Guest seuadr Posted July 20, 2009 Share #26 Posted July 20, 2009 (edited) Why torque it? That's pretty obvious to me - because YOUR calibrated wrist may not be the same as Joe's, and if Joe uses a torque wrench set the the value in the manual, he can't screw it up. Is that "teknikal" enough for you? Goose unless it's a comparison between the hulk and my grandmother, i don't think it'd be so amazingly different as to cause any problems. i've never torqued an oil pan bolt in my life either.. YMMV just my , - Jared Edited July 20, 2009 by seuadr changed my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V7Goose Posted July 20, 2009 Share #27 Posted July 20, 2009 unless it's a comparison between the hulk and my grandmother, i don't think it'd be so amazingly different as to cause any problems. i've never torqued an oil pan bolt in my life either.. YMMV just my , - Jared Well, your grandmother must be screwing up a lot of cars out there then, or else you wouldn't find oil pan plug repair kits hanging in every auto parts store in the nation! Goose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted July 20, 2009 Share #28 Posted July 20, 2009 Well, your grandmother must be screwing up a lot of cars out there then, or else you wouldn't find oil pan plug repair kits hanging in every auto parts store in the nation! Goose maybe that's because there are so many faulty torque wrenches out there.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted July 20, 2009 Share #29 Posted July 20, 2009 because YOUR calibrated wrist may not be the same as Joe's, Is that "teknikal" enough for you? Goose heh... I've worked along side of a lotta "Joes" in my life who've never used a torque wrench on an oil drain plug neither. In fact, I don't believe any automotive instructor I've ever had suggested using a torque wrench for an oil drain plug ... but then again, that's going back a lotta years.... Head bolts, intake manifold bolts, crank bearing cap bolts, con rod cap bolts, etc, etc... things where torque affects proper seating of a gasket or a bearing to ensure evenness of pressure, prevent warpage, and the like .... yes... they need to be torqued and in proper sequence but an oil drain.... c'mon ... if a person is any kind of a "wrencher", they should know what's the right tightness of such an item without having to use a torque wrench. Those oil drains that have been screwed up are from reason's such as exactly what the original poster mentioned, and from people who have no clue. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest seuadr Posted July 20, 2009 Share #30 Posted July 20, 2009 Well, your grandmother must be screwing up a lot of cars out there then, or else you wouldn't find oil pan plug repair kits hanging in every auto parts store in the nation! Goose i've never found an oil pan plug repair kit.. lots of spark plug repair kits that fit the same hole, though.. hard to settle this discussion really, you say you've never not done it, some of us say we never have, it's like oil and tires, everyone has an opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted July 20, 2009 Share #31 Posted July 20, 2009 BTW Goose, I do respect your knowledge and I'm not suggesting you're wrong ... just throwin some of my own "common sense" into the "oil pan". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted July 20, 2009 Share #32 Posted July 20, 2009 hard to settle this discussion really, you say you've never not done it, some of us say we never have, it's like oil and tires, everyone has an opinion. yep...and I'm just throwing my opinion in just coz I have one ... not trying to force anyone's choice one direction or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyR Posted July 20, 2009 Share #33 Posted July 20, 2009 While I haven't actually done this, it shouldn't be all that difficult to calibrate a torque wrench as opposed to comparing two torque wrenches to each other. I just checked my socket sets and a 15mm 12point socket seems to closely fit the 1/2inch square socket attachment on a flex handle or torque wrench or ratchet. So. exactly one foot from the center of the attachment on an 18inch flex handle, tie a rope or wire and hang a 25 pound barbell weight. With the 15mm 12 point socket on the torque wrench to be calibrated, attach the flex handle at at right angle. Pick up the torque wrench (running vertically) and with the flex handle perpendicular, lift the 25lb weight off the ground. The torque wrench reading should be (about) 25lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V7Goose Posted July 20, 2009 Share #34 Posted July 20, 2009 BTW Goose, I do respect your knowledge and I'm not suggesting you're wrong ... just throwin some of my own "common sense" into the "oil pan". I'm not arguing about this, just having a good time debating and trying to correct a number of 'less than optimal' statements that some folks are throwing out. But there is one thing I WILL argue over, and that is the FACT that best practice is to always use a torque wrench on any bolt with a torque specification provided by the manufacturer. Anyone who says you should NOT use a torque wrench (as opposed to just saying they don't WANT to) is an absolute idiot who should be prohibited from purchasing tools in any civilized country! The fact is, I don't use a torque wrench on drain plugs either, and I can't recall ever having stripped one (been wrenching WAY too many years to remember for sure, so I won't be stupid enough to represent that as an absolute fact), but I have had to repair a number of them for other people. The fact that there are so many different options available for this repair is proof in my mind that it is a common problem for inexperienced people. Here is just one sample of over 25 different options: http://www.cgenterprises.com/drain_plugs_oversize_repair.htm You and I, and anyone else, are free to decide we don't NEED or WANT to use a torque wrench on any bolt or plug, but I'd sure hate to see someone who wasn't already sure enough of themselves to decide it wasn't necessary just because we said we didn't do it on a forum. BTW, just for reference, our Oil Drain Plug (M14) torque spec is 31 ft*lbs, but the rear drain plug (also an M14) is only 17 ft*lbs. There is a reason Yamaha published a different spec for those two plugs. I don't know what it is, but I DO know that torquing both of those the same (with or without a torque wrench) is inviting a disaster somewhere. Good luck in whatever choices you make, Goose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flb_78 Posted July 20, 2009 Share #35 Posted July 20, 2009 I don't even use a torque wrench on the axle nut. I use a German torque wrench. Gudentite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilvrT Posted July 20, 2009 Share #36 Posted July 20, 2009 ahhh yes... some of those days are comming back to me now (after viewing that link)... those good ole self-tapping drain plugs I used to use because some jerk before me stripped the threads in the oil pan. How'd they do it? Probably cross-threading is my guess (as opposed to over tightening). Yes... a good discussion...which I do enjoy taking part in...why? Because there's ALWAYS something to learn. It's a good thing tho that the world does not adhere to "best practise" in all things it would apply to. Regarding the different torque spec for the 2 drain plugs... possibly the metal on the diff (I'm assuming that's what you mean by rear drain plug) is softer than the metal at the bottom of the engine? You and I, and anyone else, are free to decide we don't NEED or WANT to use a torque wrench on any bolt or plug, but I'd sure hate to see someone who wasn't already sure enough of themselves to decide it wasn't necessary just because we said we didn't do it on a forum. Goose Very GOOD Point! I do tend to forget that this is a publicly viewed forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcarl Posted July 20, 2009 Share #37 Posted July 20, 2009 Now I'm glad I didn't see this thread until today,, that way I can set you all straight as to what you really should do and as to how it really can be done. Best thing to do first is to throw away the owners\repair manual. Mostly the language is wrong, pictures never show exactly what you are looking for and when you need info, they went and put it on the wrong pages,, never mind that you remember having seen it before, it ain't there now,,,, so they're playing with you when you are in the most direst need of good solid well explained information. Best thing after that is to chuck all your metric tools down the road, you'll notice all your neighbours fighting over them and you'll have a hoot. Reason to through them out is that they usually don't work well anyways, better to use imperial tools, they're made in America, RIGHT?, that way you have an excuse to through out more tools and enjoy watching the neighbours again. That leaves you then with a couple of very important handwrenchs, the one being a hammer, and the other a vicegrip. Now you're ready to change your oil......do I need to say more?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyR Posted July 21, 2009 Share #38 Posted July 21, 2009 I'm glad I saved my Whitworths..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seabeetom Posted July 26, 2009 Share #39 Posted July 26, 2009 Just changed my oil/filter, put the drain plug back in and, using my "trusty-dusty" Harbor Freight Torque Wrench, torqued the bolt to specification. The result?? I now have a stripped drain plug bolt/oil pan. After I fork out a pretty penny to fix this, I will NOT be using another Harbor Freight tool on my baby. ANy one else ever have an issue with an H.F. Torque Wrench? Had the same thing happen. First use of a HF torque wrench was changing rear tire. Torqued pinch bolt to specs and busted it plum in half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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