn't work out, you'll always be able to sell it. Cheap junk guitars are a waste of $$$$ and you'll quit because they're too hard to play! With today's technology and production capabilities, there are some great sounding playable guitars out there without spending a ton of money! It doesn't have to be a Fender or a Gibson or any of the other big name units to provide you with endless hours of enjoyment. A high priced guitar will NOT make you a great player,,, might make ya look good, maybe, but there's always some smarty pants out there that'll blow your doors off on an old Silvertone!

 

Renne...........still play'in after all these years.

[Nighthawk II]

I got on that Justin Guitar link like one of the guys suggested and have found it to be more helpful than any of the others I've tried. I'm still not too swooft on changes but doing lots better than I was. I also have a Basic Guitar Chords book that I've actually had for a while that shows all the chords. I watch the video on the site and mark down the moves in the book and use it to practice with instead of having to keep going back to the site so much.

[SilvrT]

As former owner of H.I.S. Music,(over 10 years) Princeton Mn. I understand customer woe's. It never failed to amaze me when a customer came in with a less than acceptable/ playable guitar and ask if all guitars were this hard to play? I felt so bad when they had been taken advantage of, guitars with bowed soundboards and bad bad necks, actions that you could drive a car under and plead with me to "fix it". My best "fix" was to take a decent guitar off the wall, have them play it, take their useless piece of junk in on a trade, mark down the new one what they paid for the junker if I could and gain a loyal customer. I'd then scrap the junker for parts, use em for Mr. Fix it and burn the wood.

 

I still deal in good price point guitars and at present rolling my distributor accounts over to my son. Suggestion, purchase the BEST guitar you can afford, if it doesn't work out, you'll always be able to sell it. Cheap junk guitars are a waste of $$$$ and you'll quit because they're too hard to play! With today's technology and production capabilities, there are some great sounding playable guitars out there without spending a ton of money! It doesn't have to be a Fender or a Gibson or any of the other big name units to provide you with endless hours of enjoyment. A high priced guitar will NOT make you a great player,,, might make ya look good, maybe, but there's always some smarty pants out there that'll blow your doors off on an old Silvertone!

 

Renne...........still play'in after all these years.

 

All good advice Renne but a little clarification would be appreciated. Are you inferring (and concurring with the shop guy I mentioned) that a Yamaha guitar (in this case an F310 having a new price of $199) is of inferior quality to other brands in the same price range?

 

This guy in the shop showed me a different brand (new) guitar which he sells for $199, suggesting that it was of much better quality. Really, how is one to know ... what should a guy be looking for?

[SilvrT]

I got on that Justin Guitar link like one of the guys suggested and have found it to be more helpful than any of the others I've tried. I'm still not too swooft on changes but doing lots better than I was. I also have a Basic Guitar Chords book that I've actually had for a while that shows all the chords. I watch the video on the site and mark down the moves in the book and use it to practice with instead of having to keep going back to the site so much.

 

yep... I'm doing his lesson stuff too .... pretty good and the price is right!

[Renne]

All good advice Renne but a little clarification would be appreciated. Are you inferring (and concurring with the shop guy I mentioned) that a Yamaha guitar (in this case an F310 having a new price of $199) is of inferior quality to other brands in the same price range?

 

This guy in the shop showed me a different brand (new) guitar which he sells for $199, suggesting that it was of much better quality. Really, how is one to know ... what should a guy be looking for?

 

I missed my own point! I was so moved! The shop owner was less than diplomatic, his "know it all" approach lost him an upgrade customer, too bad for him!..I would have walked out too!...At any rate, here are some hints for you. Yes, Yamaha did make plywood tops, the thought was stability for the novice consumer however, plywood top sound quality suffers because the plywood absorbs it. These guitars were built as knock-a-rounds for the beach, camping and parties. It's true, older Yamaha's were better but target markets and raw material costs led to the compromise. Good guitars for their intended purpose, really!

 

"Quality" in the guitar world is ambiguous, each company has it's own "innovations" to promote and where they shine in one area, they'll fail in another. The object is to shop for an instrument within your price range budget that will give you "sound", "playability" and "longevity" as well as investment return.

Sticking with the tried and true will eliminate a lot of grief. Some key things to look for. #1. "SOUND",,, Solid wood top, no plywood. If your budget allows, go for a one piece Stika spruce (AA grade is best) with light bracing. The downside is "CARE, proper tuning and storage is a must to eliminate warping. A split top spruce can be acceptable ( lower cost) but the mids suffer a bit for the "purist" ( ? ). Some companies will tell you a mix of top woods (2) will provide better high's and low's because of the different densities. I find this configuration unacceptable because different wood densities allow for variations in moisture resulting in splitting and or separation under temp. variations. A "Bone" saddle and nut are keys to a good bright sound, there are some OK composite materials, shy away from "Plastic"... #2 "Playability" ,,,here's where it gets sticky, the neck! The neck contributes much to the overall sound as the string vibrations are transferred not only to the saddle but to the body via the neck/body joint. The more dense the neck material the more transfer/sustain. Most necks are mahogany and a "one piece" does this job best, Less expensive units have 2 and 3 piece necks which will allow for cracking and or splitting under adverse conditions, sustain is effected. It's important that the neck is attached to the body with a dovetail joint, many are attached with glue and screws, again possible separation! Look for quality tuners, good smooth machined gears make tuning a breeze. Neck radius/width is very important and can have a real effect on individual players. If your fingers are somewhat large, you might opt for wide as to not mute adjacent strings. You should not have to "get used to" a guitar, it should feel natural as soon as you pick it up, don't compromise. Purchase a "good" case to protect your investment, NO cardboard/gigbags. Always warm the car before you transport, do NOT leave it in the trunk, you'll cry! Maintain humidity in the case with a humidifier especially in winter or dry air climates. There you have some highlights, we won't go into pick-ups and all that. If you would like more info, please feel free to PM me. And yes, I still sell good guitars.

 

Thanks for asking,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Renne

[SilvrT]

I missed my own point! I was so moved! The shop owner was less than diplomatic, his "know it all" approach lost him an upgrade customer, too bad for him!..I would have walked out too!...At any rate, here are some hints for you. Yes, Yamaha did make plywood tops, the thought was stability for the novice consumer however, plywood top sound quality suffers because the plywood absorbs it. These guitars were built as knock-a-rounds for the beach, camping and parties. It's true, older Yamaha's were better but target markets and raw material costs led to the compromise. Good guitars for their intended purpose, really!

 

"Quality" in the guitar world is ambiguous, each company has it's own "innovations" to promote and where they shine in one area, they'll fail in another. The object is to shop for an instrument within your price range budget that will give you "sound", "playability" and "longevity" as well as investment return.

Sticking with the tried and true will eliminate a lot of grief. Some key things to look for. #1. "SOUND",,, Solid wood top, no plywood. If your budget allows, go for a one piece Stika spruce (AA grade is best) with light bracing. The downside is "CARE, proper tuning and storage is a must to eliminate warping. A split top spruce can be acceptable ( lower cost) but the mids suffer a bit for the "purist" ( ? ). Some companies will tell you a mix of top woods (2) will provide better high's and low's because of the different densities. I find this configuration unacceptable because different wood densities allow for variations in moisture resulting in splitting and or separation under temp. variations. A "Bone" saddle and nut are keys to a good bright sound, there are some OK composite materials, shy away from "Plastic"... #2 "Playability" ,,,here's where it gets sticky, the neck! The neck contributes much to the overall sound as the string vibrations are transferred not only to the saddle but to the body via the neck/body joint. The more dense the neck material the more transfer/sustain. Most necks are mahogany and a "one piece" does this job best, Less expensive units have 2 and 3 piece necks which will allow for cracking and or splitting under adverse conditions, sustain is effected. It's important that the neck is attached to the body with a dovetail joint, many are attached with glue and screws, again possible separation! Look for quality tuners, good smooth machined gears make tuning a breeze. Neck radius/width is very important and can have a real effect on individual players. If your fingers are somewhat large, you might opt for wide as to not mute adjacent strings. You should not have to "get used to" a guitar, it should feel natural as soon as you pick it up, don't compromise. Purchase a "good" case to protect your investment, NO cardboard/gigbags. Always warm the car before you transport, do NOT leave it in the trunk, you'll cry! Maintain humidity in the case with a humidifier especially in winter or dry air climates. There you have some highlights, we won't go into pick-ups and all that. If you would like more info, please feel free to PM me. And yes, I still sell good guitars.

 

Thanks for asking,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Renne

 

Great advice Renne...thanks!!! The new guitar the guy in the shop showed me definately had a much better sound than mine and did have a solid wood top. Learning to play is one of those "bucket list" items and if I never get good at it, I really don't care so for the time being, I'll stick with this Yamaha but if/when I do decide to get a better one, I am certainly a lot better educated now.

 

[Renne]

Great advice Renne...thanks!!! The new guitar the guy in the shop showed me definately had a much better sound than mine and did have a solid wood top. Learning to play is one of those "bucket list" items and if I never get good at it, I really don't care so for the time being, I'll stick with this Yamaha but if/when I do decide to get a better one, I am certainly a lot better educated now.

 

 

Great! You just keep peck'in away there! Your Yammi is JUST FINE for now! You'll eventually you'll want to upgrade, it somehow gives ya a boost to play a good new guitar,,,kinda a pride thing,,,the better the sound the more ya wanna do it! It's great fellowship too, get with someone to share, someone maybe as "green" (?) as you, you'll feed off'en one another! Have FUN! Lemmeno when you think you want to up-grade,,,I'll help ya!

 

Renne.........

[RandyR]

There are some great low to mid priced Canadian acoustic guitar makers.

 

There is a family of guitar brands owned by Godin http://www.lasido.com/ with the Seagull guitars being economical and usually good quality.

 

In the mid-tier price range is Larrivee made in BC. I play Larrivee guitars so am somewhat prejudiced, but chose them because they have great sound and playability.

http://www.larrivee.com/

 

Most Larrivee guitars are sitka spruce as Renne recommended.

 

Other choices for a top are cedar and mahogany, and other spruces (usually on only more expensive guitars like adirondack spruce, Englemann, Italian Spruce, etc). Cedar is somewhat softer than spruce and is generally warmer sounding on a new guitar than spruce which may take a couple years to break in. Usually only mahogany bodied guitars will be found with mahogany tops.

 

Maple necks are also good necks in addition to mahogany. There are starting to be some excellant quality laminate necks made by top tier makers so the old wisdom of demanding a solid neck is starting to change. Likewise the neck join to body. I prefer the dovetail neck joint, but several top tier makers are using other neck fastening techniques now ( Taylor Guitars for example).

 

The non-bone material I find acceptable for nuts and saddle is called Tusq. It is engineered to have good sound transmitting properties and is consistent from one piece to the next.

 

A 2 piece top is the norm. the 2 pieces are typically taken from side-by-side pieces cut out of the same spruce log and laid open like the pages of a book, then glued together. The variation in grain of the 2 sides will be almost a mirror image of each other.

 

Here's a good link on instrument construction: http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/pagelist.html

 

 

Bottom line. You need to be able to play it to learn it and progress to the next level. Yamaha makes good guitars.

 

There are lots of great 3 chord songs out there.

Edited February 1, 2010 by RandyR

[Renne]

Right on Randy! I didn't want to start naming brands as there are way too many,(confusion) and maybe hard to find in a given local area and not available to test hands on. I just wanted to post some things to look for while shopping. But yes, the Seagulls and Larrivee's are really nice instruments. The neck issue is just that and I agree, the more dense to wood, Maple, the better sustain. Nut and saddle materials have come a long way but bone is still my choice. As far as split tops, they are just fine, it's a matter of economics in that the co's can get a top out of a smaller diameter tree hence the "book mark" technique. A one piece takes a big log....in addition, a split top has less chance of splitting but that's still a matter of proper care....I have a Epiphone 12 I like a lot, an old early 70's Ovation, a couple arch top "f" hole Silvertones, one I elecrified,,,nice old blues sound, a Giannini 12 and an OLD" Gibson I'm restoring, a smattering of solid bodies, 60's strat and a G&L,,,an Ibanez and 70's Ibanez 5 string banjo,,,there are some others but I forget,,,their in the basement storeroom somewhere....anyway,,,,,,,,,,,,,IT"S STILL FUN!!!

 

Renne,,,still pick'in

[Freebird]

There are a lot of good guitars on the market and you don't have to spend thousands of dollars to get one. I love my Seagull. I think they are about as good as you can buy for the money spent. Mine does have the cedar top, wild cherry back and sides and the maple neck. It is a solid top but I think the back and sides are laminated. Great low action for an acoustic.

[Renne]

Again, the Seagull is a real good guitar Don, well made and pretty, they play great! I like nice low actions even though you sacrifice some volume, at the end of the night your hand and fingers seem normal! I'm in the process of ordering a "Recording King". They are the resurrected "30's" house brand for Montgomery Ward. I'm anxious to play it! If it passes the Renne test, I'll be offering them.....we'll see,,,,,,,,,,,,,Keep pick'in!

 

 

Renne............me too!